New York – In an interview that aired on Zev Brenner’s Talkline radio program last night, MK Rabbi Dov Lipman discussed his views on last week’s Million Man March in Israel, what he views as misconceptions about the Chareidi draft and offered a special request for today’s Atzeres Tefillah in Manhattan.
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Lipman scoffed at the notion that the new draft law was designed to take away from Torah values, noting that last week’s gathering in Jerusalem was an “atzeret,” a prayer rally and not a “hafgana,” a demonstration. Defending the new law as very much pro-Chareidi, Lipman outlined the terms of the new legislation.
Listen to the full radio interview below:
“Right now anybody who is in draft age in the Chareidi world, if they don’t serve, they are not allowed to go to work, so you have tens of thousands of people who are not allowed to go to work and support their families legally even if they want to. The law says that anyone aged 22 and over, because of the fact that they were brought up in this culture…they are allowed to go to work without serving.”
Lipman emphasized that after the law is enacted on Tuesday morning, 30,000 members of the Chareidi community ages 22 and up will receive letters informing them that they can go to work without any fear of being brought up on criminal charges and that there will be thousands of jobs, as well as numerous government programs, set aside to train these new entrants to the work force.
According to Lipman, the new law, which is on the books at the Knesset and is accessible to all, has a goal of having an additional 2,000 Chareidi young men enlisting in the army annually by the year 2017, a number he claims is realistic and attainable.
“There is a process and there are reasonable goals every single year for the Chareidi community to meet and I can tell you those goals are going to be met,” insisted Lipman.
Asked why there has been so much opposition to the new law, Lipman opined that the notion of having young Chareidim who are not completely committed to full time learning leaving their yeshivos is difficult for some.
“What happens when all of a sudden the doors to go open up and work are opened to these guys and 10,000 or 15,000 leave, what does that mean in terms of the yeshivas? They get paid money from the government based on the number of guys that they have. What does that mean for the Chareidi political parties and their power base that has always been just getting money for yeshivas and kollel…It is a shakeup for the Chareidi community. Change is difficult.”
“There is an issue of control here,” added Lipman. “There is an issue of power and that is certainly playing a role here.”
Lipman was quick to note that the only potential for Chareidim facing jail time for refusing to serve in the IDF was if the quota of 2,000 new Chareidim enlisting per year is not met, saying that the law would have to applied equally to all segments of the population.
“We are one nation…you can’t have different laws for different groups.”
According to Lipman, many secular Israelis are also opposed to the new draft rules for Chareidim, saying that exempting anyone at all from the draft is unfair. Lipman considers the fact that both Chareidi and secular Israelis are voicing their displeasure a vote of confidence in the new legislation.
“We knew going in that we had to compromise,” said Lipman. “We said it from the beginning – it had to be right down the middle. And if the secular community is upset and the Chareidi community feels that they have to daven about it and cry out about it, it seems like we found the right middle ground.”
Lipman also noted that there were various options available to Chareidim who enlist, including doing national service with entities such as Magen David Adom and Zaka and offered a suggestion of his own for the New York Atzeres Tefillah.
“When you pray for everything we are doing here that seems to be wrong, maybe put in a prayer for the soldiers also, who are defending everyone who is here…Show them you are part of am yisroel. Show them that we are one nation. Show them that even if you choose to learn Torah as your service to am yisroel, that you appreciate the soldiers and that would be the greatest Kiddush Hashem.”
Please stop giving this misguided soul publicity. That’s the last thing he needs.
He’s certainly right about the chareidi parties scared of losing their power base. Both sides have an argument and there’s room for reasonable people to find compromise. Enough of the hysteria.
I won’t get into if the draft is right or wrong. But this lip man is a direct salesmen for lapid
Notwithstanding the insinuations of Dov Lipman that the opposition to the draft law is based on power, money and political considerations, I beg to differ. The imposition on the Charedi community of an artificial and arbitrary quota system whereby the Charedi Community is responsible to cough up 2000 souls per year to the military is a notion that as an American, I find offensive. Unfortunately Dov Lipman has renounced his American Citizenship and drank the Israeli Socialist Kool Aid. Personal Freedom, Liberty, and Lifestyle Choice are ideas that are protected in the US by the Bill of Rights. Unfortunately there is no Bill of Rights in Israel. This draft law is clearly an attempt at social engineering by government fiat and as such is inherently repugnant to any freedom loving free thinking human being. While I admire and appreciate the bravery and service of soldiers in the IDF, I believe that military service should not be compulsory anywhere on earth. If Dov Lipman wants to show real Hakoras Hatov to the IDF, Then he should advocate that it transform itself into a professional voluntary army like the US Military with appropriate remuneration for the service rendered.
In the spirit of geviha ben pesisa, here goes:
That the Zionists might finally abandon their cruel policy of denying charedim the right to work certainly does seem like a good thing.
But he continues:
“Lipman was quick to note that the only potential for Chareidim facing jail time for refusing to serve in the IDF was if the quota of 2,000 new Chareidim enlisting per year is not met, saying that the law would have to applied equally to all segments of the population.
“We are one nation…you can’t have different laws for different groups.””
This is where he is very wrong and where he is simply propagandizing.
First, he is ignoring the deal that Ben-Gurion made which very much meant different laws for different groups.
Second, he is ignoring that this is also done elsewhere. For example, the US has had “affirmative action” and “women’s rights” for decades. Even more appropriate here, Native Americans have a very different existence than the rest of the United States.
The Zionists came after the Chareidim and the Chareidim essentially begged the Zionists to go away and stop stirring up trouble and stop shmading them and the rest of our brethren.
Zionism is shmad and a disaster.
Finally, he admits in that quote that there is the potential of throwing Jews in jail for the crime of learning Torah. It is an extreme chutzpah and shocking that a Torah-observant Jew could even attempt to defend this. In a nutshell, this seems to be the proverbial “straw that broke the camel’s back”, resulting in this widespread international backlash against the Zionist government.
He is a puppet for Lapid. I heard his silly arguments on the zev Brenner show. He claimed Lapid loves chareidim. Its like the Judenrat telling fellow Jews that hitler loves jews.
It’s well known that China the world’s number one super power is waiting on the sidelines for their official invitation to the mideast quartet, while at the same time conducting backdoor diplomacy to stabilize and neutralize the middle east so that all countries will coexist in peace. China already wields the economic clout with the Arab states due it’s billions of dollars worth of bilateral trade agreements. Chinese chemical Co recently purchased Israel fertilizer chemical giant Agam Machtishim for a few billion dollars, and China dairy giant Bright Dairy China is currently in negotiation with Dairy giant Tenuvah Israel to acquire them for a few billion dollars. If China would propose to purchase the entire Israel for a few trillion dollars with all its industry but more so it’s technology, and intelligence sharing (which China needs more than ever in light of new wave of terror from within its borders) then the military conscription in Israel will become voluntary since China will send in a million troops to protect its interests. This will be based on the Hong Kong model one country two systems which would allow Israel to function status quo and the death penalty will be instituted for murder.
Other than that both flags will fly on public buildings and China will allow the Israel flag to fly a few inches higher than her own flag for the sake of social harmony which is paramount in China based on the analects of Confuscious. The Arab states would then need to answer to China and wouldn’t even need to recognize the state of Israel which will be a win win for Israel, China, and the Arab countries in the new world order. The Obama administration should get this going and broker the deal instead of having Kerry keep spinning his wheels. At least let’s give it a try for five years with the option to renew. China will offer social services and living subsidies to all residents in the West Bank who want to work and will provide jobs as well.
Jails should be reserved for criminals of the worst kind. We don’t put people who parked on the wrong side of the street in jail. To even mention jail for yeshiva students, is the product of the anti charedi crowd who put in place the punitive financial laws against the charedim in the first place. Those same laws are the problem they are dealing with now. So, instead of coming down from the tree, he is somehow trying to convince us, a new method of punitive measures, worse than the first. No wonder everyone is up in arms against it.
Here is the problem, money. Here is the solution, let them work. End of story.
So Lipman believes that Lapid is truly only interested in what is best for Charedim, is this why he cut funding for all Charedi Schools to a level below all other schools?
The rabbis are protesting the draft because they don’t want to loose funding according to Lipman. This is the most idiotic statement I ever heard. The rabbis don’t keep that money, they pass it on in the form of stipends to the students. Not only that bit in most cases they supplement those stipends with additional funds that they raise.
Lipman is Lapids token Orthodox Jew. His useful idiot. As a politician it’s not surprising that you try to deceive people, however, your blatant lies aren’t fooling anyone.
You got to be blind not to see the truth, its not a question enlist to the army or not,
just read about the history of Israeli governments and the army, the facts remain that the most important issue by them is to destroy yidishkeit, yaldei teiman is not forgotten, not allowing any part of yidiskeit in their schools is known, forcing soldiers to be mechalel Shabbos is familiar, and above all znus in the army is part of life, now let every one thing what he wants from his children. ????