New York – “Enough is enough!”
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That’s the basic message of a letter sent by concerned parents, former teachers, and former yeshiva students to New York City Schools Chancellor Carmen Farina and seven district superintendents in Brooklyn and Queens expressing upset over the lack of a substantial secular education in at least 39 yeshivas.
Fifty-two unidentified signatories added their names to the letter, noting that ultra-Orthodox schools, especially boys’ yeshivas, spend far less time on secular instruction compared to the time spent on religious education.
Organized by the nascent education advocacy group Yaffed, the letter asks officials to “investigate the quality of secular education and, in particular English instruction, at the listed yeshivas and to take steps to ensure that pupils at these yeshivas receive the essential and substantially equivalent education to which they are entitled.”
According to Yaffed’s press release, these haredi schools typically offer an average of one-and-a-half hours of general studies on a regular school day, and English and math is only taught until students reach the age of 13, at which point their secular education is terminated entirely. Some graduates have alleged this disproportionate education has led them to become professionally stunted, unable to obtain financial independence, or enter into successful careers.
Yaffed officials are pushing for extended instruction hours; expansion of secular instruction in other subject areas besides English and math; and continuing secular instruction even into high school, among other reforms.
In an effort to protect its supporters, Yaffed said it has withheld the names of the signatories and the targeted schools. The group has retained attorneys Normal Siegel and Herbert Teitelbaum to represent their interests with the New York City Department of Education.
It’s about time!!!
To all of you who are jumping on the bandwagon saying this org Yaffed is doing a good thing I would urge you to take a look who and what kind of a person/persons is heading it. These are the same people running around all over the net bashing and defaming orthodox jewery.
I see the guy in Monroe, was able to make $50 million without secular studies.
As was reported, the company’s founder, president and CTO Shloma Baum is a Satmar chasid, an ultra-Orthodox Jew from the town of Kiryat Joel, New York. As such, he is part of a growing movement of charedi startup entrepreneurs in both Israel and the diaspora. Ultra-Orthodox Jews are underrepresented in the hi-tech community, partially because they do not always receive a rigorous math and science education and in part because the hi-tech world likes to hire people in its own image: young, male, privileged graduates of elite army units in Israel or prestigious colleges in the U.S. Baum has also developed a filter for haredi Internet users to help them avoid looking at sexually explicit or otherwise inappropriate sites.
The rabbonim, askanim and parents who deny these children a basic secular education and providing them with the skills necessary to function in society and earn a parnassah are mamash engaged in a form of child abuse and should be held accountable. A generation of dysfunctional graduates from these yeshivos whose families have to be for public and private welfare to survive a living proof of this abuse.
This is old news the almost exact letter was written to Kaiser Franz Yosef in the 1800s by the maskilem and it was bitterly fought by all the Rabonim of the day including the Chsav Sofer.They are walking in the “Footsteps” of Moshe Mendelssohn and his ilk.
Lets hope these modern day Maskilem have the same downfall as there forefathers.
This should have been done 50 years ago. Sure parents have a choice where to send their children but they have an obligation to ensure employment for them in the future.
Wake up.
No English, math, science, history, geography are taught in New Square. How will these kids survive? My nephew is in 5th grade and can’t read simple sentences.
I hope Ms. Farina does not get involved in this private school matter. Parents are responsible for their children’s education. Keep church and state separate!!
Finally AlterG can learn to write English !
The cause that Yaffed allegedly espouses, upon its own merits may be noble, if the intentions were pure; And that alone is debatable – by bigger and better people than us commentators on VIN. However, unfortunately the people behind Yaffed are entirely self serving, and that is a beef they have personally with the ultra-orthodox community. These are OTD rabble rousers and are just looking to give our Yeshivos and Mosdos a bad rap as well as stir up some trouble for their former co-religionists. There is no nobility in this whatsoever. I encourage readers to research the people behind Yaffed and see what their true agenda is. It is sad that the Orthodox community has failed these precious souls and perhaps that is something we need to look into in greater depth, but that is a different discussion. It is not always the message ONLY that needs to be looked at. The messenger plays a big role. And we need to be careful as to who we support. Easy to cast blame on a whole society. Anyone that feels they lacked proper education, and didn’t see the value and values in their religious education, pick yourselves up by your bootstraps and hit the books. It is never too late. I had 60-70 year old classmates in my college classes. Time to stop pointing fingers and take responsibility for your life. Proceed with caution. Never a good thing to start up with Mosdos HaTorah.
The Holocaust happened because of the Maskilim YM’S starting with Moshe Mendelsohn. It’s proven fact. Anyone out there a descendent of Moshe Mendelsohn? Don’t even try because he has not even one Jewish descendent. Yaffed’s supporters will go the same way.
I for one believe that one should know the language of the country he lives in and I speak to my children in English. Saying that it’s obvious this guy has an ulterior motive, He knows good and well that both parents and administrators are not going to change a schedule or curriculum that has been in place for 60-70 years. They will show tens if not hundreds of successful alumni. They will claim church and state. Finally this guy knows that we have a precedence called the Volozhina Yeshiva. If it would ever happen that a court would rule that would force a yeshiva to change their curriculum they would close their doors. This is what he really wants.
I do believe that all Yeshiva kids get a decent basic secular education. That being said, the Public School system is hardly one to talk.
Baloney!!!
I am a proud alumni of SATMAR, where I only attended English classes until age 13.
I now own my own firm, employing 28 people including 9 who are college graduates.
Yes, 9 college graduates work for me, not the other way around……
Out of my cheder class of 26 boys, 11 are multi millionaires.
This organization was founded by a bunch of lying losers !! Trying to blame their failures on someone else.
The fact is that in our great country America, if you are willing to work hard you can succeed regardless of the level of you elementary education.
This is plain anti frum nonsense. I grew up going to a school that does not teach English. I have classmates who, after getting married, decided to get professional degrees. Some are now very successful doctors, lawyers, and accountants. The fact that they didn’t spend half their childhood learning limudei chol never stopped them from doing what they wanted or needed when it was the right time.
Three of my relatives were either survivors of the holocaust of children of them, and they are all very, very wealthy, in the mega millions. And the same happened to many holocaust survivors or their decedents. Despite lack of education, Hashem gave them bracha and they are extremely successful. Many others went to college and are now earnings meager salaries, or unemployed. Yes, college can help and many are making a nice parnassah. But TO EACH HIS OWN. Respect each others ways!
I’m not sure what the last two letters of TAFFED stand for, but for sure the one who is operating it has a mind and soul dysfunction.
the person behind the org is nick moster who is from footsteps!!!!
he doesn’t care about our community one iota!!!
he has done nothing accept make problems!!!
why the unidentified signatures??????!!
the standard will be lower because English is not our primary language in the chassidishe circles. however he should be doing something productive rather then masser!!
what a loser don’t be fooled by his fake sympathy!! he is a ex chassid seeking revenge in the guise of education. just as a side note I am a math teacher for ten years. I have taught in chassisidshe /yshivishe yeshivas my entire carrer. parents work hard and most kids get up to par if they work!!! btw the public schools are failing big time more than us how about calling an investigation mr moster so tony or albero will be matzliach!!
Secular knowledge you can obtain while reading in the bathroom while Secular education is crap with salad dressing.
Hey fellers.
I’m one of the “fifty-two signatures” on the Yaffed letter. I’m not commenting here to get into a debate, and I won’t waste my time arguing with people who reply to this because they’re bored, but I do want to explain the rationale behind it.
I signed the paper for one reason, and one reason only. My “high school” gave me no secular education whatsoever. The sciences history and geography aside, I wasn’t even taught English or math. I didn’t sign it because I’m antagonistic towards the heimeshe world or because I think that it’s impossible to make a living without having received an education. Rather I signed it because I believe that everyone should get an education.
Sure finances come into play, and although some people will be successful without an education most won’t. However the fact that there can only be so many grocery stores opened up in Brooklyn pales next to the fact that there will be generation after generation of adults who can’t even formulate a sentence in the language of the country that they live in.
Hope this clarifies some.
-An adult who spent a lot of time catching up
this is the biggest crock around, i went to chasider schools, i decided i wanted a college education so I went to school, [a Catholic college] and i had no problem keeping up and spend most of my professional life working for none Jewish places with a beard and payis
I went to a famous Yeshiva known for teaching secular studies. The problem is that some of the kids, from rich parents, in the class did not allow the teacher to teach. I wanted to learn math, English and Chemistry, but there was one particular boy who made a big joke in the class, refused to leave and because of him I couldn’t learn. I resent that guy up to today, some 20 years later.
When teaching secular studies, Yeshivas should treat them seriously, and if bochurim disrupt the class, they should be expelled just like they would if they were a disruption for ruchnius studies. Otherwise, the secular studies are not going to be taken seriously and it will be just bitul Torah, as nothing is gained.
Yes. SOME of the people involved in this have less-than-honorable intentions in reporting this to the state. However, if everything were truly on the up-and-up we wouldn’t be worried about it. The reasons the yeshivos panic is because they are not reporting truthfully to the state and we all know it. For every “millionaire” you find there are THOUSANDS living off the backs of their neighbors because they don’t have the education to get a proper job and provide for their families. They have created a “lifestyle” out of abusing the welfare systems which are meant to provide temporary relief to keep people afloat. I cannot tell you how many frum yidden I’ve interviewed at our hospitals for entry-level positions and they can barely write a cohesive sentence in English.
I’m not saying this to jump on the basher bandwagon. Those people are bigots who do nothing to solve the problem. I’m saying this because there is a undeniable truth here. We are raising new generations of thieves who learn to scam the system to get the government to forcibly take from the fruits of their neighbor’s hard work and give it to them. If only they worked as hard at getting an education.
So foolish to think secular studies diminish Torah studies rather than enhance. In this modern world, the last thing I want is a scientifically-ignorant Rav making halachic rulings about medical treatment, for example. We need scientific knowledge to understand the nuances of kashrut as applied to today’s genetically-modified plants and animals. We need history,geography and archaeology to improve our understanding of the context of the Torah- if you don’t know where the peoples and places of the Torah are, or anything about their customs, how can you best understand the references? Physics and math explain the world around us. We have a long tradition of trying to understand creation and the universe through mystical texts. What is wrong with understanding this through provable science? If the intent behind excluding meaningful secular education is not to create dependency, then precisely what is the intent? If your faith is threatened by Algebra, then it is not much of a faith….
To #11 who wrote ” Anyone out there a descendent of Moshe Mendelsohn? Don’t even try because he has not even one Jewish descendent.”
That is fiction. There are descendants of his alive today and living in E”Y. I have been told they are frum.
And by the way, for those who say that Volozhin was closed because the Roshei Yeshiva refused to allow any secular studies there, that too is a lie. Read the book My Uncle the Netziv which has the daily seder hayom and you’ll see they did study language and math. They closed up when the gov’t demanded the entire day be secular subjects and only night seder for Torah. And even night seder could only be subjects approved by the gov’t.
But the kanoim love to twist history to “prove” their point.
yes, jump on the grammar, english is my 4th language as I grew up in Israel, and I am very proud of my english !
The cause that Yaffed allegedly espouses, upon its own merits may be noble, if the intentions were pure; And that alone is debatable – by bigger and better people than us commentators on VIN. However, unfortunately the people behind Yaffed are entirely self serving, and that is a beef they have personally with the ultra-orthodox community. These are OTD rabble rousers and are just looking to give our Yeshivos and Mosdos a bad rap as well as stir up some trouble for their former co-religionists. There is no nobility in this whatsoever. I encourage readers to research the people behind Yaffed and see what their true agenda is. It is sad that the Orthodox community has failed these precious souls and perhaps that is something we need to look into in greater depth, but that is a different discussion. It is not always the message ONLY that needs to be looked at. The messenger plays a big role. And we need to be careful as to who we support. Easy to cast blame on a whole society. Anyone that feels they lacked proper education, and didn’t see the value and values in their religious education, pick yourselves up by your bootstraps and hit the books. It is never too late. I had 60-70 year old classmates in my college classes. Time to stop pointing fingers and take responsibility for your life. Proceed with caution. Never a good thing to start up with Mosdos HaTorah.
The Rambam says: “One who makes up his mind to involve himself with Torah and not to work, and to support himself from charity, has profaned God’s Name and brought the Torah into contempt, extinguished the light of religion, brought evil upon himself, and has taken away his life from the World-to-Come…” (Hilchos Talmud Torah 3:10).