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New York - In Solidarity With Charedim in Israel, American Rabbis Issue Call For Mass Prayer Event In Mahattan

Published on: March 3, 2014 04:48 PM
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FILE -  Ultra-Orthodox Jews gather for a mass prayer in protest to the government's army conscription laws in Jerusalem, 02 March 2014. EPAFILE -  Ultra-Orthodox Jews gather for a mass prayer in protest to the government's army conscription laws in Jerusalem, 02 March 2014. EPA

New York - At the request of Rabbis in Israel, American Rabbis have asked that Jews in New York should join in a large Prayer gathering that will take place on Water Street in lower Manhattan this Sunday (March 9) beginning at 2:00 p.m.
According to a press release By Agudath Israel, The gathering will echo this past Sunday’s mass prayer event in Jerusalem, which brought out hundreds of thousands of Jews in response to the Israeli government’s ongoing attempt to Draft Israeli Yeshiva students into the Army.
The New York gathering, which will include a special area for women who wish to participate, will begin with ‘Mincha’ and consist of the recital of Tehillim and special prayers in unison.
Buses are expected to bring participants to the gathering location from communities and institutions outside the immediate New York area, but New York residents are being urged to take public transportation to the site, which is well serviced by the subway system, and to not attempt to drive into Manhattan for the gathering.

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Agudath Israel stressed in their press release, that although they are providing information regarding the planned mass prayer event, the gathering is not being organized under the auspices of Agudath Israel of America.


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1

 Mar 03, 2014 at 04:58 PM 5TResident Says:

Anyone who attend this is a traitor to Eretz Yisroel and the Jewish people. Period.

2

 Mar 03, 2014 at 05:05 PM The_Truth Says:

Umm, isnt this a re-hash of the asifa that was planned & cancelled a few weeks back? How will this be different?
Judging from the photos of the even in Israel, there was little (if any) support from the chassidish groups. Will it be just the opposite in NYC?
What is the goal of such a protest? Just for protests sake?

3

 Mar 03, 2014 at 05:06 PM Facts1 Says:

"Agudath Israel stressed in their press release, that although they are providing information regarding the planned mass prayer event, the gathering is not being organized under the auspices of Agudath Israel of America. "

Oh, they are afraid to take stand??????? Is it not PC to do?

4

 Mar 03, 2014 at 05:16 PM NoMan Says:

It seems the Agudah is trying to have it both ways, saying here are all the details you need to attend this event, including the endorsement of individual "gedolim" if not the MOetzes, but we are not sponsoring it.

A little disingenuous?

5

 Mar 03, 2014 at 05:27 PM RebKlemson Says:

dont people have anything to do with their lives

6

 Mar 03, 2014 at 05:28 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #1  
5TResident Says:

Anyone who attend this is a traitor to Eretz Yisroel and the Jewish people. Period.

Anyone who denies the primacy of Torah and the importance of supporting Torah study is a Kofer. Period

7

 Mar 03, 2014 at 05:42 PM Maven Says:

Of course we need to be united against the draft but the reasoning among Charedim differs.Aguda,Shas and the rest of the frum parties are pro Zionism pro Israel. Their yeshivas and Kollelim WERE financed by the Israeli government.Lapid and Lipman claim "enough is enough" you are sucking the economy dry its time to give back by joining the IDF.
Those who follow the Edah Hachareidis and Satmar don't participate in the elections refuse money for yeshivos and Kollelim don't want to join the IDF becuase a frum Jew does not belong there.Torah learning has nothing to do with this issue.The cop out for not joining the IDF becuase of Torah learning is being used ONLY by the frum Zionist.

8

 Mar 03, 2014 at 05:57 PM lostinCA Says:

Reply to #1  
5TResident Says:

Anyone who attend this is a traitor to Eretz Yisroel and the Jewish people. Period.

are u saying that as a psak halacha or your own delusion?

9

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:00 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #4  
NoMan Says:

It seems the Agudah is trying to have it both ways, saying here are all the details you need to attend this event, including the endorsement of individual "gedolim" if not the MOetzes, but we are not sponsoring it.

A little disingenuous?

A LOT disingenuous.

10

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:02 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #4  
NoMan Says:

It seems the Agudah is trying to have it both ways, saying here are all the details you need to attend this event, including the endorsement of individual "gedolim" if not the MOetzes, but we are not sponsoring it.

A little disingenuous?

Nebech, nebech, with each passing day it's becoming clearer how such a tragedy like the Shoah was able to happen. When you tell Yidden not to defend themselves, why should Esav stop his instinct to kill you?

11

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:05 PM shlomo G. Says:

some backround info
1. its " not " under any one org. similar to the one in eretz yisroel
2. the moetzes got clear urging from maran rav shteinman & rav chaim shlita to make this tefilla just as they fully supported the e"y one
3. the 3 conditions were and are - no dais its not a time for kovod/ no speeches its expected that each rav will speak to his kehilla on shabbos/ that this is NOT a machoh - klal yisroel koach is bepeh
4. last time when the chassidishe rebbes wanted the gathering it was to be a protest and rav shteinman was not really in agreement
rav shteinman shlita is " leshitoso" that the fact that hashem is letting a few heads of state turn the torah world upside down is a " patch" fun himmel and we must turn our attentio to the kol hashem ( lapid and bibi are the shluchim)
5. its 2 pm at water street
6. regardless of what you feel to daven with a 100,000 people ( or whatever number it will be) is a huge hisorerus
7 the conference call with the moetzes was on wed - it took till shabbos to get the permit

12

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:07 PM # 2 Says:

all the chassidishe were there in e"y even the eida not sure what pictures you are looking at - bring your children it will be a time for you to transmit the koach of emuna & tefila

13

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:09 PM why bash?? Says:

the moetzes & agudah is an address that many look to for guidance they are the ones being " meaged" the sefardim chassidim....why poke fun

14

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:16 PM yosher Says:

mesirah and chillul Hashem

15

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:17 PM Anonymous Says:

Free event for bigger minyan. Surely Israel will long be remembered, right? Doesn't a minyan in the synagogue work just as good and most likely better than one at Metlife Stadium? We the segemented communities do not think you need to be seen to be heard. Unless you think a front page NY Post article is more favorable than Hashem's true Hand. Curious, why do the neo-destined chassids do the asifa mass convention? Could it be they are afraid of dying as a group? In that case, perhaps Hashem's Angels' writing is already on the walls. Torah judaism may not likely be meant to endure every age as a composite decree of limited authority in a game of check your neighbor before yourself complicity. Torah is authority, not conversational intrigue.

16

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:17 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #1  
5TResident Says:

Anyone who attend this is a traitor to Eretz Yisroel and the Jewish people. Period.

Wrong. Anyone who isn't shomer Torah umitzvos like the leaders of the state or the soldiers are traitors to the Jewish people and ey. Period.

17

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:22 PM Maven Says:

Reply to #1  
5TResident Says:

Anyone who attend this is a traitor to Eretz Yisroel and the Jewish people. Period.

You meant " a traitor to Israel". Eretz Yisroel is our beloved place its called the palterin shel melekh (palace of the king) and to do a sin in the palace of a king is much worse then outside the palace.
If you think that hashem has nachas of such a medina with so many people living in sin were the mere existence is a rebellion against the almighty,you are terrible mistaken.

18

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:23 PM Anonymous Says:

How brave of American Chareidem for not wanting their brothers in EY to serve in the army ! Where is their skin in the game ??

19

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:23 PM Anonymous Says:

This is what happens when the Chasidim don't teach modern Jewish History to their yungerliet. These healthy young men have no idea of the holocaust, no idea of how Israel was founded. They believe that the world started with their date of birth. The break between the Chasidim and the rest and incidently the majority of Yidden is now complete.

20

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:33 PM Great Party Says:

Sorry, to me it looks like a great party. The atmosphere seemed to be partylike for most of the young people there. I might even think there was a tremendous amount of bitul Torah. I can find no information about where and when but it probably falls during work hours. I would like to be able to do all the things non workers do but I can't because I work.

21

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:37 PM berelw Says:

this is getting crazier by the day....this is a chilul hashem....the people behind this is the harcore anti Zionist chasidim i.e. satmare and the hardcore litvishe...most normal people in between do not support this at all.

22

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:50 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Anyone who denies the primacy of Torah and the importance of supporting Torah study is a Kofer. Period

Anyone, who doesn't fulfill their share of the burden to help protect other Yidden when they are otherwise physically able and required to do so is a BUM.

23

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:51 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #16  
Anonymous Says:

Wrong. Anyone who isn't shomer Torah umitzvos like the leaders of the state or the soldiers are traitors to the Jewish people and ey. Period.

Do you pasken for Hashem? Let Hashem decide who is a traitor, and you can crawl back to your daled amos.

24

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:52 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #10  
Anonymous Says:

Nebech, nebech, with each passing day it's becoming clearer how such a tragedy like the Shoah was able to happen. When you tell Yidden not to defend themselves, why should Esav stop his instinct to kill you?

Wrong dearie, with every passing day is it becoming more and more apparent why we need Holocaust education. Your mentality approach is like lifting the lid off the stove to see if there is any more mice in the house every day. Not exactly the word of timed perspective. Thanks.

25

 Mar 03, 2014 at 06:53 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #20  
Great Party Says:

Sorry, to me it looks like a great party. The atmosphere seemed to be partylike for most of the young people there. I might even think there was a tremendous amount of bitul Torah. I can find no information about where and when but it probably falls during work hours. I would like to be able to do all the things non workers do but I can't because I work.

Giant Party? Next year in the Bahamas right? Maybe that could be an asifa to try all the asifas! Smile!

26

 Mar 03, 2014 at 07:02 PM Cynic. Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Anyone who denies the primacy of Torah and the importance of supporting Torah study is a Kofer. Period

If what you and all the "protest" supporters are alluding to is correct, why not have a night of learning instead?

It trumps everything, right?

It certainly trumps the waste of money people will spend on transportation and lost time.

If everyone went to their local Shul or Beis Medrash, at a given time, say 5pm and said Tehillim for 30 minutes, certainly that would have a bigger effect! No?

27

 Mar 03, 2014 at 07:06 PM downtoearth Says:

who is sponsoring it?

28

 Mar 03, 2014 at 07:10 PM TorahTruth Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Anyone who denies the primacy of Torah and the importance of supporting Torah study is a Kofer. Period

If you truly believe in the primacy of Torah, it would be helpful if you learned a little of it. A "Kofer, period"... my dear friend, you may disagree with him and he may even be wrong... but a Kofer? I suggest you learn the Rambam who defines what a Kofer or a Mumer is before you call people Kofrim? BTW, nobody is denying the primacy of Torah or the importance to support it... there is a very big difference between something being primary and being exclusive.

29

 Mar 03, 2014 at 07:11 PM Ex Kollel Guy Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Anyone who denies the primacy of Torah and the importance of supporting Torah study is a Kofer. Period

I support torah 100% but em derech ertez. Tell the olim in Israel to get a job and learn torah every free minute of their life.

30

 Mar 03, 2014 at 07:13 PM TorahTruth Says:

Reply to #17  
Maven Says:

You meant " a traitor to Israel". Eretz Yisroel is our beloved place its called the palterin shel melekh (palace of the king) and to do a sin in the palace of a king is much worse then outside the palace.
If you think that hashem has nachas of such a medina with so many people living in sin were the mere existence is a rebellion against the almighty,you are terrible mistaken.

If I had to guess, I would guess that the Rebbono Shel Olam has more Nachas from the Jews in Eretz Yisrael where there is less than 3% intermarriage than from Chutz Laaretz where is greater than 70%.

31

 Mar 03, 2014 at 07:26 PM Anonymous Says:

I work very hard and pay taxes. I go to work in cold, snow, get up in the dark and return home in the dark. My money is paying to support these leeches and I resent it. They have all the time in the world to protest, drink vodka and who knows what else?

32

 Mar 03, 2014 at 07:27 PM ATT Alterg & Devee Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Anyone who denies the primacy of Torah and the importance of supporting Torah study is a Kofer. Period

I have said this many times. For the majorty of charedim this has nothing to do with the army. Its all about not going to work and the govenment ceasing to handout candies to the charedim. Here is the proof;
A) Under the new law all those currently over 22 can go to work with no army duty. Lets see ho many charedim take the bit. I am willing to bet very few.
B) Under the old law called Vadas Tal all those over 24 and married were able to do some civil service for three months (like peeling potatoes for the army) while sleeping at home. Note this is not nachal charedi. The charedim weren't forced to fight or do any major work. And it was for mature charedim just like all of us who work in goysha offices as mature adults. And we learn torah at night. Yet the cahredim never embraced it. Why not? Because they just want free handouts. This army thing is bogus. Its a copout and excuse period.

33

 Mar 03, 2014 at 07:29 PM zioni Says:

I hope and pray that it will be with Big success,
I am sure that in heaven its surely making a big roishem and bring moshiach quicker

34

 Mar 03, 2014 at 07:29 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Anyone who denies the primacy of Torah and the importance of supporting Torah study is a Kofer. Period

When the rabboinim address the work issue, I am all in for fighting the tzionim against forcing us to fight in the army. But till they get off their high horses and realize that yes the other aside is rashoim and we can't shtel tzu.But they have a strong valid point.

35

 Mar 03, 2014 at 07:41 PM anonymous Says:

Reply to #19  
Anonymous Says:

This is what happens when the Chasidim don't teach modern Jewish History to their yungerliet. These healthy young men have no idea of the holocaust, no idea of how Israel was founded. They believe that the world started with their date of birth. The break between the Chasidim and the rest and incidently the majority of Yidden is now complete.

My dear young man or maybe young lady. If all these chachomim would have watched the trucks loaded with men, women and children leaving the Ghetto for Terblinka and guarded by camouflaged SS they would keep quiet and hang their heads in shame. These were yidden "who were shomer mitzvos. and some were not but all were yiddishe neshomos murdered by gas, shot to death and beaten to death. We don't all you keep quiet and stuff yourself with pizza [cholov yisroel pizza] and "geshmacke kugel" and go back in your mekomos

36

 Mar 03, 2014 at 08:07 PM Professor Says:

Reply to #7  
Maven Says:

Of course we need to be united against the draft but the reasoning among Charedim differs.Aguda,Shas and the rest of the frum parties are pro Zionism pro Israel. Their yeshivas and Kollelim WERE financed by the Israeli government.Lapid and Lipman claim "enough is enough" you are sucking the economy dry its time to give back by joining the IDF.
Those who follow the Edah Hachareidis and Satmar don't participate in the elections refuse money for yeshivos and Kollelim don't want to join the IDF becuase a frum Jew does not belong there.Torah learning has nothing to do with this issue.The cop out for not joining the IDF becuase of Torah learning is being used ONLY by the frum Zionist.

As much as I disagree with yesterday's protest. I must say that it was a real Yom tefillah with no violence. Kol hakvod.
And when satmer and the eidah do a protest there is violence, bloodshed, and rock throwing. So

37

 Mar 03, 2014 at 08:10 PM The "real" Sabastion Says:

Reply to #21  
berelw Says:

this is getting crazier by the day....this is a chilul hashem....the people behind this is the harcore anti Zionist chasidim i.e. satmare and the hardcore litvishe...most normal people in between do not support this at all.

Let me explain something to you haters of chasidim and litfishe. First of all the learners are NOT NEEDED in the army. There are enough soldiers in the Israeli Army. They are even sending a lot of them off duty.
2, If there were G-D forbid a war or real need for "learners" to join they would run in a split second to get involved no matter in which way. Anyone who thinks otherwise doesn't know the facts. Torah Jew's fundamental inner core beliefs are "V'ohavto l'rayacha komocha". I'm sure the assimilated Jews here on this board or elsewhere, don't have the same feelings towards their fellow Jew. Why should they? After all this is a mitzvah in the Torah and they don't believe in Torah. As a matter of fact charaydim from all over the world would be on the first planes out to be moiser nefesh for their brethren in
Israel.(or anywhere BTW). This was done in the past many times. But as I wrote above, now to Yeshiva learners it's bitul Torah.
You could argue "don't they have to learn how to shoot a gun"? Yes they should go to learn that. I'm sure if they were approached with the idea of "hey people you got to learn to protect yourselves, they would do it.

38

 Mar 03, 2014 at 08:17 PM Realistic Says:

Reply to #2  
The_Truth Says:

Umm, isnt this a re-hash of the asifa that was planned & cancelled a few weeks back? How will this be different?
Judging from the photos of the even in Israel, there was little (if any) support from the chassidish groups. Will it be just the opposite in NYC?
What is the goal of such a protest? Just for protests sake?

The Chasidishe Groups in Israel were standing in a different place, not in the main center, so that's why you didn't see any pictures of them.

39

 Mar 03, 2014 at 08:22 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #11  
shlomo G. Says:

some backround info
1. its " not " under any one org. similar to the one in eretz yisroel
2. the moetzes got clear urging from maran rav shteinman & rav chaim shlita to make this tefilla just as they fully supported the e"y one
3. the 3 conditions were and are - no dais its not a time for kovod/ no speeches its expected that each rav will speak to his kehilla on shabbos/ that this is NOT a machoh - klal yisroel koach is bepeh
4. last time when the chassidishe rebbes wanted the gathering it was to be a protest and rav shteinman was not really in agreement
rav shteinman shlita is " leshitoso" that the fact that hashem is letting a few heads of state turn the torah world upside down is a " patch" fun himmel and we must turn our attentio to the kol hashem ( lapid and bibi are the shluchim)
5. its 2 pm at water street
6. regardless of what you feel to daven with a 100,000 people ( or whatever number it will be) is a huge hisorerus
7 the conference call with the moetzes was on wed - it took till shabbos to get the permit

Nice dreams, 100,000 people?

Can you figure out from where?

Satmar is not going to attend if it's not a protest.
If Satmar is not attending, a lot of Chasidishe Kehilos are in question.
The Litvishe are very confused from getting mixed messages and threats from Israel
I doubt Chabad will attend.

So I can hardly find 5,000. please explain.

40

 Mar 03, 2014 at 08:22 PM hashomer Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Anyone who denies the primacy of Torah and the importance of supporting Torah study is a Kofer. Period

There is no Torah studying if there are no Jews to protect the buchers. In America frum Yidden are protected by the US army and local police. Who protects the charedi in EY? The IDF. PERIOD.

41

 Mar 03, 2014 at 08:48 PM anonymous Says:

How history is falsified. The Satmarer escaped with the help of the "tyzionym goyishe Sochnuth", represented by Rudolf Kastner and bought ticket arranged by the deep pockets of Satmarer Chasidim and so did the Belzer Rebbe. However trainloads and trainloads of men with peyes and black hats and small children and their mothers but did not have deep pockets and went to the gas chambers of Birkenau. Yes, these treifene Tzionym helped two Rebbes to escape and fought the Nazis from El-Alamein to Northern Italy. Of course fighting causes casualties and we want to avoid that instead we argue about a suge and dance a mitzvah tanz. Now fight to the death for avoding the draft. Reminds of an Italian proverb. Se il nemico vieno andremo di la e se il nemico non viene , combattermo fino alla morto. Translation "if the enemy comes here we go there and if the enemy does not come we will fight until death. The modern day yeshivishe heroes

43

 Mar 03, 2014 at 09:02 PM Sociologist Says:

This whole thing is so embarrassing.

44

 Mar 03, 2014 at 09:06 PM Great Party modified Says:

I wish to clarify post #20.
Some photos show people that were very serious and were focused on the issue, not fun. Most seem to just be having fun.
The decision of whether this was bitul Torah should be made by the RBSO. I can only say what it seemed to be. There were many Gedolim there but I do think the young happy chevra were not on the same level of seriousness and learning as the Gedolim.

45

 Mar 03, 2014 at 09:13 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #21  
berelw Says:

this is getting crazier by the day....this is a chilul hashem....the people behind this is the harcore anti Zionist chasidim i.e. satmare and the hardcore litvishe...most normal people in between do not support this at all.

I once heard a quote that 25 percent of Yidden have mental health issues, I now believe it!

46

 Mar 03, 2014 at 09:19 PM Facts1 Says:

Reply to #21  
berelw Says:

this is getting crazier by the day....this is a chilul hashem....the people behind this is the harcore anti Zionist chasidim i.e. satmare and the hardcore litvishe...most normal people in between do not support this at all.

Hey a picture speaks more then a 1000 words, the pictures I've seen look like normal people in between. There were even pro zionist Rabbi's and even the chief Rabbi's were there.

47

 Mar 03, 2014 at 09:25 PM byebye Says:

feel so good 2 b a cheilek in such a klal yisruel where we all go biachdis and pray 2 hashem 2 b mivatel all shlechta gizeiros, chasidish, litvish, sfardish and so on

48

 Mar 03, 2014 at 09:33 PM PashutehYid Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Anyone who denies the primacy of Torah and the importance of supporting Torah study is a Kofer. Period

Exactly, because it is supposed to teach us midos, and that we are all equal.

49

 Mar 03, 2014 at 09:36 PM Mark Levin Says:

Reply to #1  
5TResident Says:

Anyone who attend this is a traitor to Eretz Yisroel and the Jewish people. Period.

So stay home!

50

 Mar 03, 2014 at 09:38 PM Mark Levin Says:

Reply to #3  
Facts1 Says:

"Agudath Israel stressed in their press release, that although they are providing information regarding the planned mass prayer event, the gathering is not being organized under the auspices of Agudath Israel of America. "

Oh, they are afraid to take stand??????? Is it not PC to do?

No, if they are involved officially then others wont be. Dont think for a second that these people dont talk to each other.

51

 Mar 03, 2014 at 09:42 PM Mark Levin Says:

Reply to #19  
Anonymous Says:

This is what happens when the Chasidim don't teach modern Jewish History to their yungerliet. These healthy young men have no idea of the holocaust, no idea of how Israel was founded. They believe that the world started with their date of birth. The break between the Chasidim and the rest and incidently the majority of Yidden is now complete.

Go to uganda if you want modern israel. Thats the problem with you, you look at it as israel.

52

 Mar 03, 2014 at 10:00 PM sane Says:

Why must dirty laundry be aired in public?

53

 Mar 03, 2014 at 10:12 PM Professor Says:

Reply to #7  
Maven Says:

Of course we need to be united against the draft but the reasoning among Charedim differs.Aguda,Shas and the rest of the frum parties are pro Zionism pro Israel. Their yeshivas and Kollelim WERE financed by the Israeli government.Lapid and Lipman claim "enough is enough" you are sucking the economy dry its time to give back by joining the IDF.
Those who follow the Edah Hachareidis and Satmar don't participate in the elections refuse money for yeshivos and Kollelim don't want to join the IDF becuase a frum Jew does not belong there.Torah learning has nothing to do with this issue.The cop out for not joining the IDF becuase of Torah learning is being used ONLY by the frum Zionist.

As much as I disagree with yesterday's protest. I must say that it was a real Yom tefillah with no violence. Kol hakvod.
And when satmer and the eidah do a protest there is violence, bloodshed, and rock throwing. So

54

 Mar 03, 2014 at 11:01 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #51  
Mark Levin Says:

Go to uganda if you want modern israel. Thats the problem with you, you look at it as israel.

What an idiotic thoughtless comment.

55

 Mar 03, 2014 at 11:05 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #41  
anonymous Says:

How history is falsified. The Satmarer escaped with the help of the "tyzionym goyishe Sochnuth", represented by Rudolf Kastner and bought ticket arranged by the deep pockets of Satmarer Chasidim and so did the Belzer Rebbe. However trainloads and trainloads of men with peyes and black hats and small children and their mothers but did not have deep pockets and went to the gas chambers of Birkenau. Yes, these treifene Tzionym helped two Rebbes to escape and fought the Nazis from El-Alamein to Northern Italy. Of course fighting causes casualties and we want to avoid that instead we argue about a suge and dance a mitzvah tanz. Now fight to the death for avoding the draft. Reminds of an Italian proverb. Se il nemico vieno andremo di la e se il nemico non viene , combattermo fino alla morto. Translation "if the enemy comes here we go there and if the enemy does not come we will fight until death. The modern day yeshivishe heroes

The best and most eloquent posting on this subject.

56

 Mar 03, 2014 at 11:10 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #37  
The "real" Sabastion Says:

Let me explain something to you haters of chasidim and litfishe. First of all the learners are NOT NEEDED in the army. There are enough soldiers in the Israeli Army. They are even sending a lot of them off duty.
2, If there were G-D forbid a war or real need for "learners" to join they would run in a split second to get involved no matter in which way. Anyone who thinks otherwise doesn't know the facts. Torah Jew's fundamental inner core beliefs are "V'ohavto l'rayacha komocha". I'm sure the assimilated Jews here on this board or elsewhere, don't have the same feelings towards their fellow Jew. Why should they? After all this is a mitzvah in the Torah and they don't believe in Torah. As a matter of fact charaydim from all over the world would be on the first planes out to be moiser nefesh for their brethren in
Israel.(or anywhere BTW). This was done in the past many times. But as I wrote above, now to Yeshiva learners it's bitul Torah.
You could argue "don't they have to learn how to shoot a gun"? Yes they should go to learn that. I'm sure if they were approached with the idea of "hey people you got to learn to protect yourselves, they would do it.

Pure baloney and historical revisionism. During the 6 day and 73 wars it wasn't the Chasidim that ran to help Israel, rather it was the type of Jew that you people hate with a passion. Lehavdil when Iraq started to send SCUD missiles into Israel, the parents of the seminary students couldn't get them back to the safety of the States fast enough!

57

 Mar 03, 2014 at 11:30 PM sylmoss Says:

Reply to #3  
Facts1 Says:

"Agudath Israel stressed in their press release, that although they are providing information regarding the planned mass prayer event, the gathering is not being organized under the auspices of Agudath Israel of America. "

Oh, they are afraid to take stand??????? Is it not PC to do?

It's not PC to make a public spectacle of frum Yidden. We are protesting against our own in public for all the goyim and muslims to shep nachus!! Demonstrations b'chlal should not be our way. What have we been teaching our youth? The kids are loving this, they are loving the "freedom" from school, from responsibility, from reality.. this is fun. Sort of like "occupy wall street". It did not look nice on them did it? ..You are so concerned about bitul Torah, what is this if not bitul everything?! This is not going to change the government in Israel but it will change us and unfortunately not for the better.

58

 Mar 03, 2014 at 11:34 PM hmmmm Says:

Reply to #43  
Sociologist Says:

This whole thing is so embarrassing.

You know what's embarrassing ? One commenter put it down with his own experience. He was in the nachal chariedi. His superior or what ever u call it was respectful to them and woke up his comrades on shabbos for shachris, but he the superior walked out of the minyan to smoke a cigerete ON SHABBOS. So there you have it. The medina doesn't need chareidim in the army. They need them so they can shmad them. That's what's embarrassing. Are we Jews , are we promoting Jewish values in the Jewish land? Make a brigade that truly respects and nurtures jewish values , customs and Halacha , why is the shomer mitzvah looked down and spit at. Why is gay rights so holy in this Jewish army. That's what's embarrassing!!

59

 Mar 03, 2014 at 11:42 PM Anonymous Says:

I am not going if R' Lezer Ginsburg is leading the tehillim. I will be able to hear him all the way to Brooklyn.
Eventually the chareidim are going to have to compromise somewhat to save the masses. Why can't they give up those who are not in yeshiva anymore, those who drink coffee all day and those who are working but are signed up as part of the yeshiva. Let them peel potatos, work in hospitals wash the floors. Why are they given a free ride and why are the yeshivas protecting and lying for them while the hesder boys have to give up 3 years of their lives.
In respect for my hesder cousins I will not attend this asifa

60

 Mar 04, 2014 at 12:11 AM Deveee Says:

If the reform and the reform-lite (mizrachists) on here are going bonkers, it must be a good thing.
We have gedolim and they decide what's right and wrong.

61

 Mar 04, 2014 at 12:22 AM LiberalismIsADisease Says:

Reply to #54  
Anonymous Says:

What an idiotic thoughtless comment.

sorry, you one downed him on the thoughtless. yours was worse!

62

 Mar 04, 2014 at 12:24 AM LiberalismIsADisease Says:

Reply to #46  
Facts1 Says:

Hey a picture speaks more then a 1000 words, the pictures I've seen look like normal people in between. There were even pro zionist Rabbi's and even the chief Rabbi's were there.

You OBVIOUSLY have no clue in the world what you are talking about! Just about EVERYONE, with the exception of the MOs, are for this.

63

 Mar 04, 2014 at 12:25 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #39  
Anonymous Says:

Nice dreams, 100,000 people?

Can you figure out from where?

Satmar is not going to attend if it's not a protest.
If Satmar is not attending, a lot of Chasidishe Kehilos are in question.
The Litvishe are very confused from getting mixed messages and threats from Israel
I doubt Chabad will attend.

So I can hardly find 5,000. please explain.

ok so stay home. you will probably daven for the sonay yisroel anyway.

64

 Mar 04, 2014 at 02:10 AM Just as Jewish Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Anyone who denies the primacy of Torah and the importance of supporting Torah study is a Kofer. Period

Where does it say in the Torah that some Jews are more Jewish than others and that the ones who study do not need to defend themselves against enemies but other Jews must die for them and also support them with their hard earned money while they do not work and pay taxes? No Where! David Hamelech, Macabees, etc. fought, and all Jews fought when needed. They did not have such outright blatantly absurd superiority complexes. Delusional of these people to believe Hashem supports their need to have fellow Israelites be on the front fighting while they relax at home with their government paid for goods and services. I do not want ANY Jew to go to war. Bunch of fake frum we have here is all.
Finally, why do they spit on the soldiers who want to serve? That is OK? Gross low life people do such disgusting things, not Torah scholars.
Finally, you are ONLY safe per Hashem wants you to be, so that is why you run from serving but God sent terrorists on your busses and missiles into your cities. Go to war and that won't happen.

65

 Mar 04, 2014 at 02:11 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #60  
Deveee Says:

If the reform and the reform-lite (mizrachists) on here are going bonkers, it must be a good thing.
We have gedolim and they decide what's right and wrong.

Not so Gedol as they are to you .

66

 Mar 04, 2014 at 02:41 AM Jew Jewisher Jewishest Says:

Reply to #17  
Maven Says:

You meant " a traitor to Israel". Eretz Yisroel is our beloved place its called the palterin shel melekh (palace of the king) and to do a sin in the palace of a king is much worse then outside the palace.
If you think that hashem has nachas of such a medina with so many people living in sin were the mere existence is a rebellion against the almighty,you are terrible mistaken.

Hashem did not tell you, specifically, if he does or does not have nachas from there being a Jewish state, where people can visit the Wailing Wall and other places of kedusha. So do not tell anyone they are mistaken since you are not Hashem and he did not give you a personal message to deliver. That is YOUR message, not God's. Sin, now let talk of sin. Yes there are sinful people in Israel and Jews do sin, which is why we have a beis din, to decide when someone is a thief, a murderer, etc. Some chareidim are also sinners, adulterers, dishonest in business, molesting children, the whole gamut. Yea they wear that shreimel ( no halacha to wear a hot fur hat in a desert), but" al tistakel bikankan ella bima sheyesh bo." Do not look at the bottle ( outer) but what is in it( neshama). So go ahead and make your stupid accusations against hard working, honest, and loyal husbands who protect you, because YOU think wearing short sleeves or none at all is the biggest of all sins to Hashem, and you do not allow an 8 year old child to do that! But raping, you will raise money to protect a rapist. I want to close by telling you Hashem has ways to bring the war to you, if you don't go to it

67

 Mar 04, 2014 at 04:43 AM Trolly_McTrollerston Says:

I wish i could recall the source, but I'm sure every one knows of the famous story where the Satmar Rebbe, R' Yoel, Z"L was approached by a reporter regarding Israel. The gist of the response of the Rebbe was that he was not negative regarding the medina. After the reporter left the shamas was confused as he knew the Rebbe's staunch anti-medina position.
The Rebbe informed that his vehement anti-medina position notwithstanding, when interacting with the outside world we can't afford to show a untied front in support of Israel.

Ve hamayvin yavin

68

 Mar 04, 2014 at 05:15 AM sndinc Says:

bad enough this happens in israel but bring this idiocy to the usa what a chilul hashem . so typical of the agudah hope no one participates in this travesty

69

 Mar 04, 2014 at 07:53 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #62  
LiberalismIsADisease Says:

You OBVIOUSLY have no clue in the world what you are talking about! Just about EVERYONE, with the exception of the MOs, are for this.

Everyone? Ha, if you live in the ghettos of BP, WB, it's everyone. There is a huge Jewish world outside of your daled Amos, mister.

70

 Mar 04, 2014 at 08:26 AM IDF vet Says:

This is all a crock. These kids just want a free ride. If all of these kids were trully sitting in learning the world would be a better place (go by any beit midrash and you will see them hanging out outside, smoking and on there phones - many and not learning nor can they). Sof, sof, they don't have the guts or fortitude to go through toranut, crawl through mud and take a 40 km hike with full battle gear. We all served and our kids are serving. We went in "frum" and came out the same way. You can daven three times a day and even find time for some learning. Occasionally get home for Shabbat and usually get home for the chagim. And want in on a secret? There is even some kiruv work going on at a very basic leve, chayal to chayal.

71

 Mar 04, 2014 at 08:33 AM Sociologist Says:

Reply to #60  
Deveee Says:

If the reform and the reform-lite (mizrachists) on here are going bonkers, it must be a good thing.
We have gedolim and they decide what's right and wrong.

Yup, no reason to use your brain and decide for yourself.

72

 Mar 04, 2014 at 10:06 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #60  
Deveee Says:

If the reform and the reform-lite (mizrachists) on here are going bonkers, it must be a good thing.
We have gedolim and they decide what's right and wrong.

Vyomer esav yesh li rav. Esav also blamed it all on das torah. When gedolim are bullied by extremists (such as R Aron Lieb was when he proposed practical solutions like vadas tal and nachal charedi) that is surly not called das torah

73

 Mar 04, 2014 at 10:11 AM anonymous Says:

Reply to #51  
Mark Levin Says:

Go to uganda if you want modern israel. Thats the problem with you, you look at it as israel.

You should have long ago moved to Uganda . What are needed stiff rubber batons and smash a few heads of these leidegeier and that would settle the matter. The mishtara has enough manpower

74

 Mar 04, 2014 at 10:13 AM anonymous Says:

Reply to #62  
LiberalismIsADisease Says:

You OBVIOUSLY have no clue in the world what you are talking about! Just about EVERYONE, with the exception of the MOs, are for this.

It is liberalism which supports your parasitic life

75

 Mar 04, 2014 at 10:53 AM HeshyEmes Says:

1. If for no other reason, simply for "Dina d'malchusa dina", anyone who lives in Israel has to obey the law & register for the draft. If the chareidim have issues of "shmad" & tznius the issues can be addressed. There would be enough frum people in the military to "protect" these "vulnerable children". Claiming that the Medineh is treif & continuing to live there under the IDF protection is hypocrisy.

2. You can't expect the non-frum to accept that Charedim are doing more than enough to protect the country by learning; remember (this is a little tricky), we are talking about the non-frum who don't believe in the Toireh protecting everyone. So how is it fair to tell the non-frum to keep on sacrificing, and we'll do the "real" protection by learning?

In Krias Shma, V'huhavtu seems to command us to learn all the time. V'huyeh then talks about our crops growing if we keep the mitzvoth. But if everyone is learning, who is plowing and gathering? I once heard pshat that V'huhavtu is singular, talking to the Yuchid. An individual can make the decision to forgo Gashmius & only do Avoideh. V'huhu is addressed to the Rabbim; the Rabbim need parnasah & need to go to work.

76

 Mar 04, 2014 at 11:50 AM anonymous Says:

Reply to #51  
Mark Levin Says:

Go to uganda if you want modern israel. Thats the problem with you, you look at it as israel.

All is needed a few good rubber truncheons and water cannons and they will run like scare chickens and those with a blue passport can come back to the good old USA and go back on the farsholtene socialist leftist section 8, food stamps and everything they get hold off and live happily ever after in the heilige kollel

77

 Mar 04, 2014 at 01:23 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #67  
Trolly_McTrollerston Says:

I wish i could recall the source, but I'm sure every one knows of the famous story where the Satmar Rebbe, R' Yoel, Z"L was approached by a reporter regarding Israel. The gist of the response of the Rebbe was that he was not negative regarding the medina. After the reporter left the shamas was confused as he knew the Rebbe's staunch anti-medina position.
The Rebbe informed that his vehement anti-medina position notwithstanding, when interacting with the outside world we can't afford to show a untied front in support of Israel.

Ve hamayvin yavin

This has to be a myth, though there is a time and place for everything.

78

 Mar 04, 2014 at 01:25 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #75  
HeshyEmes Says:

1. If for no other reason, simply for "Dina d'malchusa dina", anyone who lives in Israel has to obey the law & register for the draft. If the chareidim have issues of "shmad" & tznius the issues can be addressed. There would be enough frum people in the military to "protect" these "vulnerable children". Claiming that the Medineh is treif & continuing to live there under the IDF protection is hypocrisy.

2. You can't expect the non-frum to accept that Charedim are doing more than enough to protect the country by learning; remember (this is a little tricky), we are talking about the non-frum who don't believe in the Toireh protecting everyone. So how is it fair to tell the non-frum to keep on sacrificing, and we'll do the "real" protection by learning?

In Krias Shma, V'huhavtu seems to command us to learn all the time. V'huyeh then talks about our crops growing if we keep the mitzvoth. But if everyone is learning, who is plowing and gathering? I once heard pshat that V'huhavtu is singular, talking to the Yuchid. An individual can make the decision to forgo Gashmius & only do Avoideh. V'huhu is addressed to the Rabbim; the Rabbim need parnasah & need to go to work.

That's not really emes.

The Chareidim were there long before the Zionists imposed themselves on the land. The very least the Zionists can do is to leave the Chareidim alone and not make them serve and allow them to work as any normal country does.

Nobody asked anyone to sacrifice, and there is certainly no reciprocal obligation on the Chareidim. The Zionists decided they wanted to play country, so that's their problem.

79

 Mar 04, 2014 at 02:03 PM Anonymous Says:

My family works and these kids smoke, drink vodka, and dance. AND I HAVE TO PAY TAXES FOR THIS??????

They each have a cell phone and call internationally. Who pays since no one works?

80

 Mar 04, 2014 at 02:37 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #78  
Anonymous Says:

That's not really emes.

The Chareidim were there long before the Zionists imposed themselves on the land. The very least the Zionists can do is to leave the Chareidim alone and not make them serve and allow them to work as any normal country does.

Nobody asked anyone to sacrifice, and there is certainly no reciprocal obligation on the Chareidim. The Zionists decided they wanted to play country, so that's their problem.

Somewhere in history I seem to recall NO ONE was allowing Jews into their country, knowing full well that they were being gassed. VOILA we now have a country, but we have people who like Pharoh have a poor memory or choose to forget. I just adore the line about "playing at having a country" as I suppose all the cities and all the farms and the military and the parliament, all of it is a video game, not real. So why not join the fake army and fakely die? PLAYING with not a full deck is more apropro a description of this commenter. HELLO. You are NOT frum.

81

 Mar 04, 2014 at 06:26 PM Shanda Says:

Reply to #80  
Anonymous Says:

Somewhere in history I seem to recall NO ONE was allowing Jews into their country, knowing full well that they were being gassed. VOILA we now have a country, but we have people who like Pharoh have a poor memory or choose to forget. I just adore the line about "playing at having a country" as I suppose all the cities and all the farms and the military and the parliament, all of it is a video game, not real. So why not join the fake army and fakely die? PLAYING with not a full deck is more apropro a description of this commenter. HELLO. You are NOT frum.

I love your last comment. He is frum, he is just not Jewish.

82

 Mar 06, 2014 at 11:10 PM Real Sebastion Says:

Reply to #56  
Anonymous Says:

Pure baloney and historical revisionism. During the 6 day and 73 wars it wasn't the Chasidim that ran to help Israel, rather it was the type of Jew that you people hate with a passion. Lehavdil when Iraq started to send SCUD missiles into Israel, the parents of the seminary students couldn't get them back to the safety of the States fast enough!

Baloney. They all volunteered.

83

 Mar 09, 2014 at 09:59 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #1  
5TResident Says:

Anyone who attend this is a traitor to Eretz Yisroel and the Jewish people. Period.

and anyone who listens to 5TResident is a traitor to the torah

84

 Mar 09, 2014 at 10:03 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #75  
HeshyEmes Says:

1. If for no other reason, simply for "Dina d'malchusa dina", anyone who lives in Israel has to obey the law & register for the draft. If the chareidim have issues of "shmad" & tznius the issues can be addressed. There would be enough frum people in the military to "protect" these "vulnerable children". Claiming that the Medineh is treif & continuing to live there under the IDF protection is hypocrisy.

2. You can't expect the non-frum to accept that Charedim are doing more than enough to protect the country by learning; remember (this is a little tricky), we are talking about the non-frum who don't believe in the Toireh protecting everyone. So how is it fair to tell the non-frum to keep on sacrificing, and we'll do the "real" protection by learning?

In Krias Shma, V'huhavtu seems to command us to learn all the time. V'huyeh then talks about our crops growing if we keep the mitzvoth. But if everyone is learning, who is plowing and gathering? I once heard pshat that V'huhavtu is singular, talking to the Yuchid. An individual can make the decision to forgo Gashmius & only do Avoideh. V'huhu is addressed to the Rabbim; the Rabbim need parnasah & need to go to work.

Regarding your idiotic comment #1, first of all, it isn't dina dmalchusa. At least not yet. Some in government want to CHANGE the law. Are you intelligent enough to grasp that?
Plus, did you ever learn about the rabbonim (including those of such stature as Rabbi Akiva) who taught torah DESPITE the decrees of the Roman government. What about dina dmalchusa there?

85

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