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Postville, IA - OU To Remove Hechsher From Rubashkin If No New Management. Rabbi Weissmandel: My Hechsher Will Stay |
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"Within the coming days, or lets say a week or two, we will suspend our supervision unless there's new management in place," said Rabbi Menachem Genack, the O.U.'s head of kosher supervision.
Genack's comments came just hours after Iowa's attorney general filed criminal charges against Agriprocessors and its owner, Aaron Rubashkin, for child-labor violations.
Agriprocessors has been under the gun since a raid on May 12 resulted in the arrest of nearly 400 employees on illegal immigration charges. Following the raid, employees alleged they were shorted on pay, forced to work long hours and were the targets of sustained sexual harassment.
In May, the company announced that the Postville plant's manager, Sholom Rubashkin, would be replaced. Months later, Rubashkin is still a regular presence at the plant and no replacement has been named.
The attorney general's complaint represents the first criminal charges to be brought against the company's owner and senior management.
U/D 4:35
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Read Comments (136) — Post Yours »
1
Sep 09, 2008 at 03:46 PM YENTA PESHA Says:
it's all under hashgacha p'rotis!!!!
2
Sep 09, 2008 at 03:48 PM annon Says:
What a shame!! Rubashkin DOES NOT deserve this kind of treatment from anyone let alone from thier own Jewish brothers...
3
Sep 09, 2008 at 03:49 PM ML Says:
This might be the end of Rubashkin, unless they really make a change in management.
4
Sep 09, 2008 at 03:56 PM brooklyn rabbi Says:
deepthinker Says:
THIS HAS ALL THE EARMARKS OF A HIT JOB.
SOMEONE HAS PUT OUT A CONTRACT ON RUBASHKIN.
HE IS THE LARGEST SUPPLIER OF GLATT KOSHER MEAT IN THE U.S.
MY GUESS IS THAT IS AN UNHOLY ALLIANCE BETWEEN THE "ANIMAL RIGHTS" FANATICS AND THE NEW CONSERVATIVE "HECHSHER TZEDEK.'
09-09-2008 - 3:30 PM
================================================
Because he was the biggest producer in the usa is exactly he reason why he THOUGHT he was untouchable and can do whatever he wants.
He tried paying off everyone from the govnt to the kashrus agencies and look where all this go him. Think twice before you try to be machshil your own brothers and sisters
5
Sep 09, 2008 at 03:55 PM miamiyid Says:
time for a change !!!!!!!!
6
Sep 09, 2008 at 03:54 PM DR NO Says:
Isnt that Hechsher Tzedek's idea? Arent we HUGE hypocrites here?
Is the food Kosher or not? If you DO care for Chilul Hashem and Humane Practices - then wahts wrong with Hechsher Tzedek?
7
Sep 09, 2008 at 03:54 PM Anonymous Says:
Its so sad when you see Yidden rooting on the fall of a family that has provided Kosher for millions of people. What is it about this country that we like to build people up and then tear them down.
8
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:00 PM anon Says:
to 3:54 - Jealousy! We can't stand to see someone succeed.
9
Sep 09, 2008 at 03:58 PM Anonymous Says:
Now weez gettin serious here!
10
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:00 PM MARK Says:
rubashkin need a good pr agency not nat lewin the agudist idiot
11
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:00 PM Michal Says:
Shame on OU!!!!! I am not surprised that they are wimping out. It is unbelievable that they can be so gullible. I guess their high paying jobs and prestige win out over defending the rights of their fellow Jews. This will only spread more sinas chinam. If they succeed in removing their hechsher, they will only cause a chillul ha-shem.
May Hashem continue to bless the Rubashkin family.
12
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:01 PM Jack Gordon Says:
annon 3:48, I agree with you.
Take into account that they needed an outsider to make crucial decisions for them. What did they think till now? What changed? It just makes matters even worse.
Just like the old saying goes "kick 'em when they are down!"
It very shameful!!!
13
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:05 PM Anonymous Says:
Looks like now we cant trust the ou either
you mean to tell me that out of all the hechsheirim they give ONLY RUBASHKIN had out of all their thousand employees some minors working for them. In other words over the entire world only Rubahkin did such a "terrible crime?"?? Why are they only targeting the Rubashkins DOESNT SMELL RIGHT TO ME
14
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:35 PM Anonymous Says:
ask the ou, is THE MEAT KOSHER?
15
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:34 PM Anonymous Says:
FYI!!! they are targeting Empire and other producers as well, and the final goal is to bring the Jewish people to their knees...
The OU is getting big bucks to do what they are doing... the Rubashkin's couldn't out bid some shmucks out there...
this is dirty, and for no reason...
Hashem should help these special people get out of this fast and easy.
16
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:35 PM Anonymous Says:
Dear 4:30,Last time I checked, the A&P stopped carrying Agri and replaced them with a competitor. Just because someone is frum does NOT excuse them from having to pay the price if they do the crime. If you think that people should be absolved from having to be punished when they commit crimes just because they are frum, you have a SERIOUS problem. Furthermore, you need to seriously reexamine your moral compass.
17
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:21 PM wow Says:
one second this is charges or complain?
18
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:17 PM Anonymous Says:
Now Hechsher Tzedek could open there mouth..they will force the o-u to take off there hechsher in each company
19
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:17 PM Anonymous Says:
OH MAN
I CANT WAIT TILL THE OUHAS TO TAKE OFF THEIR HECHSHER FROM OTHER PRODUCTS THAT THEIR OWNERS WERE CHARGED WITH A CRIME
THE HIDDEN FILES AGAISNT THE OU WILL NOW BE MADE PUBLIC. THEY ARE TAKING A BIG CHANCE HERE
20
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:15 PM believe it or not Says:
Kosher meat shortage is real -- yom tov coming up and there will no meat.
21
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:30 PM Anonymous Says:
3:48...I guess yuo mean 4:14. If 4:14 doesn't want to eat their products, the A&P is having a special. Just your speed. You want Jews in Jail? Why? Because they don't wear the same levush or pray like you?
Next thing you'll all be crying that the price of meat & poultry is through the roof & demand far exceeds supply. Too bad, YOU did it with your petty jealousy & Sina.
Nice job, fellow "Frum Yidden!"
22
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:30 PM Actually Says:
Rubashkins is the only company under criminal charges currently under Ou supervision. If something "DOESNT SMELL RIGHT" it might be the meat
23
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:28 PM Yonason Says:
Don't more of you have anything serious to say about the allegations? What would your position be if they hold up? - I work for law enforcement (and wear a black hat) - and I am certaincan that charges such as this, especially the large number of them, would not be made lightly by a state Attorney General's office. Very sad . . . both Agriprocessors and many of the reactions here
24
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:28 PM Oh You Says:
OUch! This hurts.
25
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:26 PM Yosef Says:
The OU has to feel comfortable in a place. If the owners are criminals, then according to many poskim they have no reliability for kashrus. For those who don't care about criminal behavior, rabbi Weissmandel's hashgacha is good enough. The OU didn't respond before because they were just allegations. Once criminal behavior is likely, the OU must respond in kind. I don't work at the OU, but I heard them explain how they decide to pull hashgachos.
26
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:25 PM anon Says:
I have heard plenty of stories from a friend who certifies some out of the way plants under the OU - his feeling is that they are more concermed with collecting their fees than anything else - and like any good business where no one know the difference you cut corners to save money - they should really keep their mouths shut
27
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:40 PM Genius Says:
For chicken that is now about $10/ pound, i have stopped buying Rubashkin.
28
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:24 PM political analyst Says:
while I can't help feeling sorry for the rubashkins, I must say I haven't been eating their product for a while now due to serious kashrus allegations that were never properly addressed. comsumers have a right to know what's going on- & rubashkins have been less than forthcoming to put it mildly.
29
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:23 PM David Says:
Now that the OU is getting serious about getting Rubashkin to follow the rules and regulations of Kashrut and the US Gov't. I think I can finally trust the OU Hashgacha for kashrut again.
30
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:41 PM What does this have to do with the price of rice in China? Says:
What does a couple dozen kids who lied to work have to do with a hechsher?
Is the meat now not kosher because someone was 17 instead of 18 when he cut up the veal chops?
Who is OU in bed with?
Again, my friends, the question:
Who is OU in bed with?
31
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:14 PM Anonymous Says:
I can't believe that anyone is giving the Rubashkins ANY benefit of the doubt. This is a company that despite numerous warnings eagerly and willingly hired children to do industrial work. While it is legal for minors to engage in certain types of labor, working at a meat packing plant is certainly not one of them!!!
For those who think this is an attack on shechita, think again. The company was not charged with anything having to do with slaughter, despite the fact that their methods, to say the least are questionable.
For those of you who claim this is a hatchet job, perhaps. But they willingly walked into the trap. Although I do not take pleasure in anyone going to jail, especially yidden, I will be very happy to see these people go to jail and Agri go out of business ASAP!!! They are not the only producers of kosher product. They just happen to be the ones who use immoral and illegal methods to do so. Does Empire, Alle, A&H Rosenblatt, Wise etc. engage in these types of activities???
If anything, the OU has been asleep at the switch and should have revoked a long time ago!!!
I refuse to use their products...SO SHOULD ALL OF YOU!!!
32
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:11 PM ben weisz Says:
we should boycot the OU
33
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:51 PM Anonymous Says:
Dose the USDA remove itself ? so why the OU there is Kosher only
34
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:57 PM WIDOV Says:
Yidden,
This is sad.What we need to learn from this is to follow 'dina demalchisa'.America is a 'malchis shel chesed' but cannot allow big companies to break laws.
Sorry to say that once the trouble started the company should have handled the issue with more 'seychel'.This reminds me of the case with New Square, where they(new square) were screaming 'antisemiten', thinking it would help.Instead of making a deal/plea they ended up with a couple of people in 'tefisa' and 10 million fine
35
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:57 PM deepthinker Says:
SPINELESS COWARDS. WHO ASKED THEM TO PILE-ON THESE YIDDEN WHEN THEY'RE DOWN.
36
Sep 09, 2008 at 05:00 PM a reader Says:
rubashkin has made the front page of cnn.com what a kiddush hashem!!
http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/09/09/slaughterhouse.child.labor.ap/index.html
37
Sep 09, 2008 at 05:10 PM Anonymous Says:
http://www.state.ia.us/government/ag/latest_news/releases/sept_2008/Child_Labor%20.html
this is a criminal complaint based upon the idea that illegally working non-Americans can provide testimony in a criminal matter. from the PR by the Iowa AG:
According to the Affidavit: “All of the named individual Defendants possessed shared knowledge that Agriprocessors employed undocumented aliens. It was likewise shared knowledge among the Defendants that many of those workers were minors. The company’s hiring practices encouraged job applicants to submit identification documents which were forgeries, and known to contain false information as to resident alien status, age and identity.”
The Affidavit said: “Each defendant, either as principal or as aider and abettor, hired children, retained the employment of children observed working throughout the plant, and/or participated in efforts to conceal children when federal and state labor department officials inspected that plant.”
In other words, the allegations are based upon accusations, shared knowledge, essentially beliefs of illegality, (IE LH). how about a simple fact question such as, "did the company fulfill its legal obligation to check and record ID presented by prospective employees?" save the rumors for yom kippur.
38
Sep 09, 2008 at 05:12 PM Anonymous Says:
What happened to Innocent until PROVEN guilty???
39
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:59 PM anonymous Says:
I really can not believe that there are people taht are actually condoning Rubashkin and what he did.
They are the same type people that were on the Titanic as is was going down and they were looking to blame the pilot, instead of runnung for their lives.
Let us see who we can blame:
The unions
PETA
The workers
Hechsher Tzedek
The competition
Yudel Shain
The OU
but never, never Rubashkin
And for all of you that think I am a sonei Yisroel - I will lie down my life to save another Jew. Our religion is all we have to differentiate between us and the goyim. Being Jewish is our onlt ticket to Gan Eden, after 120 years. But I will not stand by when someone IN THE NAME OF YIDDISHKEIT says that it is alright to do what he did.
40
Sep 09, 2008 at 04:59 PM ano Says:
so now the ou seems to have courage
there sister group YU has a woman/man professer and they say nothing
they give us boruch lanner and coverup
but now with the rubashkins they suddenly have courage
i smell a rat
41
Sep 09, 2008 at 05:14 PM mechy Says:
Will people stop blaming anti semitism and instead focus on slopiness and bad judgement??
C'mon, it's becoming silly that no matter what we hear about Agri it always 'antisemiten'!
I wish them well, but they need to immediately get proffesionals to run the company!
42
Sep 09, 2008 at 05:24 PM anonymous Says:
Did you ever think that the OU is actually saving the company with this move?? Everyone tried helping them - they are incompetent in helping themsleves.. At least this way they will still own a company. The OU isn't stabbing them - they are saving them!@
43
Sep 09, 2008 at 05:40 PM Avraham Abba Says:
1. What's so holy about the OU?
2. Ladies and Gentlemen, let's eat meat and chicken ONLY on Shabbos and Yom Tovim. Watcvh prices plummet.
3. Jealousy should not play a role in rescinding a certificate and even if it does not, the OU is, as usual, respondig to public opinion, not to kashrus.
4. I am glad Rabbi Weissmandel has decided to only look at the kashrus, and at NOTHING else.
If he keeps giving a hechsher, that's fine with me.
5. The OU reminds me of some beis dins. It's not the law that matters, it's who you know and how much money you have, and how much they donate or slip you. Fakers.
44
Sep 09, 2008 at 05:47 PM yanky Says:
shame on ou it's time to dump them , theyre full of hot air
45
Sep 09, 2008 at 05:57 PM anonymous Says:
If Rubashkin gan get away with child labor and pay a few bucks less so that I can have cheap franks, KOL HAKAVOD TO HIM.
Being a slimeball in business has nothing to do with how much I trust him in kashrus.
46
Sep 09, 2008 at 05:56 PM Anonymous Says:
This is all part of the anti-chabad sentiment in the halls of the O/U! V'hamaivin yavin!
47
Sep 09, 2008 at 05:56 PM thinker Says:
why allways so excited to report bad on rubashkin and never a good word????!!!!!
STINKS!!!!
48
Sep 09, 2008 at 05:59 PM anonymous Says:
I am reading sall the posts. Many are repeats. Either Rubashkin is a malach or a liar. Take your pick and drink the kool-aid
49
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:03 PM Anonymous Says:
The O/u supports far more grievous ethical travesties in things they are involved in. They just keep it under the rug. What hypocrites to dump on Rubashkin that is not even being accused of crimes that the o/u perpetrates.
50
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:03 PM Anonymous Says:
Why is everyone crying?? Is this the end of kosher meat in the US? We have had kosher meat in this country for over 350 years. Schechita started here long before the Rubashkin family knew of the existence of the New World.
51
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:01 PM Michal Says:
To 5:24: There is no question that the OU is stabbing the Rubashkins in the back. I have lost trust and respect for the OU. If the OU turns their back on Agriprocessors, they along with the union and PETA will be responsible for their demise, C'V.
The OU is a spineless organization.
Yasher Koach to Rabbi Weissmandel for his courage in standing behind the Rubashkin family.
52
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:10 PM Curious Says:
It seems to me that if the OU had the oversight which we would expect from the agency providing the hashgacha, their people would have known everything that was going on in the plant (illegals, minors, abuse etc.).
So now we must ask 1) was there an issue (albeit not a kashrus issue) that they were ignoring, 2) maybe there was no problem and the OU is just bending to outside pressure 3) Maybe the OU saw the problems but because it wasn't a technical kashrus issue they did not make it public.
At this point there is no way to tell and I think its wrong to accuse either Rubashkin or the OU until all the facts come out.
53
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:26 PM Meatloaf Says:
To all those worried about the price of kosher meat: worry instead about what it means to be a Jew.
Worry instead about Jewish law.
Worry instead about Jewish ethics.
Worry instead about what we are teaching our children about kashrus when we support a company that violates Torah.
Worry instead for the future of the Jewish People if we are more concerned about a stickel of fleish then we are for the ethics of am hayehudim.
54
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:34 PM Y Says:
Unlike in other productions or food outlets, where an owner/operator of a business has to be trusted most of the time when it comes to kashrus, in the kosher meat industry its not so. The majority of operations are under hashgacha temidis every step of the way. That's how the system is set up & its quite hard to override or bypass the kashrus system.
That's why I don't buy the argument that because the owner is indicted it makes him untrustworthy.
Neither does it make any sense for the OU to punish Rubashkin for past policies that no longer exist, namely illegal aliens or minors as employees.
Has the OU given prior warning to stop the practice or else?
Is the OU convicting the current management without due process?
Or, Is the OU just using this lame excuse as a way to break the contract, because of other interests?
55
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:24 PM Anonymous Says:
anonymous Says:
comments - arrow If Rubashkin gan get away with child labor and pay a few bucks less so that I can have cheap franks, KOL HAKAVOD TO HIM.
Being a slimeball in business has nothing to do with how much I trust him in kashrus.
09-09-2008 - 5:57 PM
Is this a joke, so you have no problem with ethics as long as you get your product that you want for a good price?
Has the frum community completely lost its soul? It seems so, since many here do not think Rubashkin did anything wrong and would still buy his products even if all the allegation are true.
It seems so, sadly.
56
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:42 PM Anonymous Says:
It's not Rubashkin's job to check each document for forgery. His kashrus is 100%, period.
I wanna know who here ever checked the documents of their 'spanish' cleaning ladies (maids) or their help in each and every retail food store in 5 boros plus rest of the country? They are all illegals!
For some reason so many here get satisfaction from Rubashkin's demise, why? This is outright "sinas chinom".
The OU is removing their hechsher for political reasons. For me Rabbi Weissmandl is just fine, good bye OU.
I wander if the maids that clean the OU offices are documented or illegals?
57
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:35 PM Anonymous Says:
enough is enough i like my kosher meat and the more you fools talk the less of it there is. they are being charged with underage workers working at the plant. i was working when i was 12 life is tough some people cant give their kids everything. if those kids at 15-17 wanna work please let them. thats all they have them on. as for the illegals a bussines is not allowed to confirm the persons identity its illegal. so their is no way for them to know if they are illegals.
58
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:12 PM Duddy Says:
No one is crying for "them" we cry for “ourselves” as the price of kosher meat will sharply go up once this giant competitor is closed. If you didn’t notice, soon after the raid the price was hiked, now think what happens if it’s out...…….
59
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:12 PM Yitzchok Says:
You can no longer eat Rubashkin products! How can you trust the OU? They are not trustworthy, Mr. Rubashkin throw the OU out the window and bring in either OK or Kof K.
60
Sep 09, 2008 at 06:51 PM Michal Says:
to Meatloaf: Worry instead about blood libels
Worry instead about yidden who indict fellow Jews without just cause.
Worry instead about what we are teaching our children when frum yidden turn against their own.
Worry instead for the future of the Jewish people if we are more concerned about what the goyim think of us than we are about our fellow Jews.
61
Sep 09, 2008 at 07:35 PM Anonymous Says:
rov ganvim yisroel haim
DONT TO THE CRIME IF YOU CANT DO THE TIME.
62
Sep 09, 2008 at 07:27 PM Anonymous Says:
How do you eat a hechsher?? Maybe I should try sauteed plumbers.
63
Sep 09, 2008 at 07:25 PM in hashem we trust Says:
where are you all hates when Ice raid Howard industry
64
Sep 09, 2008 at 07:24 PM Anonymous Says:
If the OU removes the certification...I will no longer eat OU heksher
65
Sep 09, 2008 at 07:23 PM AuthenticSatmar Says:
I have lost all respect in the OU after this latest move. As for the leaglity, the OU is under contract with Rubashkin, and unless there are kashrus violations - which haven't been made, they can't walk.
I hope that Rubashkin exposes the OU for its true colors.
As for the allegations, Rubashkin asked the govt to identify any aleeged minors, yet they were unable to do so. This is nothing but a shrewd move by the prosecution. The Rubashkins will successfully defend themselves against the bogus charges. The govt has zero evidence, other than hearsay from a bunch ofillegals who purchased fake working papers. By charging them for the minors, and not about the alleged accomplice in forged documents, its obvious that it was a calculated move to besmirch the Rubashkins.
66
Sep 09, 2008 at 07:22 PM Anonymous Says:
I thought the Rabbis who visited the plant said everything is ok.
If we can't trust the RAbbi's what are we going to do? How are we going to survive?
67
Sep 09, 2008 at 07:50 PM Fluffy Dan Says:
I just called some friends, we are up to 15 people that will no longer patronize OU resteraunts. One friend is chickening out because he loves the food at Talia's, too bad, its a good place.
68
Sep 09, 2008 at 07:36 PM Yonason Says:
Michal, educate us: What does the Torah say about how a Yid is supposed to treat his workers, about following dinim of the Malchus, about business ethics? What have we become?
69
Sep 09, 2008 at 07:10 PM Anita Lane Says:
I wonder how many children have been injured & not reported or no medical care given in an attempt to cover-up the children working in the plant.
70
Sep 09, 2008 at 07:02 PM Fluffy Dan Says:
I am emailing the OU telling them how disgusting their behavior is. After, I am emailing every restaraunt with an OU telling them that if they still want my business, they have to change hashgachas. BTW, I have a corporate account, I spend an average of 40-70$ a lunch, and thats when I dine alone, I am allowed to have a guest each meal.
We have 11 frum guys in my office and each have meal accounts. All have agreed. We will not eat in an OU establishment if the OU pulls their hechsher from Rubashkins for reasons unrelated to kashrut
71
Sep 09, 2008 at 07:00 PM Anonymous Says:
How convieient for for ou to drop the hechsher as they they now have their hashgacha on emire meats.
money money money thats all it is.
72
Sep 09, 2008 at 08:07 PM Anonymous Says:
It seems no one here cares about the underage children working in dangerous jobs. BTY, there is evidence that rubashkin supplied the false documents themselves and had an office full of false documents for the workers to fill out. In addition the government has notified Rubashkin numerous times that the social security card were bogus, so the claim that rubashkin knew is not far fetched at all.
However there is allegation if one reads the whole indictment that Rubashkinn cheated them out of wages. Is that also okay as long as one get cheap kosher meats?
Rubashkin it seems caused this mess himself,
what really surprises me (or, to be honest it does not surprise me at all, since when I was a young bocher the yeshivas i went to were scamming the government left and right and even had the bocherim sign papers that they were working, when that was a blatant lie. I am proud to say I was the only bocher to refuse to participate in that scam)saddens me is that most people here don't care about anything as long as the food is kosher. You seem to have a very low moral value.
Since even if all allegation about rubaskin is true and you are convinced that it is true you see no problem with what he did, as long as it put cheap meat on you table, and of course the meat was mehadrin. Beis Shama would be applaud
by your attitude and kick you out of his beis medresh
73
Sep 09, 2008 at 08:13 PM PRL Says:
Re: " I thought the Rabbis who visited the plant said everything is ok."
Agri deceived the Rabbis who visited the plant (including Rabbi Mandel and Rabbi Elefant from the OU). On the tour, they only showed the Rabbis proper shechitah conducted by a shochet but two weeks later PETA caught on film general workers gouging the animals right after shechitah.
If the Rubashkins can't even be trusted to tell the truth to the Rabbis who went there to defend them, how can we ever trust them?
74
Sep 09, 2008 at 08:13 PM Anonymous Says:
Recently VIN reported that Empre is opening a new Meat product line and the Hecsher will be given by KAJ & Star K.
Why didnt the OU get the job??? are they not the the orginization supervising Empires Kosher poultry plants???
With this peace of news I would geuss that in the coniving unscruplus world of "Hecsherim" it pays for OU to disassociate themselves from Rubashkin in order to get the new Empire buisness.
ALL IN ALL OU USES THE MONEY MADE FROM HACSHERIM TO FUND THEIR OTHER ACTIVITIES
75
Sep 09, 2008 at 08:16 PM in hashem we trust Says:
the Ou is about to sign a new Contract with Hebrew National
76
Sep 09, 2008 at 08:19 PM brooklyn rabbi Says:
deepthinker Says:
THIS HAS ALL THE EARMARKS OF A HIT JOB.
SOMEONE HAS PUT OUT A CONTRACT ON RUBASHKIN.
HE IS THE LARGEST SUPPLIER OF GLATT KOSHER MEAT IN THE U.S.
MY GUESS IS THAT IS AN UNHOLY ALLIANCE BETWEEN THE "ANIMAL RIGHTS" FANATICS AND THE NEW CONSERVATIVE "HECHSHER TZEDEK.'
09-09-2008 - 3:30 PM
================================================
Because he was the biggest producer in the usa is exactly he reason why he THOUGHT he was untouchable and can do whatever he wants.
He tried paying off everyone from the govnt to the kashrus agencies and look where all this go him. Think twice before you try to be machshil your own brothers and sisters
=============================================
the ou WAS in bed for a long time with rubashkin but all that came to a halt when the feds walked in on them naked.
the ou has no choice because they can be held accountable too . What surprises me is that why they didnt pull out way earlier when they saw trouble.
I have my doubts now on the relabilty of the ou.
77
Sep 09, 2008 at 08:41 PM anonymous Says:
If the OU panders to the secular world it's time to boycott them. They forget that it's the observant yidden who support their company.
78
Sep 09, 2008 at 08:44 PM political analyst Says:
the OU is not the ACTIVE HASHGOCHA at AGRI, contrary to popular belief & the image the OU & AGRI project. The only one who wears the pants in AGRI (kashrus-wise) is R' M M Weissmandl. He is the ACTIVE HASHGOCHA & THE ONLY ONE IN CONTROL. The OU endorses AGRI based on their reliance of R' Weissmandl. The OU is just there for their strong & worldwide brand recognition.
Therefore if OU does withdraw their certifcation is shouldn't make one ounce of a difference for consumers in the kashrus standards considering the fact that the OU today doesn't make a difference. if you like weissmandl you're ok. if you don't like weissmandl but are relying on the OU, you've been warned
79
Sep 09, 2008 at 08:48 PM Anonymous Says:
That Rabbi Genack is awesome!!! If I wasn't a 12 year old illegal immigrant working in a plant with no time to spare, I would vote him for president!!! Genack 2008!!!!
80
Sep 09, 2008 at 08:50 PM yitzchok Says:
Let's all make a "maachoah" (proclamation) against eating in any restaurant under the OU supervision until such time that Menachem Genack asks "mechila berabim" from Mr. Rubashkin
81
Sep 09, 2008 at 09:18 PM brooklyn rabbi Says:
Michal Says:
To 5:24: There is no question that the OU is stabbing the Rubashkins in the back. I have lost trust and respect for the OU. If the OU turns their back on Agriprocessors, they along with the union and PETA will be responsible for their demise, C'V.
The OU is a spineless organization.
Yasher Koach to Rabbi Weissmandel for his courage in standing behind the Rubashkin family.
09-09-2008 - 6:01 PM
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your an ignoramous. of course weissmandel wont give up, its his bread and butter. hes not standing up for rubashkin hes standing up for his pay check
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Sep 09, 2008 at 09:18 PM brooklyn rabbi Says:
Michal Says:
To 5:24: There is no question that the OU is stabbing the Rubashkins in the back. I have lost trust and respect for the OU. If the OU turns their back on Agriprocessors, they along with the union and PETA will be responsible for their demise, C'V.
The OU is a spineless organization.
Yasher Koach to Rabbi Weissmandel for his courage in standing behind the Rubashkin family.
09-09-2008 - 6:01 PM
===============================================
your an ignoramous. of course weissmandel wont give up, its his bread and butter. hes not standing up for rubashkin hes standing up for his pay check
83
Sep 09, 2008 at 09:25 PM Shaul in Monsey Says:
Some of the comments here are ridiculous.
A 9000 count indictment hardly represents what anyone would describe as the government going fishing. What 9000 counts means is that the government has detailed employee records, and they are going to pursue this vigorously. Don't be surprised if after discovery, the Rubashkns plead out. Remember, the "geez your honor, I thought she was nineteen" defense doesn't work.
Rubashkin et al didn't build Agri so that they could do some great toiveh to klal yisrael. They built Agri to make money. Lots and lots of it. I'm not saying they aren't baalei chesed. I'm sure they are. But those who suggest that Agri was built as some sort of shrine to chesed are probably the deed holders to the Brooklyn Bridge.
The OU has every right to pull its hechsher. Like any owner of intellectual property, they have the right to protect their equity. In fact, they'd be fools not to. Agri today is a liability to any of its associates, corporate or otherwise. Just like Nike pulls its endorsements for personal misconduct of its spokespeople, OU can and should pull its hechsher if it feels its association with Agri is detrimental to the value of the OU moniker.
Speaking of Nike, these guys go to China and send teams of inspectors to factories checking and validating every employee, making sure that emplyee standards for health, cleanlines, living conditions, not to mention pay, are appropriate. In fact, many factories pass on Nike business because they just can't get certified by them. And those that do tell Nike that to meet these standards the factory will increase its prices. Nike has no problem with paying more. They understand that their brand equity is far more valuable than any profit model. Agri should have taken a page from Nike.
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Sep 09, 2008 at 09:24 PM Anonymous Says:
Yichok, I'll take you one step further!
Let's stop eating ANY food with the OU on the label, Restaurant, Grocery, Supermarket, Candy Store, etc.
Each and every one of us shall organize his whole family and ask his family to organize all the extended family and on it goes untill KLAL YISROEL is gonna stand up for this FARBISENE Chilul Hashem of the OU.
BTW, Where's Reb Yisroel Belsky with his outspoken concern and outrage about all AVLES in our midst but none about the shame in his own very office!
85
Sep 09, 2008 at 09:26 PM Milhouse Says:
Meatloaf wrote:
Worry instead about Jewish law.
Worry instead about Jewish ethics.
Worry instead about what we are teaching our children about kashrus when we support a company that violates Torah.
That's precisely it. I do worry about Jewish law and Jewish ethics, and I wouldn't want to support a company that violates Torah. Now show me where in the Torah it says that a person under 18 shouldn't be employed. I don't give a damn about what the state of Iowa thinks. (And don't bother quoting me anything about "dina demalchusa" unless you're prepared to PROVE 1. that it creates a positive obligation to obey the law; AND 2. that it applies to governments which do not have the power to expel anyone from their territory.)
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Sep 09, 2008 at 09:26 PM Michal Says:
To Yonason,
yes we are obligated to follow the laws of the land in which we reside. However, we are not obligated to follow laws that go against our own. The Torah obligates a Jew to deal with their workers with kindness and compassion, and the Rubashkins certainly have done so. In addition, according to Vayikra 25:43, we are commanded "not to rule him (slave) ruthlessly". This is certainly not the case here. The Rubashkins have given their workers higher wages compared to other meat packing plants, health insurance and safe working conditions as evidenced by the video of the rabbonim who came to visit the plant. The workers there did not complain of abuse, in fact, as I remember from the video they seemed very satisfied working at the plant. None of them expressed any complaints.
Yonason, personally I feel many of the posters are embarassed, and they feel they have to justify their feelings by going against their fellow yidden. They are blind and they are not willing to see the truth.
I believe what Yenta Pasha posted in the beginning. When all is said and done, everything that is happening is from Hashem, and he is testing out emuna and bitochon. Let's see who will pass the test.
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Sep 09, 2008 at 09:28 PM Babishka Says:
Did Rubashkin go to Guatemala and kidnap little toddlers from kindergartens, smuggle them into Iowa on slave trucks and then chain them to benches and force them to flick chickens in hot, unhuman cells?
Or did a bunch of teenagers show fake ID, and then make out multiple complaints, compounded by the minute like lawyer's fees, in order to claim a U-visa so they can stay in the U.S.
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Sep 09, 2008 at 09:33 PM Michal Says:
To Brooklyn Rabbi:
Sinas chinam is blinding you.
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Sep 09, 2008 at 09:43 PM Meatloaf Says:
“Michal Says:
to Meatloaf: Worry instead about blood libels “
You must mean Aldolpho – the young Guatemalan who lost a hand in meat grinder because Rubashkin failed to follow lockout/tag out machine safety procedures at Agri. That’s REAL blood libel.
“Worry instead about yidden who indict fellow Jews without just cause. “
9,317 citations of child labor violations sure sounds like “just cause” to me. But if that’s not enough for you wait for the Federal indictments which will come out tomorrow against two of the HR people arrested at Agri. Today.
“Worry instead about what we are teaching our children when frum yidden turn against their own.”
I guess you don’t believe we have an obligation to teach our children about dina malchusah dina. A thief is a thief, a liar is a liar and a cheat is a cheat. Tell me, did the frum yidden who bought apartments and were cheated out of their deposits recently, “frum yidden” who “turned against their own?”
“Worry instead for the future of the Jew