New York – OU Kosher Program Reaches Out To Satmar Of Kiryas Joel

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    Rabbi Moshe Perlmutter provides instruction in kosherization in Kiryas Joel.New York – The ASK OUTREACH program, which was specifically designed to put OU Kosher in contact with communities in the Torah world not part of its usual constituency, reached out in a most significant way last week, conducting a two-part hands-on session in kosherization for the Satmar Yoreh Deah Kollel of Kiryas Joel, NY.

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    ASK OUTREACH is made possible by funding from the Harry H. Beren Foundation of Lakewood, NJ.

    Under the direction of Rabbi Yosef Grossman, OU Director of Kashrut Education, and with Rabbi Moshe Perlmutter of Passaic, NJ providing the training, OU Kosher went to the Satmar Talmud Torah’s kitchen – capable of serving 10,000 meals daily — to illustrate foodservice kashering, performed in large kitchens such as those found in schools, hotels and catering establishments. The next day Rabbi Perlmutter demonstrated industrial kashering, performed in plants and factories, at Oasis Food Company in Hillside, N.J., manufacturers of margarine and other condiments.

    Some 20 members of the kollel, what Rabbi Grossman called “a very learned group,” participated. According to Rabbi Grossman, the group could have been as large as 100, based on interest in the community, if there had been space to accommodate them.

    Outreach to Satmar follows similar approaches to Chabad Lubavitch, Belz, Bobov, Vichnitz and Skver Chasidim, among other groups. “It was only a matter of time before we got to Satmar,” Rabbi Grossman said. “We were approached to demonstrate kashering. Rabbi Perlmutter has great expertise in this area.”

    In its study of Jewish law, the Satmar kollel seeks out practical applications of everything kollel members study, thus leading to the request to the OU.

    “It is clear,” declared Rabbi Menachem Genack, CEO of OU Kosher, “that in the Torah world, we have much more in common than what sets us apart. The range of communities that have availed themselves of ASK OUTREACH is living proof that the OU’s expertise spans the Jewish world, and that respect for our knowledge and its practical applications is a unifying force in the observant community.”

    Back in Kiryas Joel, the session in the Satmar kitchen, focusing on ovens, pots, kettles and other items, emphasized how to make a treif vessel kosher; as Rabbi Grossman pointed out, everything in the Satmar kitchen was kosher, but the techniques could still be demonstrated.

    “We received a very warm reception at Kiryas Joel and were made to feel right at home,” Rabbi Grossman said. He was pleased to see the OU symbol on food items in the Satmar kitchen.

    “We were very pleased to reach out to Satmar in our ongoing efforts to develop relationships with all segments of the Torah world who would like to benefit from our services,” Rabbi Grossman said. “We hope this approach to the Satmar community will be ongoing in future areas of mutual benefit.”

    Rabbi Perlmutter agreed. He noted that in kosherizing seminars he gives for the OU, this was “the only time it was totally Satmar and on their home turf, in their kitchen, with their own mashgiach participating.”

    Summing up their knowledge of kosher law as “phenomenal,” he said, “We both learned a lot from each other.”


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    20 Comments
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    Anonymous
    Anonymous
    15 years ago

    it’s high time that age-old and no more valid barriers should be eliminated. both satmar and the ou deserve tremendous credit for this. giving each other the respect and credit each deserves.

    machem
    machem
    15 years ago

    will KJ go onder the union now?

    Anonymous  sara
    Anonymous sara
    15 years ago

    I think its great like this we can all eat each others hashgoche with out fear

    baruch
    baruch
    15 years ago

    B”H

    we could learn alot from the ou .1st of all the are honost they the way it is.2nd the have a system.they know how to writte a report.rabbi genack and rabbi elefant are good people lomdim veanshei chesd.ksiva vechasima tova veshono tovah umesuka veshnas geula veyeshua.vesiyate dishmayo.for klal yisroel.

    danial
    danial
    15 years ago

    How nice it is to see satmar getting along with ou lubavitsh square and with all the gdolim of lakewood it is about time let achdis being us to our goal,let everone belive in what they belive,if someone wants to carry with an eirev let them don’t yell and abuse women who are carrieng on the st,it will be mkarev our geilah.

    Lock & Load
    Lock & Load
    15 years ago

    Rabbi Grossman said. He was pleased to see the OU symbol on food items in the Satmar kitchen.

    ————————-

    Lets get Real for 1 Minute here…..

    Satmars always ate OU Products.. As a matter of Fact even there Kosher for Passover Sugar and Salt are the OU Brands,,, They just repack it and Stamp the CRC on the Package….

    They all eat at the OU Restaurants all over the City…

    If you ever ask them How come you eat here, oh they use Ally Packing Meats…but the Kitchen is and all other Ingredients are OU!!!!

    So lets not Pretend here

    This is just a PR Stunt and Personally I can`t believe that the OU went along with it…..

    Lock & Load

    salt of the earth
    salt of the earth
    15 years ago

    Love it or hate it the OU is a model of openness and transparency for a Kashrus organization. Their policies and standards are documented and easily obtainable. While I wish they set their guidelines following opinions of Rabbanim who are more standard as opposed to Rabbis Schachter and Belsky who as great scholars are original and creative, the Satmar Hashgochos have much to learn from them.

    Leo
    Leo
    15 years ago

    Lock & Load, most product today have OU in “addition” to other koshe symbols. so what’s the big deal that Rabbi Grossman saw products with the OY Symbol?

    Lock & Load
    Lock & Load
    15 years ago

    Leo;

    Who is OY?

    Lock & Load

    Oy Gevald
    Oy Gevald
    15 years ago

    The OU is held in such high regard by the Satmars that when these otherwise restricted Chassidim travel out of KJ they buy anything bearing an OU even if the Heimishe Olam doesn’t eat those particular products. Case in point OU-D. Dunkin Donuts etc. Chasiddim have been found fressing away while plain old jewish folk with not-such-long-beards and payos know better. Half their problem in KJ is “ignorance”. They are so busy teaching restriction that they don’t educate their masses to what’s really out there. A demonstration like this only will further cause the Satmars to blindly eat anything OU.

    OU does not mean it’s Pas Yisroel.

    OU does not mean it’s Bishul Yisroel.

    OU does not mean a Mashgiach supervises production. Many products bearing OU only have periodic checks from the OU, sometimes months apart. Is that good enough? Yes, if you want to rely on those Kulos. Maybe it’s not necessary to be Machmir, but one does need to discuss with his local Posek what he should or shouldn’t eat from the OU.

    chaim perachia
    chaim perachia
    15 years ago

    Such a gevaldike zach to see the rabbunim cooperating. This is the kind of thing that brings us closer to moshiach!!!

    yankel
    yankel
    15 years ago

    I don’t see what’s the issue here? the whole shiur he gave was a stricly buissnes thing they charge a normal fee for this service.

    yenta pesha
    yenta pesha
    15 years ago

    it’s hashgacha pratis!!!!

    Anonymous
    Anonymous
    15 years ago

    TO : OY GEVALD ,

    GET A LIFE 🙂

    LES kid
    LES kid
    15 years ago

    I also know they have sponsored such groups as Conservative Rabbis who have taken classes with the RA. Keep up the good work!

    salt of the earth
    salt of the earth
    15 years ago

    Oy Gevald says: OU does not mean it’s Bishul Yisroel.

    Of course it does. It just doesn’t mean that potato products are Bishul Yisrael.

    DRE53
    DRE53
    15 years ago

    daniel wrote:

    “How nice it is to see satmar getting along with ou lubavitsh square and with all the gdolim of lakewood it is about time let achdis being us to our goal”

    you should have finished of as follows:

    “it is about time let them get along with their own brothers”

    avi
    avi
    15 years ago

    Rabbossai,

    Thjis is such a beautiful thing – let’s not ruin it with negative comment.

    Henei Ma Tov Umah Naim Sheves Achimm Gam Yachad!

    May this bring the geula much closer!

    bigwheeel
    bigwheeel
    15 years ago

    To oy Gevald! You are a spoilsport!!! Everyone (or, at least almost everyone, including this writer) is expressing how good they feel when they see cooperation and Achdus in the Jewish Community!

    I had some other, semi-negative (in the way of comparison) comments to make. But, seeing in how poor a taste your [strongly negative] comments are, I’ll refrain from imitating you!!!

    Anonymous
    Anonymous
    15 years ago

    I have worked in Kashrus for many years. I have been a mashgiach for the OU as well as Kof K as well as the Heimishe. There are many fairy tales out there. For instance, most people, including unfortunately some others in the industry itself, believe that everybody rubber stamps each other.

    While there IS a certain amount of acceptance of each other’s hashgachos, it is based upon knowledge of that organizations policies and rules. There are times when Heimishe will just add their names to an OU product.

    But…. There are MANY times when after they send in their mashgiach or verify policies and/or details they refuse.

    The facts are that the OU is NOT Bishul Yisroel on all things. They use Rav Belsky’s shlita, heter on canned goods. He holds that anything in a can will not be eaten by a king, and therefore does not require to be bishul Yisroel.

    Others while respecting R Belsky’s shita, hold that is the type of food. For instance Tuna. Kings will eat Tuna if cooked by their chefs. Therefore most of us will not eat canned non-bishul Yisroel tuna. But the OU says it is okay. If you go to the OU website, there you will see them honestly explain that their canned products are not bishul Yisroel unless so stated.

    So, when you see an OU on a can label, alongside a Heimishe hechsher with the words Bishul Yisroel, it was the Heimishe hechsher that insisted on it being Bishul Yisroel, and is providing the mashgiach.

    In those cases, it is the OU who ends up signing off on them.

    There is also a fairy tale that some of the Heimishe hecherim are not as knowledgeable as the major ones like the OU. While in some few cases that may be true, the big guys, like the Nirbarter and the Voleve REALLY KNOW THEIR STUFF, and are amazingly thorough rabbonim hamachshirim.

    There is much respect in the industry.

    I was talking to one of the rabbonim recently from one of the major “national” hashgochos. Another rov in the room, who is also a rav hamachshir came up to us, and made a negative remark about chassidishe hashgochos. This rov from the XX agency told him clearly, “Wrong! The Nirbarter and his brother are as good as they come. I wish WE could be on their level.”

    His mouth dropped open.

    So, let’s not put each other down. There are amazingly wonderful Heimishe & Chassidishe hashgochos, as well as all of us benefiting from the great work of the OU, OK, Kof-K

    All three of the above are great, as long as you check with them and find out what basis they used.

    Also, many who are really makpid on Bishul Yisroel need to find out even in restaurants, what hetering they use.

    For instance, there are those who allow a bulb in a commercial oven to be turned on by the mashgiach and considered Bishul Yisroel.

    Sepharadim may NOT rely on that at all, and many of us do not rely on that either.

    When is doubt, ASK. Speak to the mashgiach. If the mashgiach is a good one, he will be happy to answer. If he hesitates, or will answer your questions, don’t eat there.

    As a mashgiach, I used to get MANY phone calls and/or visits by customers asking me these questions. I never minded it. It is part of our job, in my opinion, to explain what the basis of our hechsher is.

    I wish there was an information panel on all “kosher” foods that explained these factors.

    Like, even if it is Cholov Yisroel, do they screen for milk from DA cows? or do they rely on the heterim.

    (if not Cholov Yisroel, for instance all OU-D, you must realize that it is NOT screened for milk from DA cows. They rely on bitul.)

    Best to learn the halochos and learn about today’s processes. Then you will be an educated kashrus consumer.

    But, don’t put anyone down. This cooperation is wonderful but not new. Whether or not y’all realize it, we have been cooperating all along. You can’t find a better group that Satmar for trying their very best to get it right, and to respect others who do the same. They will also gladly help ANY Jew out in any way. Just ask them. I have asked them for help, both in Kashrus issues and other matters, and have NEVER even sensed any hesitation.

    (To keep bringing up inside fighting among them, just as among many other groups, is mean-spirited and unjust. No, they are not perfect. But, I wish I were doing as good a job of being a good Jew as they are. Remember, due to their “high profile,” anything negative about them always is spread around like cream cheese. Could YOU stand up to that kind of scrutiny. Satmar Chassidim have always lived their lives like Gov Palin does now. Everything they say or do, or ever said or ever did, gets scrutinized and criticized.)

    It is Slichos time. Let’s enjoy this nice article, and see the good in it, not to look at it and search for something negative to say.

    Thank you VIN for this article.