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Kiryas Joel, NY - Pre-Wedding Melee Erupts Over Festive Lights; Trooper Cars Pelted With Eggs, Plastic Bottles

Published on: June 8, 2009 06:01 PM
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Kiryas Joel - Young men shouted and pelted trooper cars with eggs and plastic water bottles Monday during a melee that erupted hours before an outdoor wedding that was expected to draw thousands of spectators.

Troopers say roughly 200 young men staged a rowdy protest as workers from Orange & Rockland Utilities removed decorative lights that had been strung from poles without permission. The lights were for the wedding of a granddaughter of Rabbi Aaron Teitelbaum, a Satmar Hasidic leader.

Protesters blocked the company’s trucks with metal pedestrian barriers and then climbed on the trucks, troopers said. Then they used the same barriers to block trooper cars as state police tried to escort the utility workers out of Kiryas Joel.

One trooper was treated for minor injuries. No police cars were damaged.

One man was arrested and was expected to face a felony charge. His identity and the charges were not immediately available.

In the mean time Thousands are expected to fill the square in front of the Congregation Yetev Lev synagogue in Kiryas Joel at 6:30 p.m. for the wedding of Bluma Ashkenaazy, a granddaughter of Rabbi Aaron Teitelbaum, one of two brothers who lead the Satmar Hasidic movement. The 18-year-old bride will marry Yekisiel Teitelbaum, 19, whose family is from Brazil.

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Read Comments (165)  —  Post Yours »

1

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:05 PM izzy Says:

wow its not only in Israel with the riots. Good for them more chliah Hashem. These guys have too much time on their hands.

2

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:05 PM Anonymous Says:

great way to make a kidush hashem!

3

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:04 PM Anonymous Says:

What goes around comes around..

4

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:06 PM Anonymous Says:

chillul hasham sham on u k.j.

5

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:12 PM cranberry stuffer Says:

Bucherim! boys will be boys. u make me proud!

6

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:10 PM Ich Zug Says:

Zul Yeder Aheim Gein..Vus iz geshein tzi di Tekunes??
Why are the rebbes allowed to have grand wedding? Let everyone go home and only the immediate family should enjoy the festivities.

7

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:09 PM Anonymous Says:

What did they accomplish???

8

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:08 PM Miss Williamsburg Says:

This is such a Chillul Hashem.
However coming from the "Times Herald Record" I imagine they multiplied the facts and details tenfold. I hope so anyway.

9

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:14 PM Moishe Groinem Says:

What happened to this generation?

1st Yerushalaim now K.J.

Where are our leaders...?

10

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:13 PM Anonymous Says:

It remind me of the old times when to used to throw stones on anybody who didn't agree 100% with their shitah its diffrent times now

11

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:17 PM Anonymous Says:

I don't understand what the melee was all about? This is Ahavas Yisroel?

12

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:16 PM what is going on there? Says:

If this is true, it is a major chillul Hashem with serious consequences. Whoever is responsible must be held accountable.

This is the Hassidic sect that talks about yodayim yedei eisav??

13

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:16 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #4  
Anonymous Says:

chillul hasham sham on u k.j.

I like when you make stupid comments with out knowing exactly what happened

14

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:16 PM Anonymous Says:

Kj It gos bout ways

15

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:15 PM Anonymous Says:

Before judging KJ remember there are two sides to each story and secondly we know that the secular media hates charedi Jews. They sell newspapers by writing tall tales, as the saying goes, blood sells...

16

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:15 PM shmuli Says:

& if the decorative lights would have created a fire??? what a sconah!! lets just think, what would have happened had the zionist oppressors ( ZAHAL) had tried to remove the illegal lights???

i just cant believe that our religeon that is being hijacked by taliban style sects, is so machmir on the little things, & yet so maykil on things like chillul hashem,

17

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:19 PM take it easy Says:

Wo! This little incident which was of course provoked by some jealous imfarginner utility workers will give plenty of stuff for l the anti satmer, anti chareidy, anti ultras, anti anything frum that love to blog and vent their hatred on this sìte...

18

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:00 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #7  
Anonymous Says:

What did they accomplish???

What did they accomplish? duh?? Probably made another anti-semite or two today. If these guys want to carry on like chayos let them go to Yerushalayim.

19

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:59 PM formerkj Says:

Reply to #8  
Miss Williamsburg Says:

This is such a Chillul Hashem.
However coming from the "Times Herald Record" I imagine they multiplied the facts and details tenfold. I hope so anyway.

They actually minimized it. My sister witnessed the whole scene...They took off a violin citing open wires which could lead to fire. It was put right back on as soon as they left. The workers returned with a police escort this time and within 5 minutes, after repeatedly trying to remove the barricades peacefully with hundreds of young boys who should have been in Yeshiva shouting boo, they were pelted with eggs. One policewoman spotted one of the throwers and gave chase. When she caught him, he wrestled out of her grasp, causing her to fall flat on her face and injuring herself. He was chased by many officers by then into Grand Food Market where he was ultimately arrested. The only detail they got wrong was that they described him as a man, but he's only a boy, probably no more than 15-16. What kind of good can come out of this? Those cheering on the bochur, shame on you! Let me see you take money out of your pocket to help with his legal fund. Maybe instead of letting the kids out early today for the big event, they should instead sponsor a class in basic manners, how to avoid the cops, and what to do when you get arrested. ohhhhh...and mazel tov to the rebbe!

20

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:58 PM Anonymous Says:

A chillul Hashem was caused in honor of a chosson/kallah. This is not a Simcha B'Meono.

21

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:58 PM not a satmere Says:

wow come out all you people who hate satmer & start your frum way to act up agents them its for sure not a kidush hashem what when on there but YOU dont mind the chilel hashem cuz i dont think your 100 % like the shilchon oruch wants you should be & even you are but when you father or rosh yeshive or child or friend makes a chilel hashem ul find already 1000 ways to say its not SO bad but when it comes to satmer lets bark im not a satmere but i cant take this fake funny fraud way you people think & write

22

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:54 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #13  
Anonymous Says:

I like when you make stupid comments with out knowing exactly what happened

i was there the cool heads where afraid to say anything because then u where shouted down as a misnagid

23

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:53 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #15  
Anonymous Says:

Before judging KJ remember there are two sides to each story and secondly we know that the secular media hates charedi Jews. They sell newspapers by writing tall tales, as the saying goes, blood sells...

thats exactly why we have to be extra carefull not to do anything stupid

24

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:50 PM Anonymous Says:

how hard is it to understand the concept of asking the town council or whatever for permission and doing things according to the rules? these utility men are not anti-semites out to get us, they had a legit complaint. if the bochrim would have just asked the town council or zoning board, or whoever deals with this, maybe they would have gotten permission, and this whole chillul hashem could have been avoided.
and if they got a no? then who cares? last i checked, a yiddeshe wedding, including a rebbe's grandchildren, requires a couple, eidim, a mesader kiddushin, a chuppah, a minyan, kesuba, ring, and a glass of wine. why did they have to make a big deal over these lights? it's not like anyone was trying to stand in the way of anything remotely pertaining to conducting a proper yiddishe wedding.
while i am sure this media report is somewhat exaggerated, it is not made up out of thin air; the fact is, some guys stupidly started a riot over nothing (not that we should riot even over a big deal- there are more mature ways to deal with such matters). is the wedding still going to happen as planned, with thousands of chasidim in attendance dancing the streets, or will the cops now have to stand around and be ready force everyone to go home if it gets too "crazy", and then actually mess with our rituals? thanks to these thugs who have a) fabricated charges of anti-semitism and b) acted like hooligans, now there may be real anti-semitism, as well as reasons for the goyim of the area to keep a closer watch on, and possibly interfere with, the community whenever a ritual, such as a chasunah, or hachnassas sefer torah, or simchas torah etc takes place in the streets.

25

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:48 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #17  
take it easy Says:

Wo! This little incident which was of course provoked by some jealous imfarginner utility workers will give plenty of stuff for l the anti satmer, anti chareidy, anti ultras, anti anything frum that love to blog and vent their hatred on this sìte...

Jealous utility workers? Those are high voltage and current lines, thousands of volts, not household 120/240 volts, schlemiel! If some "chachem" or "bucher" touches the line by accident, and he's grounded, well, then he's badly injured at best (C"V)!

The utility workers don't want to have to clean up the mess if the "bochurim" start electrocuting themselves and blowing parts of the grid.

26

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:47 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #16  
shmuli Says:

& if the decorative lights would have created a fire??? what a sconah!! lets just think, what would have happened had the zionist oppressors ( ZAHAL) had tried to remove the illegal lights???

i just cant believe that our religeon that is being hijacked by taliban style sects, is so machmir on the little things, & yet so maykil on things like chillul hashem,

and you are makil on the little things and makil on hevei don es kol hoadam lkaf zchus. does anyone have any idea what really happened or youre all basing your claims of chilul hashem and dislike for chasidim on what some shmobag wrote in the paper. or should i say using what some shmobag said to justify your prexisting hatred. but then again i should be dan you lkaf zechus that you do know what happened. so i have a good idea lets all be dan everyone lkaf zechus, show some ahavas chinam and daven to hashem to bring the geulah.

27

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:07 PM Anonymous Says:

the other side of the story:
I was there and this is what I tell you guys.
First, there is an extra 0 in the report, there were only 20 boys not 200
1 bottle flew on a car from a young shtinker, the police didn't even see anything, it was a incident that many people walked by and didn't even stop to see what's going on. some kids on the block were standing like they come to every emergency call.
it can happen anytime you get teen agers upset. not that it's right but to make a news story out of it, give me a break
this comes from someone who is really jealous on this happy day. we all saw him and know who it is, he went to make pictures of police standing next to a car, sent it to all news blogs and there you go. I can all assure you that Der Yid will write a 6 page article this week about 25 troopers coverd with eggs under the direct order of the ruv of kj etc etc.
to call this a mini riot with trowing eggs is a huge overstatement. so all of you KJ haters, get bak to work or whatever you have or dont have to acomplish.

anyway, I see tons of people walking to the Chupa I don't want to be late.
Each wedding in Satmar is exciting, someone who was never there can never understand the joy and happiness we are filled with on such a day.

28

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:47 PM Freyer Yid Says:

All you Satmar bashers:

Remember, that Satmar is the very largest Jewish group in the world.

This means that every once in awhile, a few of their tens of thousands of bochurim, or young men, will mess up and do something stupid.

Then you all jump on Satmar.

When you study the numbers and statistics, you will see they are some of the very best behaved people on the globe.

And.... those Satmar Chossids are there for YOU, as they are there for ANY JEW who needs help. There is no Jewish group ready to dig into their not to deep pockets, spending their last dime to help strangers. And, they ask nothing in return. They don't ask you to sit down and learn what their rebbe said. They don't try to convert you to Satmar. They don't even try to make you religious.
If you ask for help, they are there for you. No strings attached.

And they are the most bashed and maligned group in the Jewish community.... All because their views on the State of Israel don't match what we expect or want them to be. Why should Satmar not have the right to their opinions without being hated for them..... no group.... and I repeat: NO Jewish Group shows more love for fellow Jews than Satmar does.

Yes, they helped me. I was not religious at all. I am still only shomer shabbos about 1/2 the time. But when they found out my wife needed surgery and I did not have the money for it, they immediately raised the money... in less than 12 hours...
They paid the bill completely, and did not even give me an envelope to return the money. And, they did this eagerly, and with love. They treated me, a man whose kippa was in his pocket, as if I were a well-respected rov.
They spoke to me with respect, and treated me with respect.

I will always respect them.

29

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:04 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #17  
take it easy Says:

Wo! This little incident which was of course provoked by some jealous imfarginner utility workers will give plenty of stuff for l the anti satmer, anti chareidy, anti ultras, anti anything frum that love to blog and vent their hatred on this sìte...

This incident was stupid but not criminal; the boys just wanted to liven up the chassanah for the rebbe but someone should have told them to back off when the O&R workers tried to remove the lights. It seems that the adults no longer have control over the bachurim or simply don't care enough to step in. This inmaturity is probably another reason why some may question the idea of these children getting married at 18 years old.

33

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:37 PM Anonymous Says:

listen folks i was there. the truth is, that buchrim r buchrim and they r entiltled for mistakes. thelets not make it a biger chilul hashem. it was a giant mistake and i am sure it wont happen anymore. and those who got arested and will spend the chasuneh night in jail will for sure give the lesson for all of thier friends.

34

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:26 PM Anonymous Says:

Why are they climbing on utility poles - there's 2400 to 7200 volts up there (and that's assuming it's in the residential grid)! Apart from the danger of falling they're in serious danger of electrocution - unless you're a trained linesman you should stay on the ground and away from power lines.

35

 Jun 08, 2009 at 05:26 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #16  
shmuli Says:

& if the decorative lights would have created a fire??? what a sconah!! lets just think, what would have happened had the zionist oppressors ( ZAHAL) had tried to remove the illegal lights???

i just cant believe that our religeon that is being hijacked by taliban style sects, is so machmir on the little things, & yet so maykil on things like chillul hashem,

Do you have any reason to think there was a danger of fire? If not, why suggest it?

36

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:23 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #28  
Freyer Yid Says:

All you Satmar bashers:

Remember, that Satmar is the very largest Jewish group in the world.

This means that every once in awhile, a few of their tens of thousands of bochurim, or young men, will mess up and do something stupid.

Then you all jump on Satmar.

When you study the numbers and statistics, you will see they are some of the very best behaved people on the globe.

And.... those Satmar Chossids are there for YOU, as they are there for ANY JEW who needs help. There is no Jewish group ready to dig into their not to deep pockets, spending their last dime to help strangers. And, they ask nothing in return. They don't ask you to sit down and learn what their rebbe said. They don't try to convert you to Satmar. They don't even try to make you religious.
If you ask for help, they are there for you. No strings attached.

And they are the most bashed and maligned group in the Jewish community.... All because their views on the State of Israel don't match what we expect or want them to be. Why should Satmar not have the right to their opinions without being hated for them..... no group.... and I repeat: NO Jewish Group shows more love for fellow Jews than Satmar does.

Yes, they helped me. I was not religious at all. I am still only shomer shabbos about 1/2 the time. But when they found out my wife needed surgery and I did not have the money for it, they immediately raised the money... in less than 12 hours...
They paid the bill completely, and did not even give me an envelope to return the money. And, they did this eagerly, and with love. They treated me, a man whose kippa was in his pocket, as if I were a well-respected rov.
They spoke to me with respect, and treated me with respect.

I will always respect them.

BRAVO!!! I didn't hear such true words in a long time. I always knew the fine point of satmar-hearts of Chessed- and finally somebody brought out.

Ppl, the chupa was beautiful. Todays afternoon activity is long forgotten. The beirach moshe was here and the hisoirris was exceptionally high. We hopefully poyeld alas gits!

Let's enjoy the rest of the chassunah!

37

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:23 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #13  
Anonymous Says:

I like when you make stupid comments with out knowing exactly what happened

I know exactly what happen and I'm telling you SHAME ON YOU ALL

38

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:54 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #11  
Anonymous Says:

I don't understand what the melee was all about? This is Ahavas Yisroel?

What has ahavas yisroel got to do with it? Were the troopers or the utility workers yisroel?

39

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:18 PM Me Says:

Reply to #27  
Anonymous Says:

the other side of the story:
I was there and this is what I tell you guys.
First, there is an extra 0 in the report, there were only 20 boys not 200
1 bottle flew on a car from a young shtinker, the police didn't even see anything, it was a incident that many people walked by and didn't even stop to see what's going on. some kids on the block were standing like they come to every emergency call.
it can happen anytime you get teen agers upset. not that it's right but to make a news story out of it, give me a break
this comes from someone who is really jealous on this happy day. we all saw him and know who it is, he went to make pictures of police standing next to a car, sent it to all news blogs and there you go. I can all assure you that Der Yid will write a 6 page article this week about 25 troopers coverd with eggs under the direct order of the ruv of kj etc etc.
to call this a mini riot with trowing eggs is a huge overstatement. so all of you KJ haters, get bak to work or whatever you have or dont have to acomplish.

anyway, I see tons of people walking to the Chupa I don't want to be late.
Each wedding in Satmar is exciting, someone who was never there can never understand the joy and happiness we are filled with on such a day.

Well said, I couldn't agree more. To all KJ haters. Stop saying its an act of "KJ" its just a few bocerim being wild, it has nothing to do with "KJ"

40

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:16 PM dont be stupid Says:

Boichirim are boochirim they don't get it we were all the same we did not think for one second what it means Yes its a big chilul hashem but all you guys don't care when its a chilul hashem when a rabbi got arrested lat week in kansas city trying to help astudent who got a ticket then you all tried to minimize it come on guys give me a break it does not bother you hashems kooved Satmar is the one that bothers you listen to me when you need help satmar is there when there is a big accident on the thruway even if its goyim who is giving out thousands of gallons of water to the drvers stuck in the traffic? You got it satmar yingeliet so just cut it now again its a chilul hashem but don't jump you guys don't mean hashems kooved I wish you would mean it

41

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:13 PM Mazel Tov Says:

When will everyone learn that you can't have a good time at the expense of others? Playing with electrical lines is literally playing with fire. Besides, teenage boys should be in Yeshiva learning. Enough time gets wasted in the name of holiness when there is a Rebbeshe chasuna. Doesn't anyone have any control in Kiryas Yoel? Nobody noticed their absence from class?

42

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:04 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #33  
Anonymous Says:

listen folks i was there. the truth is, that buchrim r buchrim and they r entiltled for mistakes. thelets not make it a biger chilul hashem. it was a giant mistake and i am sure it wont happen anymore. and those who got arested and will spend the chasuneh night in jail will for sure give the lesson for all of thier friends.

MISTAKE? A mistake is when someone does something- by mistake. Without putting any thought into it. I don't know what was done, or what happened but a mistake it definitely was not. This was done on purpose.

43

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:57 PM Anonymous Says:

intresting in the city evrey little rebbele puts lights on the light poles and nither the city nor con ed removes them o&r didnt come on their own either. somebody who lives in k.j. (remember 60 minutes ?) didnt like that there is lights hanging so he decided to make a little labedig and call o&r

44

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:57 PM Dov Says:

How come we are always making excuses for rioting chasidim? Always another side of the story. How about behaving and no story at all.

45

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:51 PM Anonymous Says:

why should jews get permission from goyim like the electric company to string lights on their telephone poles and electric grid..... next thing you know the local towns will actually ask for zoning variances and maybe heaven forbid building permits to ensure the quality of the finished building product...ofcourse those antisemites might even start enforcing other laws (like noise/sanitation/fire safety codes etc...)that are only meant for the goyim...keep up the good work guys...

46

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:48 PM Tzaddik misnaged Says:

Shame on these so-called 'frummer'yidden. The Torah guides us,NOT our emotions and desires. Is the Yetzer Horah becoming a Satmar Chossid? Laws must be obeyed! Permission must be requested and granted before doing unauthorized activities. They do not own this state or country.All they do is cause grief to the Jewish people by making a chillul Hashem. They should grow up before getting married. They don't work and are spoiled by rich parents who do not discipline their children. Everything is theirs.Kochi v'otzem yodi rules .Why wear the peyos and chassidic outfits if you can't act like b'nei Torah?

48

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:35 PM simcha Says:

Reply to #27  
Anonymous Says:

the other side of the story:
I was there and this is what I tell you guys.
First, there is an extra 0 in the report, there were only 20 boys not 200
1 bottle flew on a car from a young shtinker, the police didn't even see anything, it was a incident that many people walked by and didn't even stop to see what's going on. some kids on the block were standing like they come to every emergency call.
it can happen anytime you get teen agers upset. not that it's right but to make a news story out of it, give me a break
this comes from someone who is really jealous on this happy day. we all saw him and know who it is, he went to make pictures of police standing next to a car, sent it to all news blogs and there you go. I can all assure you that Der Yid will write a 6 page article this week about 25 troopers coverd with eggs under the direct order of the ruv of kj etc etc.
to call this a mini riot with trowing eggs is a huge overstatement. so all of you KJ haters, get bak to work or whatever you have or dont have to acomplish.

anyway, I see tons of people walking to the Chupa I don't want to be late.
Each wedding in Satmar is exciting, someone who was never there can never understand the joy and happiness we are filled with on such a day.

"I can all assure you that Der Yid will write a 6 page article this week about 25 troopers covered with eggs under the direct order of the ruv of kj etc etc."

Hysterical!!!!

49

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:31 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #35  
Milhouse Says:

Do you have any reason to think there was a danger of fire? If not, why suggest it?

In simple terms that even you would understand, it is "assur" to hang anything on utility poles without prior approval. Even a string for an eruv is assur without approval which can usually be obtained. Those are the rules approved by the New York Public Service Commission which approves all tariff conditions governing the O&R distribution lines. If these idiots don't understand the dangers of climbing electric poles or hanging lights from the poles, than O&R should simply shut of power to KJ and these Satmer can sit in the dark.

50

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:46 PM Anonymous Says:

Isn't it stealing when you hook-up lights to utility pole?

51

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:39 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #21  
not a satmere Says:

wow come out all you people who hate satmer & start your frum way to act up agents them its for sure not a kidush hashem what when on there but YOU dont mind the chilel hashem cuz i dont think your 100 % like the shilchon oruch wants you should be & even you are but when you father or rosh yeshive or child or friend makes a chilel hashem ul find already 1000 ways to say its not SO bad but when it comes to satmer lets bark im not a satmere but i cant take this fake funny fraud way you people think & write

You may not be Satmer but you are also difficult to understand. Have respect for other readers on VIN. You string together words incoherently without any punctuation. I see a few "chilul hashems" in your message but not clear if you are saying that it was the actions of the Satmer or the police. Either way, if you bother to post, please make it intelligible.

52

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:41 PM Anonymous Says:

Bottom line, it was a beautiful חופה , so very nice, אשרי עין ראתה כל אלו
Tousends of people all around the chupa, I saw the Sqvere Rebbe, Tzalimer Ruv, Toldos avrum Yitzchuk and plenty more.
afterwerds the Rebbe gave his emotional blessing, young and old danced for a long time. everyone was so happy. that's all I care.

53

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:34 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #35  
Milhouse Says:

Do you have any reason to think there was a danger of fire? If not, why suggest it?

Any insulator eventually breaks down in conditions of enough voltage and current. The current flow then increases dramatically - this is often seen as a spark. Although wood is a good insulator, the resistance is dependent upon the density and type of wood. A violin is a very thin structure - not like the dense woods used in the utility poles (or the oak they used to use for the electric chair). It's entirely possible there's enough current and voltage to arc and cause a fire, especially dangerous if people are nearby.

54

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:34 PM Askupeh Says:

Reply to #28  
Freyer Yid Says:

All you Satmar bashers:

Remember, that Satmar is the very largest Jewish group in the world.

This means that every once in awhile, a few of their tens of thousands of bochurim, or young men, will mess up and do something stupid.

Then you all jump on Satmar.

When you study the numbers and statistics, you will see they are some of the very best behaved people on the globe.

And.... those Satmar Chossids are there for YOU, as they are there for ANY JEW who needs help. There is no Jewish group ready to dig into their not to deep pockets, spending their last dime to help strangers. And, they ask nothing in return. They don't ask you to sit down and learn what their rebbe said. They don't try to convert you to Satmar. They don't even try to make you religious.
If you ask for help, they are there for you. No strings attached.

And they are the most bashed and maligned group in the Jewish community.... All because their views on the State of Israel don't match what we expect or want them to be. Why should Satmar not have the right to their opinions without being hated for them..... no group.... and I repeat: NO Jewish Group shows more love for fellow Jews than Satmar does.

Yes, they helped me. I was not religious at all. I am still only shomer shabbos about 1/2 the time. But when they found out my wife needed surgery and I did not have the money for it, they immediately raised the money... in less than 12 hours...
They paid the bill completely, and did not even give me an envelope to return the money. And, they did this eagerly, and with love. They treated me, a man whose kippa was in his pocket, as if I were a well-respected rov.
They spoke to me with respect, and treated me with respect.

I will always respect them.

You brought tears to my eyes. Every word you write is true. I disagree with satmar a lot, regarding Eretz Yisroel and on their falsities surrounding the Eiriv, but the Chesed they do is legendary.

One thing I want to know, who called the Orange & Rockland Utilities?

55

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:43 PM a chusid Says:

I have 1 question to ask is anyone that bashes and cries here aware that theese lights have been used in KJ for the last 20 years by every wedding etc. And O&R never had a problem with it till someone had to call them today and to say something, so please before u cry just listen to a diff. Side of the coin. And don't be "a self hating jew"

56

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:41 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #19  
formerkj Says:

They actually minimized it. My sister witnessed the whole scene...They took off a violin citing open wires which could lead to fire. It was put right back on as soon as they left. The workers returned with a police escort this time and within 5 minutes, after repeatedly trying to remove the barricades peacefully with hundreds of young boys who should have been in Yeshiva shouting boo, they were pelted with eggs. One policewoman spotted one of the throwers and gave chase. When she caught him, he wrestled out of her grasp, causing her to fall flat on her face and injuring herself. He was chased by many officers by then into Grand Food Market where he was ultimately arrested. The only detail they got wrong was that they described him as a man, but he's only a boy, probably no more than 15-16. What kind of good can come out of this? Those cheering on the bochur, shame on you! Let me see you take money out of your pocket to help with his legal fund. Maybe instead of letting the kids out early today for the big event, they should instead sponsor a class in basic manners, how to avoid the cops, and what to do when you get arrested. ohhhhh...and mazel tov to the rebbe!

I really feel so badly your pain, go to the marriott in down town brooklyn, that's a big kiddush hosham? grow up you only see when someone else dos bad look at your self, I could understand your feeling everyone with a smile with bigdie shabbos in kiryes yoel and you have to see all this, should hosham be Menocham you bakurov

57

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:49 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #43  
Anonymous Says:

intresting in the city evrey little rebbele puts lights on the light poles and nither the city nor con ed removes them o&r didnt come on their own either. somebody who lives in k.j. (remember 60 minutes ?) didnt like that there is lights hanging so he decided to make a little labedig and call o&r

"evrey little rebbele puts lights on the light poles"

First, the Satmer rebbe, Z'tl, is not just a "little rebbele" and you should seek his mechila. Also, when they hang lights on utility poles in NYC, Con Ed provides prior approval to the block associations or groups hanging the lights and provides clear instructions as to how high on the pole the lights can hang and what types of wiring they must use. These bochurim in KJ had no such approval.

58

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:48 PM Anonymous Says:

Don't you realize that as frum Jews we have to set an example and NOT behave like HOOLIGANS and HOODLUMS. Every action has to be considered what the ramifications will be. You dress in satin ( bekishe) and fur (shtreimel) behave like ROYALTY! That's what frum Jews are SUPPOSED to be. Being arrested is appropriate for LOWLIFES! What a Chilul Hashem

59

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:25 PM Vayoel Moishe Says:

Where is "Hisgaris Beimas" is it said only against others . in our own shtetel you can do whatever you want. Chilul Hashem is such a great Aveira that we don't do any good by down playing it. Erev yom Kippur we will be melamed zechis. For now we all in Kiryas Yoel have to denounce this with the utmost force. They did not stop you from being a yid. it was only a few lights up and down. Are we allowed to act in such a manner.

60

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:25 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #29  
Anonymous Says:

This incident was stupid but not criminal; the boys just wanted to liven up the chassanah for the rebbe but someone should have told them to back off when the O&R workers tried to remove the lights. It seems that the adults no longer have control over the bachurim or simply don't care enough to step in. This inmaturity is probably another reason why some may question the idea of these children getting married at 18 years old.

Actually, resisting arrest and throwing things at police (an possibly throwing things at and blocking utility workers) are criminal.
I think everyone recognizes that teenagers do stupid things and don't believe this reflects on all of Satmar. What might reflect on KJ/Satmar is whether or not youth and adults are tought to respect secular workers and secular authority and how the community responds afterward. i.e. is there a public apology to the workers and the troopers? are steps taken to make sure there are no repeats, does someone own up and take responsibility? Unfortunately, while the OJ community is terrific about circling around and protecting their own, taking responsibility and just saying "I'm sorry" is not heard very often, or at least not heard in a public form.

61

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:22 PM cp Says:

Why is everyone so quick to say "stop bashing satmar"? Stop being paranoid! We're outraged because these are frumme yidden who make a shande!

62

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:16 PM A Pushita Yid Says:

Reply to #17  
take it easy Says:

Wo! This little incident which was of course provoked by some jealous imfarginner utility workers will give plenty of stuff for l the anti satmer, anti chareidy, anti ultras, anti anything frum that love to blog and vent their hatred on this sìte...

I'm sorry, but anything having to do with chilul Hashem even in the smallest form, cannot be called a "little incident". This is said even if these boys were demanding something they had a right to (which in this case, my personal opinion is that they didn't). There are laws as to how a yid behaves, under all circumstances (besides for situations where it's about defending against murder b'gashmius / b'ruchnius) especially in galus.

63

 Jun 08, 2009 at 06:13 PM chaim Says:

a generation of ignorant savages,here and in jerusalem

64

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:02 PM stealing Says:

Reply to #50  
Anonymous Says:

Isn't it stealing when you hook-up lights to utility pole?

Yes its stealing I pitty you because there are 2 things what will keep you from sleep One is Chilul Hashem and the Second one is stealing I hope you davend minchah already

65

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:01 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #56  
Anonymous Says:

I really feel so badly your pain, go to the marriott in down town brooklyn, that's a big kiddush hosham? grow up you only see when someone else dos bad look at your self, I could understand your feeling everyone with a smile with bigdie shabbos in kiryes yoel and you have to see all this, should hosham be Menocham you bakurov

Well said!

All those self-hating jews: u can team up with those depressed ppl standing at susmans or chareidim shuls. They're nebech terrible jealous and can't express there envy other than calling O&R to rip down those decorative stuff.

Go ahead! It just shows ur deep unhappines and jealousy on all those ppl dressed in bigdai shabbos.

Mazel Tov! Satmara rebbe wishes u all a Mazel Tov

66

 Jun 08, 2009 at 07:56 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #40  
dont be stupid Says:

Boichirim are boochirim they don't get it we were all the same we did not think for one second what it means Yes its a big chilul hashem but all you guys don't care when its a chilul hashem when a rabbi got arrested lat week in kansas city trying to help astudent who got a ticket then you all tried to minimize it come on guys give me a break it does not bother you hashems kooved Satmar is the one that bothers you listen to me when you need help satmar is there when there is a big accident on the thruway even if its goyim who is giving out thousands of gallons of water to the drvers stuck in the traffic? You got it satmar yingeliet so just cut it now again its a chilul hashem but don't jump you guys don't mean hashems kooved I wish you would mean it

not only water to drivers but where do ppl stuck in traffic on the thruway and the 17 close to KJ go when shabbos is close and have nowhere to go. and how simchas have they hosted in that way? I know. but you don't

67

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:31 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #43  
Anonymous Says:

intresting in the city evrey little rebbele puts lights on the light poles and nither the city nor con ed removes them o&r didnt come on their own either. somebody who lives in k.j. (remember 60 minutes ?) didnt like that there is lights hanging so he decided to make a little labedig and call o&r

Great... You hit the nail on the head. Who called Orange & Rockland? When there is a true emergency it takes them hours to come. All of a sudden it's dangerous and there there in minutes. Well only some nudnicks that can't swallow that the Grand Rebbi of Satmar is marrying off his grandchild.

68

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:28 PM Anonymous Says:

What would the bal shem tov say when he sees that chasidus became a gang, full of hater, fights, שנאת חינם,

I'm sure that when the bal shem tov grandson Rabbi Nachman from breslov got married, there were no lights, and not even signs or people walking with candles, not even parentches, not a choir of 25 chasidim.

What happened to our generation that chasidus means parenches, which kind of hat u are wearing,giving kugel etc.

What happened to all the kiruv levavus that the bal shem tov and his followers did.

what happened to the פשוטי עם that the bal shem tov said that they are the holiest of klall yisorel, 2day if u have money u are accepted, if u learn your a lamdan, what's with the bus drivers and with plumbers, why don't I see a picture of them in kol haolom kilo? Because they don't have a last name as Grunwald, Horowitz, Teitelbaum, Tewerski?

Why do I see that the only ones that sit on the head table of all the rebisha tishen with out a beard are people with money?

what about ahavs yisroel, what about תיקון חצות, does any of u guys or u Rabbi's do תיקון חצות ? Do any of u talk to hashem in middle of the day in Yiddish, English, Spanish (what ever language u speak) besides the daily davening (which u do as routine and u have in mind your business).

Does your Rabbi take care of your kids that go off the derech, or that can use some chizuk? Or is he just there u should clap for him and make him כבוד when the photographer of kol haolom kilo arrives.
Why does a Rabbi have to have a last name like Teitelbaum, Tewerski, Horowitz, Grunwald, etc
Why don't we see a Rabbi named Schwartz, Goldstein, Wertzberger? Rabbi Shaya'la kerstirer wasn't a son of a Rabbi and he became one, because he was holy,why today u have to have a last name, is this like a mafia gang, u have to be apart of the family in order to work for the family?

How low can we go?

Non of u are chasidim, u are a sect that dresses as chasidim, u call urselfs chasidim and u make בושות for Chasidus, aren't u guys afraid of such holy people?

69

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:23 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #28  
Freyer Yid Says:

All you Satmar bashers:

Remember, that Satmar is the very largest Jewish group in the world.

This means that every once in awhile, a few of their tens of thousands of bochurim, or young men, will mess up and do something stupid.

Then you all jump on Satmar.

When you study the numbers and statistics, you will see they are some of the very best behaved people on the globe.

And.... those Satmar Chossids are there for YOU, as they are there for ANY JEW who needs help. There is no Jewish group ready to dig into their not to deep pockets, spending their last dime to help strangers. And, they ask nothing in return. They don't ask you to sit down and learn what their rebbe said. They don't try to convert you to Satmar. They don't even try to make you religious.
If you ask for help, they are there for you. No strings attached.

And they are the most bashed and maligned group in the Jewish community.... All because their views on the State of Israel don't match what we expect or want them to be. Why should Satmar not have the right to their opinions without being hated for them..... no group.... and I repeat: NO Jewish Group shows more love for fellow Jews than Satmar does.

Yes, they helped me. I was not religious at all. I am still only shomer shabbos about 1/2 the time. But when they found out my wife needed surgery and I did not have the money for it, they immediately raised the money... in less than 12 hours...
They paid the bill completely, and did not even give me an envelope to return the money. And, they did this eagerly, and with love. They treated me, a man whose kippa was in his pocket, as if I were a well-respected rov.
They spoke to me with respect, and treated me with respect.

I will always respect them.

Wow how emotional well said I have tears in my eyes

70

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:23 PM Anonymous Says:

now you know why the heliger vilna gaon was against chassidus.

71

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:21 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #53  
Anonymous Says:

Any insulator eventually breaks down in conditions of enough voltage and current. The current flow then increases dramatically - this is often seen as a spark. Although wood is a good insulator, the resistance is dependent upon the density and type of wood. A violin is a very thin structure - not like the dense woods used in the utility poles (or the oak they used to use for the electric chair). It's entirely possible there's enough current and voltage to arc and cause a fire, especially dangerous if people are nearby.

Nice theoretical discussion of what might happen in some hypothetical situation. But what makes you think there was a danger of fire in THIS instance? What makes you think that whoever installed these lights didn't know what they were doing?

72

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:20 PM tzirel Says:

Reply to #21  
not a satmere Says:

wow come out all you people who hate satmer & start your frum way to act up agents them its for sure not a kidush hashem what when on there but YOU dont mind the chilel hashem cuz i dont think your 100 % like the shilchon oruch wants you should be & even you are but when you father or rosh yeshive or child or friend makes a chilel hashem ul find already 1000 ways to say its not SO bad but when it comes to satmer lets bark im not a satmere but i cant take this fake funny fraud way you people think & write

I can't believe this like what one of the fist ppl said what hapend to all the takonos they talk big but dnt preech what they say and how do u want to have ahavas isreal when the two brthrs dnt have it nt even when they sat shiva this is such a chilul hashem rather nt have the grand lights than make a chilul hashem

73

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:16 PM destro613 Says:

the state troopers should have brought some patty wagons and arrested all of the protesters and O&R should have turned off the power to those poles

74

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:16 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #66  
Anonymous Says:

not only water to drivers but where do ppl stuck in traffic on the thruway and the 17 close to KJ go when shabbos is close and have nowhere to go. and how simchas have they hosted in that way? I know. but you don't

I've been stuck in traffic on the Thruway several times erev shabbos and have checked in to the Hilton near the Tappan zee bridge. The hotel was very helpful in arranging meals for shabbos. The last place I would go is KJ and today's incident shows why. This is not the first time they have behaved this way towards the police. When its the rebbe's yahrtzeit and the NYS Police were tying to control the crowds at the Cemetery, there was pushing and shoving and refusal to obey the police orders. They believe they are only responsible to hashem and not subject to civil law.

75

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:14 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #38  
Milhouse Says:

What has ahavas yisroel got to do with it? Were the troopers or the utility workers yisroel?

Millhouse, what gives you replied to “Anonymous” without any insult

76

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:12 PM Anonymous Says:

This was all planed as moshe witrieol was no ware to be found

77

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:08 PM seen it all Says:

kids are kids, I was a bochur and did crazy things too, but where are the RY's of Satmar, the rosh hakohols, the teachers, any mature adults? These kids could have CH"V caused a major electrical fire, and R"L it should break out when thousands of people are crammed together by a simcha vidal.

78

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:37 PM formerkj Says:

Reply to #56  
Anonymous Says:

I really feel so badly your pain, go to the marriott in down town brooklyn, that's a big kiddush hosham? grow up you only see when someone else dos bad look at your self, I could understand your feeling everyone with a smile with bigdie shabbos in kiryes yoel and you have to see all this, should hosham be Menocham you bakurov

My only pain is that I have family living in that shtetl you call home and others call communism Russia. It used to bug me when I read a critical story of kj in the record and I loved seeing a nice story once in a while. But the leadership is corrupt and things are out of control. I b'h married into a different sect of society where my children don't have to grow up seeing adults act like children and children acting like sheep. I am neither an "aroni" or "zali" so your words are pointless. I just think it's a "shanda" for kj that instead of a nice chuppah picture in the local papers tomorrow, it'll be a beardless kid in handcuffs who wasn't even there.

79

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:36 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #55  
a chusid Says:

I have 1 question to ask is anyone that bashes and cries here aware that theese lights have been used in KJ for the last 20 years by every wedding etc. And O&R never had a problem with it till someone had to call them today and to say something, so please before u cry just listen to a diff. Side of the coin. And don't be "a self hating jew"

so a ganef for twenty years isn't a ganef because no one called the police. a child molester isn't a molester because h e was doing it for twenty years and none called the cops? you need some serious help

80

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:33 PM Anonymous Says:

The issue here is NOT Satmar, NOT the simcha, and NOT KJ.

The issue is that someone started playing around high voltage / high current installations. Let's say there are 20 houses on that leg of the distribution grid. Keeping the math simple (I'll eliminate root mean square RMS and peak to peak AC for the people who don't understand), if each house has 100 amp service at 240 volts, that means 10 amps at 2400 volts per house, or 200 amps at 2400 volts for that branch. That's a lot, and I mean a LOT of electricity.

Look, everyone's entitled to act foolish once in a while, and I'm not going to give a bochur a black eye for having a bit of fun at a simcha. This wasn't fun. This was stupidity of the highest order. A fire could have started or people could be killed (C"V).

If anyone is thinking about hanging something on a utility pole, DON'T. You may lose your life, or endanger someone else's. Don't blame the cops or the utility - this is a matter of public safety for everyone.

81

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:14 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #28  
Freyer Yid Says:

All you Satmar bashers:

Remember, that Satmar is the very largest Jewish group in the world.

This means that every once in awhile, a few of their tens of thousands of bochurim, or young men, will mess up and do something stupid.

Then you all jump on Satmar.

When you study the numbers and statistics, you will see they are some of the very best behaved people on the globe.

And.... those Satmar Chossids are there for YOU, as they are there for ANY JEW who needs help. There is no Jewish group ready to dig into their not to deep pockets, spending their last dime to help strangers. And, they ask nothing in return. They don't ask you to sit down and learn what their rebbe said. They don't try to convert you to Satmar. They don't even try to make you religious.
If you ask for help, they are there for you. No strings attached.

And they are the most bashed and maligned group in the Jewish community.... All because their views on the State of Israel don't match what we expect or want them to be. Why should Satmar not have the right to their opinions without being hated for them..... no group.... and I repeat: NO Jewish Group shows more love for fellow Jews than Satmar does.

Yes, they helped me. I was not religious at all. I am still only shomer shabbos about 1/2 the time. But when they found out my wife needed surgery and I did not have the money for it, they immediately raised the money... in less than 12 hours...
They paid the bill completely, and did not even give me an envelope to return the money. And, they did this eagerly, and with love. They treated me, a man whose kippa was in his pocket, as if I were a well-respected rov.
They spoke to me with respect, and treated me with respect.

I will always respect them.

listen Yoely, you aint fooling me... and to Stamar I say, don't do Chesed & stop causing a Chilul Hashem day & night!

82

 Jun 08, 2009 at 09:08 PM Yeah Says:

Reply to #81  
Anonymous Says:

listen Yoely, you aint fooling me... and to Stamar I say, don't do Chesed & stop causing a Chilul Hashem day & night!

Yeah just wait till you will need their help then you should scream with a Loud speaker STOP DOING CHESED

83

 Jun 08, 2009 at 09:03 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #68  
Anonymous Says:

What would the bal shem tov say when he sees that chasidus became a gang, full of hater, fights, שנאת חינם,

I'm sure that when the bal shem tov grandson Rabbi Nachman from breslov got married, there were no lights, and not even signs or people walking with candles, not even parentches, not a choir of 25 chasidim.

What happened to our generation that chasidus means parenches, which kind of hat u are wearing,giving kugel etc.

What happened to all the kiruv levavus that the bal shem tov and his followers did.

what happened to the פשוטי עם that the bal shem tov said that they are the holiest of klall yisorel, 2day if u have money u are accepted, if u learn your a lamdan, what's with the bus drivers and with plumbers, why don't I see a picture of them in kol haolom kilo? Because they don't have a last name as Grunwald, Horowitz, Teitelbaum, Tewerski?

Why do I see that the only ones that sit on the head table of all the rebisha tishen with out a beard are people with money?

what about ahavs yisroel, what about תיקון חצות, does any of u guys or u Rabbi's do תיקון חצות ? Do any of u talk to hashem in middle of the day in Yiddish, English, Spanish (what ever language u speak) besides the daily davening (which u do as routine and u have in mind your business).

Does your Rabbi take care of your kids that go off the derech, or that can use some chizuk? Or is he just there u should clap for him and make him כבוד when the photographer of kol haolom kilo arrives.
Why does a Rabbi have to have a last name like Teitelbaum, Tewerski, Horowitz, Grunwald, etc
Why don't we see a Rabbi named Schwartz, Goldstein, Wertzberger? Rabbi Shaya'la kerstirer wasn't a son of a Rabbi and he became one, because he was holy,why today u have to have a last name, is this like a mafia gang, u have to be apart of the family in order to work for the family?

How low can we go?

Non of u are chasidim, u are a sect that dresses as chasidim, u call urselfs chasidim and u make בושות for Chasidus, aren't u guys afraid of such holy people?

People threw stones and other things at the Baal Shem tove Tz"l calling him all kind of names. Wanting him thrown out of town and putinto Chairem. Maybe not for his sons wedding but at other times. This is golus these are bocurim any where any place and life needs to go on. Mazel to to the rebas family.

84

 Jun 08, 2009 at 09:03 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #71  
Milhouse Says:

Nice theoretical discussion of what might happen in some hypothetical situation. But what makes you think there was a danger of fire in THIS instance? What makes you think that whoever installed these lights didn't know what they were doing?

If a licensed electrician was at the event and showed what he did was up to the National Electrical Code, the matter would've ended right then and there. If it isn't up to code, the utility, the fire marshall and the cops would all have every right, and obligation to shut down any non-conforming wiring. The power distribution grid is known for having localized failures cause cascading failures.

If you can say, the bochur who did this is a licensed electrician OR did this under the supervision of a licensed electrician then you've got a leg to stand on. Can you say whether this was a "wye" or a "delta" power distribution setup? Are the transformers connected phase-to-phase, or phase-to-neutral? Were the lights connected to a PDU (a "distro" as we call it)? What about grounding? Did they meter the phase legs before they connected the loads?

I'm an electrical engineer by training. I've got a very healthy respect for electricity. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt if you can show that someone who knows what they're doing was there.

This could've been easily avoided. Rent a generator and some light trusses, like they use for concerts.


85

 Jun 08, 2009 at 09:01 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #70  
Anonymous Says:

now you know why the heliger vilna gaon was against chassidus.

I guess you never needed Bikur Cholim, Hatzolah, Chaveirim, Shomrim, Eitzah, Nshei Chayil, or any of the other hundreds of gmachs. Most of which were founded by Chasidim. Chesed equals Ahavas Yisroel. That is what brings Moshiach.

When my child gets beaten by other children who call him chasidishe, I'm sure the Vilna Gaon would not be proud. Quit bashing Chasidim. You just might need their services one day. I hope you don't choke on your Geiva when you call them for help.

86

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:57 PM Dov Says:

Reply to #67  
Anonymous Says:

Great... You hit the nail on the head. Who called Orange & Rockland? When there is a true emergency it takes them hours to come. All of a sudden it's dangerous and there there in minutes. Well only some nudnicks that can't swallow that the Grand Rebbi of Satmar is marrying off his grandchild.

Yeh is the fault of those who told the electric people that they were being robbed and put the community in danger. The goyim are actually more responsible here.

87

 Jun 08, 2009 at 08:46 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #28  
Freyer Yid Says:

All you Satmar bashers:

Remember, that Satmar is the very largest Jewish group in the world.

This means that every once in awhile, a few of their tens of thousands of bochurim, or young men, will mess up and do something stupid.

Then you all jump on Satmar.

When you study the numbers and statistics, you will see they are some of the very best behaved people on the globe.

And.... those Satmar Chossids are there for YOU, as they are there for ANY JEW who needs help. There is no Jewish group ready to dig into their not to deep pockets, spending their last dime to help strangers. And, they ask nothing in return. They don't ask you to sit down and learn what their rebbe said. They don't try to convert you to Satmar. They don't even try to make you religious.
If you ask for help, they are there for you. No strings attached.

And they are the most bashed and maligned group in the Jewish community.... All because their views on the State of Israel don't match what we expect or want them to be. Why should Satmar not have the right to their opinions without being hated for them..... no group.... and I repeat: NO Jewish Group shows more love for fellow Jews than Satmar does.

Yes, they helped me. I was not religious at all. I am still only shomer shabbos about 1/2 the time. But when they found out my wife needed surgery and I did not have the money for it, they immediately raised the money... in less than 12 hours...
They paid the bill completely, and did not even give me an envelope to return the money. And, they did this eagerly, and with love. They treated me, a man whose kippa was in his pocket, as if I were a well-respected rov.
They spoke to me with respect, and treated me with respect.

I will always respect them.

What a load of garbage.

If it is true what you say about only being 1/2 Shomer Shabbos, then your a Satmer Chosid who doesn't give a damn.

1) Or else you wouldn't be on this forum.
2) Your English would be proper.

88

 Jun 08, 2009 at 09:19 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #77  
seen it all Says:

kids are kids, I was a bochur and did crazy things too, but where are the RY's of Satmar, the rosh hakohols, the teachers, any mature adults? These kids could have CH"V caused a major electrical fire, and R"L it should break out when thousands of people are crammed together by a simcha vidal.

Thats why so many of us are so outraged. Just as happened over shabbos at the parking lot in in yerushalayim, the Gerer and Satmer rabbonim seem to be terrified of these bums and are afraid to interfere.

89

 Jun 08, 2009 at 09:17 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #71  
Milhouse Says:

Nice theoretical discussion of what might happen in some hypothetical situation. But what makes you think there was a danger of fire in THIS instance? What makes you think that whoever installed these lights didn't know what they were doing?

Even if they were electrical engineers, it is illegal to hang anything from utility poles in New York without approval. We don't want every "litte rebbele" in the words of a prior posting deciding what rules will apply to his chassidim and which don't. And don't post your usual gibberish about there is nothing in the Torah about hanging lights from utility poles and since yiddin are only subject to halacha the O&R rules don't apply to them.

90

 Jun 08, 2009 at 10:12 PM Anonymous Says:

does this only happen insatmar

91

 Jun 08, 2009 at 10:09 PM esther Says:

Reply to #71  
Milhouse Says:

Nice theoretical discussion of what might happen in some hypothetical situation. But what makes you think there was a danger of fire in THIS instance? What makes you think that whoever installed these lights didn't know what they were doing?

mh,this is a quite a stretch.please!

92

 Jun 08, 2009 at 10:39 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #73  
destro613 Says:

the state troopers should have brought some patty wagons and arrested all of the protesters and O&R should have turned off the power to those poles

Patty wagons? Why, to feed the oilom with hamburgers?

93

 Jun 08, 2009 at 10:26 PM Anonymous Says:

what's the name of the bucher and his mother to say thilim that he shoud be released from jail

94

 Jun 08, 2009 at 10:51 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #78  
formerkj Says:

My only pain is that I have family living in that shtetl you call home and others call communism Russia. It used to bug me when I read a critical story of kj in the record and I loved seeing a nice story once in a while. But the leadership is corrupt and things are out of control. I b'h married into a different sect of society where my children don't have to grow up seeing adults act like children and children acting like sheep. I am neither an "aroni" or "zali" so your words are pointless. I just think it's a "shanda" for kj that instead of a nice chuppah picture in the local papers tomorrow, it'll be a beardless kid in handcuffs who wasn't even there.

At least your children can see the better society where you are smoking pot

95

 Jun 08, 2009 at 10:48 PM Anonymous Says:

the rebbes bow to Arafat and Ahmadijenabad and the chasidim have become Palestinians.

96

 Jun 08, 2009 at 10:44 PM Anonymous Says:

Mazel Tov to most of the blogers here you finnally have a oprutunity when the satmar kj sliped and you all got alive this is nothing more then SINAS AM HOORETZ LTALMID CHUCHEM I can tell that most if not all yidishe comunities can not compare to kj not with chesed in this little comunity their is evrey chesed org. U can think of so MAZEL TOV to u that they made your day

97

 Jun 08, 2009 at 10:53 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #84  
Anonymous Says:

If a licensed electrician was at the event and showed what he did was up to the National Electrical Code, the matter would've ended right then and there. If it isn't up to code, the utility, the fire marshall and the cops would all have every right, and obligation to shut down any non-conforming wiring. The power distribution grid is known for having localized failures cause cascading failures.

If you can say, the bochur who did this is a licensed electrician OR did this under the supervision of a licensed electrician then you've got a leg to stand on. Can you say whether this was a "wye" or a "delta" power distribution setup? Are the transformers connected phase-to-phase, or phase-to-neutral? Were the lights connected to a PDU (a "distro" as we call it)? What about grounding? Did they meter the phase legs before they connected the loads?

I'm an electrical engineer by training. I've got a very healthy respect for electricity. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt if you can show that someone who knows what they're doing was there.

This could've been easily avoided. Rent a generator and some light trusses, like they use for concerts.


Excuse me, did I make any claims or assumptions about this person? I did not. Therefore I don't have to show anything. You're the one who claimed that there was a danger of fire, therefore it's up to you to show that the person who put these things up didn't know what he was doing. (And don't tell me you're not the same anonymous person who made that claim; by posting as "anonymous" you take responsibility for every other post under that name. If you don't like it, don't post anonymously.)

98

 Jun 08, 2009 at 10:54 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #88  
Anonymous Says:

Thats why so many of us are so outraged. Just as happened over shabbos at the parking lot in in yerushalayim, the Gerer and Satmer rabbonim seem to be terrified of these bums and are afraid to interfere.

Mah inyan Ger etzel Har Sinai?

99

 Jun 08, 2009 at 10:55 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #91  
esther Says:

mh,this is a quite a stretch.please!

What's a stretch? That someone who does something knows what they're doing? By you that's a stretch?!

100

 Jun 08, 2009 at 10:56 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #89  
Anonymous Says:

Even if they were electrical engineers, it is illegal to hang anything from utility poles in New York without approval. We don't want every "litte rebbele" in the words of a prior posting deciding what rules will apply to his chassidim and which don't. And don't post your usual gibberish about there is nothing in the Torah about hanging lights from utility poles and since yiddin are only subject to halacha the O&R rules don't apply to them.

What's any of that got to do with whether it's a fire hazard?

101

 Jun 09, 2009 at 05:41 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #50  
Anonymous Says:

Isn't it stealing when you hook-up lights to utility pole?

They were HANGING on the poles, they get plugged in on the end to private electric.

102

 Jun 09, 2009 at 05:39 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #36  
Anonymous Says:

BRAVO!!! I didn't hear such true words in a long time. I always knew the fine point of satmar-hearts of Chessed- and finally somebody brought out.

Ppl, the chupa was beautiful. Todays afternoon activity is long forgotten. The beirach moshe was here and the hisoirris was exceptionally high. We hopefully poyeld alas gits!

Let's enjoy the rest of the chassunah!

"The beirach moshe was here and the hisoirris was exceptionally high. "

It's about time they finally let him go to a chasunah.

103

 Jun 09, 2009 at 05:37 AM me Says:

Reply to #34  
Anonymous Says:

Why are they climbing on utility poles - there's 2400 to 7200 volts up there (and that's assuming it's in the residential grid)! Apart from the danger of falling they're in serious danger of electrocution - unless you're a trained linesman you should stay on the ground and away from power lines.

The 7,000-15,000 line is at the top of the pole with the heavy porcelein insulators. Everything coming out of the transformers is 110 single phase or three phase. The light are way below the transformers and probably just make the 12 foot minimum height above a walkway required by NEC. That's still 20-30 feet below the high voltage lines.

104

 Jun 09, 2009 at 05:31 AM me Says:

Reply to #16  
shmuli Says:

& if the decorative lights would have created a fire??? what a sconah!! lets just think, what would have happened had the zionist oppressors ( ZAHAL) had tried to remove the illegal lights???

i just cant believe that our religeon that is being hijacked by taliban style sects, is so machmir on the little things, & yet so maykil on things like chillul hashem,

"& if the decorative lights would have created a fire??? "

And if a 747 would have fallen on the wedding procession???

"What if " doesn't count when "what if" didn't happen. You're just trying to paint the worst case scenario and it hasn't happened in 25 years and there's no reason to expect it to happen now. You think this is the first time a Rebbe made a chasunah?? These things are all over Monsey, brooklyn, Skverr, etc. They get put up a few days before and they get packed away after sheva brochos.

"What would have happened if you were born with brains???
I wouldn't have to answer your foolish comment.

105

 Jun 09, 2009 at 02:10 AM True Story Says:

The story is like this ...the last couple of nights the boochirim are putting up lights in front of the shul for the chasunah Yossel Waldman who lives across the street called O@R the electric company that boochirim are doing dangerous things O@R came and took of the lights so the boochirim kept on putting it back.today when O@R came again after Yossel called them the boochirim got angry and they threw eggs on them they called the troopers when the troopers came they pointed on a group of boochirim the troopers started to go to that direction the boochirim started to run one lady trooper tripped and fell so she got more angry and started runing after one particalar boocher the boocher ran across the road to grand food market there she caught him and arrested him clamiming that he pushed a baricaid so she should fall

106

 Jun 09, 2009 at 02:01 AM Proud to live in KJ Says:

Reply to #74  
Anonymous Says:

I've been stuck in traffic on the Thruway several times erev shabbos and have checked in to the Hilton near the Tappan zee bridge. The hotel was very helpful in arranging meals for shabbos. The last place I would go is KJ and today's incident shows why. This is not the first time they have behaved this way towards the police. When its the rebbe's yahrtzeit and the NYS Police were tying to control the crowds at the Cemetery, there was pushing and shoving and refusal to obey the police orders. They believe they are only responsible to hashem and not subject to civil law.

You are speaking lots of shtisim ...does not sound like you travel at all and of course you were never stuck in traffic erev shabbos because KJ is 40 miles north of the Tappan Zee bridge and if you would of atleast said that you went in to monsey for shabbos you would make some scence but I guess you don't have

107

 Jun 09, 2009 at 02:00 AM Anonymous Says:

why this RAGE all the time?

108

 Jun 09, 2009 at 01:56 AM Vinor Goen Says:

Reply to #70  
Anonymous Says:

now you know why the heliger vilna gaon was against chassidus.

Why the wilner goen was against chasidus I don't know but why you are against chsidus I think I know

109

 Jun 09, 2009 at 01:48 AM formerkj Says:

Reply to #94  
Anonymous Says:

At least your children can see the better society where you are smoking pot

Riiiiiiigggghhhht....smoking pot...hmmm..interesting analogy. The only pot my kids know about is the one I cook them cholent and soup in every week. You automatically assume that if you leave the holy confines of shtetel, you are modern, drug dealing, etc. I'm probably more chasidish than you, but with a proper english. That's the problem with kj, some are so closeminded that they believe anything but their way is a goy! Wake up and smell the world. You need to get out more and maybe you should watch out for that "smoking pot".....it's starting to burn! Or maybe that's just the wiring on the electric signs.............

110

 Jun 09, 2009 at 01:23 AM talking shtisim Says:

Reply to #74  
Anonymous Says:

I've been stuck in traffic on the Thruway several times erev shabbos and have checked in to the Hilton near the Tappan zee bridge. The hotel was very helpful in arranging meals for shabbos. The last place I would go is KJ and today's incident shows why. This is not the first time they have behaved this way towards the police. When its the rebbe's yahrtzeit and the NYS Police were tying to control the crowds at the Cemetery, there was pushing and shoving and refusal to obey the police orders. They believe they are only responsible to hashem and not subject to civil law.

i dont know where you were stuck couple of times erev shabbos but KJ is about 40 miles from the Tappan Zee bridge and its north and Tappan Zee bridge is south of KJ 40 miles so you are sucking out stories from your finger and hashem should help you should not be stuck by exit 16 on the thruway because you will have to be on the mercy from this KJ people

111

 Jun 09, 2009 at 01:11 AM Anonymous Says:

What's a difference whoever wasn't there missed a beautiful wedding. There was no room in the Beis medrish. The Rebbe's Mitzvah tantz was gorgeous. And all jealous cats knock your head in the nearest wall to get your senses back.

112

 Jun 09, 2009 at 12:48 AM Megahouse Says:

Reply to #71  
Milhouse Says:

Nice theoretical discussion of what might happen in some hypothetical situation. But what makes you think there was a danger of fire in THIS instance? What makes you think that whoever installed these lights didn't know what they were doing?

"What makes you think that whoever installed these lights didn't know what they were doing?"
You finally broke me up, Milhouse. Satmar chasidim - and they might know what they are doing! Keep on truckin', Milhouse. You made my day.

113

 Jun 09, 2009 at 05:51 AM me Says:

Reply to #64  
stealing Says:

Yes its stealing I pitty you because there are 2 things what will keep you from sleep One is Chilul Hashem and the Second one is stealing I hope you davend minchah already

Thank you for answering a question and demonstrating that you are a Golem. A chochum answers "I do not know" when he doesn't know. You posken it's stealing because you've never seen chasanuh lights before. There plugged in at the end to somebody's porch. They do not get wired to the pole. Telling loshon hora (lies) is something for which you also go to hell.
-Nesiyah Tova

114

 Jun 09, 2009 at 05:47 AM me Says:

Reply to #53  
Anonymous Says:

Any insulator eventually breaks down in conditions of enough voltage and current. The current flow then increases dramatically - this is often seen as a spark. Although wood is a good insulator, the resistance is dependent upon the density and type of wood. A violin is a very thin structure - not like the dense woods used in the utility poles (or the oak they used to use for the electric chair). It's entirely possible there's enough current and voltage to arc and cause a fire, especially dangerous if people are nearby.

Thank you for demonstrating your ignorance for all to see.
1) The decorative hanging violins are not made of wood.
2) They are not connected to anything higher than the 110v household current where they are plugged in.
3) Rebbes have been doing this for decades and I do ot believe there is a single incident of fire or electracution.
4) When wood gets wet it conducts just fine.
5) The lights and decorations weren't anywhere near the High voltage lines.
6) You don't live in Monsey, Brooklyn, Skverr, or Monroe, because you have obviously never seen chasunah lights in your life.

115

 Jun 09, 2009 at 12:37 AM Anonymous Says:

what's with all of you? as the saying goes " with friends like these...." we can say " with yiden like these who needs anti-semites?" and then you turn around and say " hashem send us moshiach?" why should he when this is how we behave? one yid towards the other? and why should the goyim be any different towards us if we talk like this? if you really want moshiach to come, show hashem by behaving the way we're supposed to

116

 Jun 09, 2009 at 12:30 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #80  
Anonymous Says:

The issue here is NOT Satmar, NOT the simcha, and NOT KJ.

The issue is that someone started playing around high voltage / high current installations. Let's say there are 20 houses on that leg of the distribution grid. Keeping the math simple (I'll eliminate root mean square RMS and peak to peak AC for the people who don't understand), if each house has 100 amp service at 240 volts, that means 10 amps at 2400 volts per house, or 200 amps at 2400 volts for that branch. That's a lot, and I mean a LOT of electricity.

Look, everyone's entitled to act foolish once in a while, and I'm not going to give a bochur a black eye for having a bit of fun at a simcha. This wasn't fun. This was stupidity of the highest order. A fire could have started or people could be killed (C"V).

If anyone is thinking about hanging something on a utility pole, DON'T. You may lose your life, or endanger someone else's. Don't blame the cops or the utility - this is a matter of public safety for everyone.

They dident use the elctric pole they used the "street light pole".only to hang there decorative bulbs.

117

 Jun 08, 2009 at 11:47 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #97  
Milhouse Says:

Excuse me, did I make any claims or assumptions about this person? I did not. Therefore I don't have to show anything. You're the one who claimed that there was a danger of fire, therefore it's up to you to show that the person who put these things up didn't know what he was doing. (And don't tell me you're not the same anonymous person who made that claim; by posting as "anonymous" you take responsibility for every other post under that name. If you don't like it, don't post anonymously.)

I was nowhere near the event in question, and cannot make any observations except what is posted here in this thread.

What I see is that the article says "decorative lights were strung from poles without permission".

This can mean one of two things - either the lights were merely strung from the utility poles OR the lights were both strung from the poles and illuminated by tapping into the pole power.

Scenario #1 - someone is climbing on utility poles near 2400 volt lines to string the lights. This person can fall or accidentally touch the power lines, the transformer, or the drop to the nearest house. Multiple potential injury scenarios here. How powerful are the lights? High wattage lights = heat = fire risk. How are the lights being attached? Proper rigging, or being nailed up? Did someone do a physical load calculation? What condition are the insulators on the pole? What about the potential for a ground loop from the house line feeding the lights to the actual power network? Also potential for heat, shock, fire and death.

Scenario #2 - same as above, except someone is tapping into the power lines themselves to power the lights. There's no breaker or disconnect except at the substation - if you're working on the power lines out in a residential neighborhood you've got to know enough to handle things properly to avoid being electrocuted. That's why the utilities have linemen to do such things, and that's why there are electricians. Anyone else who plays with this sort of electrical work is literally playing with death.

Sorry you don't like that I post anonymously. It's my choice, but my comments are my own and I don't take responsibility for any other anonymous poster. I prefer to post anonymously. End of discussion about that.

Let me reiterate that I am NOT bashing KJ, Satmar, the simcha, or anyone, Yiddisher or Goyish. My only problem is with someone who either through innocence or sheer stupidity could have caused a much bigger problem.

This whole thing could have been prevented by either renting a generator and lights (it's an outdoor simcha, right?) or by calling an electrician to just supervise and to talk with the utility and the cops.

I'm done on this subject.

118

 Jun 08, 2009 at 11:32 PM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #95  
Anonymous Says:

the rebbes bow to Arafat and Ahmadijenabad and the chasidim have become Palestinians.

Huh? Do you have any idea what you're talking about? When has a satmar rebbe (or any rebbe for that matter) done any such thing?

119

 Jun 09, 2009 at 07:03 AM a Says:

Remember, how this group put up a grand bais hamedrash in 2 weeks!!!(Amid multiple calls to the municipalities about serious violations by the same group who probably called here as well) besides they use these electric lines all the time by big outdoor events, I'd still punish that bucher who made a huge chilul hashem

120

 Jun 09, 2009 at 07:06 AM a Says:

Remember, how this group put up a grand bais hamedrash in 2 weeks!!!(Amid multiple calls to the municipalities about serious violations by the same group who probably called here as well) besides they use these electric lines all the time by big outdoor events, I'd still punish that bucher who made a huge chilul hashem

121

 Jun 08, 2009 at 11:36 PM POSAK Says:

Reply to #6  
Ich Zug Says:

Zul Yeder Aheim Gein..Vus iz geshein tzi di Tekunes??
Why are the rebbes allowed to have grand wedding? Let everyone go home and only the immediate family should enjoy the festivities.

Zei Magin Huben Alaz .Ven de vast dich mashadech zein, mit a rebbisha mishpuchu vest dee huben vifel lamp dee vist. FARSHTIST

122

 Jun 08, 2009 at 11:27 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #61  
cp Says:

Why is everyone so quick to say "stop bashing satmar"? Stop being paranoid! We're outraged because these are frumme yidden who make a shande!

everyone is quick to bash Satmar because they are the most intolerant of the bunch. after the world publically (via the UN) declared the formation of a Jewish State, the Satmar would not accept this gift from Hakodesh Boruch Ho, and were persistant to bash it. it is the Satmar to thank for the creation of the Niturei Karta morons who publicly meet with Sonai Yisrael and wave the Palestinian flag to support our enemies. it is the Satmar who believe that they know what Hakodesh Boruch Ho really wants even though we see Nisim and Niflaot in Eretz Yisrael and Medinat Yisrael on a daily basis, miracles brought only through the power of the almighty, Neged HaTeva. however the Satmar excel in Chilul Hashem, just look at the youtube collection of the public civil lawsuits between the "Rebbes", the fights between brothers and the hooliganism in honor of the wedding of "nobility"

123

 Jun 08, 2009 at 11:17 PM A Golus Yid Says:

Reply to #80  
Anonymous Says:

The issue here is NOT Satmar, NOT the simcha, and NOT KJ.

The issue is that someone started playing around high voltage / high current installations. Let's say there are 20 houses on that leg of the distribution grid. Keeping the math simple (I'll eliminate root mean square RMS and peak to peak AC for the people who don't understand), if each house has 100 amp service at 240 volts, that means 10 amps at 2400 volts per house, or 200 amps at 2400 volts for that branch. That's a lot, and I mean a LOT of electricity.

Look, everyone's entitled to act foolish once in a while, and I'm not going to give a bochur a black eye for having a bit of fun at a simcha. This wasn't fun. This was stupidity of the highest order. A fire could have started or people could be killed (C"V).

If anyone is thinking about hanging something on a utility pole, DON'T. You may lose your life, or endanger someone else's. Don't blame the cops or the utility - this is a matter of public safety for everyone.

To me, the issue is not Satmar, not the simcha, not KAJ, and certainly not how much chesed Satmar does, and not the electricity. To me, the issue is why frum kids would react this way to any provocation, real or not. I don't know any frum kids who would start throwing things at anyone, let alone police or utility workers. Now, in one week, we hear about it in Yerushalayim and here. I know it's not the first time it ever happened, but I don't understand it at all. There is something wrong with the chinuch, no matter what branch they belong to!

124

 Jun 08, 2009 at 11:08 PM Anonymous Says:

(Reply to 83) I wrote 68, I'm not talking in particular about todays story, I'm talking about chasidus in general.

Look what chasidus became in this days, tell me that I'm wrong

125

 Jun 09, 2009 at 07:27 AM Anonymous Says:

After 125 postings there is still one basic point that no one disagrees with. These bochurim had no authorization to hang the lights for a private party. Had they requested such approval in advance, as normal people do in other cities, the local utility would typically have someone from their community relations office come out with one or two lineman to assure it is done safely. That was not done here because the Satmer believe they are not subject to the rules applicable to everyone else.

As long as they continue to behave this way, they will suffer, their bochurim will be jailed and their institutions will be greeted with skepticism when they seek zoning changes. Once they agree to play by the rules and subordinate themselves to the applicable laws and regulations the rest of us live by, they can prosper. If their leaders (whomever they are) cannot or will no control these bochurim who create these incidents than the police will increasingly intervene.

126

 Jun 09, 2009 at 07:39 AM annonymousdude1@gmail.com Says:

Reply to #70  
Anonymous Says:

now you know why the heliger vilna gaon was against chassidus.

was the heliger vilna gaon againt Ahavas Yisroel too??

127

 Jun 09, 2009 at 07:44 AM tzirel Says:

Reply to #94  
Anonymous Says:

At least your children can see the better society where you are smoking pot

And who said that if u live in kj there is no pot ask anyone there is more drugs by the chasidim than anywhere else cuz they were closed into a box and now they are coming out to see the world

128

 Jun 09, 2009 at 08:25 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #27  
Anonymous Says:

the other side of the story:
I was there and this is what I tell you guys.
First, there is an extra 0 in the report, there were only 20 boys not 200
1 bottle flew on a car from a young shtinker, the police didn't even see anything, it was a incident that many people walked by and didn't even stop to see what's going on. some kids on the block were standing like they come to every emergency call.
it can happen anytime you get teen agers upset. not that it's right but to make a news story out of it, give me a break
this comes from someone who is really jealous on this happy day. we all saw him and know who it is, he went to make pictures of police standing next to a car, sent it to all news blogs and there you go. I can all assure you that Der Yid will write a 6 page article this week about 25 troopers coverd with eggs under the direct order of the ruv of kj etc etc.
to call this a mini riot with trowing eggs is a huge overstatement. so all of you KJ haters, get bak to work or whatever you have or dont have to acomplish.

anyway, I see tons of people walking to the Chupa I don't want to be late.
Each wedding in Satmar is exciting, someone who was never there can never understand the joy and happiness we are filled with on such a day.

i was also there.put back the 0!ther were many bottels and eggs flying,
the boys were screaming NAZIS NAZIS
waht a chillil hasem
do they think eliminating a few lights will make there rebbe to be nothing ? this is what makes a rebbe lights.? i guess the lights and signs are all he has

129

 Jun 09, 2009 at 08:10 AM Anonymous Says:

How interesting, whenever Satmar blows up you hear about the chesed they do, but in the same time they can't get along within their own circles, for the past decade Satmar rules when it comes to Chilul Hashem, inside fighting is going on for years, every second day another story in the news, I can't think of any other Chasidus that caused such Chilul Hashem in the last 25 years, so if they are true Balei Chesed why not at home? charity begins at home!! continue your battles in secular courts which is no big deal if you compare it to the grave sin of voting in Israel or by going to the Kosel R"L. and leave us alone with your Chesed..

130

 Jun 09, 2009 at 08:06 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #70  
Anonymous Says:

now you know why the heliger vilna gaon was against chassidus.

"now you know why the heliger vilna gaon was against chassidus.”

NO. that is not true. THe VG, tz'l, was not against "chassidus"; he was against certain chassideshe rabbonim who had created personality cults that detracted from a focus on serving hashem. He acknowledged that certain chassidic rabbonim were at the same madregah as Litvashe rabbonim and did not oppose chassidism in the abstract.

131

 Jun 09, 2009 at 07:59 AM I Love you to Says:

Reply to #125  
Anonymous Says:

After 125 postings there is still one basic point that no one disagrees with. These bochurim had no authorization to hang the lights for a private party. Had they requested such approval in advance, as normal people do in other cities, the local utility would typically have someone from their community relations office come out with one or two lineman to assure it is done safely. That was not done here because the Satmer believe they are not subject to the rules applicable to everyone else.

As long as they continue to behave this way, they will suffer, their bochurim will be jailed and their institutions will be greeted with skepticism when they seek zoning changes. Once they agree to play by the rules and subordinate themselves to the applicable laws and regulations the rest of us live by, they can prosper. If their leaders (whomever they are) cannot or will no control these bochurim who create these incidents than the police will increasingly intervene.

I love you to ...and hashem should help you should not know from pain anymore

132

 Jun 09, 2009 at 09:16 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #36  
Anonymous Says:

BRAVO!!! I didn't hear such true words in a long time. I always knew the fine point of satmar-hearts of Chessed- and finally somebody brought out.

Ppl, the chupa was beautiful. Todays afternoon activity is long forgotten. The beirach moshe was here and the hisoirris was exceptionally high. We hopefully poyeld alas gits!

Let's enjoy the rest of the chassunah!

The beirach moshe was here

How did he look?

133

 Jun 09, 2009 at 09:12 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #128  
Anonymous Says:

i was also there.put back the 0!ther were many bottels and eggs flying,
the boys were screaming NAZIS NAZIS
waht a chillil hasem
do they think eliminating a few lights will make there rebbe to be nothing ? this is what makes a rebbe lights.? i guess the lights and signs are all he has

Plus tens of thousands of chasidim ...plus torah that does not matter by you plus yiras shumayim that you don't care for plus siyate dishmaya which you wish yo will have plus chesed which is the first thing our helige rabbi ztzl taught us and we won't move from his shita and the rabbi shlita should lead us till moshiach comes and takes us out from this goolos

134

 Jun 09, 2009 at 09:11 AM Anonymous Says:

i want to make one importent point clear. yes there were always lights by every wedding from the satmar rebbes in KJ. but the lights were hanging on poles which was put in from the "askunim" not on the O&R poles. but since last year when the KJ village made new sidwalks on the main streets, they had to take away the "heimishe" poles. so the buchrim tought they can hang the lights on the utility poles. so it was a simple error.

but when the company came to tell them to take it off "a night before the incident" they got blocked and had to call in police, so then it was a "nitzuchen" fight with the company and the buchrim. stupid move on the village for not telling the buchrim that no one can fight the police, and the same has to be said on the yeashiva menahalim: where were u when u were needed to talk to the buchrim?

i was there and it was there "over" 200 buchrim who stupiditly tought they can fight with the state police.

135

 Jun 09, 2009 at 09:09 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #55  
a chusid Says:

I have 1 question to ask is anyone that bashes and cries here aware that theese lights have been used in KJ for the last 20 years by every wedding etc. And O&R never had a problem with it till someone had to call them today and to say something, so please before u cry just listen to a diff. Side of the coin. And don't be "a self hating jew"

It doesn't matter sir, this is not an excuse to fight with O&R and the police and make a chilul hashem.

136

 Jun 09, 2009 at 09:05 AM KJ Man Says:

Reply to #129  
Anonymous Says:

How interesting, whenever Satmar blows up you hear about the chesed they do, but in the same time they can't get along within their own circles, for the past decade Satmar rules when it comes to Chilul Hashem, inside fighting is going on for years, every second day another story in the news, I can't think of any other Chasidus that caused such Chilul Hashem in the last 25 years, so if they are true Balei Chesed why not at home? charity begins at home!! continue your battles in secular courts which is no big deal if you compare it to the grave sin of voting in Israel or by going to the Kosel R"L. and leave us alone with your Chesed..

We leave you alone with our chesed actualy you are the one that comes to us to help you ....

137

 Jun 09, 2009 at 08:57 AM A not so outsider Says:

Reply to #19  
formerkj Says:

They actually minimized it. My sister witnessed the whole scene...They took off a violin citing open wires which could lead to fire. It was put right back on as soon as they left. The workers returned with a police escort this time and within 5 minutes, after repeatedly trying to remove the barricades peacefully with hundreds of young boys who should have been in Yeshiva shouting boo, they were pelted with eggs. One policewoman spotted one of the throwers and gave chase. When she caught him, he wrestled out of her grasp, causing her to fall flat on her face and injuring herself. He was chased by many officers by then into Grand Food Market where he was ultimately arrested. The only detail they got wrong was that they described him as a man, but he's only a boy, probably no more than 15-16. What kind of good can come out of this? Those cheering on the bochur, shame on you! Let me see you take money out of your pocket to help with his legal fund. Maybe instead of letting the kids out early today for the big event, they should instead sponsor a class in basic manners, how to avoid the cops, and what to do when you get arrested. ohhhhh...and mazel tov to the rebbe!

#19 you couldn't be any more right!
I understand the behind the scenes of Takanus and I do understand the regality of a Rebbe's chasuna but there can't be two worlds. You have to practice what you preach and to have a glorious chasuna that gets out of hand is uncalled for. A child (15-16 is not of majority yet) is supposed to be under care of a parent or care taker a.k.a. Menahelim, Rebbe's, Dorm Madrichim, etc. not to run amuck! This child will now have to deal with the consequences and with due right (for the shallow person's thinking would be 'shidduchim' oy!). He did wrong and there is no reason to cat call after his 'heroics'. It was downright stupid of him and those in charge of him.
As for using utility polls for gala light shows, there are rules, believe it or not! There are ways to go about doing the same exact thing you planned on with the violin(s) and lighting- it's called PERMITS people! Do it right and you solve the issues with authorities and possible dangers to the public. Electricity is set with safety standards for a reason and if you do not do it right there can be a surge of electrons (negative energy which gives us light) that can do more harm than good. If the towns people worked it right (or maybe wrong in this matter) we would have another August 15th blackout because of your thoughtlessness and carelessness. It could have caused more ouch- than ooh's and aah's of your creations. Please think before you do, and do it right, the workers were keeping you safe not killing your joy! Chasuna's should be safe and fun; not possible dangers and certainly not chilul Hashem- don't we have enough of that already?!

138

 Jun 09, 2009 at 08:43 AM mayer Says:

Remember allways say that the police are the ones that made the chilul hashem and blame nobody else but them.

139

 Jun 09, 2009 at 08:41 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #6  
Ich Zug Says:

Zul Yeder Aheim Gein..Vus iz geshein tzi di Tekunes??
Why are the rebbes allowed to have grand wedding? Let everyone go home and only the immediate family should enjoy the festivities.

Sorry but your talking nonsence how would you like by your childrens weddings to have only immidiet family

140

 Jun 09, 2009 at 08:40 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #128  
Anonymous Says:

i was also there.put back the 0!ther were many bottels and eggs flying,
the boys were screaming NAZIS NAZIS
waht a chillil hasem
do they think eliminating a few lights will make there rebbe to be nothing ? this is what makes a rebbe lights.? i guess the lights and signs are all he has

All of those who bash those KJ kids about hanging the lights on utility poles: FOR YOUR INFO, they hung it onto the street lights. And for the past 25 yrs no one made a damn. It took 25 yrs for yossel waldman to wake up cuz his party was a total failure now the past week.

This whole incident was one big effect of an action called REVENGE.

And to all those self-hating jews: listen to the other side of the story before posting ur senseless comments.

141

 Jun 09, 2009 at 09:26 AM Tzaddik misnaged Says:

#125,123, You are 100% correct!122,good point.49,46,60 and those who share your sentiments,I'm with you. I do know Satmar Chassidim and those I know are fine people. The hooligans make them look bad. Remember,the way they dress represents something and the world is always watching (so is HKB"H)No matter how much good they do,the bad does not become botttul,nullified by good deeds. Rob Yoseph to help Shimon-.Is that kosher? Does the Torah allow one to sin if he does good deeds? Or is this a chassidic minhag,that the rebbe will wipe away the sins of his followers?

142

 Jun 09, 2009 at 09:22 AM yenta Says:

There is a cute (and true) story about the origin of these "lekterlech".

R' Hershele Spinker ztz"l and the Ashau'er Rav ztz"l were brothers in law.

Once at a Spinker chasuna, with lekters all strung out, Ashau'er Rav asks Spinker Rebbe, what is the significance of these lekterlech, and Spinker Rebbe explains to him the whole "inyan".

So, Ashau'er Rav thinks to himself, well if it's an inyan, then I should also be doing it.

By the next wedding of a child of Ashau'er Rav, he also was mekayyem the inyan.

He connected an extension wire and hung out a bulb in his back-yard.

Z'chusom yogain aleinu

143

 Jun 09, 2009 at 09:42 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #5  
cranberry stuffer Says:

Bucherim! boys will be boys. u make me proud!

keep stuffing yourself with cranberries and keep your unjust comments to yourself!I hope you don't have children of your own,or teach children because you sound like you would be an awful role model!!

144

 Jun 09, 2009 at 09:29 AM knowitall Says:

Maybe, if they were alowed some sports playing, they would not need this disgusting outburst as an outlet.

145

 Jun 09, 2009 at 10:12 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #144  
knowitall Says:

Maybe, if they were alowed some sports playing, they would not need this disgusting outburst as an outlet.

that's y the sporters are so peaceful...

146

 Jun 09, 2009 at 10:06 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #113  
me Says:

Thank you for answering a question and demonstrating that you are a Golem. A chochum answers "I do not know" when he doesn't know. You posken it's stealing because you've never seen chasanuh lights before. There plugged in at the end to somebody's porch. They do not get wired to the pole. Telling loshon hora (lies) is something for which you also go to hell.
-Nesiyah Tova

Stealing was sarcastic. Wake up, me!

147

 Jun 09, 2009 at 10:01 AM Common sense Says:

Reply to #55  
a chusid Says:

I have 1 question to ask is anyone that bashes and cries here aware that theese lights have been used in KJ for the last 20 years by every wedding etc. And O&R never had a problem with it till someone had to call them today and to say something, so please before u cry just listen to a diff. Side of the coin. And don't be "a self hating jew"

And years ago no one wore seat belts, so you don't have to wear seat belts right? They didn't come to remove these lights because they hate Jews. They came because of the danger -that is why they have this policy. The chillul Hashem is that your mentality is like this, not that one or two buchrim acted up. Maybe you shouldn't live in a town with only yidden because you start forgetting we are in golus. Stop thinking that the only thing in Judaism is your Levush -how you act is much more important! Also, stop screaming Anti-semitism - everyone knows Eisav sonei L'Yakkov, but this kind of behavior is just adding fuel to the fire. Stop making excuses for this kind of behaviour and start doing the right thing!

148

 Jun 09, 2009 at 09:57 AM midwest Says:

Reply to #93  
Anonymous Says:

what's the name of the bucher and his mother to say thilim that he shoud be released from jail

Say tehillim for him???? Are you kidding me? The kid messed up, he will get a slap on the wrist and learn from his mistakes. How about we say tehillim for sick children r'l or other cases that are serious. A kid gets kicked out of class for misbehaving does not get my rachmanus nor will a punk who throws a bottle at a policeman get it.

149

 Jun 09, 2009 at 10:16 AM fzr Says:

Reply to #113  
me Says:

Thank you for answering a question and demonstrating that you are a Golem. A chochum answers "I do not know" when he doesn't know. You posken it's stealing because you've never seen chasanuh lights before. There plugged in at the end to somebody's porch. They do not get wired to the pole. Telling loshon hora (lies) is something for which you also go to hell.
-Nesiyah Tova

Stealing was sarcastic. I wonder how you didnt notice?

150

 Jun 09, 2009 at 11:00 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #74  
Anonymous Says:

I've been stuck in traffic on the Thruway several times erev shabbos and have checked in to the Hilton near the Tappan zee bridge. The hotel was very helpful in arranging meals for shabbos. The last place I would go is KJ and today's incident shows why. This is not the first time they have behaved this way towards the police. When its the rebbe's yahrtzeit and the NYS Police were tying to control the crowds at the Cemetery, there was pushing and shoving and refusal to obey the police orders. They believe they are only responsible to hashem and not subject to civil law.

If you've been stuck several times on erev shabbos it seems to me that you are in the habit of travelling too close to shabbos. In any event, it is a good thing you didn't go to KJ as KJ is not near the Tappan Zee and you would have been mechalel shabbos. I was stuck on the 17 erev shabbos a couple of years back when there was extremely unusual traffic going to the Catskills. Satmar chasidim were standing at the side of the highway directing frum jews to homes in KJ where they were put up for shabbos. They must have put up hundreds of jews that shabbos all without prior notice. I can assure you that I had a more spiritually uplifting shabbos there then you ever had stuck in your room at the Hilton.

151

 Jun 09, 2009 at 11:42 AM Hisgarus Be'Imos Says:

I guess hisgarus Be'Imos only applies to those who never learned Torah and never
heard about such an Issur but doesn't apply to those who think of themselves as holier than though.

152

 Jun 09, 2009 at 12:20 PM avremele Says:

"Legit" complaint??? Just as legitimate as the 311 calls when the Hooper B"M was being built.

153

 Jun 09, 2009 at 12:24 PM avremele Says:

Reply to #137  
A not so outsider Says:

#19 you couldn't be any more right!
I understand the behind the scenes of Takanus and I do understand the regality of a Rebbe's chasuna but there can't be two worlds. You have to practice what you preach and to have a glorious chasuna that gets out of hand is uncalled for. A child (15-16 is not of majority yet) is supposed to be under care of a parent or care taker a.k.a. Menahelim, Rebbe's, Dorm Madrichim, etc. not to run amuck! This child will now have to deal with the consequences and with due right (for the shallow person's thinking would be 'shidduchim' oy!). He did wrong and there is no reason to cat call after his 'heroics'. It was downright stupid of him and those in charge of him.
As for using utility polls for gala light shows, there are rules, believe it or not! There are ways to go about doing the same exact thing you planned on with the violin(s) and lighting- it's called PERMITS people! Do it right and you solve the issues with authorities and possible dangers to the public. Electricity is set with safety standards for a reason and if you do not do it right there can be a surge of electrons (negative energy which gives us light) that can do more harm than good. If the towns people worked it right (or maybe wrong in this matter) we would have another August 15th blackout because of your thoughtlessness and carelessness. It could have caused more ouch- than ooh's and aah's of your creations. Please think before you do, and do it right, the workers were keeping you safe not killing your joy! Chasuna's should be safe and fun; not possible dangers and certainly not chilul Hashem- don't we have enough of that already?!

Do you realize that all the chassidim want to be a part of the rebbe's simcha.

BTW, the chasunah started and ended according to the takunes. (With the posssible exception of the mitzva tantz. Bentching was on time!)

154

 Jun 09, 2009 at 12:52 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #125  
Anonymous Says:

After 125 postings there is still one basic point that no one disagrees with. These bochurim had no authorization to hang the lights for a private party. Had they requested such approval in advance, as normal people do in other cities, the local utility would typically have someone from their community relations office come out with one or two lineman to assure it is done safely. That was not done here because the Satmer believe they are not subject to the rules applicable to everyone else.

As long as they continue to behave this way, they will suffer, their bochurim will be jailed and their institutions will be greeted with skepticism when they seek zoning changes. Once they agree to play by the rules and subordinate themselves to the applicable laws and regulations the rest of us live by, they can prosper. If their leaders (whomever they are) cannot or will no control these bochurim who create these incidents than the police will increasingly intervene.

U look like the guy that does evreythinh right %100 kosher can I see maybe your tax returns?

155

 Jun 09, 2009 at 12:43 PM Big Masmid Says:

Reply to #28  
Freyer Yid Says:

All you Satmar bashers:

Remember, that Satmar is the very largest Jewish group in the world.

This means that every once in awhile, a few of their tens of thousands of bochurim, or young men, will mess up and do something stupid.

Then you all jump on Satmar.

When you study the numbers and statistics, you will see they are some of the very best behaved people on the globe.

And.... those Satmar Chossids are there for YOU, as they are there for ANY JEW who needs help. There is no Jewish group ready to dig into their not to deep pockets, spending their last dime to help strangers. And, they ask nothing in return. They don't ask you to sit down and learn what their rebbe said. They don't try to convert you to Satmar. They don't even try to make you religious.
If you ask for help, they are there for you. No strings attached.

And they are the most bashed and maligned group in the Jewish community.... All because their views on the State of Israel don't match what we expect or want them to be. Why should Satmar not have the right to their opinions without being hated for them..... no group.... and I repeat: NO Jewish Group shows more love for fellow Jews than Satmar does.

Yes, they helped me. I was not religious at all. I am still only shomer shabbos about 1/2 the time. But when they found out my wife needed surgery and I did not have the money for it, they immediately raised the money... in less than 12 hours...
They paid the bill completely, and did not even give me an envelope to return the money. And, they did this eagerly, and with love. They treated me, a man whose kippa was in his pocket, as if I were a well-respected rov.
They spoke to me with respect, and treated me with respect.

I will always respect them.

"when you study the numbers and statistics you will see they are some of the best behaved people on the globe"
Oh really? like when they made a pogrom on Lubavitcher chassidim in 1977
or when they attacked the holy Klausenburge rebbe and chassidim or when they
attacked Belzer chassidim in the 80's or when they terrorized Spinka and the Krula
rav befor WWII or when they used the most foul language in their newspapers against
Agudas Yisroel, Ger, the Chazon Ish, Rabbi Moshe Feinstein and whom not, whoever
didn't agree with their Shitta ( the majority of chareidim) was fair game for terror.
No other group ever behaved like this on a consistent basis so stop with this crap.

156

 Jun 09, 2009 at 12:38 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #129  
Anonymous Says:

How interesting, whenever Satmar blows up you hear about the chesed they do, but in the same time they can't get along within their own circles, for the past decade Satmar rules when it comes to Chilul Hashem, inside fighting is going on for years, every second day another story in the news, I can't think of any other Chasidus that caused such Chilul Hashem in the last 25 years, so if they are true Balei Chesed why not at home? charity begins at home!! continue your battles in secular courts which is no big deal if you compare it to the grave sin of voting in Israel or by going to the Kosel R"L. and leave us alone with your Chesed..

We definetely will leave you alone with our chesed. With Hashem's help, you should never be at our mercy

157

 Jun 09, 2009 at 12:33 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #12  
what is going on there? Says:

If this is true, it is a major chillul Hashem with serious consequences. Whoever is responsible must be held accountable.

This is the Hassidic sect that talks about yodayim yedei eisav??

no its called social activisim expressing ones freedodmof expretion

158

 Jun 09, 2009 at 01:43 PM Anonymous Says:

I think everyone is wondering why KJ is always in the news for not listening to county laws AND why are they the only ONE or TWO groups of people living in the USA who act like a gang with public workers and POLICE!!! certainly no Litvish or most Chasidish bochurim would act with disrespect to a police officer or utility worker (reasons why are too embarrassingly simple to speak out.)
A Chillul Hashem indeed

159

 Jun 09, 2009 at 02:41 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #153  
avremele Says:

Do you realize that all the chassidim want to be a part of the rebbe's simcha.

BTW, the chasunah started and ended according to the takunes. (With the posssible exception of the mitzva tantz. Bentching was on time!)

On the button Tekunas. About Mitzvah tantz nobody asked you to stay there. Officially it's meant for family only,

160

 Jun 09, 2009 at 05:19 PM Anonymous Says:

Why is it that every time VIN prints a story about "Chasidim Gone Wild", it gets over 100 posts while nice stories about some act of tzedakah or an important piece of d'var torah, there are perhaps a dozen posts by the usual suspects who seem to sit by their computer all day waiting to argue with one another on trivia

161

 Jun 09, 2009 at 07:00 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #155  
Big Masmid Says:

"when you study the numbers and statistics you will see they are some of the best behaved people on the globe"
Oh really? like when they made a pogrom on Lubavitcher chassidim in 1977
or when they attacked the holy Klausenburge rebbe and chassidim or when they
attacked Belzer chassidim in the 80's or when they terrorized Spinka and the Krula
rav befor WWII or when they used the most foul language in their newspapers against
Agudas Yisroel, Ger, the Chazon Ish, Rabbi Moshe Feinstein and whom not, whoever
didn't agree with their Shitta ( the majority of chareidim) was fair game for terror.
No other group ever behaved like this on a consistent basis so stop with this crap.

And when one boocher stabbed the other boochir in ponovitz or when one litvishe boocher killed the other and the yeshiva said it was the super

162

 Jun 09, 2009 at 08:47 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #143  
Anonymous Says:

keep stuffing yourself with cranberries and keep your unjust comments to yourself!I hope you don't have children of your own,or teach children because you sound like you would be an awful role model!!

ROOSHA !!!!!
You don't shelt somebody ! Theres no excuse for that remark !!

163

 Jun 09, 2009 at 08:46 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #41  
Mazel Tov Says:

When will everyone learn that you can't have a good time at the expense of others? Playing with electrical lines is literally playing with fire. Besides, teenage boys should be in Yeshiva learning. Enough time gets wasted in the name of holiness when there is a Rebbeshe chasuna. Doesn't anyone have any control in Kiryas Yoel? Nobody noticed their absence from class?

By the way the pols were not open wires there were the light poles and there is no open wires so I don't know what you guys are talk about

164

 Jun 09, 2009 at 09:28 PM Anonymous Says:

Just for all the 160 commenters Grand Food Market deliverd a video tape of the arrest to the police station and that trooper was lying this boochur did not hit her when she tried to arrest him

165

 Jun 10, 2009 at 05:32 AM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #130  
Anonymous Says:

"now you know why the heliger vilna gaon was against chassidus.”

NO. that is not true. THe VG, tz'l, was not against "chassidus"; he was against certain chassideshe rabbonim who had created personality cults that detracted from a focus on serving hashem. He acknowledged that certain chassidic rabbonim were at the same madregah as Litvashe rabbonim and did not oppose chassidism in the abstract.

What a load of garbage. His pronouncements were against the entire movement, not against individuals. His objections were to the entire movement. His cherem was against the entire movement. Name a single chasidisher rebbe whom he acknowledged to be an erlicher yid; you can't, because he did no such thing.

Face it, the Vilner Go'on made a terrible mistake about chasidus. He thought it was a libertine movement that would lead people away from keeping torah and mitzvos, as the Sabbateans and Frankists had done before. He was wrong. When chasidim and misnagdim came together to fight the maskilim, the misnagdim saw that chasidim can learn, and the chasidim saw that misnagdim can be yir'ei shomayim, and that was the end of the machlokes.

166

 Jun 10, 2009 at 05:22 AM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #122  
Anonymous Says:

everyone is quick to bash Satmar because they are the most intolerant of the bunch. after the world publically (via the UN) declared the formation of a Jewish State, the Satmar would not accept this gift from Hakodesh Boruch Ho, and were persistant to bash it. it is the Satmar to thank for the creation of the Niturei Karta morons who publicly meet with Sonai Yisrael and wave the Palestinian flag to support our enemies. it is the Satmar who believe that they know what Hakodesh Boruch Ho really wants even though we see Nisim and Niflaot in Eretz Yisrael and Medinat Yisrael on a daily basis, miracles brought only through the power of the almighty, Neged HaTeva. however the Satmar excel in Chilul Hashem, just look at the youtube collection of the public civil lawsuits between the "Rebbes", the fights between brothers and the hooliganism in honor of the wedding of "nobility"

That's just stupid. What has Satmar got to do with Neturei Karta? NK are not even chasidim, let alone Satmarers?

167

 Jun 10, 2009 at 05:20 AM Milhouse Says:

Reply to #117  
Anonymous Says:

I was nowhere near the event in question, and cannot make any observations except what is posted here in this thread.

What I see is that the article says "decorative lights were strung from poles without permission".

This can mean one of two things - either the lights were merely strung from the utility poles OR the lights were both strung from the poles and illuminated by tapping into the pole power.

Scenario #1 - someone is climbing on utility poles near 2400 volt lines to string the lights. This person can fall or accidentally touch the power lines, the transformer, or the drop to the nearest house. Multiple potential injury scenarios here. How powerful are the lights? High wattage lights = heat = fire risk. How are the lights being attached? Proper rigging, or being nailed up? Did someone do a physical load calculation? What condition are the insulators on the pole? What about the potential for a ground loop from the house line feeding the lights to the actual power network? Also potential for heat, shock, fire and death.

Scenario #2 - same as above, except someone is tapping into the power lines themselves to power the lights. There's no breaker or disconnect except at the substation - if you're working on the power lines out in a residential neighborhood you've got to know enough to handle things properly to avoid being electrocuted. That's why the utilities have linemen to do such things, and that's why there are electricians. Anyone else who plays with this sort of electrical work is literally playing with death.

Sorry you don't like that I post anonymously. It's my choice, but my comments are my own and I don't take responsibility for any other anonymous poster. I prefer to post anonymously. End of discussion about that.

Let me reiterate that I am NOT bashing KJ, Satmar, the simcha, or anyone, Yiddisher or Goyish. My only problem is with someone who either through innocence or sheer stupidity could have caused a much bigger problem.

This whole thing could have been prevented by either renting a generator and lights (it's an outdoor simcha, right?) or by calling an electrician to just supervise and to talk with the utility and the cops.

I'm done on this subject.

Once again, you're assuming that they did something dangerous, without any foundation whatsoever. What makes you think whoever did this didn't know as much as you do about it? Without knowing that, how can you accuse them of risking a fire?

168

 Jun 10, 2009 at 02:23 AM Anonymous Says:

I just went over to check it out
On grfield rd since the village rebuled the street is all the wires underground and there's only street light poles there and don't sell me storys that the stupid light poles is 14000 wt. So if you're dreaming wake up or if you're just talking from SINAH take in afew doses..... And you'll get better iy"h. I promes u

169

 Jun 10, 2009 at 01:39 PM BB Says:

The truth is this was a minor incident blown out of proportion for the sake of notoriety. Rebbishe weddings are always prepared with strung lights, in BP, WB, Monsey, Yeruselayim and KJ as well. The utility companies never bothered before with this and would not have in this situation as well. However, certain individuals from Reb Aron's brother Zalmen Leib' camp ("Zollies") sought to disrupt Reb Arons simcha by complaining to the authorities about unauthorized and dangerous lights on public property. Absent all this, the wedding would have gone on without with no danger to the public and the lights would have been gone by the next day. This wasn't a riot of satmar vs. the police. Rather it was an internal satmar conflict that spilled over to the public.

170

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