Brooklyn, NY – Upon receipt on Monday of a letter signed by 52 members of Brooklyn’s Jewish community charging that an alarming number of local yeshivas are in violation of state education laws by shortchange students on time spent on secular education, officials for the DOE say they will investigate the matter.
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THEJEWISHWEEK.com (http://bit.ly/1h4SmkQ) reports that through an email response, DOE spokesman Harry Hatfield wrote, “We take seriously our responsibility to ensure that all students in New York receive an appropriate education, and we will investigate all allegations that are brought to our attention.”
As reported earlier on VIN News, The letter, organized by an Organization called Yaffed signed by former yeshiva students and teachers and current yeshiva parents, claimed that 39 yeshivas in Brooklyn and Queens are failing to meet New York State Education Department guidelines by averaging only 90 minutes of English and math per day, none at all on Fridays.
It is about time!
Oh boy. Here comes the damage control and c.y.a. All yeshiva principles and head staff get back from the country NOW!!.
Leave it to the Jewish Week to display the negatives of the Hareid comunity
At least in NY, maybe things will change.
A couple of years ago I heard a Rav relate the following story…favorably:
A European trained Rosh Yeshiva admonished a bochur, who years later was in Kollel with the Rav, and who was the source of the story. The bochur was carrying his math book close to his chest. The Rosh Yeshiva stopped him in a hallway, and said:
“You carry a Gemora dat vay, a math book you carry like a dead skvirrel.”
Sad.
How about first insuring that the education provided to the public sector is up to par and then worry about whether Yeshivas are providing enough secular education.
You see, if public school students aren’t providing education, they will mature into a life of low level crime, violence and substance abuse. Yeshivah students without secular education for the most part evolve into Kollel life. (Oy Gevalt!)
Besides, a paltry sum total of 52 members of the Brooklyn community (out of how many tens of thousands?) are listed in the complaint. Losers, each and every one of them! They are simply justifying their unsuccessful lives on their lack of schooling. I can guarantee that if these complainants had been educated in the public school system, they would still be members of the unemployable community because of their flawed character, not the flawed Yeshivah system.
Certainly nothing with the educational authorities inspecting schools. That is sort of what I expect them to do.
While I personally have advanced education, and I much favor that our yeshivos provide adequate education, I am quite uncomfortable by this situation. If it was about pushing yeshivos to provide the education, I could be supportive. But I fear the present matter is not “lishmoh”. I suspect that there are emotional factors here, and the “gang” is looking to cause as much trouble as possible.
There are many ways to address the problem. I am not sure any of them were investigated or attempted. This is not the first instance in which someone with issues looks to take revenge at the system.
Yeshivas in CH offer even less than that. Some don’t offer any secular studies at all.
I’m always amazed when I hear children in Boro Park, who were born in America, speak English with the same accent my mother, born in Eastern Europe in 1930, spoke with her entire life.
The idea to get them to learn English is good. The way that Mr. Mostel from Yaffed should be dealt with by the Rabbis. Ostracization, G-d willing!!
If people were educated, who would make it big?
Big deal! I went through yeshiva secular education and am earning money and leading a productive life!
Wake up and realize most of the stuff they want to push to be taught has no effect on anything almost anyone out there uses on a daily basis.
this isnt news.
I went to Yeshiva and I speak a better english than George Soros..
There is a list of about 55 billionairs that dropped out of school.
After all maybe this was their success.
In the ratio of how many kids are in yeshivas compared to public schools I think the success rate of the boys coming out of yeshivas is much greater than kids coming out of public schools
These people are Self-Hating Jews. I am proof that the system works. I went to a good yeshiva and dropped out of high school secular studies. I then continued my learning Torah, with good solid (limudei-kodesh only) yeshivas, and learned in kollel several years.
I am now 40+, and have a solid career, without any degrees and I am earning a whopping 250k+/yr.
No, I don’t own a business, and I am in the financial services/banking industry.
I can sincerely attest to the fact, that my gemara skills along with the great values, which I received in yeshiva along with the values that I have inherited from my ancestors, is what got me to where I am today. I am b’h better off, than most of my secular or jewish colleagues, which have attended, some of the world-renowned universities.
Funny story I was once on the bus years ago going to Montreal and the customs guy came on the bus and asked one of the boys what is your birthdate he answered ג שבט he kept on asking him and the boy kept on repeating the same thing the boy had no idea that he had an English birthday
Pity this wasnt addressed years ago the boys come out of yeshiva unable
to write a proper sentence, let alone paragraph.
Not going into the fact that its mesira to say anything against mosdos that our holy people of the previous generation build with blood and sweat, I had a subpar english education, and I BH earn more money or should I say much more money, then the lawyers who are respresenting me in verious transactions, I sometimes wonder why they spend the best 8 years of their life in collegen by time they get out, they already have a family to feed.
I know countless people, who can’t read a contract, they can not read english, yet they do business in the tens of millions, to be successful in business you don’t need to know math at all, I long forgot how to solve math problems on paper, you need an intrapreneurial spirit, and for someone like that, education is harmful because the secret of success is to think outside of the box, (do what 98 percent of people are not doing) and in school you only learn conventional thinking.
The ones that signed this letter and the proponents are nothing short of rodfim. What’s going to happen now, will be a full fledged look into ALL yeshivas and how secular studies are taught. Be prepared for more hours of חול, for no reason whatsoever.
I am not מקנאה the upcoming גהנים of these chasidishe OYSVORF BUMS who are behind this !!
For once I agree. I work with too many graduates of the yeshiva system who can’t write a paragraph and can’t operate a computer. Lord knows if they can even read. This is not “good enough”! We are too often taking big dollars to produce mediocre minds, and a mind is a terrible thing to waste! How many girls come out of bais yakov, get married, time to support a husband in kolel and sure enough, she can’t get a job because in school they told her computers are evil and books are the work of the satan. Lord help us!
Reply to 16 I believe you are in a fantasy.
I don’t think they need more secular studies but the minimal time spent on English studies should be done by qualified, motivated teachers and they should be supported by the administration.
Yes those intiating this have an agenda and are up to no good. But who else will do our dirty work? If any of us speak up we are going against das torah and will be ex-communicated. More importantly whether you agree with their approach or not why aren’t we addressing the greater issue? Why are we not providing a secular education?
1) For those who argue, I know millionares without education. Well what about your straight guy who wants to just work and get a salary job. Not everyone is cut out to open a business. Even those who made it threw college without a HS education would have been better off and more well equiped if they had one
2) Even more important, what constructive thing are these boys doing anyhow? How many 14 yr olds are capable of sitting & learning a whole day. Schools end up just shlpeing out the day to keep the kids busy. The kids end up growing up in a less structured enviornment. I have yet to see the schools without a secular eductaion produce greater talmidi chachmim.
This anti secular machla just grows and grows. Just llok at EY. the poverty is terrible. Whats the American solution? Adopt kollels. Noone came up with the solution to adopt work programs. And with the charedim in the government now we can finally work out a feasable army solution. But no secular studies and work is treif.
I just past through East New York, where 99% of the residents receive
free elementary school
free high school
free college
free everything ( that we hard working tax paying people pay for..)
I was amazed by the “success” exhibited in that area….
1) Blocks & blocks of empty stores.
2) Crime through the roof.
3) Guys hanging out 24/7 at the bodegas…
Was very happy to make it back safely to Williamsburg, where we only have 90 minute secular education, but we also BH have:
1) A strong vibrant economy
2) Crime free 99%
3) Chesed Capital of the World
I am happy to be part of the amazing Williamsburg community & if the Jewish Week & their ilk can’t comprehend how we ignoramus Chassidim can be so successful, I invite them to come spend some time here & see it themselves & not rely on a few losers
There is absolutely nothing wrong with being literate. There is absolutely nothing wrong with supporting yourself and your family with an honest job. Most of our great rabbis in the past had professions. The Rambam says: “One who makes up his mind to involve himself with Torah and not to work, and to support himself from charity, has profaned God’s Name and brought the Torah into contempt, extinguished the light of religion, brought evil upon himself, and has taken away his life from the World-to-Come…” (Hilchos Talmud Torah 3:10).
They don’t work anyhow, so why do the kids need an education? Just remain on welfare forever.
The ones that signed this letter and the proponents are nothing short of rodfim. What’s going to happen now, will be a full fledged look into ALL yeshivas and how secular studies are taught. Be prepared for more hours of חול, for no reason whatsoever.
I am not מקנאה the upcoming גהנים of these chasidishe OYSVORF BUMS who are behind this !!
As I’ve stated previously, this Yaffed group does not have pure intentions in my opinion and that is why I cannot support this initiative. As an attorney I have several Chassidisher clients that I represent regularly. I happen to admire greatly the fact that they were able to achieve great success without receiving any secular education. Many are extremely intelligent investors and have amassed much greater wealth than some of my other clients with degrees. I’ve broached this issue before regarding secular education with them. Some feel it is unnecessary. Others believe that a more comprehensive secular education should be provided to students because you can’t expect the masses to be entrepreneurs and as the community continues to grow BH” so are the needs and the necessity to work. One thing I do know that all have expressed. They are so inundated with collectors that show up at their door daily, that it’s impossible to support them all. They see the exponential growth as a wonderful thing but a more realistic system needs to be in place.
This is an affront to freedom of religion – if these otd losers don’t like it they.can go to russia
Read comment #41 you may want to stick with the programs especially if you get section 8
This past school year, my son was in an eighth grade in a yeshiva that had secular edication.He was very upset because the teacher was teaching about population control and evolution. The teacher who was also not Jewish was not a yirei Shomoyim.
I am moche for Kevod Hatora! Oy Lonu Meielbona Shel Torah! It is a busha vecharpa how much bizayon hatorah is posted in these comments. However it is naturally the case, as Chaza”l say, Yoser sinas am haaretz letalmid chacham mesinas hoakum leyisroel. By the way, it is said in seforim hakedoshim, that if you are not machshiv torah, then you are automatically considered an am haaretz rch”l.
It appears that diemaynstazdiebiztklieg is talking to the point, as there is no one that has yet to prove the comments, as defective. Way to go, diemaynstazdiebiztklieg!