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Israel - Rabbinical Power Struggle over What Brucha is Required for Bamba Snack |
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This arcane dispute has been thrust to the forefront of a power struggle between two sons of Sephardi Jewry's most influential halachic authority - Rabbi Ovadia Yosef, the spiritual mentor of Shas.
Rabbi Yitzhak Yosef and Rabbi David Yosef, the two sons, are vying to become the next chief sephardi rabbi of Jerusalem.
By taking the Jerusalem Chief Rabbinate post, each son could potentially position himself to inherit the mantle of rabbinic leadership for Sephardi Jewry from the 89-year-old father, who has a history of heart disease.
David Yosef is close to former Shas chairman Aryeh Deri, who is expected to make a political comeback after serving a 22-month prison sentence, probation and a decade-long ban from politics starting in July 1999 for taking a bribe of about $150,000. David Yosef was forced out of Shas's inner power circle after Deri was forced to step down.
Meanwhile, Yitzhak Yosef has received the open support of his father and others in Shas in his campaign to become Jerusalem's next Sephardi chief rabbi.
Camps supporting each of the sons have enlisted an unlikely and seemingly mundane food commodity to advance their respective aims.
In a surprise opinion, Yitzhak Yosef, who heads the Hazon Ovadia Yeshiva and authored the Yalkut Yosef - a compilation of halachic opinions that quote heavily from his father's rulings - argued that the proper blessing for Bamba, which is made out of ground corn, is Borei Pri Ha'adama (Blessed are You, the Creator of the fruits of the earth).
Yitzhak Yosef argued that since the corn was grown especially for the production of the Bamba, this was the proper blessing even if the corn were no longer recognizable.
In contrast, David Yosef, head of the Yechaveh Da'at Yeshiva and rabbi of Jerusalem's Har Nof neighborhood, ruled in a more mainstream opinion that the proper blessing was Shehakol (Blessed are You Who brings everything into being by His word).
In a telephone conversation with The Jerusalem Post, David Yosef said he rejected his brother's reasoning.
"I spoke with exporters from Trieste [the Italian port from which a large amount of corn flour used for Bamba production is brought to Israel]," he said. "They told me that a lot of the corn grown in Italy is used for other purposes besides Bamba, such as polenta. And even when corn is grown specifically for one purpose, we still say a shehakol. In Mexico, for instance, the national food is corn tortillas. My father told all the Jews to say shehakol."
Each son claims that the elder Yosef supports his opinion on Bamba. Supporters of each have leaked letters to the press signed by Yosef to the effect that one son - either David or Yitzhak - is his legitimate spiritual heir.
The sons' position on the Bamba blessing has become a foil for determining which of the two is continuing the halachic traditions of the father. If either of the sons can prove that their father agrees with him on Bamba, then by extension, it would show that the venerable rabbi supports them in general regarding additional halachic rulings.
Meanwhile, a source close to Ovadia Yosef revealed the octogenarian rabbi's real opinion.
"Do you want to know what Maran [a name of respect for Yosef] holds?" asked the source, who insisted on remaining anonymous for fear he would be accused of political favoritism. "He believes the blessing is shehakol. But if someone said ha'adama, he does not have to bless again. After all, Bamba is made out of corn meal."
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Read Comments (61) — Post Yours »
1
Jun 16, 2009 at 08:06 PM Anonymous Says:
Uh,Oh. Azoi vi se Chasidisht zich, azoi sfardisht zich.
2
Jun 16, 2009 at 08:03 PM Anonymous Says:
B"h all problems solved
3
Jun 16, 2009 at 08:32 PM Elections Have Consequences Says:
So it all comes up to whom they pasken like to know who the next chief rabbi will be? Arm wrestling would be easier!
4
Jun 16, 2009 at 08:30 PM Elections Have Consequences Says:
Dear Jpost,
"Pious" jews arent the only ones who have to make a brocha... ALL JEWS SHOULD MAKE BROCHAS ON FOODS!!
5
Jun 16, 2009 at 08:13 PM Anonymous Says:
Vat a shanda. Neither of these two rabbonim has the common sense and midos to warrant appointment. The "search committee" should find a rebbe with the proper credentials and capable of focusing on substantive issues and let these two characters focus on the trivia they seem to kvel about.
6
Jun 16, 2009 at 10:06 PM Anonymous Says:
Don't eat it, problem solved. Seriously, aren't there more important things then what bracha to make on banba? It sounds more like a power struggle to me.
7
Jun 16, 2009 at 10:18 PM M. Sarc Says:
The Eida paskens: since bamba is a zionist invention and the bracha might be said in a hebrew dialect it should not be eaten at all.
They are also sending a "Mishlachas" to the italian port to verify if there is no "Avoida Zoro" (Idol Worship). In a statement from the Aida Hachareidis it said, if it turns out to be a "Chashash" Avoida Zoro it not be allowed even to throw these zionistic items at protests on Shabbos.
8
Jun 16, 2009 at 09:39 PM Milhouse Says:
“ So it all comes up to whom they pasken like to know who the next chief rabbi will be? Arm wrestling would be easier! ”
It's not whom they pasken like, it's whether they're mechaven to their father's daas torah. This is a question where there are valid arguments for both sides, but R Ovadia surely has an opinion one way or the other; whichever brother got it right would seem to be closer to his way of thinking than the other one.
9
Jun 16, 2009 at 09:24 PM David Says:
Wouldn't the Sephardic pronunciation be "Bracha", not "Brucha"?
10
Jun 16, 2009 at 10:30 PM Anonymous Says:
“ It's not whom they pasken like, it's whether they're mechaven to their father's daas torah. This is a question where there are valid arguments for both sides, but R Ovadia surely has an opinion one way or the other; whichever brother got it right would seem to be closer to his way of thinking than the other one. ”
Whether either of these guys are mechaven to their father's way of analyzing such a shaiyla is not the real issue. Why aren't we asking the question of whether they are the only two possible candidates for what is more of a political than religious job since orthodox jews--whether ashkenaz or sephardic--will continue to rely on their own rabbonim for guidance and as their personal posek. The fact that they are engaging in this stupid debate over such arcane issues leads one to question their common sense, not which is a better clone of Rav Ovadia (whose own judgement was questioned because of the whole Deri affair).
11
Jun 16, 2009 at 10:22 PM Anonymous Says:
“ It's not whom they pasken like, it's whether they're mechaven to their father's daas torah. This is a question where there are valid arguments for both sides, but R Ovadia surely has an opinion one way or the other; whichever brother got it right would seem to be closer to his way of thinking than the other one. ”
or just got lucky this one time....
12
Jun 16, 2009 at 10:21 PM Anonymous Says:
“ Dear Jpost,
"Pious" jews arent the only ones who have to make a brocha... ALL JEWS SHOULD MAKE BROCHAS ON FOODS!! ”
But all Jews are Pious!!!
13
Jun 16, 2009 at 10:57 PM Milhouse Says:
“ Whether either of these guys are mechaven to their father's way of analyzing such a shaiyla is not the real issue. Why aren't we asking the question of whether they are the only two possible candidates for what is more of a political than religious job since orthodox jews--whether ashkenaz or sephardic--will continue to rely on their own rabbonim for guidance and as their personal posek. The fact that they are engaging in this stupid debate over such arcane issues leads one to question their common sense, not which is a better clone of Rav Ovadia (whose own judgement was questioned because of the whole Deri affair). ”
Again, hilchos birchos hanehenin is not an arcane issue. It's every bit as important as any other area of practical halacha. Traditionally, when a rov would come on proba, this is an area he'd be tested in.
14
Jun 16, 2009 at 10:52 PM kingsley the chuchem Says:
Boy!! if this is the main issue the sefardic Rabbinate is so busy with, they have seriouss issues. Better to leave the position empty than have these two clowns.
Let them have a Bamba eating contest and then let the genius sefardim decide who will be their competent Rav haposek!! I guess the respect the yeshivishe world had for the emerging Torah sefardic Rabbonim was ill placed if these are their leaders!
15
Jun 16, 2009 at 10:40 PM Anonymous Says:
Wow. What great Rabbanim to have to busy themselves with such important issues. Their time would be better spent recommending that children not eat this high-sodium, nutritionally worthless garbage.
16
Jun 16, 2009 at 11:03 PM Anonymous Says:
“ Again, hilchos birchos hanehenin is not an arcane issue. It's every bit as important as any other area of practical halacha. Traditionally, when a rov would come on proba, this is an area he'd be tested in. ”
Its more important to know which would be better at grabbing more money from the government for the Sephardic yeshivot and welfare centers then who is more faithful to the poseks of his tata. The sephardim don't look to the rebbe for daas torah as much as they depend on him to keep the money flowing to their institutions. I suspect either of these guys can tell a kosher chicken.
17
Jun 16, 2009 at 10:59 PM Loshon Hora Says:
Sound familiar Aaron Zalman Leib?
Srulche & Mendale?
The list goes on.
I guess the Sefardim are more original, so it originated there?
Problem is the fight start when the father is still alive today, they used to have the decentcy to wait. Today the reshaim mix the old father in to it, so nasty unfortunate & a bizayon of a tzadik & the Torah.
BTW, I am not sure if there are more sons, but one, not the former MK, maybe the other one,sat on the Sefardi Aida Chareidis Beis Din with the StropkoveRebbe [also a renouned Talmid Chacham], he is a genius, and a big Talmid Chocham, with good midos, but not much back bone they push him around quite easily, from what I heard. I don't know weather he says Shehokol, Hoadama or no brocho, because izuki mazik, like drinking Olive oil.
18
Jun 16, 2009 at 11:50 PM Milhouse Says:
“ Its more important to know which would be better at grabbing more money from the government for the Sephardic yeshivot and welfare centers then who is more faithful to the poseks of his tata. The sephardim don't look to the rebbe for daas torah as much as they depend on him to keep the money flowing to their institutions. I suspect either of these guys can tell a kosher chicken. ”
Racist.
19
Jun 16, 2009 at 11:47 PM Milhouse Says:
“ Wow. What great Rabbanim to have to busy themselves with such important issues. Their time would be better spent recommending that children not eat this high-sodium, nutritionally worthless garbage. ”
Rabbanim are for deciding halacha, not for giving nutritional advice.
For what it's worth, Israeli children, who eat bamba from a very early age, are significantly less likely to develop peanut allergies than are demographically similar children in other countries, who don't eat bamba.
20
Jun 16, 2009 at 11:39 PM Anonymous Says:
Don't eat it, problem solved. Seriously, aren't there more important things then what bracha to make on banba? It sounds more like a power struggle to me.
21
Jun 17, 2009 at 06:21 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Don't eat it, problem solved. Seriously, aren't there more important things then what bracha to make on banba? It sounds more like a power struggle to me. ”
There is nothing more important to show who is more careful with halacha. BTW, doe any one know if you have to take trumah from salt?
22
Jun 17, 2009 at 06:04 AM Just Thinking Says:
Amazing how all the posters above drank up all the garbage the anti-religious newspaper is feeding them. They pictured a typical Halachik argument, which is a friendly exchange of opinions into some rabid huge fight. If you think any of these Rabbis spent more then a few minutes on the question, you're wrong. Besides for the fact That Rabbi David Yosef already took down his request for the post.
Dudes, just grow up
23
Jun 17, 2009 at 03:03 AM Moishe Pipick Says:
Is it any wonder that people hate jews? They can't even get this together. Why blame anti - semites or arabs or other 'self - hating' jews, when these are the worst kind of jews? These 2 bumbling idiots take after their radical father. All 3 should be thrown out of the government and should be thrown out of Israel.
This is yet more proof that these 'rabbis' are a bags of wind, since they have time to talk about Bamba & Lipa.. and the real issues (abuse, kashrut scandals, money scandals..) are swept under the wrong. - An empty barrel makes alot of noise.Shame on these fools and those who follow them. Let's rip out this cancer now!
24
Jun 17, 2009 at 03:00 AM anon Says:
At least they're all acting l'shem shomayim.
25
Jun 17, 2009 at 02:51 AM HaLeiVi Says:
Are they actually fighting over the position or is this the musings of an obviously non-"pious" reporter who can't figure out why else they would argue about a Bracha?
26
Jun 17, 2009 at 01:04 AM Heter Iska Says:
If he seriously believes that corn is grown specifically for production of Bamba, he may reconsider his desire to become a posek, at least in these matters. Shouldn't people do some research before making such statements ? Or maybe I misunderstood his words, in which case - my apologies ...
27
Jun 17, 2009 at 07:08 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Is it any wonder that people hate jews? They can't even get this together. Why blame anti - semites or arabs or other 'self - hating' jews, when these are the worst kind of jews? These 2 bumbling idiots take after their radical father. All 3 should be thrown out of the government and should be thrown out of Israel.
This is yet more proof that these 'rabbis' are a bags of wind, since they have time to talk about Bamba & Lipa.. and the real issues (abuse, kashrut scandals, money scandals..) are swept under the wrong. - An empty barrel makes alot of noise.Shame on these fools and those who follow them. Let's rip out this cancer now! ”
People hate Jews because two talmidai chachomim disagree over what brachah to make over Bamba???
Gee, the German's ym"s vzr"m, zol em alleh huben a miseh meshinah, must have been way ahead of their time. They slaughtered my grandfather's family, mena'ar ve'ad zokain, taf venoshim 65+ years ago.
Rabbi Yosef SENIOR was hardly bar mitzvah yet (although he might have already known much of torah ba'al peh by then).
How did they know he would one day have two sons who would argue over the proper brachah one recites to thank hashem for Bamba 65 years later???
And if that is why they hate us, why didn't the Germans ym"s simply find little Ovadia Yosef and kill him (c"v) and leave all of European Jewry alone?
I sense a minor flaw in your claim.
28
Jun 17, 2009 at 07:03 AM Anonymous Says:
“ If he seriously believes that corn is grown specifically for production of Bamba, he may reconsider his desire to become a posek, at least in these matters. Shouldn't people do some research before making such statements ? Or maybe I misunderstood his words, in which case - my apologies ... ”
Why do they need to do research? everything you need to know is in the Torah. That was how they knew to issue a das torah to ban Lipa.
29
Jun 17, 2009 at 06:43 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Rabbanim are for deciding halacha, not for giving nutritional advice.
For what it's worth, Israeli children, who eat bamba from a very early age, are significantly less likely to develop peanut allergies than are demographically similar children in other countries, who don't eat bamba.
”
The peanut allergy boom is an American phenomenon or mishagas.
30
Jun 17, 2009 at 07:18 AM anonymous Says:
Sefardic Rabbi's suffer from KDS - Kovod defficiency syndrom. This is nuts and if this is the way they behave then neither one should take over. To say that the corn is grown specially for the Bamba is absurd. Maybe we should start calling is "shmura Bamba". I think when they cut the corn they say "Lsheim Mitzvos Bamba" On pesach of course (for those who eat kitniyos). the rest of the year maybe they also say it since they are so machmir in italy on the corn for bamba. This is the most crazy argument I have heard.
31
Jun 17, 2009 at 08:02 AM moish Says:
This is a very legitimate halachic machlokes, but it is ridiculous to suggest that because their father paskens the same way as them on this ruling should make him more fitting to take over his father; what, they should just parrot whatever rulings their father gave and not be able to have their own opinion on the matter? that wouldn't make them much of a rov.
32
Jun 17, 2009 at 08:01 AM moish Says:
“ Is it any wonder that people hate jews? They can't even get this together. Why blame anti - semites or arabs or other 'self - hating' jews, when these are the worst kind of jews? These 2 bumbling idiots take after their radical father. All 3 should be thrown out of the government and should be thrown out of Israel.
This is yet more proof that these 'rabbis' are a bags of wind, since they have time to talk about Bamba & Lipa.. and the real issues (abuse, kashrut scandals, money scandals..) are swept under the wrong. - An empty barrel makes alot of noise.Shame on these fools and those who follow them. Let's rip out this cancer now! ”
The same boring anti-religious verbal diarreha, can't you think of something original to say? Is all that a rov is allowed to talk about all day - abuse? An jew has to know the brocho on bamba if he wants to eat it, and a rov has an obligation to clarify the halocho for his followers. And if someone is machti es horabim to join his moshav leitzim every rov has an obligation to be moicheh.
33
Jun 17, 2009 at 07:54 AM Jimmy37 Says:
Ok, WHAT IS THE REAL STORY??? If there is any truth to the political wrangling, then neither is worthy of the post.
This is completely crazy. All this maneuvering makes me want to throw up. Or just open a bag of fried pork rinds. I wonder what the bracha for THAT is!
34
Jun 17, 2009 at 07:53 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Sefardic Rabbi's suffer from KDS - Kovod defficiency syndrom. This is nuts and if this is the way they behave then neither one should take over. To say that the corn is grown specially for the Bamba is absurd. Maybe we should start calling is "shmura Bamba". I think when they cut the corn they say "Lsheim Mitzvos Bamba" On pesach of course (for those who eat kitniyos). the rest of the year maybe they also say it since they are so machmir in italy on the corn for bamba. This is the most crazy argument I have heard. ”
At least they don't have wars in their yeshivas throwing smoke bombs down vents or beating each other up in the streets, over succession issues- like your Ashkenaz yeshivas in Israel have been known to do.
35
Jun 17, 2009 at 07:49 AM moish Says:
“ If he seriously believes that corn is grown specifically for production of Bamba, he may reconsider his desire to become a posek, at least in these matters. Shouldn't people do some research before making such statements ? Or maybe I misunderstood his words, in which case - my apologies ... ”
Yes you misunderstood his words, he didn't say that all corn was made from bamba, but the corn which osem buy for their bamba is grown for them for this purpose.
36
Jun 17, 2009 at 07:47 AM Anonymous Says:
A friend who went to rav ovadiah for semicha had a fruit bowl placed in front of him before beginning. The rav smiled and explained that before he tests anyone he wnats to see whther they know birchos hanehenin.
37
Jun 17, 2009 at 08:07 AM moish Says:
“ Sound familiar Aaron Zalman Leib?
Srulche & Mendale?
The list goes on.
I guess the Sefardim are more original, so it originated there?
Problem is the fight start when the father is still alive today, they used to have the decentcy to wait. Today the reshaim mix the old father in to it, so nasty unfortunate & a bizayon of a tzadik & the Torah.
BTW, I am not sure if there are more sons, but one, not the former MK, maybe the other one,sat on the Sefardi Aida Chareidis Beis Din with the StropkoveRebbe [also a renouned Talmid Chacham], he is a genius, and a big Talmid Chocham, with good midos, but not much back bone they push him around quite easily, from what I heard. I don't know weather he says Shehokol, Hoadama or no brocho, because izuki mazik, like drinking Olive oil. ”
I don't know if this is who you are referring to but the oldest son R' Yaakov is a huge talmid chochom and has completely independent views of his father on all subjects, whether in halocho, hashkofo, or political affiliation, and has his own following.
38
Jun 17, 2009 at 08:06 AM Mmm . . . Says:
Any product for which the specific brochah cannot be halachically established is usually Shehakol - there are "dreis" such as with rice by eating a mezonos and ho'adoma beforehand - but these are just "dreis" and don't really address the question (see Shulchan Oruch HaRav, Hilchos B'rochos concerning rice).
39
Jun 17, 2009 at 08:37 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Sefardic Rabbi's suffer from KDS - Kovod defficiency syndrom. This is nuts and if this is the way they behave then neither one should take over. To say that the corn is grown specially for the Bamba is absurd. Maybe we should start calling is "shmura Bamba". I think when they cut the corn they say "Lsheim Mitzvos Bamba" On pesach of course (for those who eat kitniyos). the rest of the year maybe they also say it since they are so machmir in italy on the corn for bamba. This is the most crazy argument I have heard. ”
If this is the craziest arguement (that is, if it is as big a deal as the article claims it to be) you ever heard you haven't been listening very well.
This is not a problem with sefardic rabbonim any more than it is by ashkenazic rabbonim.
40
Jun 17, 2009 at 09:38 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Any product for which the specific brochah cannot be halachically established is usually Shehakol - there are "dreis" such as with rice by eating a mezonos and ho'adoma beforehand - but these are just "dreis" and don't really address the question (see Shulchan Oruch HaRav, Hilchos B'rochos concerning rice). ”
It's made from processed corn. It tastes like peanut. the item in the picture is cream-filled.
So why exactly would you not make a shehakol?
Do you say HaEitz on apple juice when the apples are "specifically grown to make juice"?
All processed foods use raw ingredients which were produced specially for that item - do we have to make 3 brachas on chocolate mousse (HaAdama for the cocoa beans, shehakol for the sugar, and hagafen for the wine alcohol added)?
Let's spend time on real questions, rather than rabbis waste effort on narishkeit...
41
Jun 17, 2009 at 09:45 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Any product for which the specific brochah cannot be halachically established is usually Shehakol - there are "dreis" such as with rice by eating a mezonos and ho'adoma beforehand - but these are just "dreis" and don't really address the question (see Shulchan Oruch HaRav, Hilchos B'rochos concerning rice). ”
WHO cares which baracha as long as they say Sh'hakol...this is dancing on the head of a pin and really doesn't merit the time its being given. The article suggests both of these heilege rabbonim have too much time on their hands and might consider focusing on the real issues confronting sephardim in yerushalayim.
42
Jun 17, 2009 at 08:55 AM Rebitzen Says:
“ Rabbanim are for deciding halacha, not for giving nutritional advice.
For what it's worth, Israeli children, who eat bamba from a very early age, are significantly less likely to develop peanut allergies than are demographically similar children in other countries, who don't eat bamba.
”
When did you become a medical professional ?
43
Jun 17, 2009 at 10:51 AM moish Says:
“ WHO cares which baracha as long as they say Sh'hakol...this is dancing on the head of a pin and really doesn't merit the time its being given. The article suggests both of these heilege rabbonim have too much time on their hands and might consider focusing on the real issues confronting sephardim in yerushalayim. ”
This guy doesn't know any yiddish [and probably isn't orthodox] and he thinks "heilige" is an insult, as he is always using it while insulting rabbonim, or maybe its just his perverse sense of humor.
44
Jun 17, 2009 at 11:15 AM Anonymous Says:
“ This guy doesn't know any yiddish [and probably isn't orthodox] and he thinks "heilige" is an insult, as he is always using it while insulting rabbonim, or maybe its just his perverse sense of humor.
”
Both of the sons are respected and learned rabbonim with very different views.
45
Jun 17, 2009 at 11:05 AM HaLeiVi Says:
“ WHO cares which baracha as long as they say Sh'hakol...this is dancing on the head of a pin and really doesn't merit the time its being given. The article suggests both of these heilege rabbonim have too much time on their hands and might consider focusing on the real issues confronting sephardim in yerushalayim. ”
Yeah, Take it from somebody who never saw the inside of a Gemara - granted that you saw the outside.
46
Jun 17, 2009 at 01:12 PM Milhouse Says:
“ When did you become a medical professional ? ”
When did you become a psychic?
47
Jun 17, 2009 at 01:12 PM Milhouse Says:
“ WHO cares which baracha as long as they say Sh'hakol...this is dancing on the head of a pin and really doesn't merit the time its being given. The article suggests both of these heilege rabbonim have too much time on their hands and might consider focusing on the real issues confronting sephardim in yerushalayim. ”
וכל זה כשנולד לו ספק אחר שלמד או בדיעבד. אבל לכתחילה אסור לו לצאת בברכת שהכל, אלא צריך לברך על כל דבר ברכה המיוחדת לו. ואם הוא עם הארץ ילך אצל חכם וילמדנו הלכות ברכות.
48
Jun 17, 2009 at 01:07 PM Milhouse Says:
“ It's made from processed corn. It tastes like peanut. the item in the picture is cream-filled.
So why exactly would you not make a shehakol?
Do you say HaEitz on apple juice when the apples are "specifically grown to make juice"?
All processed foods use raw ingredients which were produced specially for that item - do we have to make 3 brachas on chocolate mousse (HaAdama for the cocoa beans, shehakol for the sugar, and hagafen for the wine alcohol added)?
Let's spend time on real questions, rather than rabbis waste effort on narishkeit... ”
Learn hilchos brochos, and you'll begin to have answers. But don't dismiss it as a stupid thing to argue about.
49
Jun 17, 2009 at 01:05 PM Milhouse Says:
“ I don't know if this is who you are referring to but the oldest son R' Yaakov is a huge talmid chochom and has completely independent views of his father on all subjects, whether in halocho, hashkofo, or political affiliation, and has his own following.
”
He said not the former MK.
50
Jun 17, 2009 at 02:17 PM brooklynnative Says:
Honestly, you really think G-d cares what exact word is used when making a blessing over a food product? Is g-d really concerned with the mundane minutia like this? What a waste of time and energy. It's splitting hairs. How about this... before you eat Bamba, just say thanks g-d. I'm sure the creator will get the idea. I think worrying over exactly what should be said before every little, insignificant action borders on mental illness. Your time would be better spent concentrating on healing the world. Forget about this silly, man-made controversy. It's all about who wants to be in charge down the road. Ridiculous!
51
Jun 17, 2009 at 01:56 PM Anonymous Says:
“ The Eida paskens: since bamba is a zionist invention and the bracha might be said in a hebrew dialect it should not be eaten at all.
They are also sending a "Mishlachas" to the italian port to verify if there is no "Avoida Zoro" (Idol Worship). In a statement from the Aida Hachareidis it said, if it turns out to be a "Chashash" Avoida Zoro it not be allowed even to throw these zionistic items at protests on Shabbos. ”
no, no the eidah says no such thing. your spewing shtusim v'havulim, and possibly moitzy shem ruh on the eidah shlit"a. the eidha gives a hechsher on bambah, as can be seen in the picture, and the eidah paskens shehakol on bamah.
52
Jun 17, 2009 at 01:52 PM Anonymous Says:
“ There is nothing more important to show who is more careful with halacha. BTW, doe any one know if you have to take trumah from salt? ”
terumah on salt? now your just asking stupid questions to waste time and appear like a talmid chochom. eisav did the same thing, check rashi at the begining of parshas toldos.
53
Jun 17, 2009 at 02:44 PM Anonymous Says:
“ terumah on salt? now your just asking stupid questions to waste time and appear like a talmid chochom. eisav did the same thing, check rashi at the begining of parshas toldos. ”
Eisav asked about Ma'aser on salt...
54
Jun 17, 2009 at 03:04 PM listen 2 me Says:
“ Don't eat it, problem solved. Seriously, aren't there more important things then what bracha to make on banba? It sounds more like a power struggle to me. ”
thats right its not more then a power fight
55
Jun 17, 2009 at 03:57 PM Milhouse Says:
“ Honestly, you really think G-d cares what exact word is used when making a blessing over a food product? Is g-d really concerned with the mundane minutia like this? What a waste of time and energy. It's splitting hairs. How about this... before you eat Bamba, just say thanks g-d. I'm sure the creator will get the idea. I think worrying over exactly what should be said before every little, insignificant action borders on mental illness. Your time would be better spent concentrating on healing the world. Forget about this silly, man-made controversy. It's all about who wants to be in charge down the road. Ridiculous! ”
Yes, God really does care. Why do you think there's a whole section in Shulchon Oruch, and literally thousands of teshuvos about it? You are clearly not a religious Jew and don't belong here.
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Jun 17, 2009 at 02:52 PM Anonymous Says:
“ Learn hilchos brochos, and you'll begin to have answers. But don't dismiss it as a stupid thing to argue about. ”
I'm not sure you know how to properly identify a facetious comment as being such.
They were rhetorical questions.
The point is that nobody makes a production over (heavily) processed foods being deconstructed to their original components of ingredients and identifying the item with the more exclusive potential bracha and then investigating the provenance of said ingredient to explore ways to change to another bracha.
(very very limited exceptions with regard to grapes since there are both rishona and achrona reasons, as well as nochri issues, but that's about it)
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Jun 17, 2009 at 05:16 PM Milhouse Says:
“ I'm not sure you know how to properly identify a facetious comment as being such.
They were rhetorical questions.
The point is that nobody makes a production over (heavily) processed foods being deconstructed to their original components of ingredients and identifying the item with the more exclusive potential bracha and then investigating the provenance of said ingredient to explore ways to change to another bracha.
(very very limited exceptions with regard to grapes since there are both rishona and achrona reasons, as well as nochri issues, but that's about it) ”
And I repeat that you need to learn these halochos, and not dismiss the issues you raised as silly. They are not.
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Jun 17, 2009 at 05:39 PM Anonymous Says:
“ Eisav asked about Ma'aser on salt... ”
Really? I am not the first to ask that question?? Duh, of course I knew that where else would I get that hairbrain idea? From rabbi's who argue over which bracha to recite over an amalgam of junk food?
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Jun 17, 2009 at 04:17 PM Anonymous Says:
“ Yes, God really does care. Why do you think there's a whole section in Shulchon Oruch, and literally thousands of teshuvos about it? You are clearly not a religious Jew and don't belong here. ”
I like how you went from being a medical professional, to a halachic posek, and now to a clerical fanatic.
I feel bad for that guy you just trashed for being less frum than you, and hope he doesn't develop animosity toward the rest of us.
Kamtza and Bar Kamtza, anyone?
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Jun 18, 2009 at 09:59 AM BrooklynNative Says:
“ Yes, God really does care. Why do you think there's a whole section in Shulchon Oruch, and literally thousands of teshuvos about it? You are clearly not a religious Jew and don't belong here. ”
You are talking about words written by a man. Are you saying a Rabbi's interpretation is the word of god? A Rabbi is a mere mortal. I don't care how learned he is.
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Jun 18, 2009 at 04:40 PM moish Says:
“ You are talking about words written by a man. Are you saying a Rabbi's interpretation is the word of god? A Rabbi is a mere mortal. I don't care how learned he is. ”
[I see you need to learn a few basics of juadism]. God commanded us in the Torah to listen the Rabbi's of the Sanhedrin. They taught these brochos, and anyone who deviates from their words an iota is transgressing the word of God.