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London - Board for Shechita: Kosher Chickens Not Secretly Injected with Pork |
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False labelling: Jews who also don't eat pork, are at risk in Chinese and Indian restaurants
Restaurants and cafes unwittingly buy chicken containing other animals from wholesalers and dish it up for customers.
The meat is bulked up by producers in Germany and Spain.
The Food Standards Agency traced the beef and pork proteins only after using new scientific techniques.
The proteins are in a powder mix that is injected with water into birds to make them look "meatier".
The FSA tested four supposedly chicken-only powder mixes from three meat production firms. All contained protein from either cows or pigs. It is not illegal to add the pork and beef bulking agents, but the FSA said many Brits were unaware of their presence.
They are on the ingredients list as "hydrolised animal proteins".
The FSA said it is safe to eat the chicken, but most EU countries do not approve of the practice.
It urged Brits to ask restaurant owners whether their chicken was bulked up with beef or pork before they purchased meals.
A spokesman for British Hindus, who do not eat beef, expressed "shock" at the findings.
The London Board for Shechita, which supplies kosher meat to the Jewish community, insisted none of its chicken was bulked up in this way.
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Read Comments (30) — Post Yours »
1
Jun 04, 2009 at 08:23 PM Anonymous Says:
Even though the article says that this new form of "protein" made from beef and pork is based on what they call "new scientific techniques", most frumme yidden would still prefer not to eat chickens that are injected with this mixture. The London Shechita Board is correct in avoiding these chickens and hopefully American shoicthauses will take a similiar action. Its hard to reconcile glatt kosher chickens with pork stuffing. I'm 100 percent certain that no chasideshe mashgiach would approve it.
2
Jun 04, 2009 at 08:54 PM SimchaB Says:
#1, Hello! read this again "The Food Standards Agency "traced" the beef and pork proteins only after using new scientific techniques". So what in the world are you talking about?
3
Jun 04, 2009 at 08:34 PM eli Says:
what does chassidish have to do with shechita? what does it mean chasidishe shechita? what did rashi eat if there was no chassidim then?
4
Jun 04, 2009 at 09:56 PM Loshon Hora Says:
Does that mean the chickens were fed with pork & beef before slaughter.
Well I guess it wrong to feed vegitarian birds meat products. Birds of pray are meat eaters.
I don't think the fact they may have eaten or drunk pork products makes the treif.
5
Jun 04, 2009 at 09:53 PM Anonymous Says:
“ #1, Hello! read this again "The Food Standards Agency "traced" the beef and pork proteins only after using new scientific techniques". So what in the world are you talking about? ”
So are you saying that these pork-based protein additives are ok from a kashruth perspective and the London mashgichim would not have known about these special chickens without the new FSA notification??
6
Jun 04, 2009 at 10:06 PM GROSSE LAMDAN Says:
“ what does chassidish have to do with shechita? what does it mean chasidishe shechita? what did rashi eat if there was no chassidim then? ”
From what I understand Rashi finding that Chasidish schita was unavailable in France during his lifetime refrained from eating meat. He knew that it would take quite a few generations to be available there.
7
Jun 04, 2009 at 10:37 PM Anonymous Says:
“ From what I understand Rashi finding that Chasidish schita was unavailable in France during his lifetime refrained from eating meat. He knew that it would take quite a few generations to be available there. ”
You are no "grosse lamdan"; Rashi lived in the tenth/eleventh century and had no way of knowing that the BS'Tov would come along 700 years later. I suspect you are being sarcastic but he was not a vegetarian and ate whatever passed for chassidshe hasgacha in France. Whatever standard that was, however, it was unlikley to be a litvashe mashgiach.
8
Jun 04, 2009 at 11:30 PM Anonymous Says:
“ Does that mean the chickens were fed with pork & beef before slaughter.
Well I guess it wrong to feed vegitarian birds meat products. Birds of pray are meat eaters.
I don't think the fact they may have eaten or drunk pork products makes the treif. ”
Actualy The Laws Of Kosher Animal That Was Fed Non Kosher Meat Are Extremely Complex . . .
9
Jun 05, 2009 at 06:34 AM murray Says:
“ Actualy The Laws Of Kosher Animal That Was Fed Non Kosher Meat Are Extremely Complex . . . ”
chickens are routinely fed a corn and grain mixture that also contains chicken by -products. One must assume that the kosher chickens are being fed treif chicken. Is this a valid problem and issue to us kosher consumers, also, as an aside- is their any concept of "cannibalism" as these chickens are eating their own species, albeit, I assume unwittingly.
10
Jun 05, 2009 at 06:26 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Even though the article says that this new form of "protein" made from beef and pork is based on what they call "new scientific techniques", most frumme yidden would still prefer not to eat chickens that are injected with this mixture. The London Shechita Board is correct in avoiding these chickens and hopefully American shoicthauses will take a similiar action. Its hard to reconcile glatt kosher chickens with pork stuffing. I'm 100 percent certain that no chasideshe mashgiach would approve it. ”
When I was in Saudi Arabia many years ago they had in PLACE a system to check all NZ and AUS. Lamb and Beef imports for pork residue. They are and were super MACHMIR on this issue as you can imagine. There were NO competing supervisory bodies giving conflicting opinions. If only the yidden can learn something from
LIFE not from the lowly ARABS.
11
Jun 05, 2009 at 06:17 AM Anonymous Says:
“ what does chassidish have to do with shechita? what does it mean chasidishe shechita? what did rashi eat if there was no chassidim then? ”
Obviously, what Rashi and his generation ate meat that would be unacceptable by today's higher standards.
12
Jun 05, 2009 at 05:25 AM Anonymous Says:
this is nothing to do with feeding the chickens this is after it is skinned and killed and in the factory ready for distrubution when they inject the chicken with a water base powder to make the piece of chicken look bigger and that your getting more for your money it would never happen to kosher chicken
13
Jun 05, 2009 at 02:07 AM Milhouse Says:
“ Actualy The Laws Of Kosher Animal That Was Fed Non Kosher Meat Are Extremely Complex . . . ”
Look, there is absolutely nothing wrong or unhealthy about this. It's listed in the ingredients, and anyone who doesn't know what hydrolised animal proteins means is invited to look it up. If someone has an objection to eating a particular species, they can ask the manufacturer which additive was used, and what animals were in it. There is no reason why this should be banned or condemned or why anyone should worry about it. But of course if kosher chickens are injected the additive would have to be kosher, just like any ingredient that is used in a kosher product; and the injection would have to happen after the salting. Likewise if the chicken is halal, the other ingredients would have to be halal too. That just stands to reason.
14
Jun 05, 2009 at 02:03 AM Milhouse Says:
“ Actualy The Laws Of Kosher Animal That Was Fed Non Kosher Meat Are Extremely Complex . . . ”
No, they are not. They are extremely simple: the animal is kosher.
15
Jun 05, 2009 at 02:03 AM Milhouse Says:
“ So are you saying that these pork-based protein additives are ok from a kashruth perspective and the London mashgichim would not have known about these special chickens without the new FSA notification?? ”
No, of course not. How on earth could you possibly have read that into the comment?
The additives are not kosher, and of course kosher chickens do not contain them. One could make a kosher equivalent, but it would have to be injected after the salting, and I'm not sure that it would work then.
16
Jun 05, 2009 at 02:01 AM Milhouse Says:
“ Does that mean the chickens were fed with pork & beef before slaughter.
Well I guess it wrong to feed vegitarian birds meat products. Birds of pray are meat eaters.
I don't think the fact they may have eaten or drunk pork products makes the treif. ”
No. Read the article. The mixture is injected into the chickens, and is listed on the ingredients. There's absolutely nothing unhealthy about it, but of course it's not kosher. Oh, and chickens are certainly not vegetarians!
And no, eating pork does not make an animal treif! An animal can eat whatever it likes, it's not Jewish and doesn't have to keep kosher, and nothing it eats can affect its kashrus unless it causes an injury (e.g. if the animal eats a nail which punctures its stomach).
17
Jun 05, 2009 at 01:58 AM Milhouse Says:
“ what does chassidish have to do with shechita? what does it mean chasidishe shechita? what did rashi eat if there was no chassidim then? ”
Chassidishe shechita used to mean that they used the steel chalofim that the Rav Baal Hatanya introduced. Nowadays his takono was accepted by everybody, so in that sense all kosher meat is "chassidishe". But it also means that the shochet is a yerei shomayim, with a beard, goes to mikveh, learns chasidus, etc. In the 19th century when the haskoloh had penetrated deep into the Litvishe world, a lot of people didn't trust a shochet who didn't conduct himself like a chosid, for fear that he was infected by the haskoloh and lacked in yir'as shomayim.
18
Jun 05, 2009 at 01:28 AM Milhouse Says:
“ Even though the article says that this new form of "protein" made from beef and pork is based on what they call "new scientific techniques", most frumme yidden would still prefer not to eat chickens that are injected with this mixture. The London Shechita Board is correct in avoiding these chickens and hopefully American shoicthauses will take a similiar action. Its hard to reconcile glatt kosher chickens with pork stuffing. I'm 100 percent certain that no chasideshe mashgiach would approve it. ”
Do you even have any idea what you just said? Because it's incomprehensible in English.
19
Jun 05, 2009 at 02:20 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Does that mean the chickens were fed with pork & beef before slaughter.
Well I guess it wrong to feed vegitarian birds meat products. Birds of pray are meat eaters.
I don't think the fact they may have eaten or drunk pork products makes the treif. ”
No. they meat is injected with this treif AFTER slaughter. to make it look like a bigger piece of flesh.
20
Jun 05, 2009 at 01:41 AM Anonymous Says:
“ what does chassidish have to do with shechita? what does it mean chasidishe shechita? what did rashi eat if there was no chassidim then? ”
Well in those times nobody had prepared chicken on a shelf , you had to buy your chicken take it to the shochet and then take it home to make it kosher, I don't think rashi would eat prepared chicken of the shelf evan from a chasidhishe shceta if its pr
21
Jun 05, 2009 at 12:21 AM Anonymous Says:
“ You are no "grosse lamdan"; Rashi lived in the tenth/eleventh century and had no way of knowing that the BS'Tov would come along 700 years later. I suspect you are being sarcastic but he was not a vegetarian and ate whatever passed for chassidshe hasgacha in France. Whatever standard that was, however, it was unlikley to be a litvashe mashgiach. ”
you aint too bright either b/c Rashi Z"L lived in the ELEVENTH century (into the 12th as he was niftar in 1104 l'misparam),
22
Jun 05, 2009 at 07:56 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Do you even have any idea what you just said? Because it's incomprehensible in English. ”
In simple terms, Rev Millhouse, a chicken injected with pork is TREIFUS, and while you may not care, most yidden would NOT eat such a chicken. Sorry its so complicated for you.
23
Jun 05, 2009 at 11:26 AM thick skull Says:
“ you aint too bright either b/c Rashi Z"L lived in the ELEVENTH century (into the 12th as he was niftar in 1104 l'misparam), ”
is sarcasm lost on everyone these days?
24
Jun 05, 2009 at 02:27 PM Housemil Says:
“ Chassidishe shechita used to mean that they used the steel chalofim that the Rav Baal Hatanya introduced. Nowadays his takono was accepted by everybody, so in that sense all kosher meat is "chassidishe". But it also means that the shochet is a yerei shomayim, with a beard, goes to mikveh, learns chasidus, etc. In the 19th century when the haskoloh had penetrated deep into the Litvishe world, a lot of people didn't trust a shochet who didn't conduct himself like a chosid, for fear that he was infected by the haskoloh and lacked in yir'as shomayim. ”
You are reading too much. Chassidishe shechita meant two hundred years ago the same as today. "I am better than you and if you do not agree here is a punch in the nose." Somehow we have convinced ourselves that chassidim used to be better than today. Sorry, they have a mesorah of going to goyishe courts, using violence and looking down on other people for no logical reason. This was not started today.
25
Jun 05, 2009 at 02:00 PM Anonymous Says:
“ Chassidishe shechita used to mean that they used the steel chalofim that the Rav Baal Hatanya introduced. Nowadays his takono was accepted by everybody, so in that sense all kosher meat is "chassidishe". But it also means that the shochet is a yerei shomayim, with a beard, goes to mikveh, learns chasidus, etc. In the 19th century when the haskoloh had penetrated deep into the Litvishe world, a lot of people didn't trust a shochet who didn't conduct himself like a chosid, for fear that he was infected by the haskoloh and lacked in yir'as shomayim. ”
and when the Gaon and other Gedolim issued their charomim, one of the things they ahssured was eating from the shechita of any of "these chassidim."
26
Jun 05, 2009 at 05:10 PM Anonymous Says:
It is more important that the shechita itself be done properly and that the animal has been inspected carefully and feels no pain than worrying about the shochet being a "yir'as shomayim". We could have the most frumme shochet in the litvashe world but I'd take the better shochit over the better yid with the longer beard.
27
Jun 05, 2009 at 06:02 PM Milhouse Says:
“ chickens are routinely fed a corn and grain mixture that also contains chicken by -products. One must assume that the kosher chickens are being fed treif chicken. Is this a valid problem and issue to us kosher consumers, also, as an aside- is their any concept of "cannibalism" as these chickens are eating their own species, albeit, I assume unwittingly. ”
No, it is not a problem.
28
Jun 05, 2009 at 06:02 PM Milhouse Says:
“ It is more important that the shechita itself be done properly and that the animal has been inspected carefully and feels no pain than worrying about the shochet being a "yir'as shomayim". We could have the most frumme shochet in the litvashe world but I'd take the better shochit over the better yid with the longer beard. ”
You are wrong. If the shochet is not a yerei shomayim you have no basis for assuming that the shechita was done properly. As for whether the animal feels pain, that's irrelevant. A properly done shechitah is generally painless, but that's not necessary; if you use a dull chalef, as people did before the new chassidishe chalofim, and thus you have to saw back and forth several times until the simonim are cut, the animal will probably feel lots of pain, but that doesn't affect the kashrus.
29
Jun 05, 2009 at 05:56 PM Milhouse Says:
“ and when the Gaon and other Gedolim issued their charomim, one of the things they ahssured was eating from the shechita of any of "these chassidim." ”
Yes. And they were wrong, as everybody accepts today, since everyone today uses the Alter Rebbe's chalofim.
30
Jun 05, 2009 at 05:52 PM Milhouse Says:
“ When I was in Saudi Arabia many years ago they had in PLACE a system to check all NZ and AUS. Lamb and Beef imports for pork residue. They are and were super MACHMIR on this issue as you can imagine. There were NO competing supervisory bodies giving conflicting opinions. If only the yidden can learn something from
LIFE not from the lowly ARABS. ”
How long ago was this? Because they used to import meat shechted by local zovchim, with halal stamps on it, until there was a huge scandal in the early '80s, when it was discovered that someone at the Iraqi embassy had sold copies of the halal stamp, and many of the carcasses being exported as halal were neveilos. After that the Arabs stopped importing meat altogether, and instead began importing live sheep, to be shechted on arrival. The Australian unions got very upset about that, but the Arabs insisted that they could no longer trust the Australian zevicha.