Welcome, Guest! - or
Easy to remember!  »  VinNews.com

Lakewood, NJ - Teenager Killed by Drug Overdose

Published on: March 1, 2009 12:02 PM
By: VIN News
Change text size Text Size  
Bookmark and Share

Lakewood, NJ - Hatzolah responded about 11:00am Shabbas morning to East End Avenue, for reports of a teenage boy who was unconscious and didn’t wake up, from a drug overdose.

Advertisement:

After Hatzolah trying to work on the child to resuscitate him, the 19-year-old boy was r"l pronounced dead, as the result of overdosing on the pain reliever drug Percocet.

Percocet is one of the common prescription drugs being abused. And experts say that the growing use and abuse of pain pills and other drugs increasingly hurt hundreds of families across the Tri-State area.

While a lot of pain pill addiction begins with genuine injuries, other people find themselves in trouble after taking pills for fun, and Percocet is now reported to be the most common first illicit drug tried by young people.

The levaya was late last night in Lakewood, NJ.

 


More of today's headlines

Brooklyn, NY - Today marks 15 years since a Hasidic teenager was gunned down on the entrance ramp of the Brooklyn Bridge. On March 1, 1994, 16-year-old Ari Halberstam... New York, NY - Former New York City mayor Ed Koch isn't ready to die but he's already made his arrangements for that day. The 84-year-old Koch has a gravestone...

 

Total197

Read Comments (197)  —  Post Yours »

1

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:28 AM Anonymous Says:

BDH, not one comment, how sad, that right Yidden do like we always do when there is a problem we do not want to acknowledge. Stick our heads in the sand, it will go away. NO, it will not just as the abuse problem will not go away neither will this, unless we take action and bring the problem into the open. Wake UP do something before it is to late. Recognize the symptoms, speak to your children, ask questions and demand answers,

2

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:26 AM Anonymous Says:

So sad!! The situation needs to be taken out from under the carpet!!

3

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:23 AM frustrated Says:

Another one r"l.
When will our Rabbanim, en masse (not just isolated individuals) begin to publicly acknowledge the pain and turmoil so many frum children are in? It isn't just from sexual abuse (although that too); it is so many kids disconnected and disenfranchised from being a frum Jew, being part of a frum community. How are we making them feel like they belong, like we each have something unique and valuable to contribute to society? If this isn't a crucial part of being manhigim, what is?!?
This isn't bash Rabbanim time - it's a cry of pain - so many families and Yeshivos don't approach things differently simply because they passively/actively follow the "lead" of the leaders. Its time for change on all levels.
Too many frum people are living with the externals of a frum lifestyle and not transmitting the heart and soul of Judaism and God because they are spiritually stagnant themselves.
What do you think will happen when children have such easy access to alternatives when the path you want them to live isn't very attractive?
LET'S MAKE BEING FRUM ATTRACTIVE!
Beside shmiras halashon and middos campaigns, where's the Hashkafa discussions? How about (gasp) Chassidus?
I am afraid for our children's futures.

4

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:16 AM Anonymous Says:

Hashem help us all this is getting out of hand already.

5

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:37 AM Anonymous Says:

is Lakewood still in denial or will the iyun pilpul jews wake up and realize that they arent perfect?

6

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:34 AM Anonymous Says:

BDH He was a great guy and a good friend and he'll be missed.

7

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:33 AM Anonymous Says:

Its so sad , the family will suffer for years, oh the pain

8

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:30 AM Anonymous Says:

He will be missed.

9

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:52 AM know it all! Says:

I knew him very well such a nice kid always there to help a friend! we should only hear good news! btw this couldve happend to any kid who is on the street the drug situation is so out of hand - and so accecsable that its a miracle that this is the only kid in lkwd that it happend to!

10

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:48 AM rodneybenking Says:

This is so sad. A yiddishe neshama that didn't have to be lost. What a horrible tragedy. My heart goes out to the family. Maybe its about time our hiellege raboonim stop worrying about Lipa, and start addressing the real problems that we face. But we all know this will never happen. It's easier and safer to bash Lipa.

11

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:47 AM they are not in denial!! Says:

bh in lakewood we have many people who are open and addres this problem. They are having an evening dedicated to this boy - arranged by 'the kollel' and 'the minyan' of lakewood for teenagers to discuss the alcohol and drug problem in our community. Hopefuly this will make these troubled teens aware of the terrible effects these things have on them. Im sure they all learnt a big lesson from this.
I knew Shua personally he was a great guy and loved by all...
May his neshama fbe at peace and may he daven for all of us!

Hamokom yenacheim eschem besoch shaar avelie zion birushalayim...

12

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:06 PM Wait a minute! Says:

Reply to #1  
Anonymous Says:

BDH, not one comment, how sad, that right Yidden do like we always do when there is a problem we do not want to acknowledge. Stick our heads in the sand, it will go away. NO, it will not just as the abuse problem will not go away neither will this, unless we take action and bring the problem into the open. Wake UP do something before it is to late. Recognize the symptoms, speak to your children, ask questions and demand answers,

What do you mean "not one comment??"
This was just posted and you commented as soon as it was posted!

13

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:06 PM COMMON SENSE Says:

Reply to #3  
frustrated Says:

Another one r"l.
When will our Rabbanim, en masse (not just isolated individuals) begin to publicly acknowledge the pain and turmoil so many frum children are in? It isn't just from sexual abuse (although that too); it is so many kids disconnected and disenfranchised from being a frum Jew, being part of a frum community. How are we making them feel like they belong, like we each have something unique and valuable to contribute to society? If this isn't a crucial part of being manhigim, what is?!?
This isn't bash Rabbanim time - it's a cry of pain - so many families and Yeshivos don't approach things differently simply because they passively/actively follow the "lead" of the leaders. Its time for change on all levels.
Too many frum people are living with the externals of a frum lifestyle and not transmitting the heart and soul of Judaism and God because they are spiritually stagnant themselves.
What do you think will happen when children have such easy access to alternatives when the path you want them to live isn't very attractive?
LET'S MAKE BEING FRUM ATTRACTIVE!
Beside shmiras halashon and middos campaigns, where's the Hashkafa discussions? How about (gasp) Chassidus?
I am afraid for our children's futures.

Why is it that whenever there is a problem, it is the Rabbonim that take the blame. Of course, Rabbonim have a responsibillity in all aspects of Jewish life. But what about the rest of us? Don't we have individual responsibilities? Of course, it's much easier to say, "The Rabbonim should do it" than to take on responsiblity ourselves.
The fact is that there are a number of organizations and centers that deal with Frum drug abusers. However, these organizations are terribly underfunded and cannot provide the services necessary or to provide personnel necessary to deal with the problem abusers. Yet, people manage to spend inordinate and outrageous amounts of money on Simchas. Even in these financially troublng times, some people have no problem throwing out money for fancy Simchas. Just last week, I attended a Bar Mitzvah that must have cost (my estimate is conservative) $100,000.00. It is so outrageous and contrary to basic Hashkofo. And yet, these centers and organizatioins that deal with these troubled youth go wanting.
But it's not just money. They also need volunteers, which are also hard to get. Where are the volunteers we need?
Rabosay, let's not avoid our responsiblities by saying the Rabbonim should do it all. Let's stop wasting money on Simchas in an outrageous fashion and support institutions that need out financial help

14

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:05 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #10  
rodneybenking Says:

This is so sad. A yiddishe neshama that didn't have to be lost. What a horrible tragedy. My heart goes out to the family. Maybe its about time our hiellege raboonim stop worrying about Lipa, and start addressing the real problems that we face. But we all know this will never happen. It's easier and safer to bash Lipa.

yup 100%

15

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:02 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #5  
Anonymous Says:

is Lakewood still in denial or will the iyun pilpul jews wake up and realize that they arent perfect?

Exactly what do you want us to do, we don't have a magic solution, Mr no iyun no pilpul Am Hooo'oooritz

16

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:02 PM Anonymous Says:

BDH what a tragerty
it is time to get together and help all these children (start by acepting all the kids in the schools so they dont feel let down)

17

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:01 PM Anonymous Says:

i am not sure why this needs to be on this website. its a tragedy and people in lakewood are aware of this tragedy. it is was intentional it for sure does not belong here. If it was not intentional (and YES this can happen) then why post this. does the family and friends need to see this. why does vinnews need to post this?(they might just censor this entire post as they do many times)

rabbonim and roshei yeshivas in lakewood are very aware of the problem. there are 2 large Bais Medrash and/or after work "yeshivos" Programs in Lakewood that work closely with teenage at risk bochrim. this is on top of the many elementary programs that are not publicized and kept discreet to ensure its success. there are numerous HS yeshivos that recently opened to accept good average bochrim who are NOT the "mitzuyonim" but are clearly able to learn in yeshiva. In the past there was not a middle level yehshiva. so the bochrim or burnt out from the intense learning before bais medrash or gave up hope early on. TODAY there are chosheve established yeshivas that are geared to every level of learning and all producing bnei torah.

YES IT is a tragedy when even one is not saved. Our hearts cry out.



18

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:12 PM Anonymous Says:

and what do the roshei hayeshivas have to say...the mashgichim.....NOTHING...get drunk if you have to bring in the money....PURIM

19

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:09 PM Joseph Says:

Reply to #3  
frustrated Says:

Another one r"l.
When will our Rabbanim, en masse (not just isolated individuals) begin to publicly acknowledge the pain and turmoil so many frum children are in? It isn't just from sexual abuse (although that too); it is so many kids disconnected and disenfranchised from being a frum Jew, being part of a frum community. How are we making them feel like they belong, like we each have something unique and valuable to contribute to society? If this isn't a crucial part of being manhigim, what is?!?
This isn't bash Rabbanim time - it's a cry of pain - so many families and Yeshivos don't approach things differently simply because they passively/actively follow the "lead" of the leaders. Its time for change on all levels.
Too many frum people are living with the externals of a frum lifestyle and not transmitting the heart and soul of Judaism and God because they are spiritually stagnant themselves.
What do you think will happen when children have such easy access to alternatives when the path you want them to live isn't very attractive?
LET'S MAKE BEING FRUM ATTRACTIVE!
Beside shmiras halashon and middos campaigns, where's the Hashkafa discussions? How about (gasp) Chassidus?
I am afraid for our children's futures.

You were on the right track making sense up until that Chassidus comment.

20

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:07 PM Anonymous Says:

whats the adress for shiva?

21

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:17 PM Proactive Says:

The highschools should have proffesionals address the drug and alcohol problem in school!!!! Just like they have internet asifos there should be awareness about this evergrowing issue!

22

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:39 PM Anonymous Says:

So sad. May the family have only simchas in the future.

I've been involved in helping teenagers with addiction problems, get help, for the last 10 years. You have no idea how big the problem is. It's at the stage where keeping it quite will no longer help the problem.

Keep in mind, that one of the main places in Brooklyn that has been helping "Teens-at-risk" for many years, and has successfully sent many many teens to rehab, is on the verge of closing, due to lack of funding. Please help them out. You can find them at www.ourplaceny.org.

23

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:28 PM Anonymous Says:

address 825 east end avenue

24

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:25 PM Brooklyn Mom Says:

All of you, stop judging. You don't want Chassidus? Well, is your way working? Conversely, does Chassidus always work?

We need to come together & offer support to kids in MO, Chassidic, Litvish, Yeshivish, frum, Frei communities. OUR CHILDREN ARE DYING. That's the issue, not whether one derech is better than the others.

That is what denial is about. Not the Rabbonim. Not the parents. It's the responsibility of EVERYONE.

25

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:24 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #17  
Anonymous Says:

i am not sure why this needs to be on this website. its a tragedy and people in lakewood are aware of this tragedy. it is was intentional it for sure does not belong here. If it was not intentional (and YES this can happen) then why post this. does the family and friends need to see this. why does vinnews need to post this?(they might just censor this entire post as they do many times)

rabbonim and roshei yeshivas in lakewood are very aware of the problem. there are 2 large Bais Medrash and/or after work "yeshivos" Programs in Lakewood that work closely with teenage at risk bochrim. this is on top of the many elementary programs that are not publicized and kept discreet to ensure its success. there are numerous HS yeshivos that recently opened to accept good average bochrim who are NOT the "mitzuyonim" but are clearly able to learn in yeshiva. In the past there was not a middle level yehshiva. so the bochrim or burnt out from the intense learning before bais medrash or gave up hope early on. TODAY there are chosheve established yeshivas that are geared to every level of learning and all producing bnei torah.

YES IT is a tragedy when even one is not saved. Our hearts cry out.



why hide our problems

26

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:21 PM Anonymous Says:

Can someone reply with his name?

27

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:18 PM Anonymous Says:

So sad. May the family have only simchas in the future.

I've been involved in helping teenagers with addiction problems, get help, for the last 10 years. You have no idea how big the problem is. It's at the stage where keeping it quite will no longer help the problem.

Keep in mind, that one of the main places in Brooklyn that has been helping "Teens-at-risk" for many years, and has successfully sent many many teens to rehab, is on the verge of closing, due to lack of funding. Please help them out.

28

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:18 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #20  
Anonymous Says:

whats the adress for shiva?

if you know the person you would know the address
if you dont know the name and are just trying to google the address you will just have to wait till someone releases that specific piece of loshon hora

29

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:18 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #17  
Anonymous Says:

i am not sure why this needs to be on this website. its a tragedy and people in lakewood are aware of this tragedy. it is was intentional it for sure does not belong here. If it was not intentional (and YES this can happen) then why post this. does the family and friends need to see this. why does vinnews need to post this?(they might just censor this entire post as they do many times)

rabbonim and roshei yeshivas in lakewood are very aware of the problem. there are 2 large Bais Medrash and/or after work "yeshivos" Programs in Lakewood that work closely with teenage at risk bochrim. this is on top of the many elementary programs that are not publicized and kept discreet to ensure its success. there are numerous HS yeshivos that recently opened to accept good average bochrim who are NOT the "mitzuyonim" but are clearly able to learn in yeshiva. In the past there was not a middle level yehshiva. so the bochrim or burnt out from the intense learning before bais medrash or gave up hope early on. TODAY there are chosheve established yeshivas that are geared to every level of learning and all producing bnei torah.

YES IT is a tragedy when even one is not saved. Our hearts cry out.



It needs to be posted so that the rest of us do not make believe that this problem is dealth with. In fact, this and other such tragic stories need to be posed in every Shul and Yeshiva.

30

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:18 PM action oriented Says:

Reply to #13  
COMMON SENSE Says:

Why is it that whenever there is a problem, it is the Rabbonim that take the blame. Of course, Rabbonim have a responsibillity in all aspects of Jewish life. But what about the rest of us? Don't we have individual responsibilities? Of course, it's much easier to say, "The Rabbonim should do it" than to take on responsiblity ourselves.
The fact is that there are a number of organizations and centers that deal with Frum drug abusers. However, these organizations are terribly underfunded and cannot provide the services necessary or to provide personnel necessary to deal with the problem abusers. Yet, people manage to spend inordinate and outrageous amounts of money on Simchas. Even in these financially troublng times, some people have no problem throwing out money for fancy Simchas. Just last week, I attended a Bar Mitzvah that must have cost (my estimate is conservative) $100,000.00. It is so outrageous and contrary to basic Hashkofo. And yet, these centers and organizatioins that deal with these troubled youth go wanting.
But it's not just money. They also need volunteers, which are also hard to get. Where are the volunteers we need?
Rabosay, let's not avoid our responsiblities by saying the Rabbonim should do it all. Let's stop wasting money on Simchas in an outrageous fashion and support institutions that need out financial help

Finally someone with common sense
Finally someone who realizes that the rabbanim are't angels. They have enough to deal with on their own. They can only be as good as we allow them to be. It is also as you said within us to accomadate them by trying to help the community as well. They are also human beings. Bashing rabbanim just because you disagree is not the right thing to do period, You are allowed to disagree but don't blame shame it is a waste of time. In that time ask what can I do for my neigborhood, or for klall Yisroel? Thanks we need more comments like these.

31

 Mar 01, 2009 at 12:54 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #19  
Joseph Says:

You were on the right track making sense up until that Chassidus comment.

Spoken by one who has no clue what chassidus is......
Taamu ureu ki tov H'

32

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:13 PM Help Prevent this in the Future Says:

This is very sad and if there is any good that can come out of this tragedy it is to help prevent it in the future.

Then Minyan Shelanu works with youth at risk in Lakewood and I know that they have and currentley do help send many kids to rehab and the like. This is extremely expensive and they struggle financially with this. More so in a community that does not believe these problems exist or look at it like its not "their" problem.

They can use your support and I am sure this can be the biggest aliyah for the neshomah.

You can check out their website at MinyanShelanu.com and YOU can make a difference there as well.

33

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:11 PM Anonymous Says:

Isn't this medication a normal legal medication? What wrong did this boy do?

34

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:11 PM Enough Already Says:

Dont blame anyone - blame yourself - if YOU would be a better role model the kid wouldnt have done it.

35

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:02 PM Anonymous Says:

VIN does not "censor" comments which express a dissenting point of view no matter how offensive ehreleche yiddim such a yourself may find them...there is clearly a major shared responsibility here for this tragedy that includes the rabbonim and roshei yeshivot....please stop trying to hide the problem

36

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:16 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #31  
Anonymous Says:

Spoken by one who has no clue what chassidus is......
Taamu ureu ki tov H'

No offense, but I don't see anything special "chassius" has to offer either. They have more than their share of problems in society, so why should THAT be a solution?

37

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:15 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #20  
Anonymous Says:

whats the adress for shiva?

YENTA!
Don't be so transparent.
You aint going.
You just have this burning desire to know who!

38

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:27 PM Chaim A Says:

I am 21 Year old Addict and yes there is help out there, But you people will never understand how hard it is to break this addiction. I have been to 4 rehabs. I go to support groups here in Lakewood and I still keep relapsing. Forget about helping us, just be our friend. Dont only gossip about us, I have made dumb choices in my life but all my friends have left me, The only one who stuck with me is my family. Many of my friends dont even have family left by their side. And all those who say lakewood does not have this problem... Wake up and smell the coffee. Its not only the kids hanging out at J2 Motzei Shabbos, Its guys from BMG bochurim and married guys alike, addiction has no pity!! Believe me I speak the truth, from facts that i see and all the frum people I meet in the recovery rooms!!!

39

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:21 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #33  
Anonymous Says:

Isn't this medication a normal legal medication? What wrong did this boy do?

Genius!!
There's a reason it's called ABUSE!!!
'Normal legal' is when product directions are followed.
Overdose is abuse.
GET IT??

40

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:49 PM DEGU Says:

#38 Chaim A. Some of us understand. Most don't. You are 100% right that the problem is in Yeshivos, and married families too. I don't know you, but I will daven that you should have the strength needed to pull thru. You can do it! Don't ever give up!

41

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:52 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #38  
Chaim A Says:

I am 21 Year old Addict and yes there is help out there, But you people will never understand how hard it is to break this addiction. I have been to 4 rehabs. I go to support groups here in Lakewood and I still keep relapsing. Forget about helping us, just be our friend. Dont only gossip about us, I have made dumb choices in my life but all my friends have left me, The only one who stuck with me is my family. Many of my friends dont even have family left by their side. And all those who say lakewood does not have this problem... Wake up and smell the coffee. Its not only the kids hanging out at J2 Motzei Shabbos, Its guys from BMG bochurim and married guys alike, addiction has no pity!! Believe me I speak the truth, from facts that i see and all the frum people I meet in the recovery rooms!!!

I don't blame J2 for being open Motzoi Shabbos and becoming a hangout.

Lakewood used to be free of all eateries that had sit-downs and had take out ONLY to avoid having hang-outs (I know, it's hard for New Yorkers to imagine such ideals). Then along came one food establishment who decided to break the rule and "paved the way" for every place to follow suit. That helped contribute to the spiritual decline of what used to be a town of spirituality (the cheaper home prices that brought many Boro Parkers and Flatbush people in didn't help either). That place will bear responsibility for that, no matter how much the owner denies it being his fault.

42

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:51 PM Icicle Says:

Love your fellow Jew, no more, no less, it's a No -Brainer, Dump the Frum rationalizations that so separate our generation (Gap)Maybe, Lakewood should once and for all rid itself of the "Holier than thou attitude" which when passed on to the next generation can and does lead to senseless Hatred

43

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:43 PM Anonymous Says:

I am #17 and the reason I did not want this public was for the other posts who are just trying to find out who it is? his address? for what? to help him? you are late.

if its to menachm aval with out knowing who it is -that is noble.

did anyone think about the family and friends. what do they feel about this posting? maybe this was a real OD by mistake. We dont know.

YOU WANT TO HELP. get out there and volunteer in the elementery grades, become a mentor or pay for mentoring. many parents cannot afford the professional mentors who are expensive and great. invite these teenagers into your home, say a good shabbos with a smile to them. DAVEN AND LEARN IN THE "KOLLEL" or "MINYAN". Make them feel part of the community. Be their friends.
show them that you know they are also "normal". the drugs and alcohol is escape from reality IN PART because we look at them as "on the fringe" and they know it.THEY ARE CRYING TO BE LOVED.

44

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:42 PM Percocet is Heroin Says:

I have seen news programs about this pain medication Percocet. It is prescribed by Physicians after major surgery to control severe pain. Unfortunately, for some people it can be very addictive. One family in the news a few years ago lost a son who was prescribed this after an accident of some sort -- a broken bone or similar incident. He became so addicted he could not stop taking it and took his life because he could not function normally anymore. He was a College student at the time I believe. My wife had major surgery and was prescribed Oxycontin for pain, which is even stronger than Percocet. Her Physician gave me a strict routine after two months to decrease the dosage by 10% every five days until she was not taking it anymore because so many people can become addicted to that too. Percocet and Oxycontin are pharmaceutical grade HEROIN. DANGER DANGER DANGER !!! They are a absolute SAKANAH !!! When my wife was down to the last 1/4 of the original dosage her pain exploded and it took a lot of will power to live with pain with nothing other than a regular over the counter Aleve pill.

45

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:40 PM an observer Says:

chassidus wont solve everything, but it could help bring heart and meaning and purpose to rituals that have turned dry and repetitive.

the attitude of many in the frum community is emty and phoney. No rhyme or reason. just do it. keep any problems quiet or else there will be a problem with shidduchim.

Many frum kids look so sad and miserable. They wont communicate with their parents whom they see as hypocrites who lie and steal and are abusive of one another.

if their parents are not sincere, these kids feel it...drugs and booze are their way of sell-medicating themselves out of the misery of their hopeless lives.

46

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:40 PM Lakewood Mom Says:

I totally agree with Brooklyn Mom!! We are all Jews...let's stop judging others and being elitests. We need to have achdus and unite and all take responsibility for each other. Love your children unconditionally, not everyone fits into the box u want them to!

47

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:39 PM Rebitzen Says:

Reply to #14  
Anonymous Says:

yup 100%

I hear an echo.

48

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:36 PM Anonymous Says:

To #33. Yes Percocet is a legal medication (although it's a Controlled Substance). That doesn't mean that it's not abused. It's from a class of Drugs known as opiates. The class includes, Vicodin, Percocet, Oxycontin, and the like (Heroin is from the same class). In the Brooklyn teen community I would have to say that after Marijuana and Alcohol - Oxycontin and Percocet has the highest abuse rate. It's a very potent drug. Having too much of it will cause respiratory depression and death. If Hatzolah (or 911) get there in time, they can give Narcan which will reverse the effects. But if they aren't called until it's too late, then you see what can happen.

The problem in our communities is a lot bigger than people think.

49

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:36 PM Rebitzen Says:

Reply to #10  
rodneybenking Says:

This is so sad. A yiddishe neshama that didn't have to be lost. What a horrible tragedy. My heart goes out to the family. Maybe its about time our hiellege raboonim stop worrying about Lipa, and start addressing the real problems that we face. But we all know this will never happen. It's easier and safer to bash Lipa.

What does Lipa have to do with this inyan. People like you never miss an opportunity to bash our heiliga Rabbonim, without who we would have no leaders for klal yisrael. Stop already, enough is enough.

50

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:34 PM sane Says:

More emphasis must be placed on self identity, self esteem and chanoch lanaar cfi darcho. Many bochurim are not cut out to learn 12 hours a day - and know it - but lose self esteem when they simply can't do it and are discouraged from doing anything else. There should be realisitc counseling in Yeshivos and particulalry Beis Medrash, so boys can find their way in life.

51

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:33 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #39  
Anonymous Says:

Genius!!
There's a reason it's called ABUSE!!!
'Normal legal' is when product directions are followed.
Overdose is abuse.
GET IT??

I might be dumb so answer even nastier next time but NO I don't get it

52

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:32 PM Anonymous Says:

Its amazing how many people will just jump up and down and celebrate at every tragedy that befalls the Heimishe community, its sickening! They will without fail chastise the Rabbanim and Rebbes.
While it is true that we, and by that I mean, each every person who calls himself "bnei avraham yitzchok v'yakov", must invest all efforts in healing and treating and foremost in perventative measures so that we don't come to these unfortunate situations.

But, all these "righteous" individuals who never fail to rip apart every Rabbinic authority, I have one question to you; how much time, effort, money have you invested in these neshomos nebech? Have you taken upon yourself to make a shiur with a child-at-risk? Have you donated to the many organizations that do wonders in rehabilitating the youngsters? Have you even gone so far as to greet any of these kids on the corner with a smiling "good morning"? Or is all you can afford to get on a website and write up nasty comments on our Rabbanim, Askanim as so on?

I am closely familiar with a certain community who have established at least ten organizations, that run the gamut from finding chavrusas in yeshiva to weaker bochurim, to paying psychological help to afflicted youth who have suffered mental and other abuses, to establishing organizations that provide counseling to young couples. If anyone would bother to open the eyes and see the good that is being done by the Rabbanim that you all are so eager to rip apart. Most moisdos have increased their budget greatly, but I guess its much more convenient to criticize. How unfortunate! Please utilize whatever is at your disposal to build instead of tearing down.

53

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:29 PM Anonymous Says:

When will the Oilam an lakewood promote AA- NA- SA- ? There are so many yeshiva guys who need this help. How much more suffering do we need?!! Please!!!

54

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:11 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #3  
frustrated Says:

Another one r"l.
When will our Rabbanim, en masse (not just isolated individuals) begin to publicly acknowledge the pain and turmoil so many frum children are in? It isn't just from sexual abuse (although that too); it is so many kids disconnected and disenfranchised from being a frum Jew, being part of a frum community. How are we making them feel like they belong, like we each have something unique and valuable to contribute to society? If this isn't a crucial part of being manhigim, what is?!?
This isn't bash Rabbanim time - it's a cry of pain - so many families and Yeshivos don't approach things differently simply because they passively/actively follow the "lead" of the leaders. Its time for change on all levels.
Too many frum people are living with the externals of a frum lifestyle and not transmitting the heart and soul of Judaism and God because they are spiritually stagnant themselves.
What do you think will happen when children have such easy access to alternatives when the path you want them to live isn't very attractive?
LET'S MAKE BEING FRUM ATTRACTIVE!
Beside shmiras halashon and middos campaigns, where's the Hashkafa discussions? How about (gasp) Chassidus?
I am afraid for our children's futures.

the rabunim are only busy with lipa schmeltzer!!!!!!!!!

55

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:05 PM Anonymous Says:

To poster#41- if u want to know why kids overdose etc, its because of people like yourself-maybe- who shun kid who go to "hangouts/pizza stores on a sat night". Let's be real for a second- do you really think we are still living in a shtetil somewhere in europe with no running electricity???wake up!!! Maybe if you stop degrading kids who look for healthy outlets outside the beis medrash EX getting pizza with some friends...than maybe these issues will stop. The issue of abuse also comes from the same issue of isolation of the sexes and the deprived of living in a normal society

56

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:02 PM E Says:


Many have already said the following but it is worth repeating.

For those who are posting and saying "Why aren't the Rabbanim doing anything about it?" or "How could we keep brushing these things under the carpet?" I say this: YOU are the problem. Look at yourself in the mirror and ask yourself what have YOU done today to help one of these kids? Have you made a phone call to a teen-at-risk 'just to say hi' recently? Have you given a donation to an organization like The Minyan, The Kollel, Our Place, The Corner, Camp Extreme, Areivim etc.?

There are hundreds of people in every city who work tirelessly on behalf of these kids. The issue is not being brushed under the carpet? The Gedolim are NOT overlooking the problem. I personally have spoken with R' Mattisyahu sometimes very late at night about problems that arose. He is very involved and works very hard behind the scenes to help anyone who is involved with these kids.

We all know the problems. Don't be so obnoxious to post here what you feel is "THE SOLUTION" to the problem until you have many years experience under your belt dealing with this like we do.

You want some advice on what you can do? You can go ask a Rov how you can help. Donate $$ to one of the places I've listed above. Or how about more practically...when you see a kid without a Yarmulka waiting for a ride in front of Shoprite or J2, don't look away. Give him a ride no matter where he's going. Ask him his name. Ask him what he does with his time. Offer your number in case he ever needs anything. Give him 5 bucks when he leaves the car if you know he has no money. That's how you can help. Say hello to the kid working behind the counter in whatever store it may be. You have no idea how much Chizuk it will give him. Call him by his first name. Tell him it's nice to see him. But absolutely positively DON'T look away. You would be killing him slowly by looking away.

After all the Tehillim is said for Shua, and after all the tears are cried, I beg of anyone reading this to take upon yourself to do one Chessed a day or a week - whatever you can handle - for a kid at risk. Even a smile counts.

May all of us who work with these kids one day be zoche to be out of a job. May all of Klal Yisroel be Zoche to share only in Simchos.

Shua, you were a great guy. You came from so much and worked on yourself to better yourself every day. We all had faith in you that you would one day succeed. Please Daven to Hashem that the friends you were close to down here who are going through similar difficult situatuions should be able to get the help that they need to get away from the terrible things they are involved with. I spoke to many of your friends last night and they want to make changes in their lives. Please beg Hashem to help them in their mission.

You will be sorely missed. Boruch Dayan Ha'Emes.

57

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:01 PM E Says:


Many have already said the following but it is worth repeating.

For those who are posting and saying "Why aren't the Rabbanim doing anything about it?" or "How could we keep brushing these things under the carpet?" I say this: YOU are the problem. Look at yourself in the mirror and ask yourself what have YOU done today to help one of these kids? Have you made a phone call to a teen-at-risk 'just to say hi' recently? Have you given a donation to an organization like The Minyan, The Kollel, Our Place, The Corner, Camp Extreme, Areivim etc.?

There are hundreds of people in every city who work tirelessly on behalf of these kids. The issue is not being brushed under the carpet? The Gedolim are NOT overlooking the problem. I personally have spoken with R' Mattisyahu sometimes very late at night about problems that arose. He is very involved and works very hard behind the scenes to help anyone who is involved with these kids.

We all know the problems. Don't be so obnoxious to post here what you feel is "THE SOLUTION" to the problem until you have many years experience under your belt dealing with this like we do.

You want some advice on what you can do? You can go ask a Rov how you can help. Donate $$ to one of the places I've listed above. Or how about more practically...when you see a kid without a Yarmulka waiting for a ride in front of Shoprite or J2, don't look away. Give him a ride no matter where he's going. Ask him his name. Ask him what he does with his time. Offer your number in case he ever needs anything. Give him 5 bucks when he leaves the car if you know he has no money. That's how you can help. Say hello to the kid working behind the counter in whatever store it may be. You have no idea how much Chizuk it will give him. Call him by his first name. Tell him it's nice to see him. But absolutely positively DON'T look away. You would be killing him slowly by looking away.

After all the Tehillim is said for Shua, and after all the tears are cried, I beg of anyone reading this to take upon yourself to do one Chessed a day or a week - whatever you can handle - for a kid at risk. Even a smile counts.

May all of us who work with these kids one day be zoche to be out of a job. May all of Klal Yisroel be Zoche to share only in Simchos.

Shua, you were a great guy. You came from so much and worked on yourself to better yourself every day. We all had faith in you that you would one day succeed. Please Daven to Hashem that the friends you were close to down here who are going through similar difficult situatuions should be able to get the help that they need to get away from the terrible things they are involved with. I spoke to many of your friends last night and they want to make changes in their lives. Please beg Hashem to help them in their mission.

You will be sorely missed. Boruch Dayan Ha'Emes.

58

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:18 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #5  
Anonymous Says:

is Lakewood still in denial or will the iyun pilpul jews wake up and realize that they arent perfect?

"iyun pilpul jews" sounds pretty similar to the term bench kvetcher to me??!! i would give the bnei torah and talmidie chachamim of lakewood a more respectable title.

59

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:17 PM To the 21 year old addict Says:

Reply to #38  
Chaim A Says:

I am 21 Year old Addict and yes there is help out there, But you people will never understand how hard it is to break this addiction. I have been to 4 rehabs. I go to support groups here in Lakewood and I still keep relapsing. Forget about helping us, just be our friend. Dont only gossip about us, I have made dumb choices in my life but all my friends have left me, The only one who stuck with me is my family. Many of my friends dont even have family left by their side. And all those who say lakewood does not have this problem... Wake up and smell the coffee. Its not only the kids hanging out at J2 Motzei Shabbos, Its guys from BMG bochurim and married guys alike, addiction has no pity!! Believe me I speak the truth, from facts that i see and all the frum people I meet in the recovery rooms!!!

PLEASE PLEASE don't lose hope. There are friends out there, people who want to give you another chance. You might not realize this yet but i know they will find you .. please ,.. thank you.

61

 Mar 01, 2009 at 01:55 PM Anonymous Says:

It's very COLD here in Fakewood

62

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:24 PM esther Says:

Reply to #45  
an observer Says:

chassidus wont solve everything, but it could help bring heart and meaning and purpose to rituals that have turned dry and repetitive.

the attitude of many in the frum community is emty and phoney. No rhyme or reason. just do it. keep any problems quiet or else there will be a problem with shidduchim.

Many frum kids look so sad and miserable. They wont communicate with their parents whom they see as hypocrites who lie and steal and are abusive of one another.

if their parents are not sincere, these kids feel it...drugs and booze are their way of sell-medicating themselves out of the misery of their hopeless lives.

if only it was as simple as learning chasidus.unfortunately there are MANY kids from chsidishe,even CH families involved with drugs.there are so many variables in addiction-abuse,mental health issues,learning disabilities,and many times there is no "simple"reason-it's not fair to make a blanket statement about the parents.and sadly rehab often doesn't help.

63

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:24 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #41  
Anonymous Says:

I don't blame J2 for being open Motzoi Shabbos and becoming a hangout.

Lakewood used to be free of all eateries that had sit-downs and had take out ONLY to avoid having hang-outs (I know, it's hard for New Yorkers to imagine such ideals). Then along came one food establishment who decided to break the rule and "paved the way" for every place to follow suit. That helped contribute to the spiritual decline of what used to be a town of spirituality (the cheaper home prices that brought many Boro Parkers and Flatbush people in didn't help either). That place will bear responsibility for that, no matter how much the owner denies it being his fault.

get a life loser

64

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:22 PM ADDICT Says:

PEOPLE JUST JUDGE IVE BEEN ADDICTED TO OXYCONTIN FOR OVER 2 YEARS IT IS COMPLETE HELL GETTING OFF IT PLEASE DONT JUDGE ANYONE AND ESPECIALLY MY GOOD FRIEND WHO WAS JUST NIFTAR. THIS KILLS ME SO MUCH MORE WHEN YOU PEOPLE TALK LIKE THIS

65

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:51 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #57  
E Says:


Many have already said the following but it is worth repeating.

For those who are posting and saying "Why aren't the Rabbanim doing anything about it?" or "How could we keep brushing these things under the carpet?" I say this: YOU are the problem. Look at yourself in the mirror and ask yourself what have YOU done today to help one of these kids? Have you made a phone call to a teen-at-risk 'just to say hi' recently? Have you given a donation to an organization like The Minyan, The Kollel, Our Place, The Corner, Camp Extreme, Areivim etc.?

There are hundreds of people in every city who work tirelessly on behalf of these kids. The issue is not being brushed under the carpet? The Gedolim are NOT overlooking the problem. I personally have spoken with R' Mattisyahu sometimes very late at night about problems that arose. He is very involved and works very hard behind the scenes to help anyone who is involved with these kids.

We all know the problems. Don't be so obnoxious to post here what you feel is "THE SOLUTION" to the problem until you have many years experience under your belt dealing with this like we do.

You want some advice on what you can do? You can go ask a Rov how you can help. Donate $$ to one of the places I've listed above. Or how about more practically...when you see a kid without a Yarmulka waiting for a ride in front of Shoprite or J2, don't look away. Give him a ride no matter where he's going. Ask him his name. Ask him what he does with his time. Offer your number in case he ever needs anything. Give him 5 bucks when he leaves the car if you know he has no money. That's how you can help. Say hello to the kid working behind the counter in whatever store it may be. You have no idea how much Chizuk it will give him. Call him by his first name. Tell him it's nice to see him. But absolutely positively DON'T look away. You would be killing him slowly by looking away.

After all the Tehillim is said for Shua, and after all the tears are cried, I beg of anyone reading this to take upon yourself to do one Chessed a day or a week - whatever you can handle - for a kid at risk. Even a smile counts.

May all of us who work with these kids one day be zoche to be out of a job. May all of Klal Yisroel be Zoche to share only in Simchos.

Shua, you were a great guy. You came from so much and worked on yourself to better yourself every day. We all had faith in you that you would one day succeed. Please Daven to Hashem that the friends you were close to down here who are going through similar difficult situatuions should be able to get the help that they need to get away from the terrible things they are involved with. I spoke to many of your friends last night and they want to make changes in their lives. Please beg Hashem to help them in their mission.

You will be sorely missed. Boruch Dayan Ha'Emes.

Very well written but why are our gedolim working behind the scenes ? Let them come out publicly and say where our $$$ shold really go to chavrei, the minyan, oros yisroel, pearl blau, self contained classrooms and places that really change and improve peoples lives

66

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:48 PM Anonymous Says:

אל תשמחי אויבתי לי כי נפלתי קמתי, אלולא שנפלתי לא קמתי, כי אשב בחשך ה' אור לי אלולא שישבתי בחשך לא היה אור

67

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:42 PM wtf Says:

R Heinemann who was the boys RoshYeshiva went to be menochun avel today at the boys home and the father told him it WAS NOT AN OVERDOSE this boy was clean for over 6 months he just didn't wake up.

68

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:42 PM emes Says:

And now let's all go to schi's dinner and celebrate their fancy local taxpayer funded state of the art building , while Chavrei Hakolel and other mosdos that are saving yiddesha neshamos and really making a difference in klal yisroel suffer financially.That's what happenes when we give tzedaka based on media not importance

69

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:03 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #62  
esther Says:

if only it was as simple as learning chasidus.unfortunately there are MANY kids from chsidishe,even CH families involved with drugs.there are so many variables in addiction-abuse,mental health issues,learning disabilities,and many times there is no "simple"reason-it's not fair to make a blanket statement about the parents.and sadly rehab often doesn't help.

if the lakewood mashgichim ever found out how many bochurim and kollel guys have drug issues they would need to close the place down .

70

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:03 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #48  
Anonymous Says:

To #33. Yes Percocet is a legal medication (although it's a Controlled Substance). That doesn't mean that it's not abused. It's from a class of Drugs known as opiates. The class includes, Vicodin, Percocet, Oxycontin, and the like (Heroin is from the same class). In the Brooklyn teen community I would have to say that after Marijuana and Alcohol - Oxycontin and Percocet has the highest abuse rate. It's a very potent drug. Having too much of it will cause respiratory depression and death. If Hatzolah (or 911) get there in time, they can give Narcan which will reverse the effects. But if they aren't called until it's too late, then you see what can happen.

The problem in our communities is a lot bigger than people think.

If the poor guy didn't understand my explanation in # 39,
your's is waaaaaay over his head!

71

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:02 PM Anonymous Says:

just curious ,but did this boy that passed away have a cast on his leg?

72

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:55 PM Srul Menachem Says:

It nebech I once sew the nifter davaning mincha in bais medrash g'voha and was praying so erlich with so much kavunah. May his neshomoh have an aliah
Imocho hashem dimoh maial kol punim umain.

73

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:36 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #41  
Anonymous Says:

I don't blame J2 for being open Motzoi Shabbos and becoming a hangout.

Lakewood used to be free of all eateries that had sit-downs and had take out ONLY to avoid having hang-outs (I know, it's hard for New Yorkers to imagine such ideals). Then along came one food establishment who decided to break the rule and "paved the way" for every place to follow suit. That helped contribute to the spiritual decline of what used to be a town of spirituality (the cheaper home prices that brought many Boro Parkers and Flatbush people in didn't help either). That place will bear responsibility for that, no matter how much the owner denies it being his fault.

Explain how it would be the owners fault ?

74

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:34 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #33  
Anonymous Says:

Isn't this medication a normal legal medication? What wrong did this boy do?

Once you're done with the English lesson, I'd like to address something else in your
#33 comment.
Who said the boy did wrong??
There is something called ACCIDENTAL overdose.

75

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:31 PM In Tears Says:

The family should know of no more sorrow. ברוך דין האמת

76

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:29 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #53  
Anonymous Says:

When will the Oilam an lakewood promote AA- NA- SA- ? There are so many yeshiva guys who need this help. How much more suffering do we need?!! Please!!!

all of which r going on in lakewod

77

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:29 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #51  
Anonymous Says:

I might be dumb so answer even nastier next time but NO I don't get it

Okay.
I'm sorry.
Let's do this slowly now.
When a doctor prescribes (says to take) medicine,
he instructs (tells) you to take a certain amount of it in a specified (?) time.
This amount is referred to as (is called) a dose.
When one takes more than the prescription dose (more than the doctor said to take),
it is called an O-V-E-R-D-O-S-E! That is not good for you.
Hope you understand (get it) now.

78

 Mar 01, 2009 at 02:27 PM Anonymous Says:

Lakewood puts a Damper on Many Kosher outlets for our youth to burn up some calories. Not much for them to do in their spare time

79

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:05 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #64  
ADDICT Says:

PEOPLE JUST JUDGE IVE BEEN ADDICTED TO OXYCONTIN FOR OVER 2 YEARS IT IS COMPLETE HELL GETTING OFF IT PLEASE DONT JUDGE ANYONE AND ESPECIALLY MY GOOD FRIEND WHO WAS JUST NIFTAR. THIS KILLS ME SO MUCH MORE WHEN YOU PEOPLE TALK LIKE THIS

Um, I feel bad for you, but, uh, not one person who commented here judged him...So I'm not sure what you're talking about...

81

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:25 PM Anonymous Says:

Percocet is a very strong drug. I was given percocet in the hospital to help alleviate after birth pains in the hospital within the next half hour I was on oxygen and hooked up to machines because I had trouble breathing.

Drugs should be monitored even when taking it as prescribed. Of course don't play around with drugs that weren't prescribed to you.

Hashem should grant the family a nechamah.

82

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:21 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #41  
Anonymous Says:

I don't blame J2 for being open Motzoi Shabbos and becoming a hangout.

Lakewood used to be free of all eateries that had sit-downs and had take out ONLY to avoid having hang-outs (I know, it's hard for New Yorkers to imagine such ideals). Then along came one food establishment who decided to break the rule and "paved the way" for every place to follow suit. That helped contribute to the spiritual decline of what used to be a town of spirituality (the cheaper home prices that brought many Boro Parkers and Flatbush people in didn't help either). That place will bear responsibility for that, no matter how much the owner denies it being his fault.

It's people like you that turn off frum people. You are the type od frumy who makes his own rules. Internet is ok, Correct? all rabonim in lakewood asered it no? why are you bashing this so called food establishment that broke the rules? shame on you and the people in your town who think like you!

83

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:21 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #71  
Anonymous Says:

just curious ,but did this boy that passed away have a cast on his leg?

i was wondering the same thing. Because one of the boys did have a cast on his leg

84

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:51 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #82  
Anonymous Says:

It's people like you that turn off frum people. You are the type od frumy who makes his own rules. Internet is ok, Correct? all rabonim in lakewood asered it no? why are you bashing this so called food establishment that broke the rules? shame on you and the people in your town who think like you!

no rules were broken . we live in a free societty. u dont like the rest? dont go there . u dont sem to have a problem blogging even though the rabbanim passed a rules noto. you broke the rule too . maybe we should throw u out of lakewood along with all the other hoier then though yuge lite who never worked a day in thier life but mooch of the the local, local government , and tomchei shabbos .

85

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:49 PM Emes? Says:

Reply to #68  
emes Says:

And now let's all go to schi's dinner and celebrate their fancy local taxpayer funded state of the art building , while Chavrei Hakolel and other mosdos that are saving yiddesha neshamos and really making a difference in klal yisroel suffer financially.That's what happenes when we give tzedaka based on media not importance

Or Jealousy?

86

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:41 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #68  
emes Says:

And now let's all go to schi's dinner and celebrate their fancy local taxpayer funded state of the art building , while Chavrei Hakolel and other mosdos that are saving yiddesha neshamos and really making a difference in klal yisroel suffer financially.That's what happenes when we give tzedaka based on media not importance

Schi is also a very important org. they also save yiddeshe neshamos. going to schi's dinner doesnt mean that chavrei hakolel isnt important

87

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:31 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #64  
ADDICT Says:

PEOPLE JUST JUDGE IVE BEEN ADDICTED TO OXYCONTIN FOR OVER 2 YEARS IT IS COMPLETE HELL GETTING OFF IT PLEASE DONT JUDGE ANYONE AND ESPECIALLY MY GOOD FRIEND WHO WAS JUST NIFTAR. THIS KILLS ME SO MUCH MORE WHEN YOU PEOPLE TALK LIKE THIS

Um, I feel bad for you, but, uh, not one person who commented here judged him...So I'm not sure what you're talking about...

88

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:30 PM Long Island Bubby Says:

None of us know the pain that an addicted person is in. Years ago, we lost a neighbor to post-partum depression and the pain to her family and friends were unbearable. With all the professional help we got for ourselves and our children, the message we got was simple. Personal pain is not always observable to an outsider. There are many,many reasons for unbearable unhappiness which is the basis for many addictions, and all we can do is love, support and respect those persons and their families. Hope & Daven that the HaKadosh Baruch Hu will intervene and give strength to that person to overcome his unhappiness and find solace in his Faith and his family.

89

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:30 PM Anonymous Says:

Unfortunately, alcohol and drug addiction are no strangers to Jews. In the addiction field, substance abuse is known as an “equal opportunity destroyer”. Heroin, marijuana, cocaine, pills, LSD, ecstasy, and the like never checked anyone’s tzitzis to determine whether they should be abused by any individual. Even if the statistical incidence is not exactly comparable to the goyishe velt, we are still facing a situation that we need to consider “epidemic”. We need to stop the denial (“Nisht bei undz”), or concluding that the individual must be depressed. We also need to mature enough in our perspective and put our blaming fingers away. We have done enough to alienate these youth that they seek solace in their drug world, and we must address our young people (children and talmidim) is a more welcoming way.

The professionals who spend countless hours listening to these kids know a lot about how they chose the paths that led to so much destruction. It is not whether they wear white shirts, and it is not cell phones or the internet. It is also not the pizza shops. It is us. Yes, every adult that exists in the lives of these children. They will find their temporary consolation in the buzz of drugs and alcohol when they are not feeling warm and welcome in our community. Professionals will unanimously describe the profound loneliness that each of these kids-at-risk experience and how they find the numbing of drugs a welcome escape from the pain of the existence we have made for them.

No, it’s not that Torah learning is boring. Chas veshalom. No, they do not have a problem with Hashem. It is all about pain relief. No wonder that every substance of abuse serves as a form of pain relief. For those who may be unaware, alcohol was the first form of surgical anesthesia. Percocet, Vicodin, and Oxycontin are opiate pain killers. Cocaine is a topical anesthetic. You get the point. We have led these children into pain, and we are appalled that they want to escape this.

Our intense denial has perpetuated the damage of the addiction problem. We resist efforts to help the kids. There were several programs available, and these have either teetered on closing or have been closed. We relegate those schools that try to address the needs of these kids to second class status – all the while continuing to make admission criteria in yeshivos more restrictive so that we can eject a few more onto the street. It’s us, not them.

Listen to the professionals who try to teach the community about the addictions. Listen to those who seek to have input into chinuch to make it better for the children. Maybe it is time to wake up and listen. Maybe it does not feel good to recognize that there is basis for changing. But it hurts a whole lot less than another levaya of another overdose victim. May Hashem spare us any and all versions of pain and send us Moshiach Tzidkenu.

90

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:16 PM moglass Says:

I wish ppl would realize that it WAS a unfortunate accident and was not your typical overdose-it coudve happend to you. He WAS clean. And let his neshoma rest in piece. Don't disrespect a niftar. Its such a ugly thing to do. Ya know, he's not your own kid-but he's sombodys kid,brother,friend and to spread rachilus ( cuz its all false rumors) on the poor niftar just shows the low level that some of klal yisroel have sunk to-ALL FOR THE DAMN HOCK damn it! Ppl should just say boruch dayan emes and be respectfull. Why do some ppl just not get it? It was a mistake but ppl rather say it waz a reg.overdose cuz it fuels more hock...sick sick sick!

91

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:16 PM Anonymous Says:

Parents, if you love your children and have the slightest doubt that they may be using drugs (and I believe that a good parent can see when there may be an issue) then have them tested for drugs randomly. If they ask you "why don't you trust me??", then tell them that you love them sooo much that your not willing to rely on your judgement of what and who to trust, and that you have to do everything in your power to be sure that there is no problem.
They will see how strongly you love them and will slowly reach a point that you will no longer have to worry.
I only wish my parents would have done the same.

92

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:13 PM N.K Says:

Reply to #61  
Anonymous Says:

It's very COLD here in Fakewood

Shame on you for being nasty while a family is mourning!
Achdus now! (and if not, keep the "rishes" to another place)

93

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:10 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #17  
Anonymous Says:

i am not sure why this needs to be on this website. its a tragedy and people in lakewood are aware of this tragedy. it is was intentional it for sure does not belong here. If it was not intentional (and YES this can happen) then why post this. does the family and friends need to see this. why does vinnews need to post this?(they might just censor this entire post as they do many times)

rabbonim and roshei yeshivas in lakewood are very aware of the problem. there are 2 large Bais Medrash and/or after work "yeshivos" Programs in Lakewood that work closely with teenage at risk bochrim. this is on top of the many elementary programs that are not publicized and kept discreet to ensure its success. there are numerous HS yeshivos that recently opened to accept good average bochrim who are NOT the "mitzuyonim" but are clearly able to learn in yeshiva. In the past there was not a middle level yehshiva. so the bochrim or burnt out from the intense learning before bais medrash or gave up hope early on. TODAY there are chosheve established yeshivas that are geared to every level of learning and all producing bnei torah.

YES IT is a tragedy when even one is not saved. Our hearts cry out.



Hey how about teaching (gasp!!) secular studies in your high schools?! Whatta concept! My son does very poorly in Gemarah but is an excellent writer and science student and if that's how he is, then so be it. So long as the yeshiva accepts him for who he is we're all in good shape.

94

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:58 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #33  
Anonymous Says:

Isn't this medication a normal legal medication? What wrong did this boy do?

HE TOOK AN OVERDOSE, what part don't you understand?

95

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:17 PM Anonymous Says:

Where does he come in to the picutre

96

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:17 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #77  
Anonymous Says:

Okay.
I'm sorry.
Let's do this slowly now.
When a doctor prescribes (says to take) medicine,
he instructs (tells) you to take a certain amount of it in a specified (?) time.
This amount is referred to as (is called) a dose.
When one takes more than the prescription dose (more than the doctor said to take),
it is called an O-V-E-R-D-O-S-E! That is not good for you.
Hope you understand (get it) now.

so when the bottle of xtra strength tylenol says not to exceed 2 in a 24 hour period does that mean the person is a drug addict ? or does it mean that the person felt justified to take a third because his headache became too much to deal with ? now is it possible that this bochur felt the same way with his pain and perhaps took more then perscribed because he couldnt bear the pain?

97

 Mar 01, 2009 at 03:15 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #38  
Chaim A Says:

I am 21 Year old Addict and yes there is help out there, But you people will never understand how hard it is to break this addiction. I have been to 4 rehabs. I go to support groups here in Lakewood and I still keep relapsing. Forget about helping us, just be our friend. Dont only gossip about us, I have made dumb choices in my life but all my friends have left me, The only one who stuck with me is my family. Many of my friends dont even have family left by their side. And all those who say lakewood does not have this problem... Wake up and smell the coffee. Its not only the kids hanging out at J2 Motzei Shabbos, Its guys from BMG bochurim and married guys alike, addiction has no pity!! Believe me I speak the truth, from facts that i see and all the frum people I meet in the recovery rooms!!!

Chaim, how lucky you are to have an understanding family. I should only hope to be a good enough mother that my kids would put all their faith in me in good times and bad. We're rootin' for ya!!

98

 Mar 01, 2009 at 04:29 PM mark mayer appel Says:

Chevra,,,,,,,,,,lets take a moment and pay our respect to the niftar,AM ECHAD-WE ARE ONE wlill continue to fight the battle against drug abuse and emotional abuse by our community.lets hug and provide more chizuk to our kids,only thru reaching out to our future generation can we make a real diffrence may the niftar be a meiltz yosher for am yisroeal mma

99

 Mar 01, 2009 at 04:26 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #96  
Anonymous Says:

so when the bottle of xtra strength tylenol says not to exceed 2 in a 24 hour period does that mean the person is a drug addict ? or does it mean that the person felt justified to take a third because his headache became too much to deal with ? now is it possible that this bochur felt the same way with his pain and perhaps took more then perscribed because he couldnt bear the pain?

you have an excellent point . People here are cluless as to what happened . Lakewooders are known to hock for the sake of hocking, even if it means hurting a live soul or soul that passed on .

100

 Mar 01, 2009 at 04:24 PM Anonymous Says:

Very sad!:(

101

 Mar 01, 2009 at 04:24 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #86  
Anonymous Says:

Schi is also a very important org. they also save yiddeshe neshamos. going to schi's dinner doesnt mean that chavrei hakolel isnt important

"Saving" yiddeshe neshamos how does a state of the art building save neshamos $30,000 per child instead of $80,000 I think will keep the child out of public school and build the same generations in klal yisroel . Funnel your money to where it makes an impact

102

 Mar 01, 2009 at 04:41 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #17  
Anonymous Says:

i am not sure why this needs to be on this website. its a tragedy and people in lakewood are aware of this tragedy. it is was intentional it for sure does not belong here. If it was not intentional (and YES this can happen) then why post this. does the family and friends need to see this. why does vinnews need to post this?(they might just censor this entire post as they do many times)

rabbonim and roshei yeshivas in lakewood are very aware of the problem. there are 2 large Bais Medrash and/or after work "yeshivos" Programs in Lakewood that work closely with teenage at risk bochrim. this is on top of the many elementary programs that are not publicized and kept discreet to ensure its success. there are numerous HS yeshivos that recently opened to accept good average bochrim who are NOT the "mitzuyonim" but are clearly able to learn in yeshiva. In the past there was not a middle level yehshiva. so the bochrim or burnt out from the intense learning before bais medrash or gave up hope early on. TODAY there are chosheve established yeshivas that are geared to every level of learning and all producing bnei torah.

YES IT is a tragedy when even one is not saved. Our hearts cry out.



the problem is our culture that cuases the "at risk" in the first place. not the need to have such programs after

103

 Mar 01, 2009 at 04:58 PM Under the carpet somewhere in Toronto Says:

So many have commented how this situation (and many others like this one) needs to be taken from under the carpet and other similar comments. I find it sad/ironic/predictable how so many of us feel this way, yet leave our name's as "anonymous" or put other meaningless alibis. By doing this, we are in fact sweeping it right back under the carpet. Everything that is on this comment board may be intelligent and inspiring, but no real good will come from it because all these comments are all anonymous. Until "real people" with real names are willing to speak up and address the issues it is still under the carpet.
The reason for this is that we are "scared". We aren't willing to put our names where are mouths are. Shidduchim / Sholom Bayis / kids thrown out of schools, are all issues which cause us to sit idly and hide behind the anonymous alibi. The problem with this is that it gets us nowhere. There are only a very few individuals in the community who have taken personal risks to speak up - L'maan hoemes. I suspect that there are many more like myself who would be willing to speak up as long as we knew that we were speaking as a group.

Proposal -

Would VIN or any other site be willing to create a closed forum for all of us who would really like to engage in a serious conversation, with our names out there so that we can engage in real life conversations as well. This would need to be moderated by a trustworthy individual who would protect the privacy of us all in the initial stages. I don't have enough technological know how , let alone the time to devote to such a forum, but would be among the 10 rishonim to join. What do you think?

104

 Mar 01, 2009 at 04:52 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #98  
mark mayer appel Says:

Chevra,,,,,,,,,,lets take a moment and pay our respect to the niftar,AM ECHAD-WE ARE ONE wlill continue to fight the battle against drug abuse and emotional abuse by our community.lets hug and provide more chizuk to our kids,only thru reaching out to our future generation can we make a real diffrence may the niftar be a meiltz yosher for am yisroeal mma

OH PUH LEEZE
None of you here were so generous last year when a "modernishe" bochur from long island fell off a porch in florida. you were all so quick to blast and bash the lifestyle and the community and the school because he was categorized as "modern orthodox" as opposed to this kid who happens to be from lakewood (though seems to have been very much not "yeshivish") now you call for "achdus" ???
real achdus is when you stand up and call for it when you dont feel the pain at home and choose to be judgemental of toehrs.

call for achdus next time you really wanna criticize the victims . then you are being truly honest and sincere.

105

 Mar 01, 2009 at 04:49 PM get an education Says:

Reply to #96  
Anonymous Says:

so when the bottle of xtra strength tylenol says not to exceed 2 in a 24 hour period does that mean the person is a drug addict ? or does it mean that the person felt justified to take a third because his headache became too much to deal with ? now is it possible that this bochur felt the same way with his pain and perhaps took more then perscribed because he couldnt bear the pain?

taking too much tylenolo can kill you too. what planet are you from?

and yes it is possible to become addicted to tylenol just like its possible to become addicted to coffee or dr. pepper or shmutz on the inernet

106

 Mar 01, 2009 at 05:29 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #105  
get an education Says:

taking too much tylenolo can kill you too. what planet are you from?

and yes it is possible to become addicted to tylenol just like its possible to become addicted to coffee or dr. pepper or shmutz on the inernet

apparently u don't realize but I was responding to a nother commentator. I happen to agree with u but you obviously can't read.

107

 Mar 01, 2009 at 05:34 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #10  
rodneybenking Says:

This is so sad. A yiddishe neshama that didn't have to be lost. What a horrible tragedy. My heart goes out to the family. Maybe its about time our hiellege raboonim stop worrying about Lipa, and start addressing the real problems that we face. But we all know this will never happen. It's easier and safer to bash Lipa.

You are one hundred percent right ! well said!

108

 Mar 01, 2009 at 05:38 PM Anonymous Says:

We all need to work on ourselves to not be judgmental about the way a person looks.Every person who hears such news needs to take upon themselves to be interested in one yiddishe neshamma that they think needs Chisuk. This will be an aliyah neshama for this boy, and will bring someone else closer to the Ribbono Shel Olam. Lets do something positive instead of just shmoosing about it.

109

 Mar 01, 2009 at 05:38 PM MARKMAPPEL Says:

Reply to #104  
Anonymous Says:

OH PUH LEEZE
None of you here were so generous last year when a "modernishe" bochur from long island fell off a porch in florida. you were all so quick to blast and bash the lifestyle and the community and the school because he was categorized as "modern orthodox" as opposed to this kid who happens to be from lakewood (though seems to have been very much not "yeshivish") now you call for "achdus" ???
real achdus is when you stand up and call for it when you dont feel the pain at home and choose to be judgemental of toehrs.

call for achdus next time you really wanna criticize the victims . then you are being truly honest and sincere.

AM ECHAD SUPPORTS ALL KID FROM ALL BACKGROUNDS AND GAVE OUR FULL SUPPORT TO THE FAMMILY FROM LONG ISLAND.AM ECHAD IS A GRASSROOTS ORGINIZATION THAT DOES NOT NOT JUDGE ANY ONE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, WE LOVE YOU ANONYMOUS MMMA MARKMAPPEL@AOL.COM

110

 Mar 01, 2009 at 06:00 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #64  
ADDICT Says:

PEOPLE JUST JUDGE IVE BEEN ADDICTED TO OXYCONTIN FOR OVER 2 YEARS IT IS COMPLETE HELL GETTING OFF IT PLEASE DONT JUDGE ANYONE AND ESPECIALLY MY GOOD FRIEND WHO WAS JUST NIFTAR. THIS KILLS ME SO MUCH MORE WHEN YOU PEOPLE TALK LIKE THIS

So why did you deceide to become a drug addict. Who are you blaming? Your parents, your teachers, your community who? B"h the majority of people are not addicts, so please tell me what is your reason, I would love to understand.

111

 Mar 01, 2009 at 05:47 PM Anonymous Says:

to#69: Then close the place down if that is what it's going to take!!Do you realize how much damage is being done by staying open?? Drug pushing and selling, etc.Have them all go cold turkey!!! Get some professional help in for them if necessary, but make sure that there are no drugs on the premises and the next person found or caught with any form of substance goes out in handcuffs!!! DO IT!! After 2 or 3 go out in cuffs, they will not be so quick to bring it to the yeshiva to influence other innocent students. Something MUST BE DONE before we have another tragedy!! Then, the only person you can blame is YOURSELF because you did not do anything NOW, when you had a chance!!!!

112

 Mar 01, 2009 at 05:40 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #38  
Chaim A Says:

I am 21 Year old Addict and yes there is help out there, But you people will never understand how hard it is to break this addiction. I have been to 4 rehabs. I go to support groups here in Lakewood and I still keep relapsing. Forget about helping us, just be our friend. Dont only gossip about us, I have made dumb choices in my life but all my friends have left me, The only one who stuck with me is my family. Many of my friends dont even have family left by their side. And all those who say lakewood does not have this problem... Wake up and smell the coffee. Its not only the kids hanging out at J2 Motzei Shabbos, Its guys from BMG bochurim and married guys alike, addiction has no pity!! Believe me I speak the truth, from facts that i see and all the frum people I meet in the recovery rooms!!!

You seem to be a wonderful boy who unfortunately got caught up with this! May Hashem help you rid this addiction and you should lead a happy and healthy life!

113

 Mar 01, 2009 at 07:10 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #110  
Anonymous Says:

So why did you deceide to become a drug addict. Who are you blaming? Your parents, your teachers, your community who? B"h the majority of people are not addicts, so please tell me what is your reason, I would love to understand.

zeeskeit you don't decide to become an addict-it's a personality disorder. Every person has a different personality. Are you covering something up by stating your first sentence?

114

 Mar 01, 2009 at 07:09 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #110  
Anonymous Says:

So why did you deceide to become a drug addict. Who are you blaming? Your parents, your teachers, your community who? B"h the majority of people are not addicts, so please tell me what is your reason, I would love to understand.

That's a pretty sick comment, full of the exact smug judgment that he respectfully asked people to avoid posting. Where did he mention anything about placing blame? For all you know he blames himself for getting himself into that predicament, which he should, but people like you certainly aren't helping to make things right. If you really want to help the unfortunate addicts in our communities, get off your high horse first and stop acting like you're better than them.

115

 Mar 01, 2009 at 07:41 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #64  
ADDICT Says:

PEOPLE JUST JUDGE IVE BEEN ADDICTED TO OXYCONTIN FOR OVER 2 YEARS IT IS COMPLETE HELL GETTING OFF IT PLEASE DONT JUDGE ANYONE AND ESPECIALLY MY GOOD FRIEND WHO WAS JUST NIFTAR. THIS KILLS ME SO MUCH MORE WHEN YOU PEOPLE TALK LIKE THIS

Dear No. 64: I wish you good health and peace. I hope you can find a good clinic or whatever support you need. I understand that in the past few years, there have been some new medications that can be used to help wean people off of narcotics and maintain sobriety. Try not to let the judgmental members of the community get you down. Those people's opinions are not worth worrying about.

116

 Mar 01, 2009 at 07:23 PM Anonymous Says:

Morei vrabosai! this is a problem that exists all over! Wherever you'll find yidden! May it be anywhere in the usa (that includes flatbush boro park monsey monroe and williamsburg)! And yes I have witnessed it first hand! And yes in williamsburg! The matzav is gevaldig biter! Girls boys and fathers of young kids are unfortunately struggling with this issue. Now with an economy like this who knows what lie ahead!
its ironic how many talkers there are and noone is willing to help these young people and their struggling families! Please rabbosei we need you all to help us help our struggling family members and friends in crisis!
Shamosim balei batim and balei simchos let's stop the wineing and dining in shul! How many more need to loose their parent? Or child? Whith purim on the way please do not serve alcohol to minors or anyone we never know if they are takin any meds! Hatzlacha rabbah may we know of no more tzar!

117

 Mar 01, 2009 at 06:43 PM lakewood Says:

evrybody just shutup and mind your own bizz you all have your own problems that im sure you dont want evereone comenting about

118

 Mar 01, 2009 at 08:36 PM WAKE UP!!!!!wake up!!!! Says:

although in this case it has been stated to not be a deliberate overdose- please lock up your medicines in your homes- even the innocent looking ones. its just like the internet it could look not dangerous by itself . but by mixing a few of the "blue ones "and "red ones" with just little alcohol, can kill someone. Drugs affecting our community are not just the ones that are illegal. THEY ARE IN EVERY ONE OF OUR HOMES. HOW ABOUT HOME CHEMICALS? ITS ALSO AWAY TO O.D . EVEN WITHOUT CONSUMING.

Ask Rabbi Abraham J Twerski how many years he has been screaming for everyone to wake up.

If one person in a yeshiva is effected it is a cause to be concerned that many are -possibily for the same reason. AND THEN QUESTION YOURSELF - WHY DID YOU NOT TRY TO HELP THEM?WHY DID YOU NOT RECOGNIZE THAT THERE WAS A PROBLEM?

EVEN ONE CHILD IS AN EPIDEMIC. AND KICKING HIM OUT OF YESHIVA IS NOT THE REAL ANSWER- NOT ALL THE TIME.

119

 Mar 01, 2009 at 08:39 PM Anonymous Says:

How does one help someone who is intent on destroying themselves?. Being non judgemental does not seem to be the answer. Being nice doesn't help at all.
"Someone" seems to be going deeper and deeper into their pit.
At what point does trying to help turn into enabling?
Is there anyone truly qualified to help a young man, no longer a kid at risk, whose parents have tried to be nice till its killing them?
Let's stop bashing and kvetching and let's post some solutions.
It would be helpful to hear true advice that has helped from past addicts (if there is such a thing as past).

120

 Mar 01, 2009 at 08:55 PM Drei Says:

Instead of using this poor soul to vent our pet peeves we should express our sincere feelings of sympathy to a family in deep pain.may they have a true 'nechama'

121

 Mar 01, 2009 at 09:15 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #21  
Proactive Says:

The highschools should have proffesionals address the drug and alcohol problem in school!!!! Just like they have internet asifos there should be awareness about this evergrowing issue!

I agree. They do this in the less "yeshivish elementary(junior high) schools and high schools.

122

 Mar 01, 2009 at 09:09 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #17  
Anonymous Says:

i am not sure why this needs to be on this website. its a tragedy and people in lakewood are aware of this tragedy. it is was intentional it for sure does not belong here. If it was not intentional (and YES this can happen) then why post this. does the family and friends need to see this. why does vinnews need to post this?(they might just censor this entire post as they do many times)

rabbonim and roshei yeshivas in lakewood are very aware of the problem. there are 2 large Bais Medrash and/or after work "yeshivos" Programs in Lakewood that work closely with teenage at risk bochrim. this is on top of the many elementary programs that are not publicized and kept discreet to ensure its success. there are numerous HS yeshivos that recently opened to accept good average bochrim who are NOT the "mitzuyonim" but are clearly able to learn in yeshiva. In the past there was not a middle level yehshiva. so the bochrim or burnt out from the intense learning before bais medrash or gave up hope early on. TODAY there are chosheve established yeshivas that are geared to every level of learning and all producing bnei torah.

YES IT is a tragedy when even one is not saved. Our hearts cry out.



Who said this boy was at risk. YOu are jumping to conclusions. This incident needs to be on this website or any others to inform the public that some "drugs" that are prescribed or over the counter drugs can be lethal and dangerous.

123

 Mar 01, 2009 at 08:42 PM comment 117 I AGREE. Says:

comment 117 I AGREE.

I THINK MANY PEOPLE WHO READ THE ABOVE COMMENTS REALIZE THAT THIS WAS NOT A INTENDED O.D. and I believe it was an accident as i heard .

but the issues of the danger should be addresed in a diffrent format, blog.....many people have no idea the danger of simple household medicine. I remember a person in yeshiva who took to much sudafed then what was prescribed on the over the counter bottle. He had to be rushed to the hospital to pump his stomach s his heart was racing fast.


.

124

 Mar 01, 2009 at 09:51 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #110  
Anonymous Says:

So why did you deceide to become a drug addict. Who are you blaming? Your parents, your teachers, your community who? B"h the majority of people are not addicts, so please tell me what is your reason, I would love to understand.

just like you became a blogger addict he became a drug addict . what makes him tick does not make someone else tick

125

 Mar 01, 2009 at 10:18 PM jj Says:

it sounds like fun.where can I get some?

126

 Mar 01, 2009 at 10:38 PM TRUTH Says:

Reply to #68  
emes Says:

And now let's all go to schi's dinner and celebrate their fancy local taxpayer funded state of the art building , while Chavrei Hakolel and other mosdos that are saving yiddesha neshamos and really making a difference in klal yisroel suffer financially.That's what happenes when we give tzedaka based on media not importance

First of all, chavrei hakollel and minyan also generate tremendous amount of unding from the same people and taxpayers that support SCHI. Secondly, how d o you know which neshama needs more special attention. How do you know how each neshama would look without it? some peoples emotions are stirred by different tzedakas. AS long as they are giving tzedaka they are all on right track

127

 Mar 01, 2009 at 10:28 PM AA all the way Says:

Reply to #53  
Anonymous Says:

When will the Oilam an lakewood promote AA- NA- SA- ? There are so many yeshiva guys who need this help. How much more suffering do we need?!! Please!!!

my dear friend, you are right. you dont need to affect the oilam. all you have to do is to get some guys, start some meeting and the rest will follow. trust me, as a person who has helped be a part of jewish recovery in new york. i'm in yeshiva now and there is a handful of guys who are in recovery. as a group we go to meetings and help each other with our struggles. we do not express our beliefs to the world. we limit ourselves to those who will accept us and b'h everything is great. stay strong...

128

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:30 PM Michoel Levy Says:

Reply to #68  
emes Says:

And now let's all go to schi's dinner and celebrate their fancy local taxpayer funded state of the art building , while Chavrei Hakolel and other mosdos that are saving yiddesha neshamos and really making a difference in klal yisroel suffer financially.That's what happenes when we give tzedaka based on media not importance

Hello there Mr (hide behind the word) Emes, just wanted to comment on your statement "while CK & other Mosdos that are saving Yiddesha neshamos & really making a difference in klal yisrael suffer financially,that's what happens when we give tzedaka based on media not importance" As someone who has worked with teenagers,boys spending time abroad in E. Yisrael & now work for a Yeshiva that services boys post-Israel,many of whom have struggled with substance abuse in the past,& still battle on thru their college years, I must tell you that your statements are not "emes" as u call them,but actually blatantly false. Yes the wonderful 4 men who currently run CK are doing a phenominal job & are truly providing a service to these families & boys,as well as a nachas ruach to Hashem for standing in the "no guts no glory" breach and saving the Almighty's children. But to insinuate that a fabulous institution like Schi is not "saving Yiddesha neshamos,or is somehow an organization based on media importance" is a terrible thing to say & somehow suggests that these children are not as important or not Hashems' as it were,as much as our teenagers who are in your view the only "Mosdos of importance".I know the staff @ the Kollel personally,& have taught many Chassanim there. i am also affiliated with Minyan Shelanu. That said i strongly support Schi in their holy work an avoda which is as important crucial & and vital to our nation as any other. You see when it comes to different challenges facing klal yisraels' "heartbeat" it's children,i am,as we believe we should all be,an equal opportunity lender. As for those criticizing our Rabbanim,lay leaders,and communities in general. I truly feel that this is an agenda-driven critique @ best. This problem,which unfortunately took the life of a young boy in Lakewood is not Being hidden under any carpet, nor being smoothed over with sound bites any longer. Everyone the world over knows this is a challenge which is being addressed @ every level these days. for those specifically targeting Lakewood on this blog, i must say, i grew up in Bklyn NY & in the 80's the community there took a heck of alot longer to address the problem than Lakewood has over the last 4-5 years. Others still, hide behind anonymous names & preach to us, I suspect they're either bitter @ not being able to fundraise the necessary funds for their institutions which deal with this problem. Well listen up fellas all our Mosdos are suffering financially (including mine) but that doesnt mean we need to scream shout & criticize, basically exploiting this childs death for our own benefit i dare say. i guess the others are accustomed to criticizing anything that appears on this site & has some "anonymous soundbiting opportunity" attached to it. either way Hope fully we as a nation will get better @ meeting the challenges we face today with help from Our dear Almighty. Even if it means we'll have one less thing to blog about Heaven forbid. Btw my name IS attached,so u can look me up I'm in the book.

129

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:20 PM Moishie Says:

Reply to #119  
Anonymous Says:

How does one help someone who is intent on destroying themselves?. Being non judgemental does not seem to be the answer. Being nice doesn't help at all.
"Someone" seems to be going deeper and deeper into their pit.
At what point does trying to help turn into enabling?
Is there anyone truly qualified to help a young man, no longer a kid at risk, whose parents have tried to be nice till its killing them?
Let's stop bashing and kvetching and let's post some solutions.
It would be helpful to hear true advice that has helped from past addicts (if there is such a thing as past).

The individual must know, feel and sense that you really CARE and have unconditional love for him or her. Being nice and non-judgemental is good but is inadequate. So many parents and mechanchim really care, but are unable to convey the message to troubled individuals. Sometimes it appears that parents and teachers act caringly but their reaction to social stigma sometimes diminishes the sincerity. It takes a tremendous level of self-restraint to watch incorrect and clearly wrong behavior, but still hold on caringly to a troubled individual, so that the individual knows you are a trusted crutch that can always be leaned on. Never, ever betray that trust! It is OK to show your pain, but it must be the pain that you sense for the individual; not the pain you feel because you are personally embarrased by your association to this individual.

#56/57 pointed out some good simple examples to build the self-esteem of such individuals. If they felt good about themselves this would not be happening. We all have so much stress in our life, it is so challenging to always be upbeat and complimentary to people around us. It is so natural to criticize! (Take the average VIN Comment) It's no wonder people have low self-esteem. If only we can all as a zechus for the niftar become sensitive to those around us and only say something if it's positive, look for ways to build up those around us emotionally and have a more positive attitude, we will change our communities and rid so many problems. May the family, friends and community have a Nechama B'Soch Sh'ar Aveilei Tzion V'Yerushalayim. I did not know the niftar and family.

130

 Mar 01, 2009 at 11:04 PM Mrs. Kugelfresser Says:

Reply to #103  
Under the carpet somewhere in Toronto Says:

So many have commented how this situation (and many others like this one) needs to be taken from under the carpet and other similar comments. I find it sad/ironic/predictable how so many of us feel this way, yet leave our name's as "anonymous" or put other meaningless alibis. By doing this, we are in fact sweeping it right back under the carpet. Everything that is on this comment board may be intelligent and inspiring, but no real good will come from it because all these comments are all anonymous. Until "real people" with real names are willing to speak up and address the issues it is still under the carpet.
The reason for this is that we are "scared". We aren't willing to put our names where are mouths are. Shidduchim / Sholom Bayis / kids thrown out of schools, are all issues which cause us to sit idly and hide behind the anonymous alibi. The problem with this is that it gets us nowhere. There are only a very few individuals in the community who have taken personal risks to speak up - L'maan hoemes. I suspect that there are many more like myself who would be willing to speak up as long as we knew that we were speaking as a group.

Proposal -

Would VIN or any other site be willing to create a closed forum for all of us who would really like to engage in a serious conversation, with our names out there so that we can engage in real life conversations as well. This would need to be moderated by a trustworthy individual who would protect the privacy of us all in the initial stages. I don't have enough technological know how , let alone the time to devote to such a forum, but would be among the 10 rishonim to join. What do you think?

Dear Under the Carpet in Toronto: I understand where you are coming from. Unfortunately, I cannot sign my "real" name because I have mishpucha in Toronto. I have heard that this is a very big problem in Toronto, even among middle aged married people with pre-teen children. Drinking and pot smoking are very common. This is probably the case in other communities too. I know that back in the 60s, when my children's grandparents were young married, that prescription drug abuse and alcohol abuse were very common. There were young veibelach in the heimish community that we lived in that needed uppers to wake up in the morning and downers at night to go to sleep and these were all prescribed by reputable doctors. Ayn chadash tachas hashemesh, but nowadays, there is no more room for any more shmutz under the carpet and it's time to clean house! And the children are watching.....

131

 Mar 01, 2009 at 10:56 PM little sheep Says:

baruch dayan ha'emes.

132

 Mar 01, 2009 at 10:53 PM Anonymous Says:

I just want to know why when a horrible tragedy occurs people decide to spill out all the spite they feel about their community, high school teachers, rabbonim, and parents that they feel are somehow to blame for it all. Yes we all had our issues and awful experiences, but on such a topic board all you should be saying, is "Hamakom Yenachem Eschem" and such. Please put all your malice into something else. The niftar is not here to defend himself. Please remember that its harder to ask mechila after the person who people spoke bad about already has had his neshama go up. And also keep in mind that all the gossip that is going around is causing extra pain to a family who has already suffered from a horrible loss of a sibling.

I would also like to say to the person who posted the family's information, that you have no shame nor any regard for another person's privacy and i pray that you never know the humiliation that you have caused his family in by doing so. Try and think before you do something as crude and indelicate as that again!!

133

 Mar 02, 2009 at 03:39 AM Avrohom Abba Says:

Reply to #104  
Anonymous Says:

OH PUH LEEZE
None of you here were so generous last year when a "modernishe" bochur from long island fell off a porch in florida. you were all so quick to blast and bash the lifestyle and the community and the school because he was categorized as "modern orthodox" as opposed to this kid who happens to be from lakewood (though seems to have been very much not "yeshivish") now you call for "achdus" ???
real achdus is when you stand up and call for it when you dont feel the pain at home and choose to be judgemental of toehrs.

call for achdus next time you really wanna criticize the victims . then you are being truly honest and sincere.

Excellent, honest, realistic and brave, are all the correct words to describe this person's statement. Where was the Jewish community when it was a modern Orthodox person who was killed then? And guess what? Even if a totally non religious person passes, do we ever have the right to lessen its significance?
Since when do all the tzadikim suddenly come out onto the scene and decide what only Hashem should decide?
I will try my best bli neder to never decide about matters that are from the Only One.
Boruch Dayan Emes.

134

 Mar 02, 2009 at 03:31 AM Anonymous Says:

just wanted to say stop being so harsh on the ppl that are basheing rabonim and organozations becuase most of them are just teenagers that feel neglected or feel like theyre instatution is being neglected and lets just give them a hug and show them how much we and the rabonim really care

135

 Mar 02, 2009 at 03:22 AM A profesional in the field Says:

As someone working with teens at risk for many years, and also being a substance abuse professional, let me make this clear. In all my years, Lakewood poses to be one of the biggest problems in regards to kids going off the derech. And when Lakewood kids go off..they go off harder than most. They display the most frustration and anger towards Rabbanim and Yiddishkeit in general out of all the Jewish communities that I see. This is because Lakewood is more or less a Jewish ghetto..either your "in" Lakewood or you're not. This has to change. Monsey and Brooklyn have their outlets and have Rabbanim and proffesionals who are way more open minded and down to earth who can relate. Lakewood had a few of these people, but it is NOT enough. The Lakewood community should learn from other communities . I have worked with many Lakewood teenagers and most despise their community. If you want these horrible deaths to stop than I suggest as a community looking in the mirror and realizing that a Jew is a Jew regardless of his appearance. As a community if you can't and are not willing to accept this than may Hashem rachmanos on you. When you give a dirty look to a teenager who went "off" you will also have to answer for that one day. I suggest next time you see some "off the derech teenagers'' in Lakewood..maybe stop your car and ask them if they need a ride, or go pick them up a pie of pizza. These gestures make a world of difference. Baruch dayan emmes. May we all experience no more sorrow.

136

 Mar 02, 2009 at 03:06 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #41  
Anonymous Says:

I don't blame J2 for being open Motzoi Shabbos and becoming a hangout.

Lakewood used to be free of all eateries that had sit-downs and had take out ONLY to avoid having hang-outs (I know, it's hard for New Yorkers to imagine such ideals). Then along came one food establishment who decided to break the rule and "paved the way" for every place to follow suit. That helped contribute to the spiritual decline of what used to be a town of spirituality (the cheaper home prices that brought many Boro Parkers and Flatbush people in didn't help either). That place will bear responsibility for that, no matter how much the owner denies it being his fault.

It's nebach that you have to blame the restaurants for the town hangouts. The parents have to know where their kids are -Being at night seder is no excuse to not watch your kids.

137

 Mar 02, 2009 at 02:05 AM Frum therapist Says:

As all the professionals and rabbis who work with teens at risk and substance abusers will tell you, a large, large percentage have developed these problems as a reaction to the trauma of sexual abuse. While Dov Hikind continues to publicize this problem and to work for solutions in Brooklyn, the Lakewood community and its leaders refuse to address it publicly, sweeping the problem under the rug. The rug has no more room. We must start acknowledging that far too many children in our community have been hurt by our neglecting to put into place reasonable safety plans to protect our children. We continue to minimize the pain caused by this horrible experience, and to let the molesters off the hook. Do the math. How many teens at risk? If, as the professionals say a MAJORITY have been abused, then wouldn't it make sense if there were at least SOME arrests made of those Roydfim who prey upon our innocent kids? Have there been ANY in Lakewood, ever???? As we learn from Shaul Hamelech's terrible mistake in keeping Agag alive in this week's haftarah, "Kol Hamerachem Al Ha'achzarim, Sofo L'achzar al Harachmanim."

To all those who say we should not blame our leaders, you are right. We don't HAVE any leaders. That is why in Brooklyn, Dov Hikind was forced, Bmakom Sheayn Ish to take charge. If those who CALL themselves leaders would actually lead, then they would be the one's to publicly acknowledge the problem and to put efforts into solving it.

138

 Mar 02, 2009 at 12:49 AM help needed! Says:

What we need is an orginiztion with a dedicated reliable staff of rabbonim doctors and therapists willing to help for a minimal fee since it can cost a family hundreds of thousands of dollars to treat one individual! Very often the family cannot pay for treatment and rehabs don't do very much (that's our familys experience). Therefore I suggest an org. Of such be born, not for the sake of some askin bragging to people about others but for the sake of helping our yidden!!!!!

139

 Mar 02, 2009 at 12:23 AM SSIY Says:

The Yeshivish World has a major problem with cigarette smoking. This
for some reason is extremely prevalent in Eretz Yisrael and places
like Lakewood. Cigarette's our a gateway drug. How many of these at
risk kids started out smoking cigarette's before moving on to more
hard core drugs. How does a young Jewish boy pick up a habit like this
which destroys lives. Walk outside a Yeshiva like the Mir and it is
impossible to go anywhere without encountering someone who is smoking.
Klal Yisrael needs to end their SILENCE and speak up against smoking
in our communities. A young impressionable mind that somehow picks up
this terrible addiction that is so hard to overcome, is starting on a
path that will lead to devastating consequences that we as a community
cannot bear. Nipping this problem at it's bud by literally eradicating
smoking from our community and especially preventing those who do not
smoke from starting would save Klal Yisrael so much pain and
suffering.

140

 Mar 02, 2009 at 07:17 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #128  
Michoel Levy Says:

Hello there Mr (hide behind the word) Emes, just wanted to comment on your statement "while CK & other Mosdos that are saving Yiddesha neshamos & really making a difference in klal yisrael suffer financially,that's what happens when we give tzedaka based on media not importance" As someone who has worked with teenagers,boys spending time abroad in E. Yisrael & now work for a Yeshiva that services boys post-Israel,many of whom have struggled with substance abuse in the past,& still battle on thru their college years, I must tell you that your statements are not "emes" as u call them,but actually blatantly false. Yes the wonderful 4 men who currently run CK are doing a phenominal job & are truly providing a service to these families & boys,as well as a nachas ruach to Hashem for standing in the "no guts no glory" breach and saving the Almighty's children. But to insinuate that a fabulous institution like Schi is not "saving Yiddesha neshamos,or is somehow an organization based on media importance" is a terrible thing to say & somehow suggests that these children are not as important or not Hashems' as it were,as much as our teenagers who are in your view the only "Mosdos of importance".I know the staff @ the Kollel personally,& have taught many Chassanim there. i am also affiliated with Minyan Shelanu. That said i strongly support Schi in their holy work an avoda which is as important crucial & and vital to our nation as any other. You see when it comes to different challenges facing klal yisraels' "heartbeat" it's children,i am,as we believe we should all be,an equal opportunity lender. As for those criticizing our Rabbanim,lay leaders,and communities in general. I truly feel that this is an agenda-driven critique @ best. This problem,which unfortunately took the life of a young boy in Lakewood is not Being hidden under any carpet, nor being smoothed over with sound bites any longer. Everyone the world over knows this is a challenge which is being addressed @ every level these days. for those specifically targeting Lakewood on this blog, i must say, i grew up in Bklyn NY & in the 80's the community there took a heck of alot longer to address the problem than Lakewood has over the last 4-5 years. Others still, hide behind anonymous names & preach to us, I suspect they're either bitter @ not being able to fundraise the necessary funds for their institutions which deal with this problem. Well listen up fellas all our Mosdos are suffering financially (including mine) but that doesnt mean we need to scream shout & criticize, basically exploiting this childs death for our own benefit i dare say. i guess the others are accustomed to criticizing anything that appears on this site & has some "anonymous soundbiting opportunity" attached to it. either way Hope fully we as a nation will get better @ meeting the challenges we face today with help from Our dear Almighty. Even if it means we'll have one less thing to blog about Heaven forbid. Btw my name IS attached,so u can look me up I'm in the book.

Michael, I rarely comment on these blogs but I just wanted to say. Thank you your putting things in perspective for the many reader of VIN.! Your comment was very eloquently written and your point is well taken. it is no secret to us how much mesiros nefesh you and others like yourself put into 'Gds children'. May you keep up your holy work for many years to come but let us soon see the time when your efforts will no longer be needed! (Your chaver close by # 24)

141

 Mar 02, 2009 at 08:02 AM Professional Says:

The large number of posts above suggests that many people care about a tragedy such as this one, and are searching for answers.

There are no easy answers, no quick fixes.

Some issues to consider:

1) Teens are exposed to all sorts of potential dangers, due to a myriad of reasons, and hence it behooves parents and yeshivas and seminaries to educate our youth about some of the potential dangers. Study after study has shown that talking about such issues does not prompt teens to engage in an activity (if done correctly, of course). Teachers and rebbes can be trained as to how to approach certain topics. For example, the sad story of Bnei Aharon dying during their service has been attributed by commentaries to their being drunk. Purim is soon upon us. Yet, I would venture to guess that except for jokes and encouragement by rebbeim for young talmidim to get drunk, there is little or no discussion of alcohol and its potential effects on the body--let alone of the Remo's halachic solution, ie to go to sleep on Purim afternoon and not get intoxicated.

2) Communities have to support programs that help wayward youth. While the rabbonim of Lakewood have travelled far and wide to raise money for the Yeshiva, it would be great if a fraction of the funds raised went toward helping some of the wayward youth.

3) After-school recreation and sports are needed by frum youth, to blow off some steam, and help them deal with the testosterone etc surging through their bodies.
Find healthy outlets for teens.

4) Mental health care begins with community efforts to stop ostracizing our youth. The teenage years are a time of questioning and exploration. Let's not condemn those who wander a bit. Where is our common sense and rachmanus? Why are we so narrow-minded and neurotic?

142

 Mar 02, 2009 at 08:01 AM cool masmid Says:

Reply to #135  
A profesional in the field Says:

As someone working with teens at risk for many years, and also being a substance abuse professional, let me make this clear. In all my years, Lakewood poses to be one of the biggest problems in regards to kids going off the derech. And when Lakewood kids go off..they go off harder than most. They display the most frustration and anger towards Rabbanim and Yiddishkeit in general out of all the Jewish communities that I see. This is because Lakewood is more or less a Jewish ghetto..either your "in" Lakewood or you're not. This has to change. Monsey and Brooklyn have their outlets and have Rabbanim and proffesionals who are way more open minded and down to earth who can relate. Lakewood had a few of these people, but it is NOT enough. The Lakewood community should learn from other communities . I have worked with many Lakewood teenagers and most despise their community. If you want these horrible deaths to stop than I suggest as a community looking in the mirror and realizing that a Jew is a Jew regardless of his appearance. As a community if you can't and are not willing to accept this than may Hashem rachmanos on you. When you give a dirty look to a teenager who went "off" you will also have to answer for that one day. I suggest next time you see some "off the derech teenagers'' in Lakewood..maybe stop your car and ask them if they need a ride, or go pick them up a pie of pizza. These gestures make a world of difference. Baruch dayan emmes. May we all experience no more sorrow.

Let me thank you for all you do..... but also let me just say as someone who is living in Lakewood for over 15 years, that there is everything to love about this town and there are a lot of people that would be willing to do whatever it takes to help these boys...... My take is that these boys have no geshmuk in serving the Almighty and so its very convenient to blame everyone but themselves- they blame Almighty Himself, their parents, their rabbeim, the rov of the shul, the Lakewood Mashgiach and Roshei Yeshivos etc. - its blame blame just not themselves. I have one advice for ALL these boys; go inside a bais hamedresh and open up a gemorah and start learning hard as it maybe and ALL the problems will fall to the wayside .... Guaranteed!!!!!!!

143

 Mar 02, 2009 at 08:08 AM Anonymous Says:

In response to number 110: he decided to become an addict the same day u decided to become an idiot! People don't wake up and decide to become addicts!! The pain of rejection and dejection is very real in the youth of our society. Stop judging already!!

144

 Mar 02, 2009 at 09:11 AM professional in the field Says:

Reply to #142  
cool masmid Says:

Let me thank you for all you do..... but also let me just say as someone who is living in Lakewood for over 15 years, that there is everything to love about this town and there are a lot of people that would be willing to do whatever it takes to help these boys...... My take is that these boys have no geshmuk in serving the Almighty and so its very convenient to blame everyone but themselves- they blame Almighty Himself, their parents, their rabbeim, the rov of the shul, the Lakewood Mashgiach and Roshei Yeshivos etc. - its blame blame just not themselves. I have one advice for ALL these boys; go inside a bais hamedresh and open up a gemorah and start learning hard as it maybe and ALL the problems will fall to the wayside .... Guaranteed!!!!!!!

Thank you for the hakara Hatov. It's tough work. Your advice is well founded, but these guys have zero drive to learn. In majority of these cases the boys do blame because most have had traumatic experiences in their own lives. They blame, and usually, with just cause. I myself was "off the derech" well over a decade ago...and I'm going to explain why because it's important for people to realize how one person can hurt someone to such a degree. I was 15 in a yeshiva high school, and after failing gemarah for 7 consecutive months I was told that if I wouldnt pass the class I would have no choice but to make the work up in the summer, and in yeshiva. Not wanting to give up my summer, my parents hired a Rabbi to help me. For two and a half months straight I studied and studied. There wasn't one test that I failed. In fact I was getting 70's and 80's. I also passed the final. My parents were so proud of me, and more importantly, i was proud of myself and my dedication. I recieved my report card and the teacher failed me with a 64.2 average with 65 being passing (up from my average in the 20's) After many protests....it was made clear to me and my parents...and I quote the teacher..." It's not about the homework or the effort...what the calculator says goes." Needless to say...I was devastated. After that I was hurt that words on this page won't do justice. The last thing I would want to do is learn. So yes, these guys can blame...and many times with just cause. We need to engage these students and build them up again. They need positivity and encouragement. They need to see themselves as worthy people. OUR job is to make them feel accepted. There is no other way.

145

 Mar 02, 2009 at 09:28 AM sane Says:

Reply to #142  
cool masmid Says:

Let me thank you for all you do..... but also let me just say as someone who is living in Lakewood for over 15 years, that there is everything to love about this town and there are a lot of people that would be willing to do whatever it takes to help these boys...... My take is that these boys have no geshmuk in serving the Almighty and so its very convenient to blame everyone but themselves- they blame Almighty Himself, their parents, their rabbeim, the rov of the shul, the Lakewood Mashgiach and Roshei Yeshivos etc. - its blame blame just not themselves. I have one advice for ALL these boys; go inside a bais hamedresh and open up a gemorah and start learning hard as it maybe and ALL the problems will fall to the wayside .... Guaranteed!!!!!!!

You are obviously not a "masmid" if you are putting a post on VIN, so don't tell other people to open a gemorra when you don't do it yourself. This is the typical hypocricy that promotes our youths' rejection of our values and resort to extreme measures. Let us instead promote realism in raising children and help prepare them for what they are meant to be, not what you want them to be.

146

 Mar 02, 2009 at 10:27 AM Malka Says:

Reply to #38  
Chaim A Says:

I am 21 Year old Addict and yes there is help out there, But you people will never understand how hard it is to break this addiction. I have been to 4 rehabs. I go to support groups here in Lakewood and I still keep relapsing. Forget about helping us, just be our friend. Dont only gossip about us, I have made dumb choices in my life but all my friends have left me, The only one who stuck with me is my family. Many of my friends dont even have family left by their side. And all those who say lakewood does not have this problem... Wake up and smell the coffee. Its not only the kids hanging out at J2 Motzei Shabbos, Its guys from BMG bochurim and married guys alike, addiction has no pity!! Believe me I speak the truth, from facts that i see and all the frum people I meet in the recovery rooms!!!

Chaim A, I pray the obsession is lifted from you.

147

 Mar 02, 2009 at 10:19 AM Rebbe J Says:

Reply to #142  
cool masmid Says:

Let me thank you for all you do..... but also let me just say as someone who is living in Lakewood for over 15 years, that there is everything to love about this town and there are a lot of people that would be willing to do whatever it takes to help these boys...... My take is that these boys have no geshmuk in serving the Almighty and so its very convenient to blame everyone but themselves- they blame Almighty Himself, their parents, their rabbeim, the rov of the shul, the Lakewood Mashgiach and Roshei Yeshivos etc. - its blame blame just not themselves. I have one advice for ALL these boys; go inside a bais hamedresh and open up a gemorah and start learning hard as it maybe and ALL the problems will fall to the wayside .... Guaranteed!!!!!!!

You still have your head buried in the sand. Your way of thinking is the problem, not the solution. You remind me of my days in yeshiva. If there was no heat in the building the Rebbe would say "learn geshmak" and you'll warm up. Your post is just as stupid.

148

 Mar 02, 2009 at 10:59 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #18  
Anonymous Says:

and what do the roshei hayeshivas have to say...the mashgichim.....NOTHING...get drunk if you have to bring in the money....PURIM

I pity that you have such a misguided view. Not everyrhing is about money. Most mechanchim want what's best for their talmidim.

149

 Mar 02, 2009 at 10:58 AM little sheep Says:

it's interesting that while all the anonymous posters here were bashing people who are "very obviously at fault" for this tragedy, when i texted a friend of his, without mentioning that i had heard about his death, (nor was i 100% sure that they were friends) our conversation went something like this:

me-"thinking of you"
friend-"my friend died"
me-"i was wondering if he was your friend. i just heard about it. i'm here if you need to talk"
friend-"...i can't stop crying. i'm not dealing. it's too much..."
me-"i wish i knew what to say."
friend-"there's nothing to say"
me-"i know. that's one of the hard parts. do you want to talk?"
friend-"nothing to say."

interesting how we're all busy bashing people who "could've, would've, and should've" when the people close to him who are in pain are NOT. and let me tell you, this kid could do plenty of bashing, but isn't. maybe it's time to take a good, hard look and see whose neshamos are more messed up-ours, or theirs?

150

 Mar 02, 2009 at 10:04 AM shoor habor Says:

Reply to #142  
cool masmid Says:

Let me thank you for all you do..... but also let me just say as someone who is living in Lakewood for over 15 years, that there is everything to love about this town and there are a lot of people that would be willing to do whatever it takes to help these boys...... My take is that these boys have no geshmuk in serving the Almighty and so its very convenient to blame everyone but themselves- they blame Almighty Himself, their parents, their rabbeim, the rov of the shul, the Lakewood Mashgiach and Roshei Yeshivos etc. - its blame blame just not themselves. I have one advice for ALL these boys; go inside a bais hamedresh and open up a gemorah and start learning hard as it maybe and ALL the problems will fall to the wayside .... Guaranteed!!!!!!!

if my kid went to a lipa concert i would send him to boot camp even if all they served was chazer .

151

 Mar 02, 2009 at 11:39 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #135  
A profesional in the field Says:

As someone working with teens at risk for many years, and also being a substance abuse professional, let me make this clear. In all my years, Lakewood poses to be one of the biggest problems in regards to kids going off the derech. And when Lakewood kids go off..they go off harder than most. They display the most frustration and anger towards Rabbanim and Yiddishkeit in general out of all the Jewish communities that I see. This is because Lakewood is more or less a Jewish ghetto..either your "in" Lakewood or you're not. This has to change. Monsey and Brooklyn have their outlets and have Rabbanim and proffesionals who are way more open minded and down to earth who can relate. Lakewood had a few of these people, but it is NOT enough. The Lakewood community should learn from other communities . I have worked with many Lakewood teenagers and most despise their community. If you want these horrible deaths to stop than I suggest as a community looking in the mirror and realizing that a Jew is a Jew regardless of his appearance. As a community if you can't and are not willing to accept this than may Hashem rachmanos on you. When you give a dirty look to a teenager who went "off" you will also have to answer for that one day. I suggest next time you see some "off the derech teenagers'' in Lakewood..maybe stop your car and ask them if they need a ride, or go pick them up a pie of pizza. These gestures make a world of difference. Baruch dayan emmes. May we all experience no more sorrow.

funny you say that b/c i spoke to a 'professional in the field too' and he told me that brooklyn kids that "go off" they "go off harder"
go figure!

152

 Mar 02, 2009 at 11:14 AM whatever Says:

If you're not here to send your condolences, or have nice things to say about this boy, then why don't you save your ridiculous comments for another forum. A boys life was taken, and all most of you can do is rant. I want you to think about, this being your brother, son, father, or friend, then let's see how quick you are to post such comments. May his family find peace, and may his soul rise to the heavens.

153

 Mar 02, 2009 at 12:43 PM Anonymous Says:

As someone who is a professional working with teens with emotional and behavioral problems for years, as well as teaching, I must say that any rebbe who would fail a student with a 64.2 average after a summer of effort should not be in chinuch. The 'lesson' he taught this student was a cruel one. In fact, of course, Hashem DOES value the effort. As for the moronic notion that studying Gemorrah is a cure-all (#142), what can we say to people who are simply uneducable?

There is hope for our youth when we start use common sense, and start by caring about our youth, as people, not judging everyone we encounter.

There is simply too much judgementalism in our community.

As for tragedies such as this one, we can continue to put our heads in the sand, or seek to learn so as to help others who might be tempted to take painkillers to treat their pain, or due to having fallen into an addiction. To do so, however, we have to confront some bitter realities, including the fact that our yeshiva system has failed so many of our youth, and that our overly narrow minded approach pushes away too many who do not fit the cookie cutter approach in so many charedi communities.

154

 Mar 02, 2009 at 12:42 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #144  
professional in the field Says:

Thank you for the hakara Hatov. It's tough work. Your advice is well founded, but these guys have zero drive to learn. In majority of these cases the boys do blame because most have had traumatic experiences in their own lives. They blame, and usually, with just cause. I myself was "off the derech" well over a decade ago...and I'm going to explain why because it's important for people to realize how one person can hurt someone to such a degree. I was 15 in a yeshiva high school, and after failing gemarah for 7 consecutive months I was told that if I wouldnt pass the class I would have no choice but to make the work up in the summer, and in yeshiva. Not wanting to give up my summer, my parents hired a Rabbi to help me. For two and a half months straight I studied and studied. There wasn't one test that I failed. In fact I was getting 70's and 80's. I also passed the final. My parents were so proud of me, and more importantly, i was proud of myself and my dedication. I recieved my report card and the teacher failed me with a 64.2 average with 65 being passing (up from my average in the 20's) After many protests....it was made clear to me and my parents...and I quote the teacher..." It's not about the homework or the effort...what the calculator says goes." Needless to say...I was devastated. After that I was hurt that words on this page won't do justice. The last thing I would want to do is learn. So yes, these guys can blame...and many times with just cause. We need to engage these students and build them up again. They need positivity and encouragement. They need to see themselves as worthy people. OUR job is to make them feel accepted. There is no other way.

your teacher was very wrong. In fact I don't think kids should get marks only in numbers. They should be graded according to the effort put in as well. A rebbe or teacher has to be tuned in to his students and know if one is really trying or not and of course the parents have to be involved with their child. I know teachers who give special tests to students who are having a hard time, just so they can pass the course. Many students have hidden learning disabilities and have to be helped. Many children need motivation. A child like you were should have gotten at least a C or a B for the effort you put in.

155

 Mar 02, 2009 at 12:35 PM professional in the field Says:

Reply to #151  
Anonymous Says:

funny you say that b/c i spoke to a 'professional in the field too' and he told me that brooklyn kids that "go off" they "go off harder"
go figure!

I guess everyone has a right to their own opinions. I work in a setting where we have students from almost every Jewish community in the States, and yes when teenagers from Lakewood go "off the derech" they do go off harder and it's much more of a challenge to bring them back. When one is raised in such an insular community these things happen in greater extremes. (KJ and Williamburg are another 2) I can't count of how many of my students through out the years have told me that if you're not part of the yeshiva world you're looked at as nothing. Whether true or not these are how my students feel. Those are their feelings. In Brooklyn there is way more substance abuse and teens using in greater numbers, but they have ample professionals working with them, and more than dedicated. When it comes to Lakewood, there are professionals and Rabbanim working with them, but not close to enough, and this is mainly because Lakewood is still somewhat in the dark about the problems it has, and funding is not enough. Where's the Our Place of Lakewood? This is ridiculous to discuss. You want to see the problem go for it, if you don't, well what I can't do much about that. These teenagers need to feel validated. We have to stop talking and start listening. These teenagers are hurting, and they want to be accepted for who they are, and not what they look like, or what music they listen to. They are not foreigners or strangers. And if there could be one positive aspect coming out of this tragedy, it's that a community will be more aware and ready to tackly issues in a sincere and emmesdik way. I only hope that Lakewood moves full speed ahead and continues to understand the world these teens go through and start accepting these people for who they are. Real, caring, yet hurting teenagers.

156

 Mar 02, 2009 at 02:21 PM a professional in the field Says:

Reply to #154  
Anonymous Says:

your teacher was very wrong. In fact I don't think kids should get marks only in numbers. They should be graded according to the effort put in as well. A rebbe or teacher has to be tuned in to his students and know if one is really trying or not and of course the parents have to be involved with their child. I know teachers who give special tests to students who are having a hard time, just so they can pass the course. Many students have hidden learning disabilities and have to be helped. Many children need motivation. A child like you were should have gotten at least a C or a B for the effort you put in.

Yes, my teacher was very wrong. I was devastated and I refused to go back to yeshiva...that's how low I felt. I couldn't understand how a Rabbi could do that to me after all my effort. I ended up on the streets of Brooklyn...using all sorts of drugs from xtc, to acid, drinking, to smoking weed, and others. Substances became my friend. I'm only writing this l'toeles so people can understand what one small action can do to a vulnerable teenager. As backwards as this may seem, inside I thank that Rabbi for what he did. Because of him, I experienced another world and now use my life experiences to help others who are struggling with their own. I only became religious again at 19, and it was only because I was in the one of the most amazing yeshivas that deals with these types of teenagers and these types of issues. (which will not be named) We need more "been there done that" type people in this line of work. BUT a message to all you Rebbeim...please don't overlook a student's efforts. You can literally kill them.

157

 Mar 02, 2009 at 02:23 PM Grammar Girl Says:

142 = retard

158

 Mar 02, 2009 at 02:53 PM Mrs. Kugelfresser Says:

157, please don't say 142 = retard. I have relatives who are mentally challenged and yet they have way much more sense than 142. The word "retard" is offensive, and not at all educational. This issue is much more nuanced, as is much of what is being discussed in terms of the way the frum community handles issues. Denial, head in the sand, head in the gemorrah. So, if you wanna make a point, do it nicely, without flaming and calling names. After all, name calling can be abusive and "not nice" and this is something that causes people pain and may send people to doing all kinds of things that are not healthy....which is exactly the point!

159

 Mar 02, 2009 at 04:51 PM "Lakewood Boy" Says:

To #142: Since your so smart and you seem to have all of the perfect solutions for all troubled teens and it seems like you can relate to them a lot why don't you go and help them out!
As i was reading all the posts i said to myself that I'm not going to write in, but after i saw what you wrote i couldn't resist, YOU ARE SO WRONG!!!! I really pray for you as only an 18 year old can that none of your kids ever struggle with Judisam and its concepts, because if they do, and you give them the advice that you posted, they will be in for one hell of a life!

160

 Mar 02, 2009 at 04:55 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #155  
professional in the field Says:

I guess everyone has a right to their own opinions. I work in a setting where we have students from almost every Jewish community in the States, and yes when teenagers from Lakewood go "off the derech" they do go off harder and it's much more of a challenge to bring them back. When one is raised in such an insular community these things happen in greater extremes. (KJ and Williamburg are another 2) I can't count of how many of my students through out the years have told me that if you're not part of the yeshiva world you're looked at as nothing. Whether true or not these are how my students feel. Those are their feelings. In Brooklyn there is way more substance abuse and teens using in greater numbers, but they have ample professionals working with them, and more than dedicated. When it comes to Lakewood, there are professionals and Rabbanim working with them, but not close to enough, and this is mainly because Lakewood is still somewhat in the dark about the problems it has, and funding is not enough. Where's the Our Place of Lakewood? This is ridiculous to discuss. You want to see the problem go for it, if you don't, well what I can't do much about that. These teenagers need to feel validated. We have to stop talking and start listening. These teenagers are hurting, and they want to be accepted for who they are, and not what they look like, or what music they listen to. They are not foreigners or strangers. And if there could be one positive aspect coming out of this tragedy, it's that a community will be more aware and ready to tackly issues in a sincere and emmesdik way. I only hope that Lakewood moves full speed ahead and continues to understand the world these teens go through and start accepting these people for who they are. Real, caring, yet hurting teenagers.

Being a Lakewooder -I can tell you that even regular normal medicine doesn't exsist here and you want normal mental health? But there is noone to straighten it out because everyone has the excuse they are too busy learning!

161

 Mar 02, 2009 at 04:54 PM to # 142 Says:

All i can say to you is that your kids will end as dealers, the way you seem to have chinuch, why dont you get out of the beis medrash for a second(you closeminded freak) and look at the problems of the outside world!!!!!!! UR RETARDED

162

 Mar 02, 2009 at 04:57 PM Att 142 Says:

Why dont you put up ur name and well speak this out in the beis maedrash!!!!??
Do you know that it is always people like you who just like to talk, but are always screwed up!!

163

 Mar 02, 2009 at 06:07 PM Brooklyn Boy Velvel Mossels Says:

Reply to #156  
a professional in the field Says:

Yes, my teacher was very wrong. I was devastated and I refused to go back to yeshiva...that's how low I felt. I couldn't understand how a Rabbi could do that to me after all my effort. I ended up on the streets of Brooklyn...using all sorts of drugs from xtc, to acid, drinking, to smoking weed, and others. Substances became my friend. I'm only writing this l'toeles so people can understand what one small action can do to a vulnerable teenager. As backwards as this may seem, inside I thank that Rabbi for what he did. Because of him, I experienced another world and now use my life experiences to help others who are struggling with their own. I only became religious again at 19, and it was only because I was in the one of the most amazing yeshivas that deals with these types of teenagers and these types of issues. (which will not be named) We need more "been there done that" type people in this line of work. BUT a message to all you Rebbeim...please don't overlook a student's efforts. You can literally kill them.

I should have guessed how you became a "professional" in the field. You takeh sound very hurting. You should go for some therapy. It sounds like you may not be 'over' your OFF-THE-D days.

164

 Mar 02, 2009 at 05:55 PM Dr. Chanaya Kavalerman Says:

Reply to #135  
A profesional in the field Says:

As someone working with teens at risk for many years, and also being a substance abuse professional, let me make this clear. In all my years, Lakewood poses to be one of the biggest problems in regards to kids going off the derech. And when Lakewood kids go off..they go off harder than most. They display the most frustration and anger towards Rabbanim and Yiddishkeit in general out of all the Jewish communities that I see. This is because Lakewood is more or less a Jewish ghetto..either your "in" Lakewood or you're not. This has to change. Monsey and Brooklyn have their outlets and have Rabbanim and proffesionals who are way more open minded and down to earth who can relate. Lakewood had a few of these people, but it is NOT enough. The Lakewood community should learn from other communities . I have worked with many Lakewood teenagers and most despise their community. If you want these horrible deaths to stop than I suggest as a community looking in the mirror and realizing that a Jew is a Jew regardless of his appearance. As a community if you can't and are not willing to accept this than may Hashem rachmanos on you. When you give a dirty look to a teenager who went "off" you will also have to answer for that one day. I suggest next time you see some "off the derech teenagers'' in Lakewood..maybe stop your car and ask them if they need a ride, or go pick them up a pie of pizza. These gestures make a world of difference. Baruch dayan emmes. May we all experience no more sorrow.

You sound like you........
- are very bitter
-have not spent too much (successful) time in lakewood
-should seek professional help from people 'in the field'

165

 Mar 02, 2009 at 06:39 PM Rabbi Avi Leibovic, Esq. Says:

www.aishtamid.org

Turning Teen Distress into Adult Success!

Real Solutions that work!

Since 2001, Aish Tamid has been working with this population and their families. I am saddened to report to you all that the problem is extensive - nationally and internationally - with numbers that are totally staggering.

Aish Tamid has serviced over 1000 boys. At least 20% of these students have been from communities outside of Los Angeles who have burned all their bridges in their local communities and have come to Los Angeles to try and start over again. Often, they come come here because they have been kicked out of their homes or communities and/or to receive services from the Los Angeles Chabad Drug Rehab Center.

There needs to be a total refocus within our yeshivas and communities as to how to work with all students - not just those labeled "at-risk." A significant majority of students (not just the ones labeled "at-risk") are totally lost and have no idea of who they are. They lack direction, confidence and a sense of realistic future goals or how to even reach their goals - if they have any.

This issue has been raised privately by me to many of the gedoylim and while they they are concerned about the situation they are somewhat unclear on how to provide a general solution for klal yisroel.

I strongly feel that needs to be an Aish Tamid ( or a similar such program) in each community with adequate community support and funding.

Many of the existing "At-Risk" programs nationally are not run appropriately with a proper and professional blend of spiritual, clinical, educational and family programming.

I cannot put all the years of experience and findings into a blog or comments section like this. Suffice it to say, that issue is severe and a major yeshua is needed ASAP as students are being lost each day.

I will not debate the points I have raised in this post but I will state that if you disagree with that I am saying here in this post you are either not up to date on what is REALLY going on in our communities, you are being naive or you are not being Modeh Al Haemes.

May we be zoche to siyata dishmaya as we continue in our daily avodas hakodesh.

www.aishtamid.org

Rabbi Avi Leibovic, Esq.

166

 Mar 02, 2009 at 08:11 PM Anonymous Says:

142, Truly naive ,as are many in Lakewood. The LA CHABAD rehab. is excellent and should be used as a Pototype here in Lakewood and Brooklyn. Lakewood can also learn alot from Chabad on how to relate to fellow Jews, so Drop the senseless hatred and grow up

167

 Mar 02, 2009 at 07:50 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #28  
Anonymous Says:

if you know the person you would know the address
if you dont know the name and are just trying to google the address you will just have to wait till someone releases that specific piece of loshon hora

thats so stupid! Hes a friend, do u know where every single one of your friends live?!!!

think before u spew!!

168

 Mar 02, 2009 at 09:20 PM Library Lover Says:

Reply to #142  
cool masmid Says:

Let me thank you for all you do..... but also let me just say as someone who is living in Lakewood for over 15 years, that there is everything to love about this town and there are a lot of people that would be willing to do whatever it takes to help these boys...... My take is that these boys have no geshmuk in serving the Almighty and so its very convenient to blame everyone but themselves- they blame Almighty Himself, their parents, their rabbeim, the rov of the shul, the Lakewood Mashgiach and Roshei Yeshivos etc. - its blame blame just not themselves. I have one advice for ALL these boys; go inside a bais hamedresh and open up a gemorah and start learning hard as it maybe and ALL the problems will fall to the wayside .... Guaranteed!!!!!!!

To "cool" masmid,
It is people like you who DO think they are "cool" whatever that means to you, that contribute, by your naivete and ignorance, to the contiinuing problem of our kids at risk. Your obnoxious attitude and Holir thatn THou outlook are what cause these kids to go elsewhere to look for outlets/help..your 'advice' is nothing but egotistical and unhelpful to the extreme. I hope you NEVER find yourself in a position of being the one that oe of these kids comes to for help...your attitude will 'help' them right onto..the wrong path..now go back to your gemara and learn about compassion, sensitivity, Bein Odom Lachaveiro, not judging anyone...must I go on???

169

 Mar 02, 2009 at 09:48 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #13  
COMMON SENSE Says:

Why is it that whenever there is a problem, it is the Rabbonim that take the blame. Of course, Rabbonim have a responsibillity in all aspects of Jewish life. But what about the rest of us? Don't we have individual responsibilities? Of course, it's much easier to say, "The Rabbonim should do it" than to take on responsiblity ourselves.
The fact is that there are a number of organizations and centers that deal with Frum drug abusers. However, these organizations are terribly underfunded and cannot provide the services necessary or to provide personnel necessary to deal with the problem abusers. Yet, people manage to spend inordinate and outrageous amounts of money on Simchas. Even in these financially troublng times, some people have no problem throwing out money for fancy Simchas. Just last week, I attended a Bar Mitzvah that must have cost (my estimate is conservative) $100,000.00. It is so outrageous and contrary to basic Hashkofo. And yet, these centers and organizatioins that deal with these troubled youth go wanting.
But it's not just money. They also need volunteers, which are also hard to get. Where are the volunteers we need?
Rabosay, let's not avoid our responsiblities by saying the Rabbonim should do it all. Let's stop wasting money on Simchas in an outrageous fashion and support institutions that need out financial help

Why are rabbonim so often blamed?

Not all rabbonim are blamed the ones who do not make fools of themselves kissing up to every shmendrik who has a few dollars do not deserve to be blamed. the ones who don't honor only money and don't care where it came from are not to blame. The ones who don't get up at your $100,000 bar mitzvahs and talk about the wonderful family that just turned what should be a ruchnius experience into not a gashmi'us one, but a behaimish one, praising the parents as model yiddisheh parents don't deserve the blame. The ones who aren't busy building palaces that imitate botai medrish are not to blame.

Think you can find a minyan of such roshai yeshivos in this dor?

170

 Mar 02, 2009 at 11:56 PM a professional in the field Says:

Reply to #164  
Dr. Chanaya Kavalerman Says:

You sound like you........
- are very bitter
-have not spent too much (successful) time in lakewood
-should seek professional help from people 'in the field'

Thank you. But

-I'm not bitter at all.

- I haven't spent too much time in Lakewood, but have spent uch time with teenagers from Lakewood.

- BH, I have no need to seek professional help. I did when I was getting off substances. In fact I help many of your children, cousins, or neighbors.

I'm sorry that these are the conclusions you make...I guess that's part of the overall problem. I suppose you might be one of those over the top parents, or "professionals" that sends their clients/children to rehab after hearing they had a beer at 14...so they can learn all about the world of substance abuse.

We need answers and competent people in this line of work. And to 163, BH with a few children and a great wife....working with off the derech teenagers for 7 years, and having a masters of science in Psychology, and being a certified substance abuse professional....having leanred in yeshiva and kollel for many years, and BH I see my talmidim getting married, I can say that I'm not anywhere close to off the derech days. BUT comments like yours might hurt a teenager.

171

 Mar 03, 2009 at 06:12 AM Anonymous Says:

Lakewood is in it's INfancy in regards to reaching out to others! They are so proud of themselves of suddenly discovering that there are Jews in Russia, let alone unaffiliated Jews living next door to them! Chabad never left Russia for the last 100 plus years! The very words they use ,characterize their distance from fellow Jews and our teens, Kiruv Rehokim (the distant ones) .It is Lakewood that is Distant and out of TOUCH!!!! as so eloquently stated by 142, so put on your rubber gloves and go back to your Talmud that you use to Rationalize your DISTANCE from fellow Jews!!!

172

 Mar 03, 2009 at 06:49 AM Sarah Says:

Reply to #50  
sane Says:

More emphasis must be placed on self identity, self esteem and chanoch lanaar cfi darcho. Many bochurim are not cut out to learn 12 hours a day - and know it - but lose self esteem when they simply can't do it and are discouraged from doing anything else. There should be realisitc counseling in Yeshivos and particulalry Beis Medrash, so boys can find their way in life.

Very important point!! Thank you.

173

 Mar 03, 2009 at 01:27 AM Anonymous Says:

As an old time Lakewooder, I have been reading all these posts with a great deal of interest. I have learned alot and see many mistakes that need to be corrected in our community.
But Lakewood is only one part of a big picture. And the picture I'm seeing is that substance abuse is rampant in the frum community, ALL OVER. Each individual community may have its own mistakes, but the problem seems to be all over: Yeshivish, Chasidish, insular, open, whatever. WHAT IS CAUSING THIS? Is there a common thread? Why are our children so confused and in so much pain, no matter where they live?
This is so painful to me, but blame is not bringing a solution as each community has its own people and "shitos" to blame. So are we being too narrow minded, too open, too judgemental, too pressured, too this or too that? How can we fix it if we can't even agree on what the problem is?

174

 Mar 03, 2009 at 12:19 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #156  
a professional in the field Says:

Yes, my teacher was very wrong. I was devastated and I refused to go back to yeshiva...that's how low I felt. I couldn't understand how a Rabbi could do that to me after all my effort. I ended up on the streets of Brooklyn...using all sorts of drugs from xtc, to acid, drinking, to smoking weed, and others. Substances became my friend. I'm only writing this l'toeles so people can understand what one small action can do to a vulnerable teenager. As backwards as this may seem, inside I thank that Rabbi for what he did. Because of him, I experienced another world and now use my life experiences to help others who are struggling with their own. I only became religious again at 19, and it was only because I was in the one of the most amazing yeshivas that deals with these types of teenagers and these types of issues. (which will not be named) We need more "been there done that" type people in this line of work. BUT a message to all you Rebbeim...please don't overlook a student's efforts. You can literally kill them.

please let me know if you have any eizos how we can help our son and his friends . He is very involved in marijuana and going off the derech. thank you so much we need much more guidance and info on where to turn for help.

175

 Mar 03, 2009 at 08:55 AM Baruch from Brooklyn age 16 Says:

JEWISH COMMUNITY HEAR WHAT I HAVE TO SAY!

Please don't let OUR PLACE in Brooklyn close down. This place has been a savior for me and my friends for the past 2 years. I have gotten clean, started wearing a kippa all the time, and started putting tefillin on again because of the caring and accepting staff there. If there is ever a time where the community as a whole should save worlds...this would be the time. If you all care about us kids who go off the derech than please start sending in checks. If it closes so many off us are literally doomed. What OUR PLACE does....is almost magical. Don't abandon us. PLEASE. Thank you for anyone who does something about this.

176

 Mar 03, 2009 at 10:12 AM "Rasha mah hoo omer?" Says:

Reply to #171  
Anonymous Says:

Lakewood is in it's INfancy in regards to reaching out to others! They are so proud of themselves of suddenly discovering that there are Jews in Russia, let alone unaffiliated Jews living next door to them! Chabad never left Russia for the last 100 plus years! The very words they use ,characterize their distance from fellow Jews and our teens, Kiruv Rehokim (the distant ones) .It is Lakewood that is Distant and out of TOUCH!!!! as so eloquently stated by 142, so put on your rubber gloves and go back to your Talmud that you use to Rationalize your DISTANCE from fellow Jews!!!

"Rasha mah hoo omer?" The following is a quote from # 171 ".....and go back to YOUR talmud......"

177

 Mar 03, 2009 at 10:07 AM Brooklyn Boy Velvel Mossels Says:

Reply to #170  
a professional in the field Says:

Thank you. But

-I'm not bitter at all.

- I haven't spent too much time in Lakewood, but have spent uch time with teenagers from Lakewood.

- BH, I have no need to seek professional help. I did when I was getting off substances. In fact I help many of your children, cousins, or neighbors.

I'm sorry that these are the conclusions you make...I guess that's part of the overall problem. I suppose you might be one of those over the top parents, or "professionals" that sends their clients/children to rehab after hearing they had a beer at 14...so they can learn all about the world of substance abuse.

We need answers and competent people in this line of work. And to 163, BH with a few children and a great wife....working with off the derech teenagers for 7 years, and having a masters of science in Psychology, and being a certified substance abuse professional....having leanred in yeshiva and kollel for many years, and BH I see my talmidim getting married, I can say that I'm not anywhere close to off the derech days. BUT comments like yours might hurt a teenager.

Actually, I AM a teenager (currently) living in Lakewood. I AM offended by the way YOU speak of my mentors,neighbors, and friends. While living in Brooklyn (in the past), it was people like YOU who turned me off. I'm not sure what you have against Lakewood. But, whatever it may be, us teens are much better off as long as you stay in Brooklyn.

178

 Mar 03, 2009 at 11:14 AM Lakewood teenager (well almost 20) who was off...but not anymore :) Says:

Reply to #177  
Brooklyn Boy Velvel Mossels Says:

Actually, I AM a teenager (currently) living in Lakewood. I AM offended by the way YOU speak of my mentors,neighbors, and friends. While living in Brooklyn (in the past), it was people like YOU who turned me off. I'm not sure what you have against Lakewood. But, whatever it may be, us teens are much better off as long as you stay in Brooklyn.

I'm also a Lakewood teenager, and I'm kinda curious to know what that guy said that was so offensive. He's pretty much speaking the truth about our community (not all ofc). Obviously, we have Rabbis that are helping us out, but do you really think it's enough? It's nice that you're sticking up for Lakewood, but it's hard to see how he offended you. Our town kinda needs to wake up. I went to Israel and there were a lot of Lakewood guys in the yeshiva I went to, and we all pretty much agreed that it was very hard for us livin in Lakewood and how we were treated....or thought we were treated atleast. This guy seems to know whats up and I only wish guys like him we're around 5 years ago. No one has the right to tell you how to feel, but it's hard to understand what he said that offended you. You sound like me 5 years ago with all your Brooklyn-Lakewood "competition" goin on. Lakewood has problems like anywhere else, but he's right when he says the we go off harder- that's just the way I see it. That guy sounds real.

179

 Mar 03, 2009 at 12:23 PM Anonymous Says:

Hey 176, I love the Talmud but not when its used to be cold, distant and ALOOF, Warm up a little, Lakewood is still in the ICE age

180

 Mar 03, 2009 at 01:23 PM Anonymous Says:

raboysay- i am a recovering addict. i was addicted to percs for almost 5yrs i started poping at age 17. let me make it very clear to all of you out there who are very naive. i have soold thousands of dollars worth of pill to frum married guys in lakewood. you have no idea how bad the problem is.....very sad

181

 Mar 03, 2009 at 01:33 PM Anonymous Says:

Why don't you ask our wonderful frum Docs in Lakewood how many prescriptions for Prozac and the like that they give out every day, esp.to the wives who have to play 2 roles in Lakewood

182

 Mar 03, 2009 at 06:25 PM Chaim Brownoberg Says:

Reply to #178  
Lakewood teenager (well almost 20) who was off...but not anymore :) Says:

I'm also a Lakewood teenager, and I'm kinda curious to know what that guy said that was so offensive. He's pretty much speaking the truth about our community (not all ofc). Obviously, we have Rabbis that are helping us out, but do you really think it's enough? It's nice that you're sticking up for Lakewood, but it's hard to see how he offended you. Our town kinda needs to wake up. I went to Israel and there were a lot of Lakewood guys in the yeshiva I went to, and we all pretty much agreed that it was very hard for us livin in Lakewood and how we were treated....or thought we were treated atleast. This guy seems to know whats up and I only wish guys like him we're around 5 years ago. No one has the right to tell you how to feel, but it's hard to understand what he said that offended you. You sound like me 5 years ago with all your Brooklyn-Lakewood "competition" goin on. Lakewood has problems like anywhere else, but he's right when he says the we go off harder- that's just the way I see it. That guy sounds real.

I think Velevel Mossels' point is that this self-proclaimed "professional in the field" is basing his 'experience' in understanding our community through a limited amount of (resentful) connections to our town.

To: Mr. Professional in the field, Shlit"a (Name-please?)
I once met someone like you .....he also states his "opinions" (or that of others) as facts.....

183

 Mar 03, 2009 at 07:40 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #126  
TRUTH Says:

First of all, chavrei hakollel and minyan also generate tremendous amount of unding from the same people and taxpayers that support SCHI. Secondly, how d o you know which neshama needs more special attention. How do you know how each neshama would look without it? some peoples emotions are stirred by different tzedakas. AS long as they are giving tzedaka they are all on right track

Uh, just to clarify. Minyan Shelanu (and im sure CK too, but i dont know forsure) does NOT "generate a tremendous amount of funding from the same ppl and taxpayers that support schi". I know for a FACT, that minyan shelanu is WAY WAY under. They are in debt about $1,000,000. They don't get much $ coming in, unless they go out there and beg. And when they do, they get petty cash.
People should wake up. The money should be pouring in, for what they do for the lakewood community. Everyone who gives a dollar each time a collector from israel knocks on their door, should think twice abt how these institutions are suffering and give them the dollar! They are helping OUR children. We all know someone the minyan (or the kollel) is helping. If not for them, THESE KIDS WOULD HAVE NO PLACE TO GO. Its time we open our pockets (and hearts), and stop ignoring what is happening right under our eyes.

184

 Mar 03, 2009 at 09:43 PM Penina Says:

When will our community leaders wake up and stop pretending that we as Jews are just as much at risk for drug abuse, alcoholism, molestation, and more? It is terrible! How many of our young people must die before we introduce teaching in the yeshivas to protect them? Most frum homes don't even call body parts by their correct name! When will we all just grow up and give the children what they need to protect themselves? It is a complete shonda that our babies are dying! Their blood will NOT be on my hands! My children are being educated in this world...not the world to come. I am preparing them for both equally!

185

 Mar 03, 2009 at 09:18 PM Anonymous Says:

i am from lakewood we all know theres a problem no ones denying it its just a hard one to take care of and the only way his death wont go in vain is if we all do something to fix ourself up and bring the geula so he can once again join us

186

 Mar 03, 2009 at 08:41 PM cryinteen Says:

boruch dayan haemet

PLEASE READ!!!
i was like crying wen i was reading this
hey ppl. i dunno the whole story, but either way dont judge (and dont deny that you are judging, please! im not intrested in that typa fight, im just saying wat i feel). Just assume that it was accidental. but still, the community shud be aware of drug issues, even if that wasnt the case here
...#64. hope ur ok. idk abt some closeminded ppl who sed things vs and who duno what they talkin abt but hang on and try to get betta we're with you!!!!! !!!! hope everything turns out good and keep tryin hard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
and as for #142 cool masmid- listen ppl for each their own. for 142 if u read this= cool masmid, mayb stickin to gemora helps you and maybe ur lucky in thhat way, but maybe not to others- thats the thing of chanoch lnar al pi darco isnt it? but you should kno 142 that wat works for you its ok... but still it might not necesarily work for others.....
and all of you, i duno what to say
im a teenager too and was upset abt what happend but also upset about the mean remarks ppl were saying!!!
please, what lesson are ppl learning if they r just bein nasty to others like in the replys to comments? i mean theres ways to say things nicer.
(abt the blaming higher people part- im a teen and i blame so maybe its wrong maybe its right, i cant say any thing about that)
we do need help though!!! and also ppl #175 i agree with- plz support OUR PLACE for boys and also for girls- that was one form of help. everyone says find a kosher place for "them"= and we found, and we dont want it to close down!!! and of course support others like that. (and yes, you could also support schii. whatver u wannt all is good!!!! u gotta undertand that!!!!!)
as for who ever said that people didnt support the "modern" boy from long island- im sure people did. so maybe some ppl arent perfect and they didnt think abt it like that, but we're all Jews, and not every one perfect. i know i for one dont think diff abt diff "types". so dont mind wat one person sed, if he even meant it like that or not!
OH and as for #177- i dono him but i would think hes talking about #164, (and hes offended by what 164 said bashing the professional in the feild, who sounds like hes only trying to help. but of course i cant know wat otheres are thinking.) i mean im a teen and i think the Professional in the Feild is trying to help,, but im kinda offended by 164's remark. please, why say that???
BUT PEOPLE IDK WHAT TO DO. I FEEL SOMETHINGS WRONG.I FEEL STUPID JUST POSTING THESE THOUGHTS ON A BLOG WHICH IDK IF ANYONE ASCTULLY GONNA SCROLL DOWN AND READ PAST NUM 180 OR WHATVER, BUT IF I COULD HELP IM TRYIN.

ALSO..., somthing else to remember (im sry if i ofended any one or anything, but im trying to practice wat i preach and be good ben adom lachavero bli neder, as a starting pnt 4 wat i needa work on...how abt ppl take that upon themselves as a zechut?.) so, as i was sayin. rem that these are ppls opinions. ppl are entitled to their opinions. thats kinda wat a blog is for, isnt it? its ok, not every ones alike, its ok to disagree. but plz do so respectfully. and everyone, try to help in whatver way u possibly can (and plz not blame. even though, i as a teen know that is PREETTTY hard not to...)
again hope i didnt offend ANYONE- im rlly tryin 2 work on it.

and sorry so long, hope u got thru all that!
may everything be good!

cryin teen

187

 Mar 03, 2009 at 11:21 PM Brooklyn Boy Velvel Mossels Says:

Reply to #186  
cryinteen Says:

boruch dayan haemet

PLEASE READ!!!
i was like crying wen i was reading this
hey ppl. i dunno the whole story, but either way dont judge (and dont deny that you are judging, please! im not intrested in that typa fight, im just saying wat i feel). Just assume that it was accidental. but still, the community shud be aware of drug issues, even if that wasnt the case here
...#64. hope ur ok. idk abt some closeminded ppl who sed things vs and who duno what they talkin abt but hang on and try to get betta we're with you!!!!! !!!! hope everything turns out good and keep tryin hard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
and as for #142 cool masmid- listen ppl for each their own. for 142 if u read this= cool masmid, mayb stickin to gemora helps you and maybe ur lucky in thhat way, but maybe not to others- thats the thing of chanoch lnar al pi darco isnt it? but you should kno 142 that wat works for you its ok... but still it might not necesarily work for others.....
and all of you, i duno what to say
im a teenager too and was upset abt what happend but also upset about the mean remarks ppl were saying!!!
please, what lesson are ppl learning if they r just bein nasty to others like in the replys to comments? i mean theres ways to say things nicer.
(abt the blaming higher people part- im a teen and i blame so maybe its wrong maybe its right, i cant say any thing about that)
we do need help though!!! and also ppl #175 i agree with- plz support OUR PLACE for boys and also for girls- that was one form of help. everyone says find a kosher place for "them"= and we found, and we dont want it to close down!!! and of course support others like that. (and yes, you could also support schii. whatver u wannt all is good!!!! u gotta undertand that!!!!!)
as for who ever said that people didnt support the "modern" boy from long island- im sure people did. so maybe some ppl arent perfect and they didnt think abt it like that, but we're all Jews, and not every one perfect. i know i for one dont think diff abt diff "types". so dont mind wat one person sed, if he even meant it like that or not!
OH and as for #177- i dono him but i would think hes talking about #164, (and hes offended by what 164 said bashing the professional in the feild, who sounds like hes only trying to help. but of course i cant know wat otheres are thinking.) i mean im a teen and i think the Professional in the Feild is trying to help,, but im kinda offended by 164's remark. please, why say that???
BUT PEOPLE IDK WHAT TO DO. I FEEL SOMETHINGS WRONG.I FEEL STUPID JUST POSTING THESE THOUGHTS ON A BLOG WHICH IDK IF ANYONE ASCTULLY GONNA SCROLL DOWN AND READ PAST NUM 180 OR WHATVER, BUT IF I COULD HELP IM TRYIN.

ALSO..., somthing else to remember (im sry if i ofended any one or anything, but im trying to practice wat i preach and be good ben adom lachavero bli neder, as a starting pnt 4 wat i needa work on...how abt ppl take that upon themselves as a zechut?.) so, as i was sayin. rem that these are ppls opinions. ppl are entitled to their opinions. thats kinda wat a blog is for, isnt it? its ok, not every ones alike, its ok to disagree. but plz do so respectfully. and everyone, try to help in whatver way u possibly can (and plz not blame. even though, i as a teen know that is PREETTTY hard not to...)
again hope i didnt offend ANYONE- im rlly tryin 2 work on it.

and sorry so long, hope u got thru all that!
may everything be good!

cryin teen

177 Today at 10:07 AM
Brooklyn Boy Velvel Mossels Says:
Reply to #170

In post # 177 I was actually replying to (offended by) "a professional in the field"
(I was NOT replying to 164)

Read 177 in response to 170 in response to 163 in response to 156 and so on...
(or something like that!)

Thanks for reading.

PS Sorry for any misunderstanding or foncusion.

188

 Mar 03, 2009 at 11:54 PM a professional in the field says Says:

Ill start by saying that if I did offend anyone, please accept my apologies as that was not my intention. To the person asking for eitzos with the son smoking weed...I suggest giving me a little more info...as much as you'd like and we can work from there. So much goes into this...how he feels about himself, to family dynamics, schooling/yeshiva, and experiences that he may have had, and the like. It's a huge challenge once the kid starts rejecting Judaism...but it sounds to me that the most important thing is for you to have dialogue with him and for him to feel love and accepted. It's a tough balance because so many factors are involved. To the people who question whether I work in this field..I'm not here to convince you. In fact...a silly choice in titles by me. I'm hesistant to use my real name because I respresent organizations and I see that people can misinterpret words, and I chas v'shalom wouldn't want the places I work for taking any slack. But I know who I am, and feel no need to prove myself. I love what I do, and have a passion for helping out teenagers who are going through rough times. It's rare one finds a line of work that's not just a 9-5 but I life mission. That's the way I see what I do, and whether you believe me or not is trivial. I knew who I am.

I also almost overdosed, and I have zero regret or shame in my years of using. These struggling teenagers need role models, and I can only hope I'm one of them. I'm also sorry if my comments come off as blanket statements about Lakewood. These are based on my years of work. It also seems that people on this blog have similar thoughts. I can't say it as a fact... just from what I've seen based on what I do. I'm happy and blessed that I've gone through what I have, and I do believe my own life ecperiences have helped me and my students relate to each other. I believe I'm helping Klal Yisrael and that's what's important. Being sincere, truthful, and accepting is what counts here. (For the almost 20 year old Lakewooder- thanks- and from the way you write I'm pretty sure we hung out a lot- if so give me ring on my second cell. Ttyl)

Let's all just do our best to accpt people for who they are.

189

 Mar 04, 2009 at 03:50 PM david Says:

Reply to #142  
cool masmid Says:

Let me thank you for all you do..... but also let me just say as someone who is living in Lakewood for over 15 years, that there is everything to love about this town and there are a lot of people that would be willing to do whatever it takes to help these boys...... My take is that these boys have no geshmuk in serving the Almighty and so its very convenient to blame everyone but themselves- they blame Almighty Himself, their parents, their rabbeim, the rov of the shul, the Lakewood Mashgiach and Roshei Yeshivos etc. - its blame blame just not themselves. I have one advice for ALL these boys; go inside a bais hamedresh and open up a gemorah and start learning hard as it maybe and ALL the problems will fall to the wayside .... Guaranteed!!!!!!!

Since when can you blame someone for not having a geshmak in serving hashem. That is something that you have to be conditioned to or it can only be achieved with immense personal effort like a baal tshuva.

When a child grows up with all the right ingredients i.e. proper education, family, community and never the less he has no geshmak you cannot simply blame them as if they are at fault. I am not saying to blame every rav and teacher either, however, you have to realize that obviously this child was not being engaged in the right manner either intellectually or emotionally which is why they don't have the geshmak.

But what I find troubling the most is that you seem to be angry at these people that went off the derech and that I don't understand. Why do frum people get mad at others in their community that are less frum than them, or that go completely off the derech. Did they do something bad to you? Are they responsible to you? Is it that they are a bad influence on your child?- Why are they responsible for your children 's education ? This is a free country. The only one who has a right to be mad about mitzvois bein adam limakom is hashem. And as far as I remember we are not his policemen.

Before we are yoitze the mitzvah of toichocho did you ever think about ahavas yisroel? Say something nice to this kid, give him a hug and if you can't than just butt out and stop speaking about these people as if they are bad.

However, in answer to my question; why do frum people criticize those with lesser standards? I truly believe that it is rooted in jealousy. When you see a woman dressed better than you would or you your wife would be or enjoying music or a avacation that you never would (because of yiras shomayim - I am not accusing people of being phony I am just saying that we all have a yaitzer horaa) you think "hey how come he/she can be from supposedly the same community/shul/school etc. and enjoy the things that I can’t”. That is what brings out the attitude of judgment and criticism.

There is a place for criticism and rebuke but the people that do for the right reasons and are therefore effective are few and far between.

190

 Mar 04, 2009 at 04:30 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #189  
david Says:

Since when can you blame someone for not having a geshmak in serving hashem. That is something that you have to be conditioned to or it can only be achieved with immense personal effort like a baal tshuva.

When a child grows up with all the right ingredients i.e. proper education, family, community and never the less he has no geshmak you cannot simply blame them as if they are at fault. I am not saying to blame every rav and teacher either, however, you have to realize that obviously this child was not being engaged in the right manner either intellectually or emotionally which is why they don't have the geshmak.

But what I find troubling the most is that you seem to be angry at these people that went off the derech and that I don't understand. Why do frum people get mad at others in their community that are less frum than them, or that go completely off the derech. Did they do something bad to you? Are they responsible to you? Is it that they are a bad influence on your child?- Why are they responsible for your children 's education ? This is a free country. The only one who has a right to be mad about mitzvois bein adam limakom is hashem. And as far as I remember we are not his policemen.

Before we are yoitze the mitzvah of toichocho did you ever think about ahavas yisroel? Say something nice to this kid, give him a hug and if you can't than just butt out and stop speaking about these people as if they are bad.

However, in answer to my question; why do frum people criticize those with lesser standards? I truly believe that it is rooted in jealousy. When you see a woman dressed better than you would or you your wife would be or enjoying music or a avacation that you never would (because of yiras shomayim - I am not accusing people of being phony I am just saying that we all have a yaitzer horaa) you think "hey how come he/she can be from supposedly the same community/shul/school etc. and enjoy the things that I can’t”. That is what brings out the attitude of judgment and criticism.

There is a place for criticism and rebuke but the people that do for the right reasons and are therefore effective are few and far between.

Well spoken, could explain partially why Lakewood and others have this insane ,senseless, hatred towards Lubav. They're jealous,that they can have unconditional Ahavas Yisroel towards EVERY Yid, and Lakewood doesn't have a CLUE on how to relate to others.

191

 Mar 04, 2009 at 07:02 PM cryinteen Says:

hey people i think this dicsussion might be kinda important but i feel bad why are all these comments under this article about this boy?????/i mean i just realized, it kinda.... i dont think its right, i mean shudnt this whole discussion relly be moved to a diff place, no? editors or whoever, any ideas???????
and velvel mossel...lol i gues diff ppl have diff opinions on things....!
oh and sorry my post was so long b4 i like didnt even relize till i actually saw it up myself....

cryin teen

192

 Mar 04, 2009 at 07:06 PM cryinteen Says:

plus i dont like going back to this sad post to read the cont of the convo, and as i said i dont think it feels "right"....?
ok sry if i dont make much sense, just thats what i think. im kinda new to this sigth, so idk if there r any forums 4 that kinda thinf or wtvr.

cryin teen

195

 Mar 05, 2009 at 05:26 PM iagreewithu Says:

yeah i agree with cryingteen it dont seem right under this thing about this boy and plus when ppl 4get about this later all the good things ppl are trying to do about this will be 4gotten too.... just like the thread about the south fallburg boys arrest.... ppl had a whole discussion like this, and now its back in the archives and who remembers and what changed because of it?!? is there a place to like copy these posts or some thing and continue this discussion else where??????

196

 Mar 06, 2009 at 01:51 PM jj Says:

I did not know shua , but from the nice things his friends write about him it seems he was a very nice guy. My heart goes out to his family.

197

 Mar 11, 2009 at 06:15 PM Anonymous Says:

to 188 please tell me how I can reach you my son is in terible trouble and I want advice on how we can get the right help a big problem is we need a network to know who to call this could be ahuge zechus for the neshama of this chaushuva niftar to help save so many of our children before it istoo late my son wll not last much longer 646 678 0 r

198

 Mar 11, 2009 at 06:51 PM dayeinu Says:

don't forget the gemoro is Shabbos. All problems in the community are the fault of the Dayanim who take bribery etc .

199

 Mar 15, 2009 at 10:59 PM recovering addicts wife Says:

Reply to #119  
Anonymous Says:

How does one help someone who is intent on destroying themselves?. Being non judgemental does not seem to be the answer. Being nice doesn't help at all.
"Someone" seems to be going deeper and deeper into their pit.
At what point does trying to help turn into enabling?
Is there anyone truly qualified to help a young man, no longer a kid at risk, whose parents have tried to be nice till its killing them?
Let's stop bashing and kvetching and let's post some solutions.
It would be helpful to hear true advice that has helped from past addicts (if there is such a thing as past).

addiction is a disease-an addict will always be an addict-the only advice is to work an a.a. program one day at a time.this is a disease and the first tip you can get to helping any addict is to get rid of your denial(which is a disease in itself)and accept it..

200

 Mar 16, 2009 at 02:15 PM Another Chaim Says:

Reply to #38  
Chaim A Says:

I am 21 Year old Addict and yes there is help out there, But you people will never understand how hard it is to break this addiction. I have been to 4 rehabs. I go to support groups here in Lakewood and I still keep relapsing. Forget about helping us, just be our friend. Dont only gossip about us, I have made dumb choices in my life but all my friends have left me, The only one who stuck with me is my family. Many of my friends dont even have family left by their side. And all those who say lakewood does not have this problem... Wake up and smell the coffee. Its not only the kids hanging out at J2 Motzei Shabbos, Its guys from BMG bochurim and married guys alike, addiction has no pity!! Believe me I speak the truth, from facts that i see and all the frum people I meet in the recovery rooms!!!

I fought and beat addiction years ago...it's hard. I feel for you and wish you the best.

201

 Jun 13, 2009 at 10:05 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #21  
Proactive Says:

The highschools should have proffesionals address the drug and alcohol problem in school!!!! Just like they have internet asifos there should be awareness about this evergrowing issue!

address the drug problem!? thats not going to help there are so many young adults that are soooo depressed u cant even imagine they dont care what drugs wil do to them as long as it numbs the pain a little! every rebbi has to be aware of when a bocher or girl needs love thats the only thing that can help

202

Sign-in to post a comment

Scroll Up
Advertisements:

Sell your scrap gold and broken jewelry and earn hard cash sell gold today!