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Tyrol, Austria - Hotel Owner Says No Rooms for Jews

Published on: May 10, 2009 10:09 AM
By: Tiroler Tageszeitung / Haaretz
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Appartementenhotel Haus Sonnenhof in het Tiroolse dorp SerfausAppartementenhotel Haus Sonnenhof in het Tiroolse dorp Serfaus

Tyrol, Austria - A hotel in Tyrol that said it does not accept Jewish guests has caused shock in the local media and tourism industry.

A Vienna family of seven had asked the Haus Sonnenhof apartment hotel in the village of Serfaus for a reservation. The owner replied by e-mail that although the room was free, she did not want to take in Jewish guests because of “bad experiences” in the past. The region around Serfaus has become popular with orthodox Jewish tourists in recent years, and several hotels in Tyrol have started offering kosher food. The Hotel Alpenruh-Micheluzzi, owner Petra Micheluzzi told the German Press Agency DPA that the rejection by the Sonnenhof was “bad for the image” of Serfaus. One such incident could destroy all the hard work by others in the travel industry, she said, a view echoed by local and regional tourism officials. “That’s terrible,” said Esther Fritsch, the president of the regional Jewish community. So far there have been no such incidents.


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Read Comments (74)  —  Post Yours »

1

 May 10, 2009 at 09:13 AM dov Says:

Now you understand what chillul hashem means. I have heard similar comments from Jewish hotel owners that 'unzerer' are more difficult especially Israelis.

2

 May 10, 2009 at 09:15 AM Anonymous Says:

Why go to austria? Why not Swiss

3

 May 10, 2009 at 09:31 AM bobov Says:

will they let me shecht a my cow in the room?

4

 May 10, 2009 at 09:30 AM Barry Says:

I don't blame him! He probably had bad experiences with Jewish guests so he won't take any other jews for now. Understand something; If you were a landlord you would discriminate too. You want rent not bedbugs & court appearances. So if you notice that various groups will infest your building or end you up in court, you won't take them in the 1st place. That's if you're doing good business!
"Acheinu bnei yisrael" when many of us go to hotels, we don't live up to our standards and WE cause a great chilul hashem that can lead to more and more incidents such as the 1 reported above by vin.
The owner of the hotel is here to make money, he's not a Neo Nazi or a radical Islamist and he may have had some very bad experiences with Jewish guests in the past and therefore decided to put this policy in place.
Let's apologize and make a kiddush hashem in the future when we go to hotels and we won't have these troubles again.

5

 May 10, 2009 at 09:27 AM Anonymous Says:

So are they anti-semy' or we have to behave more polite?

6

 May 10, 2009 at 09:25 AM pupa Says:

Reply to 1....I am sorry I disagree with you ...jewish people make all the time kidish hoshem...I travel a lot around the world...I meet people all over on plains and in hotels.they all have good things to tell about yiden...I know in the od time it happens that someone screws up but that doesn't represent the entire holly klol yisroel....reply to # 2..could be people starting to go to Vienna amd not to Swiss cuz Swiss is vvvv expensive

7

 May 10, 2009 at 09:23 AM Anonymous Says:

The main lesson what we have to know is to behave better, no to scream anti this and anti that!!

8

 May 10, 2009 at 09:54 AM Student Says:

Reply to #2  
Anonymous Says:

Why go to austria? Why not Swiss

wow what a stupid Question did u come up youself with it????

9

 May 10, 2009 at 09:52 AM postville Says:

akoom makpid al torah moshe

we have to be polite & live the room clean .
before I check out i pickup any trash , towels ,cups etc from the floor or table ,i say good morning to the hotel employees & tip if needed .

we have to avoid living the room looking like a dumping place .

some times we behave like we own the hotel asking all the time for more perks ,can u please do this, can u open this ? and if not we became upset and we call the management etc.

ve dai la chacham ve remiza

10

 May 10, 2009 at 09:46 AM Anonymous Says:

Austria reeks of anti-semitism. Why is anyone surprised?

11

 May 10, 2009 at 09:45 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #4  
Barry Says:

I don't blame him! He probably had bad experiences with Jewish guests so he won't take any other jews for now. Understand something; If you were a landlord you would discriminate too. You want rent not bedbugs & court appearances. So if you notice that various groups will infest your building or end you up in court, you won't take them in the 1st place. That's if you're doing good business!
"Acheinu bnei yisrael" when many of us go to hotels, we don't live up to our standards and WE cause a great chilul hashem that can lead to more and more incidents such as the 1 reported above by vin.
The owner of the hotel is here to make money, he's not a Neo Nazi or a radical Islamist and he may have had some very bad experiences with Jewish guests in the past and therefore decided to put this policy in place.
Let's apologize and make a kiddush hashem in the future when we go to hotels and we won't have these troubles again.

First of all, can you explain how we jews are different then any other guest, meaning what different impact are we causing hotel stays?

2nd, if the same story would of occur at blacks, you would see the next day all blacks going wild! He is clear an antisemith! Don't try to defend him

12

 May 10, 2009 at 09:44 AM Anonymous Says:

Come on don't you see it's a good reason not to sound anti-semetic. Let me hear them sending such emails to arabs, chinese , or any other ethnic group. There are roudy bisbehaved people between them too. (not that I say the Yidden are right) but it's just a good excuse.

13

 May 10, 2009 at 09:44 AM crazygirl Says:

Reply to #5  
Anonymous Says:

So are they anti-semy' or we have to behave more polite?

you don't have 2

14

 May 10, 2009 at 09:43 AM last weeks parsha Says:

hashem says we should always make a kiddush hasem and never challila a chillul hashem, then hashem will make nissim for us, like the story with rashis father, the diamond the king, the kiddush hashem and then eliyahu hanavi with the blessing of the birth of rashi, when will yiddelech know to behave as an am hanivchar

15

 May 10, 2009 at 09:39 AM Wake up call: Says:

I have encoutered a simila situation in NJ this past summer. I was told that due to the fact that a week before there a jewish group there and they wrecked their property and therefore I am not welcomed. Rabosei, we are in gulos, we get looked after every step, should we not act like we come from a royal blood, how do we forget who we are? Remember a Chilil hashem is easier to make than a Kiddush hashem. Its all up to us

16

 May 10, 2009 at 10:00 AM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #7  
Anonymous Says:

The main lesson what we have to know is to behave better, no to scream anti this and anti that!!

Only if she was telling the truth about having a bad experience. Why assume that?

In any case, I think she has an absolute right to discriminate, regardless of what Austrian law may have to say about it; and we have an equally absolute right to denounce her for it.

The real question is, if she'd had a bad experience with a black lodger, would she feel free to say that she was refusing bookings from blacks? Or would she feel compelled to pretend there was no room available? Or even to take them in anyway? Is she this free with her expression only because it's Jews, and she thinks nobody will think worse of her for it?

17

 May 10, 2009 at 10:24 AM sam kingsley Says:

I think that very shul and yeshiva should teach our children and baaleybatim the chilul hashem going on and the need for displaying kiddush hashem. Nevertheless u should see how many goyim leave these places. It is still wrong to discriminate just because of a bad experience. I have lived in many hotels for years and years and they hate us with a dispicable attitude because of who we are although that does not excuse chilul hashem. Most of these hotel people look for an excuse like these.

18

 May 10, 2009 at 10:15 AM Anonymous Says:

I know this may sound a little radical, but just maybe there is a problem with anti-Semitism in Austria AND there is a problem with some of unzerer not behaving properly and leaving a bad taste in the mouths of those with whom they do business.

This hotel owner might be the biggest anti-semit Austrian since that Adolf Schickilgruber (yes, that was his father's family name, not Hitler, that was his mother's family name) or he might not have anything against yiddin (or at least didn't until he went into the hotel business). The truth is there is no way we can know.

Either way though there is lechol hapachot a problem with how some of us treat service people of all types.

Let us use this as a wake up call, each in his or her own way, and be a little more careful with how we treat people, Jew and Gentile alike.

19

 May 10, 2009 at 10:33 AM Anonymous Says:

If we were just mentch-lich wherever we went, things like this would not happen. Unfortunately so many of us grow up not learning how to be a mentch. It is so easy to make a kiddush hashem, but we have to be mindful of everything we say or do in public. Even a simple thank you when someone holds the door for you can go a long way, let alone leaving a hotel room in the shape you found it.

20

 May 10, 2009 at 10:14 AM Moish Says:

Once in the Laurentides near Montreal when I checked out of a motel which offered free breakfast which I couldn't eat anyways except I sat for a cup of coffee, the manager billed me extra for the breakfast. When I showed him on the reservation that it says complimentary breakfast, he says, "it is complimentary, but it doesn't say how much it costs."
So I refused to pay extra and he threatened to call the local police and I figured they might be worse anti-semites than this hotel owner. So I gave him the money. He says, "I know your people, and I will never take them here again."
We are better off without staying at this mamzer's motel.

21

 May 10, 2009 at 10:11 AM Anonymous Says:

Some of u are right-such as waking up people on the plane looking for a minyan and blocking the stewards from going by. On the other hand others are right also, in that u cannot deny a whole race simply because u had a bad experience with "Jews" "blacks" "arabs" "orientals" etc etc. U have to take certain measures that insures Hotel deals with all guests fairly without discrimination because the people are "jews" That is discrimination and forbidden in Democratic countries.

22

 May 10, 2009 at 10:08 AM Meira Kingberg Says:

Reply to #2  
Anonymous Says:

Why go to austria? Why not Swiss

Why not northern Israel. If you like the mountains, it's beautiful.

23

 May 10, 2009 at 10:03 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #4  
Barry Says:

I don't blame him! He probably had bad experiences with Jewish guests so he won't take any other jews for now. Understand something; If you were a landlord you would discriminate too. You want rent not bedbugs & court appearances. So if you notice that various groups will infest your building or end you up in court, you won't take them in the 1st place. That's if you're doing good business!
"Acheinu bnei yisrael" when many of us go to hotels, we don't live up to our standards and WE cause a great chilul hashem that can lead to more and more incidents such as the 1 reported above by vin.
The owner of the hotel is here to make money, he's not a Neo Nazi or a radical Islamist and he may have had some very bad experiences with Jewish guests in the past and therefore decided to put this policy in place.
Let's apologize and make a kiddush hashem in the future when we go to hotels and we won't have these troubles again.

its sad how youll take her word before the words of our sages.. "halacha b'yudooah eisov soneh l'yaakov". why would you rather think badly about G-d's Am Hanivchar than eisov himself?
i think an apology is in order.

24

 May 10, 2009 at 10:44 AM Anonymous Says:

I run a kosher food establishment in south jersey and let me tell you I meet aprox. 800 customers a day, a large percentage of whom are orthodox/religious Jews, now obviously the root of antisemitism is and always will be in Austria and it's beyond me why any Jew would ever want to tour, visit or spend money in such an evil place. But putting that aside, the more orthodox a customer is, the more difficult it is to satisfy them, and trust me many businesses would happily forgo such clientele. Shame on you!!!

25

 May 10, 2009 at 10:56 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #24  
Anonymous Says:

I run a kosher food establishment in south jersey and let me tell you I meet aprox. 800 customers a day, a large percentage of whom are orthodox/religious Jews, now obviously the root of antisemitism is and always will be in Austria and it's beyond me why any Jew would ever want to tour, visit or spend money in such an evil place. But putting that aside, the more orthodox a customer is, the more difficult it is to satisfy them, and trust me many businesses would happily forgo such clientele. Shame on you!!!

Happy to know you hate orthodox just tell me which restaurant you run I will know to avoid it since I'm in south jersey very often and we will both be happy ...you will be happy because I'm orthodox and you don't need me as a client and I will be happy because I don't give business for an antisemite ...

26

 May 10, 2009 at 10:57 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #1  
dov Says:

Now you understand what chillul hashem means. I have heard similar comments from Jewish hotel owners that 'unzerer' are more difficult especially Israelis.

What a disgrace of these europeans
Shame on them

27

 May 10, 2009 at 10:45 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #14  
last weeks parsha Says:

hashem says we should always make a kiddush hasem and never challila a chillul hashem, then hashem will make nissim for us, like the story with rashis father, the diamond the king, the kiddush hashem and then eliyahu hanavi with the blessing of the birth of rashi, when will yiddelech know to behave as an am hanivchar

So when u will have a hotel and goyim would make you trouble you won't accept any goyim ?

28

 May 10, 2009 at 11:19 AM sam kingsley to #24 Says:

u sound like u don't like orthodox jews, in stating that " the more orthodox they are, the
more dificult it is to satisfy them." Those words says it all as u sound exactly like the hotel mgr in Austria. In business we meet all kinds of people and one should be thankful u were not around in Germany because your words sound like u would be a great Kappo with your implied conclusions of "orthodox jews.:" above.This is like the mgrs in my condo who are in the Supreme Court (and of course Jewish) fighting against a small mezuzah on the door of an owner. May I give u a brocho that you should be matzliach only with goyish customers henceforth and may your children and grandchildren ledoiros achruv continue to be succesful in all inyonim in the circles u wish to have as customers other than orthodox Jews.

29

 May 10, 2009 at 11:29 AM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #15  
Wake up call: Says:

I have encoutered a simila situation in NJ this past summer. I was told that due to the fact that a week before there a jewish group there and they wrecked their property and therefore I am not welcomed. Rabosei, we are in gulos, we get looked after every step, should we not act like we come from a royal blood, how do we forget who we are? Remember a Chilil hashem is easier to make than a Kiddush hashem. Its all up to us

If it had been a black group the management would have kept their mouths tightly shut. But because it's Jews, they felt free to open their mouths and tell you you were not welcome. I'd drop a dime on them just for that, even though I don't believe in antidiscrimination laws. Es kumt zei.

30

 May 10, 2009 at 11:32 AM shame on u Says:

Reply to #24  
Anonymous Says:

I run a kosher food establishment in south jersey and let me tell you I meet aprox. 800 customers a day, a large percentage of whom are orthodox/religious Jews, now obviously the root of antisemitism is and always will be in Austria and it's beyond me why any Jew would ever want to tour, visit or spend money in such an evil place. But putting that aside, the more orthodox a customer is, the more difficult it is to satisfy them, and trust me many businesses would happily forgo such clientele. Shame on you!!!

Come on don't be a chicken tell us ur restaurants name, u r full of HATE. I'm ultra orthodox and would love to spare u the pain. And btw if u have such big sinah. I would really like to know who gives hechsher on ur restaurant, I would really start chkng after someone like u, I wouldn't trust ur meat. Someone with sinah like a eisouv tzorich bedika.,!!!

31

 May 10, 2009 at 11:32 AM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #20  
Moish Says:

Once in the Laurentides near Montreal when I checked out of a motel which offered free breakfast which I couldn't eat anyways except I sat for a cup of coffee, the manager billed me extra for the breakfast. When I showed him on the reservation that it says complimentary breakfast, he says, "it is complimentary, but it doesn't say how much it costs."
So I refused to pay extra and he threatened to call the local police and I figured they might be worse anti-semites than this hotel owner. So I gave him the money. He says, "I know your people, and I will never take them here again."
We are better off without staying at this mamzer's motel.

I take it this was not on a credit card, or you could just cancel the charge as soon as you were away from the place.

Still, in your position I would not have paid. I'd have dared him to call the cops; chances are excellent that the cops would have done nothing. If by some chance the cops were in on the scam all the better, because I'd sue them for conspiracy to commit fraud.

32

 May 10, 2009 at 11:34 AM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #18  
Anonymous Says:

I know this may sound a little radical, but just maybe there is a problem with anti-Semitism in Austria AND there is a problem with some of unzerer not behaving properly and leaving a bad taste in the mouths of those with whom they do business.

This hotel owner might be the biggest anti-semit Austrian since that Adolf Schickilgruber (yes, that was his father's family name, not Hitler, that was his mother's family name) or he might not have anything against yiddin (or at least didn't until he went into the hotel business). The truth is there is no way we can know.

Either way though there is lechol hapachot a problem with how some of us treat service people of all types.

Let us use this as a wake up call, each in his or her own way, and be a little more careful with how we treat people, Jew and Gentile alike.

But what makes you think there is a problem with "some of unzerer not behaving properly"? What makes you think that on average we are worse than any other category of hotel guests? That's just Stockholm Syndrome, sympathising with the enemy and seeing things from his point of view. Without evidence that there really is a problem with Jews' behaviour, our first assumption should be that the complaints are unfounded. Only if we have actual evidence of misbehaviour should we address it.

33

 May 10, 2009 at 11:51 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #24  
Anonymous Says:

I run a kosher food establishment in south jersey and let me tell you I meet aprox. 800 customers a day, a large percentage of whom are orthodox/religious Jews, now obviously the root of antisemitism is and always will be in Austria and it's beyond me why any Jew would ever want to tour, visit or spend money in such an evil place. But putting that aside, the more orthodox a customer is, the more difficult it is to satisfy them, and trust me many businesses would happily forgo such clientele. Shame on you!!!

Assuming your establishment is south of Lakewood, you should realize that the 800 jews you meet on a daily basis are not the cream of yidishkeit.Vehamayvin yovin.

34

 May 10, 2009 at 11:47 AM Anonymous Says:

Let's be proud to be jewish and more proud to be irthodox jewish ...I'm in business BH and I deal with all kinds of people there are goyim ganoovim and there are orthodox yiden very honest and ehrlich and there is the opposite I just got screwd by a very orhodox customer big money but I'm still proud to be orthodox I won't change and I'm no big tzadik or fanatic but I'm an orthodox jew ...and the orthodox jews have all the volunteer organazations like hatzoloh chaveirim you name it I'm proud with them and of course hashem is proud with them...they slauhterd a cow in public neighberhood they shouldn't of done that but they are my brothers and I feel that my brother made a mistake but I still love them because they are my brothers
...Now a question what will happen when the stupid rockland people won't like me walking to shul with a Lulov And Esrog ?I bet u there will be people saying they are right you don't go in the street with a sharp weapon it can take out somones eyes and all other stupid comments ...let's start loving ourselves we have enough fights between our chasidus we don't have to take the goys fights

35

 May 10, 2009 at 11:57 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #4  
Barry Says:

I don't blame him! He probably had bad experiences with Jewish guests so he won't take any other jews for now. Understand something; If you were a landlord you would discriminate too. You want rent not bedbugs & court appearances. So if you notice that various groups will infest your building or end you up in court, you won't take them in the 1st place. That's if you're doing good business!
"Acheinu bnei yisrael" when many of us go to hotels, we don't live up to our standards and WE cause a great chilul hashem that can lead to more and more incidents such as the 1 reported above by vin.
The owner of the hotel is here to make money, he's not a Neo Nazi or a radical Islamist and he may have had some very bad experiences with Jewish guests in the past and therefore decided to put this policy in place.
Let's apologize and make a kiddush hashem in the future when we go to hotels and we won't have these troubles again.

Hitler had similar excuses, and if you're still defending those skunks, you're part of them!

36

 May 10, 2009 at 11:34 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #28  
sam kingsley to #24 Says:

u sound like u don't like orthodox jews, in stating that " the more orthodox they are, the
more dificult it is to satisfy them." Those words says it all as u sound exactly like the hotel mgr in Austria. In business we meet all kinds of people and one should be thankful u were not around in Germany because your words sound like u would be a great Kappo with your implied conclusions of "orthodox jews.:" above.This is like the mgrs in my condo who are in the Supreme Court (and of course Jewish) fighting against a small mezuzah on the door of an owner. May I give u a brocho that you should be matzliach only with goyish customers henceforth and may your children and grandchildren ledoiros achruv continue to be succesful in all inyonim in the circles u wish to have as customers other than orthodox Jews.

Well put!! Well said

37

 May 10, 2009 at 12:19 PM Swissi Says:

I must be honest here: We are not loved anywhere, BUT we do happen to leave really bad impressions in lots of hotels.
I am a Swiss and let me tell you just a few incidents that happen here in Swiss rental appartments (Why the Nochrim dont really want us). The People who arrive start koshering the kitchen- Needles to say when they leave most of the ovens must be replaced, There is tape all over the kitchens. After using the appartment one has to pay a fee to clean it up for the next person- but lots of our Chachomim think that ok lets take advantage of that, well leave all our garbage( Usually u have to pay for specific garbage bags as a tax) and let them take care of it...So the appartment looks, and smells-------
Once there was a group of Chassidim staying in the mountains, they rented the public pool for a few hours wanting it for a Mikvah, and as they started walking in the pool undressed the lifeguard told them not to they didnt listen till one had to threaten them with police...............lots of Nochrim heard of this story.
Its sad, but what we must realise is, that sometimes we are alone to blame. It leaves a big Chillul H

38

 May 10, 2009 at 12:14 PM Anonymous Says:

The landlord is right, Austria is no place for Yidden.

39

 May 10, 2009 at 12:07 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #24  
Anonymous Says:

I run a kosher food establishment in south jersey and let me tell you I meet aprox. 800 customers a day, a large percentage of whom are orthodox/religious Jews, now obviously the root of antisemitism is and always will be in Austria and it's beyond me why any Jew would ever want to tour, visit or spend money in such an evil place. But putting that aside, the more orthodox a customer is, the more difficult it is to satisfy them, and trust me many businesses would happily forgo such clientele. Shame on you!!!

first of all you really want someone to believe you that you serve 800 cust's a day.. Second, I'd give you my experience with dealing with all kinds of customers almost 2 decades (not in the food industry) in NY, and my best customers are the frum and orthodox! cassidish, litvish and modern.
yes, there are a lot of non jewish customers nice and honest, but my experience with the frummies tops it all off!
I did have some disappointments hard and bad ones, a few uncomfortable incidents, but there may always be exceptions, in every shipment of fruit you may find a few rotten ones, but the general lot still remains beautiful!
and shame on you for your raw expressions against the cream of the crop!

40

 May 10, 2009 at 01:42 PM Anonymous Says:

I heard from my Mashgiach that some yidden because the look diffrent bring up their children to not care about what other people think and feel about them, in order that they should not feel different, but because of this they never learn to care about other peoples feelings and sensibilities and cause very big chillulei Hashem-amongst other yidden and goyim.I am not saying this Hotel owner is not a anti-semite I dont know. but I do think these groups MUST make sure to educate there children to think of other peoples feelings and to act with derech eretz..

( I know family and a Rebbi of mine who are from this group in monsey who for elementary school send there children to the other yeshiva!!)

41

 May 10, 2009 at 01:39 PM Anonymous Says:

the fact is austriaens are bigger anti semites then germans

42

 May 10, 2009 at 12:46 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #4  
Barry Says:

I don't blame him! He probably had bad experiences with Jewish guests so he won't take any other jews for now. Understand something; If you were a landlord you would discriminate too. You want rent not bedbugs & court appearances. So if you notice that various groups will infest your building or end you up in court, you won't take them in the 1st place. That's if you're doing good business!
"Acheinu bnei yisrael" when many of us go to hotels, we don't live up to our standards and WE cause a great chilul hashem that can lead to more and more incidents such as the 1 reported above by vin.
The owner of the hotel is here to make money, he's not a Neo Nazi or a radical Islamist and he may have had some very bad experiences with Jewish guests in the past and therefore decided to put this policy in place.
Let's apologize and make a kiddush hashem in the future when we go to hotels and we won't have these troubles again.

So Christens always behave, according to youe logic?

Do you know that sterotyping is anti semitsm.

43

 May 10, 2009 at 12:39 PM duvi Says:

Reply to #4  
Barry Says:

I don't blame him! He probably had bad experiences with Jewish guests so he won't take any other jews for now. Understand something; If you were a landlord you would discriminate too. You want rent not bedbugs & court appearances. So if you notice that various groups will infest your building or end you up in court, you won't take them in the 1st place. That's if you're doing good business!
"Acheinu bnei yisrael" when many of us go to hotels, we don't live up to our standards and WE cause a great chilul hashem that can lead to more and more incidents such as the 1 reported above by vin.
The owner of the hotel is here to make money, he's not a Neo Nazi or a radical Islamist and he may have had some very bad experiences with Jewish guests in the past and therefore decided to put this policy in place.
Let's apologize and make a kiddush hashem in the future when we go to hotels and we won't have these troubles again.

so if they banned african americans for their "bad behavor" or any other ethnicity you would blame that ethnicity or you would be crying racism? something tells me you would be crying racism.

of course that does not mean we should not make a kiddush hashem, i always try my best to make a kiddush hashem and i get very upset when i see jews making a chillul hashem. However that doesnt make it right to start discriminating against jews. I am shocked by frum jews justifying antisemitism!

44

 May 10, 2009 at 02:16 PM globetrotter Says:

I was there and I must state it is one of most beautiful spots on earth.

That said you must understand there culture and I feel I have to bring out my observation and actualy an observation of many Well mannerd Jewish Religous Tourist. Seeing our kids throwing trash on the ground (where under normal circumstance you will not find as much as a cigarette stub on the floor)
screaming behaving like they in Borough Park ,as well as there parents ill mannered not greeting or thanking when they enter a store or anywhere else for that matter. Behaving like the world belongs to them. We have to teach Nimus Behavior to the adults as well as the kids. And I want to point out although many of you are not going to like this statement but it is a fact, that European Jewish kids and Adults generally behave better then the Americans and the Israelis.

Mr. Feder a Wishnitzer Chusid and Chushever Yid from Israel who has a Hotel in Hungary for the last 15 years or so told us ones ,that one of the Hotels he used to lease for the summer refused to lease it to him again because of the filth and trash not to speak about property damage people caused at the property.
For example he said in one room someone schmired shoe polish all over the wallpaper and in another room the beds where disassembled carpets where ruined Bathrooms Damaged etc. etc .

It is so easy to make a Kiddush Hashem with a little effort why do we have to give them more ammunition against us .

45

 May 10, 2009 at 02:36 PM Anonymous Says:

To all Jew haters around here [oh sorry, frum jew haters], I used to go for years on mid winter vacation to several hotels in NJ with a group of friends, (a few couples), we switched around during the years between a few brand name hotels, we always left the rooms/suites sparkling, never made any noises in the lobbies and hallways, let alone littering, and behaved properly as the Torah requires us to do.
One day during one of my stays the maid cam in to the room and asked my wife: "be honest with me, did you people sleep the last few nights in here? did you sit around here? besides the towels in the tub everything looks intact the way i made it!"
We were quite pleased with the compliment, but we actually made our beds before the maid came to make it or change the linen, and we kept it beautiful like a yid..
She finished off by saying: "I know you people are always the cleanest and the best!"
Oh, forgot to identify myself, I'm a chassidishe man from Williamsburg, with long peyos on my sides [sorry, long curls], and my wife with a covered sheitel.

46

 May 10, 2009 at 03:02 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #45  
Anonymous Says:

To all Jew haters around here [oh sorry, frum jew haters], I used to go for years on mid winter vacation to several hotels in NJ with a group of friends, (a few couples), we switched around during the years between a few brand name hotels, we always left the rooms/suites sparkling, never made any noises in the lobbies and hallways, let alone littering, and behaved properly as the Torah requires us to do.
One day during one of my stays the maid cam in to the room and asked my wife: "be honest with me, did you people sleep the last few nights in here? did you sit around here? besides the towels in the tub everything looks intact the way i made it!"
We were quite pleased with the compliment, but we actually made our beds before the maid came to make it or change the linen, and we kept it beautiful like a yid..
She finished off by saying: "I know you people are always the cleanest and the best!"
Oh, forgot to identify myself, I'm a chassidishe man from Williamsburg, with long peyos on my sides [sorry, long curls], and my wife with a covered sheitel.

You are almost an exception.

47

 May 10, 2009 at 02:53 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #44  
globetrotter Says:

I was there and I must state it is one of most beautiful spots on earth.

That said you must understand there culture and I feel I have to bring out my observation and actualy an observation of many Well mannerd Jewish Religous Tourist. Seeing our kids throwing trash on the ground (where under normal circumstance you will not find as much as a cigarette stub on the floor)
screaming behaving like they in Borough Park ,as well as there parents ill mannered not greeting or thanking when they enter a store or anywhere else for that matter. Behaving like the world belongs to them. We have to teach Nimus Behavior to the adults as well as the kids. And I want to point out although many of you are not going to like this statement but it is a fact, that European Jewish kids and Adults generally behave better then the Americans and the Israelis.

Mr. Feder a Wishnitzer Chusid and Chushever Yid from Israel who has a Hotel in Hungary for the last 15 years or so told us ones ,that one of the Hotels he used to lease for the summer refused to lease it to him again because of the filth and trash not to speak about property damage people caused at the property.
For example he said in one room someone schmired shoe polish all over the wallpaper and in another room the beds where disassembled carpets where ruined Bathrooms Damaged etc. etc .

It is so easy to make a Kiddush Hashem with a little effort why do we have to give them more ammunition against us .

Its not orthodox or non orthodox, jews or non jews, There are many frum yidden clean neat and mannered, on the other hand there are also unmannered and not so clean frum yidden, same goes with non frum and with non jews as well.
in all circles you can find all types, and one who discriminates against a whole race or religion because of a few that don't behave properly is a pure racist and a punk!
And all those commentators supporting this Hitler mentality are accomplices to all harm being caused and fueled by such blunt hatred.

48

 May 10, 2009 at 03:36 PM Anonymous Says:

We have to distinguish between two issues, both of which are part of this story. The first issue is the anti semitism in the Tyrol. I have been there many times myself and there are unreconstructed old school austrian anti semites there. I have a fair number of personal experiences of this kind. At the same time, there are decent people who welcome Jews, whether because it is good for business or because they dont care or both. In the very village of Serfaus, for example, there is a hotel owned by local gentiles which caters each summer to Chareidim from Eretz Yisroel and is under chassidische hashgacha. Same village as the story which promted these comments. But whether the goyim choose to be anti semites or not, is their business.
The second issue is that it is our business to decide if we want to make a kiddush hashem or a chilul hashem. To argue for or against our behaviour as a cause of anti semitism is besides the point. The Ribono Shel Olam created a world in which Esav Sone es Yakov. But he also created a world in which we have responsibilities. Not to the goyim, but to ourselves. Some frum jews have absolutely no awareness of the dignity and self respect the Torah demands of a Jew. And they make a chilul hashem. Others do not. Just like the villagers of Serfaus, people are people and any given group has people who get it and people who dont.
Our achrayus is not to shrei at the goyim but to examine ourselves and ensure that our conduct is blameless and admirable. And not because we think that will protect us from the goyim, but because it is what the Ribono Shel Olam requires of us.

49

 May 10, 2009 at 04:15 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #48  
Anonymous Says:

We have to distinguish between two issues, both of which are part of this story. The first issue is the anti semitism in the Tyrol. I have been there many times myself and there are unreconstructed old school austrian anti semites there. I have a fair number of personal experiences of this kind. At the same time, there are decent people who welcome Jews, whether because it is good for business or because they dont care or both. In the very village of Serfaus, for example, there is a hotel owned by local gentiles which caters each summer to Chareidim from Eretz Yisroel and is under chassidische hashgacha. Same village as the story which promted these comments. But whether the goyim choose to be anti semites or not, is their business.
The second issue is that it is our business to decide if we want to make a kiddush hashem or a chilul hashem. To argue for or against our behaviour as a cause of anti semitism is besides the point. The Ribono Shel Olam created a world in which Esav Sone es Yakov. But he also created a world in which we have responsibilities. Not to the goyim, but to ourselves. Some frum jews have absolutely no awareness of the dignity and self respect the Torah demands of a Jew. And they make a chilul hashem. Others do not. Just like the villagers of Serfaus, people are people and any given group has people who get it and people who dont.
Our achrayus is not to shrei at the goyim but to examine ourselves and ensure that our conduct is blameless and admirable. And not because we think that will protect us from the goyim, but because it is what the Ribono Shel Olam requires of us.

The best post so far on this subject

50

 May 10, 2009 at 03:59 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #37  
Swissi Says:

I must be honest here: We are not loved anywhere, BUT we do happen to leave really bad impressions in lots of hotels.
I am a Swiss and let me tell you just a few incidents that happen here in Swiss rental appartments (Why the Nochrim dont really want us). The People who arrive start koshering the kitchen- Needles to say when they leave most of the ovens must be replaced, There is tape all over the kitchens. After using the appartment one has to pay a fee to clean it up for the next person- but lots of our Chachomim think that ok lets take advantage of that, well leave all our garbage( Usually u have to pay for specific garbage bags as a tax) and let them take care of it...So the appartment looks, and smells-------
Once there was a group of Chassidim staying in the mountains, they rented the public pool for a few hours wanting it for a Mikvah, and as they started walking in the pool undressed the lifeguard told them not to they didnt listen till one had to threaten them with police...............lots of Nochrim heard of this story.
Its sad, but what we must realise is, that sometimes we are alone to blame. It leaves a big Chillul H

I'm sorry, you are the Swiss with the stick up your bum. If you make your living from tourism then YOU have to adapt yourself to THEIR norms, and not expect them to adapt themselves to yours. They are the paying customers. If you are so inflexible, then you do not belong in the tourist trade, or in any business dealing with people from a different culture.

I see no problem with the behaviours you describe. If you're charging me a fee for a cleanup crew, then I will leave the place as dirty as I like; if you want me to leave it as clean as one would expect a room to be after someone has stayed there, then I don't expect to be charged extra for cleaning. You can't have it both ways.

Kashering an oven doesn't ruin it. And if I stay somewhere because it has a kitchenette then I expect to kasher it. And it's time you shed your puritan attitudes to skinny-dipping on PRIVATE PROPERTY THAT I HAVE PAID TO RENT. Especially in Europe, which prides itself on being so open-minded (not!).

(In 1948 Reb Betzalel Vilshansky was arrested in Paris for going to mikveh in one of the rivers; he had no idea this was illegal.)

51

 May 10, 2009 at 04:31 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #48  
Anonymous Says:

We have to distinguish between two issues, both of which are part of this story. The first issue is the anti semitism in the Tyrol. I have been there many times myself and there are unreconstructed old school austrian anti semites there. I have a fair number of personal experiences of this kind. At the same time, there are decent people who welcome Jews, whether because it is good for business or because they dont care or both. In the very village of Serfaus, for example, there is a hotel owned by local gentiles which caters each summer to Chareidim from Eretz Yisroel and is under chassidische hashgacha. Same village as the story which promted these comments. But whether the goyim choose to be anti semites or not, is their business.
The second issue is that it is our business to decide if we want to make a kiddush hashem or a chilul hashem. To argue for or against our behaviour as a cause of anti semitism is besides the point. The Ribono Shel Olam created a world in which Esav Sone es Yakov. But he also created a world in which we have responsibilities. Not to the goyim, but to ourselves. Some frum jews have absolutely no awareness of the dignity and self respect the Torah demands of a Jew. And they make a chilul hashem. Others do not. Just like the villagers of Serfaus, people are people and any given group has people who get it and people who dont.
Our achrayus is not to shrei at the goyim but to examine ourselves and ensure that our conduct is blameless and admirable. And not because we think that will protect us from the goyim, but because it is what the Ribono Shel Olam requires of us.

You say yourself that there are hoteliers in the same village who have no problem with yidden. So why do you assume that this one who does object, was the fault of her guests? Maybe it was her fault? Maybe she had unreasonable standards, or maybe she's just an antisemite, ready to see fault in whatever a yid does. There's no reason to suppose any yid caused a chilul hashem.

52

 May 10, 2009 at 04:48 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #51  
Milhouse Says:

You say yourself that there are hoteliers in the same village who have no problem with yidden. So why do you assume that this one who does object, was the fault of her guests? Maybe it was her fault? Maybe she had unreasonable standards, or maybe she's just an antisemite, ready to see fault in whatever a yid does. There's no reason to suppose any yid caused a chilul hashem.

I dont think you get my point. I didnt make any assumptions. On the contrary, I said it doesnt really matter why she is an anti semite. She might be an anti semite because her oma and opa were mechanech her, or because last summer she had a bad experience. Who cares? This is not my business. I am not an Austrian liberal, nor a tourism promoter for the Tyrol. I am a Jew. Therefore I concern myself with something else entirely- The metzius that there are frum Jews who dont get it. Take #50, for example, who will happily leave the room as dirty as he likes. Of course he may have the technical right as a guest paying a cleaning fee to do so. But does he have the right as a Jew to himself to do so? I would like to know which Rebbe, Rosh Yeshiva or other Godol beYisroel #50 models himself after. No one. And unfortunately there are others who behave the same way. Of course there are goyim who also behave inappropriately. And, perhaps #50 and his ilk would argue, why should we hold ourselves to a different or higher standard than any other paying customer? Seems like a rather silly question for self professed members of the Am hanivchar who are supposed to behave as Banim Lashem.

53

 May 10, 2009 at 04:43 PM Yidish Kup Says:

A nation is a nation when the polaks yemach shemom helped the nazis to kill us we all say polishe yemach shemom that's the way people look at a nation even if there are thousands if stories that polish people helped the jews but to that there are millions that hated the jews so this is the way the world looks at a nation when hitler yemach shemoi brainwashed the germans that yiden are evil RL he proved it to them with a few examples eventhough 20 million jews were nice and honest people when you get robbed by a shwartze you want to kill them all that's the way it is ...now we yiden are kol yisroel areivim zah lozah and we have to take the fault of our brothers but like brothers and not like enemies what we want to eat up one the other the goy hates us either way if we leave a trash they hate us if we are mentshlich they hate us why their kids are not brought up as eidel as our they will allways hate us Fact ...we won't change it ...we have to give up the medinah if not they will have another excuse to hate us which is a big excuse

54

 May 10, 2009 at 06:18 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #25  
Anonymous Says:

Happy to know you hate orthodox just tell me which restaurant you run I will know to avoid it since I'm in south jersey very often and we will both be happy ...you will be happy because I'm orthodox and you don't need me as a client and I will be happy because I don't give business for an antisemite ...

I don't think Mr. 24 hates Orthodox people. I happen to be in the restaurant business in Northern New Jersey and while I might be inclined to put things in gentler terms, being of a yeshiva background and more used to dealing with our own mishugassin, there is a certain element of truth to his complaint.

I disagree strongly though with the idea that the frummer they are the more difficult they are to please.

I have had plenty of chassicish customers I pray would come back and plenty of modern people who I could live without very happily, but there are times I go home wondering how so many people can go thru life learning gemara every day without learning anything from gemara on any day.

55

 May 10, 2009 at 06:14 PM chris Says:

the problem is which i have heard from friends who are restaurant/hotel owners is jewish people feel they have to take advantage of every free/complimentary offering in an establishment or they feel they have been robbed whenever they spend money and many establishments in new york will tell jews they need reservations even if they have room because they know the help will not get tipped and they are by nature filthy.you have to ask yourselves why around the world your disliked for the exact same reasons, there is no such thing as people disliking a people for no reason, get for real , but i suspect you people already know this

56

 May 10, 2009 at 05:27 PM Anonymous Says:

the guy is right i went around the world and some jews could really get out of hand and i have to tell them were not all the same.and stuff the i have seen in the airport is out of wack.and a lot of them are type.

57

 May 10, 2009 at 05:09 PM Yidish Kup Says:

A nation is a nation when the polaks yemach shemom helped the nazis to kill us we all say polishe yemach shemom that's the way people look at a nation even if there are thousands if stories that polish people helped the jews but to that there are millions that hated the jews so this is the way the world looks at a nation when hitler yemach shemoi brainwashed the germans that yiden are evil RL he proved it to them with a few examples eventhough 20 million jews were nice and honest people when you get robbed by a shwartze you want to kill them all that's the way it is ...now we yiden are kol yisroel areivim zah lozah and we have to take the fault of our brothers but like brothers and not like enemies what we want to eat up one the other the goy hates us either way if we leave a trash they hate us if we are mentshlich they hate us why their kids are not brought up as eidel as our they will allways hate us Fact ...we won't change it ...we have to give up the medinah if not they will have another excuse to hate us which is a big excuse

58

 May 10, 2009 at 06:34 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #4  
Barry Says:

I don't blame him! He probably had bad experiences with Jewish guests so he won't take any other jews for now. Understand something; If you were a landlord you would discriminate too. You want rent not bedbugs & court appearances. So if you notice that various groups will infest your building or end you up in court, you won't take them in the 1st place. That's if you're doing good business!
"Acheinu bnei yisrael" when many of us go to hotels, we don't live up to our standards and WE cause a great chilul hashem that can lead to more and more incidents such as the 1 reported above by vin.
The owner of the hotel is here to make money, he's not a Neo Nazi or a radical Islamist and he may have had some very bad experiences with Jewish guests in the past and therefore decided to put this policy in place.
Let's apologize and make a kiddush hashem in the future when we go to hotels and we won't have these troubles again.

• 4. Barry Says:  I don't blame him! He probably had bad experiences with Jewish guests so he won't take any other jews for now.......

NO I don't blame him I blame you for that Mostprobably because your children leave trash does not mean others do

59

 May 10, 2009 at 06:33 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #55  
chris Says:

the problem is which i have heard from friends who are restaurant/hotel owners is jewish people feel they have to take advantage of every free/complimentary offering in an establishment or they feel they have been robbed whenever they spend money and many establishments in new york will tell jews they need reservations even if they have room because they know the help will not get tipped and they are by nature filthy.you have to ask yourselves why around the world your disliked for the exact same reasons, there is no such thing as people disliking a people for no reason, get for real , but i suspect you people already know this

Thanks, Chris, sometimes we need to be reminded that there are people of your ilk who will go to any stretch of the imagination to find an excuse for hating us.

Frankly, I wish you would just hate us and accept the fact that you have no good reason to hate us, except that you were raised to hate us or choose to hate us.

The idea of us being filthy is just stupid. Even the most basic understanding of our laws and customs would have taught you that traditional Judaism and cleanliness are inseperable.

60

 May 10, 2009 at 06:23 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #32  
Milhouse Says:

But what makes you think there is a problem with "some of unzerer not behaving properly"? What makes you think that on average we are worse than any other category of hotel guests? That's just Stockholm Syndrome, sympathising with the enemy and seeing things from his point of view. Without evidence that there really is a problem with Jews' behaviour, our first assumption should be that the complaints are unfounded. Only if we have actual evidence of misbehaviour should we address it.

One need only do business in any service sector with both us and them to know there is a problem.

Even if you could prove we are no worse than them, bgi IF, we would still have a problem because a yid who learns torah and dresses as a ben torah represents HKB"H and Torah to every person he meets.

Would we be only as bad on average as Joe -Gentile we would still be doing terribly.

We must be above and beyond reproach in our dealings with every person we meet.

62

 May 10, 2009 at 09:48 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #52  
Anonymous Says:

I dont think you get my point. I didnt make any assumptions. On the contrary, I said it doesnt really matter why she is an anti semite. She might be an anti semite because her oma and opa were mechanech her, or because last summer she had a bad experience. Who cares? This is not my business. I am not an Austrian liberal, nor a tourism promoter for the Tyrol. I am a Jew. Therefore I concern myself with something else entirely- The metzius that there are frum Jews who dont get it. Take #50, for example, who will happily leave the room as dirty as he likes. Of course he may have the technical right as a guest paying a cleaning fee to do so. But does he have the right as a Jew to himself to do so? I would like to know which Rebbe, Rosh Yeshiva or other Godol beYisroel #50 models himself after. No one. And unfortunately there are others who behave the same way. Of course there are goyim who also behave inappropriately. And, perhaps #50 and his ilk would argue, why should we hold ourselves to a different or higher standard than any other paying customer? Seems like a rather silly question for self professed members of the Am hanivchar who are supposed to behave as Banim Lashem.

No, YOU are the one who doesn't get it. If someone charges a cleaning fee, and then takes offense when the guest takes advantage and leaves a mess, then that person is being unreasonable. If you sell a service, you should expect people who pay for it to use it. If you hire a cleaning lady, do you clean the house before she comes, so she shouldn't have any work? If you hire someone to mow your lawn, do you mow it first yourself? If he blames his dislike for Jews on this incident he is lying, because he had to already hate Jews for this to bother him. It wouldn't bother him in anyone else.

Yes, we should hold ourselves to a HIGHER standard than other people. But not just a DIFFERENT standard. And there's nothing higher about the standard you propose; it's just different for the sake of being different.

63

 May 10, 2009 at 10:39 PM Common Sense Says:

WONDERFUL! Now our frum brethren can get glatt meals in Austria, home or Hitler, Himmler, not to mention Kurt Waldhiem and so many others. How any Jew can go there to "relax "is beyond me. This was the cradle for the worst of the worst Nazis. Instead of screaming about the idiot hotel owner, maybe we need to take a long, hard look into our own neshomos. BTW--Israel can use every toursist dollar it can get. Any Jew who chooses Austria over EY is meshugga to begin with. Better to eat treif in Israel, than Glatt kosher in Austria, land of the murderers--in my opinion.

64

 May 11, 2009 at 06:33 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #63  
Common Sense Says:

WONDERFUL! Now our frum brethren can get glatt meals in Austria, home or Hitler, Himmler, not to mention Kurt Waldhiem and so many others. How any Jew can go there to "relax "is beyond me. This was the cradle for the worst of the worst Nazis. Instead of screaming about the idiot hotel owner, maybe we need to take a long, hard look into our own neshomos. BTW--Israel can use every toursist dollar it can get. Any Jew who chooses Austria over EY is meshugga to begin with. Better to eat treif in Israel, than Glatt kosher in Austria, land of the murderers--in my opinion.

Best comment by far and the one that makes the most sense. Even better than the know-it-all Milhouse.

65

 May 11, 2009 at 01:19 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #24  
Anonymous Says:

I run a kosher food establishment in south jersey and let me tell you I meet aprox. 800 customers a day, a large percentage of whom are orthodox/religious Jews, now obviously the root of antisemitism is and always will be in Austria and it's beyond me why any Jew would ever want to tour, visit or spend money in such an evil place. But putting that aside, the more orthodox a customer is, the more difficult it is to satisfy them, and trust me many businesses would happily forgo such clientele. Shame on you!!!

I don't know what you have. I am a big restaurant eater I have eaten in every restraint in the tri-state that an orthodox yid would go to. in NJ there is no restaurant that serves orthodox yiddin which has 800 Customers daily. Wake up, did you ever own a business?

66

 May 11, 2009 at 12:13 AM Milhouse Says:

You are aware, aren't you, that almost everyone involved in those crimes is dead or retired, and not involved in the tourist trade?

67

 May 10, 2009 at 11:31 PM Anonymous Says:

Common Sense above is 100% correct!

>But what makes you think there is a problem with "some of unzerer not behaving properly"? What makes you think that on average we are worse than any other category of hotel guests? That's just Stockholm Syndrome, sympathising with the enemy and seeing things from his point of view. Without evidence that there really is a problem with Jews' behaviour, our first assumption should be that the complaints are unfounded. Only if we have actual evidence of misbehaviour should we address it.<
You just don't get it. Deep down people have high expectations of 'G-d's People'. And it hurts like hell to often see the downright piggishness and obtuseness that many of us have. It's a DISGRACE of major proportions!!!

68

 May 11, 2009 at 08:17 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #67  
Anonymous Says:

Common Sense above is 100% correct!

>But what makes you think there is a problem with "some of unzerer not behaving properly"? What makes you think that on average we are worse than any other category of hotel guests? That's just Stockholm Syndrome, sympathising with the enemy and seeing things from his point of view. Without evidence that there really is a problem with Jews' behaviour, our first assumption should be that the complaints are unfounded. Only if we have actual evidence of misbehaviour should we address it.<
You just don't get it. Deep down people have high expectations of 'G-d's People'. And it hurts like hell to often see the downright piggishness and obtuseness that many of us have. It's a DISGRACE of major proportions!!!

You are right and please next time you go to a hotel clean up after yourself and don't leave a pigsty

69

 May 11, 2009 at 08:14 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #63  
Common Sense Says:

WONDERFUL! Now our frum brethren can get glatt meals in Austria, home or Hitler, Himmler, not to mention Kurt Waldhiem and so many others. How any Jew can go there to "relax "is beyond me. This was the cradle for the worst of the worst Nazis. Instead of screaming about the idiot hotel owner, maybe we need to take a long, hard look into our own neshomos. BTW--Israel can use every toursist dollar it can get. Any Jew who chooses Austria over EY is meshugga to begin with. Better to eat treif in Israel, than Glatt kosher in Austria, land of the murderers--in my opinion.

Sorry to be the first to tell you But EY is a Mookem sekoonah and someone has to be meshugah to vacation there

70

 May 11, 2009 at 09:35 AM Shalom Says:

# 63 - you are just missing point - you have to read the article properly. It does not say that the jidden are coming from abroad to visit Tyrol, but local charedi Jews from Vienna. It all makes sense if you have a family of 7 it is costly to travel etc. so Tyrol is a reasonable option.

71

 May 11, 2009 at 12:13 PM Mayer Says:

I truly believe that this kind of an incident can happen anywhere around the world. We have seen this happen not only in Europe but in Israeli where the charedi community is being discriminated and disrespected on a daily basis. Also I am sure that many similar things like the one in Austria occur often without being reported.
Thats said I dont really see the connection between this incident and Waldheim etc. #63. You are presenting your case completely out of context.

72

 May 11, 2009 at 12:34 PM swissi Says:

I did not mean to say, one may not leave a mess....I ment you dont leave bagages of smelli garbage........I did not not say it justifies not taking in no jews. All i ment is, that we are one very holy nation, and in that sense one expects us to behave this way.
Yes, Switzerland is not Borough Park, Yes they do have different things they are particular about over here- But we are in Galuth and it is our job to leave behind the best impression...so that the Goyim can look back and think: MI Keamcha Yisrael. And not to be thinking: Did i get my moneys worth out over here.

73

 May 11, 2009 at 02:09 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #70  
Shalom Says:

# 63 - you are just missing point - you have to read the article properly. It does not say that the jidden are coming from abroad to visit Tyrol, but local charedi Jews from Vienna. It all makes sense if you have a family of 7 it is costly to travel etc. so Tyrol is a reasonable option.

The same goes to these yidden as well. Why are they living in Austria to begin with??? It's where the Nazism started. Are there not enough places in America or Israel to live in? So #63 still has a very good point and Milhous in #66 has something naarish to say...

74

 May 11, 2009 at 08:16 PM Bezalel Says:

Reply to #73  
Anonymous Says:

The same goes to these yidden as well. Why are they living in Austria to begin with??? It's where the Nazism started. Are there not enough places in America or Israel to live in? So #63 still has a very good point and Milhous in #66 has something naarish to say...

It is very complex, I dont think it is fair to portray the situation in a such a simple fashion the way you do it. If you are interested in the (re) emergence of Jewish communities in Austria after the Shoah I would suggest you read the following book. it will give you an overall picture on who returned, migrated etc. to Austria after the Shoah. "Escape Through Vienna" by Thomas Albrich. Life in Vienna for the Jews is very good. If you say it is otherwise, that is fair, but please show me the facts why living as a Jid in present day Vienna is bad.

75

 May 12, 2009 at 11:51 AM Avraham Says:

The hotel's website is http://www.serfaus.to/sonnenhof/ and their e-mail is sonnenhof@serfaus.to

Their phone number is +43 5476 6231 and their fax is +43 5476 6231 40

Tell them what you think of them, Austrian scum.

76

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