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New York - Acapella Music and the Three Weeks |
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Ah, but what type of music? Is it only live music that we may not listen to, or is music that is taped,CDed, or MP3ed also forbidden? And if CDs, tapes, and MP3s are forbidden, what about those that were recorded with no instruments? The so-called “Sefira tapes” are they really permitted?
Before we get to the answers to these questions, let’s try to delve into why the Bais HaMikdash was destroyed. The Ran, on the Gemorah in Nedarim 81a tells us that it was because the Jewish people, although they learned Torah, did not hold it in the esteem and reverence that it should have been held. In a certain way, they viewed Torah as merely another branch of knowledge, not realizing its true character and uniqueness. They lacked in true Kavod HaTorah. The Gemorah (Megillah 3b) tells us that honoring Torah is in a certain sense even greater than studying Torah.
Now back to the question – are the tapes permitted or forbidden?
If the tapes were recorded with music, most Poskim ruled that they are to be treated like musical instruments (See responsa Maharshag Vol. II # 125; Responsa Yad Yitzchok 322; responsa Salmas Chaim #888; Kovaitz Bais Aharon VeYisroel Vol. 65 p. 108 citing Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach zatzal). There is a minority view that any tapes are permitted. However, this view has been rejected by the majority of Poskim.
Some Poskim hold to the view that the tape recorder itself is viewed as a musical instrument in and of itself, and even if there were no musical instruments played when the recording was made, it is forbidden because the tape recorder itself is considered the instrument. This view was stated by a number of Poskim including Rav Menashe Klein author of the Mishnah Halachos responsa.
There are a few questions that one can ask on this view and that is, how is it any worse than singing through the mouth? Also, there is no skill or talent involved in playing a tape recorder (at least for most people), how could it be considered music?
Some report that the position of Moreinu Rav Elyashiv, shlita is that tapes that were recorded without musical accompaniment are permitted during the three weeks and Sefira and that the theory that the tape recorder is a musical instrument in and of itself is erroneous. Lest the gentle reader think that this is merely an unsubstantiated oral ruling, the provenance of the ruling is rather clear. It is printed in the Sefer of Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach’s grandson, Rav Tuvya Freund shlita entitled “Shalmei Moed” on p. 453 footnote 40. The sefer has haskamos from Rav Azriel Auerbach Shlita, Rav Zalman Nechemia Goldberg, Rav Yehoshua Neuwirth (of Shmiras Shabbos KeHilchasa) with a Michtav Bracha of Rav Shmuel Auerbach. This position was also that of Moreinu HaRav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach, zatzal.
Thus, according to this, both Rav Shlomo Zalman and ylc”a Rav Elyashiv hold that tapes with music are forbidden, while tapes of singing without music are permitted both during sefirah and during the three weeks.
However, and this is a big however. According to Rav Dovid Morgenstern (as told to me by Rav Morgenstern) it seems that this question was posed to Rav Elyashiv on Sefira (5765) by a grandson of Rav Elyashiv. Rav Elyashiv repeated his and explanation answer (in Rav Morgenstern’s presence) five times. He said that it was clearly forbidden because the tape recorder is considered to be a musical instrument. Clearly, (and unfortunately) we have a contradiction between Rav Freund and Rav Morgenstern as to Rav Elyashiv’s position.
Admittedly, there will be frustration at not having absolute clarity as to what Rav Elyashiv holds. However, each person should listen to the view of their own Posek or Rav, and we should bear in mind that not treating the Torah views of our Torah leaders, Rabbinim, and Poskim in a respectful manner was the initial cause of the prohibition in the first place.
We should also bear in mind that when we listen to the music, it should be Leshaim Shamayim -to bring us closer to Avinu SheBashamayim.
As a parenthetic note, the very term “a capella” is something that should perhaps be avoided. The phrase was first used in Catholic churches where Latin was the language used for prayer- the Latin meaning is “in the style of the chapel.” Rav Moshe Feinstein YD II #56 writes in a responsa that music used in the formulation of prayer to an Avodah Zarah should not be used –even if the tunes are no longer utilized. Indeed, he even rejected music used by gentiles to the words of Tehillim, because the prima facie assumption is that it is Avodah Zarah. The first edition of the Levush before it was attacked by the gentile censors makes a similar point. Although merely use of the term may not be equivalent to music, we may be better off if we call it Sefirah music. [The term “Academy”, also has a similar origin, but perhaps because of its near universal use it may have been koshered].
The author may be reached at yairhoffman2@gmail.com
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Read Comments (53) — Post Yours »
1
Jul 09, 2009 at 10:53 AM Anonymous Says:
To be honest, I heard of many many t"c who are of the opinion that to say a CD or other similar devices should be forbidden is very not smart. Because in our generation it's a way of life everything today is combined with music. But in the previous generations it was most of the time heard only on special occasions. (even at home give away special time to play with the instrument) I think that we need fair discussion about the consapt.
2
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:08 AM Anonymous Says:
The article says nothing about music on an I-Pod or I-Phone so there may be options for using these new platforms that stay within the minhag of avoiding music during the 3 weeks.
3
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:07 AM Anonymous Says:
Rav Moshe paskened that you could listen to a CD but not to a tape or record because of the difference in how common it was. That psak probably is no longer valid because CDs are even more commonplace than they were back then
4
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:06 AM Tanna Kamma Says:
“ To be honest, I heard of many many t"c who are of the opinion that to say a CD or other similar devices should be forbidden is very not smart. Because in our generation it's a way of life everything today is combined with music. But in the previous generations it was most of the time heard only on special occasions. (even at home give away special time to play with the instrument) I think that we need fair discussion about the consapt. ”
So in 2009 we can't give up 3 weeks of listening to music? How spoiled we've become...
5
Jul 09, 2009 at 10:59 AM Anonymous Says:
The article is a bit confusing to the layperson....I read it to say that a tape recorder itself is assur since it takes on the attributes of a musical instrument. What about a tape recorder used to play a dvar torah etc. I assume that as long as there is no music being played, it is mutar. Also, is it ok to shop in stores where they play background music. What about the music that plays when you get put on "hold" when calling just about any business today? obviously, you can't just hang up and redial because you will get the same music until a real person answers.
Has anyone dealt with this issue.
6
Jul 09, 2009 at 10:51 AM music Says:
Does anyone know if the music hanigun shblev from eliezer rosenfeld is allowed in the 3 weeks ?
7
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:22 AM Anonymous Says:
“ To be honest, I heard of many many t"c who are of the opinion that to say a CD or other similar devices should be forbidden is very not smart. Because in our generation it's a way of life everything today is combined with music. But in the previous generations it was most of the time heard only on special occasions. (even at home give away special time to play with the instrument) I think that we need fair discussion about the consapt. ”
I heard a better reason why it should be permitted, because people are listening all year long to music in a daily bases, so it's not called a pleasure eny more. And the rabbis didn't took away our vital think only at the 9 days, like Wine snd cleaning.
8
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:22 AM Point to ponder Says:
“ So in 2009 we can't give up 3 weeks of listening to music? How spoiled we've become... ”
Don't forget that this also applies to sefirah. In total it amounts to 10 weeks a year, which is quite a lot.
Plus the 3 weeks are smack in middle of the summer when people are more prone to listen 2 music.
Obviously if the halacha prohibits it then its prohibited, bu just skip the word spoiled
9
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:14 AM Confused Says:
I don't mean this to sound in any way disrespectful. I am truly confused by Rav Elyashiv's (shlita) opinion according to Rav Morgenstern. If, indeed, a "tape recorder is considered to be a musical instrument," why can we listen to lectures and shiurim during sefira and the three weeks? Or can we?...
10
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:32 AM A YID Says:
I heard from my roshyeshiva he never said it was asar he said that chas vshalom if one of the 7 niftar's which to them u cant hear music for them for a year you wold not even want to listen to those acappela cd's and in our case we are mourning of the bieshamkdash which is 3 week's we need to make big thing about it the answer is by people who understand they would not listen to those acappela cd's during the 3 weeks . happy fasting think it over
11
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:32 AM Anonymous Says:
Why can't we refrain from all music for three weeks? How spoiled do we need to be?
12
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:28 AM Anonymous Says:
How about listening to sad, depressing music? Wouldn't that be better?
13
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:40 AM A Says:
"However, each person should listen to the view of their own Posek or Rav, and we should bear in mind that not treating the Torah views of our Torah leaders, Rabbinim, and Poskim in a respectful manner was the initial cause of the prohibition in the first place."
Hypocrite!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Was what he wrote on the psak of Harav Eliyahu just two days ago in any way keeping with this?
(Emphasis on the respect, i have no problem with him for difference of opinion)
14
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:35 AM Meir Says:
“ Rav Moshe paskened that you could listen to a CD but not to a tape or record because of the difference in how common it was. That psak probably is no longer valid because CDs are even more commonplace than they were back then ”
You made it up - there were no CD when he was alive.
15
Jul 09, 2009 at 12:06 PM Snag Says:
What's all this shtissim about how we interpret different oral traditons about R' Elyashiv thinks on the issue.
Ask him!
16
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:58 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Rav Moshe paskened that you could listen to a CD but not to a tape or record because of the difference in how common it was. That psak probably is no longer valid because CDs are even more commonplace than they were back then ”
Didn't rav moishe niftar over 25 years ago....what kind of CD's did he paskin on in the early 1980s before there were CD players....back then I was using cassette players..
17
Jul 09, 2009 at 12:10 PM Linguist Francae Says:
Acapella: the same root used for the common Jewish name Kaplan, Caplan, Koplin, Koplen, Chaplain, etc. meaning "Priest". A name of Cohanim.
18
Jul 09, 2009 at 12:16 PM Rochel Says:
“ So in 2009 we can't give up 3 weeks of listening to music? How spoiled we've become... ”
It all depends what kind of music you listen to, music can be a very spiritual way to have a stronger connection to G-d, also it can be a way to rely from stress and then you feel better... i don't think it's being spoiled...
19
Jul 09, 2009 at 12:15 PM jewish music Says:
all this music that they play is not jewish music by just puting on some jewish word dose not make it jewish music, so jewish music says only jewish music you my not listen to all this so called music you can listen to including the 3 weeks 9 days all the time and brake a leg
20
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:45 AM Anonymous Says:
The only clear heter for listening to tapes are for shiiruim, daf yomi lectures, etc.
21
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:45 AM Anonymous Says:
I don't understand. Rav Elyashiv is alive and well -- why doesn't someone just ask him what he really thinks???
22
Jul 09, 2009 at 12:30 PM Anonymous Says:
#13 - If you reread his article on Rav Eliyahu - he was most respectful. [Plus - many elderly rabbonim have said the same thing as he did] You on the other hand have violated hamechaneh shaim rah lechaveiro.. And by the way, did any Rav any tell you that you can sit there on the internet and name call a Rav a hypocrite?? Somehow, I doubt it..
23
Jul 09, 2009 at 12:59 PM check your facts Says:
“ Acapella: the same root used for the common Jewish name Kaplan, Caplan, Koplin, Koplen, Chaplain, etc. meaning "Priest". A name of Cohanim. ”
kaplan is NOT related to the french word "chaplain", it is a corruption of the hebrew/aramaic word "Kablan" (artisan)
24
Jul 09, 2009 at 12:27 PM Anonymous Says:
I was directed by Rav Marlowe o.b.m. of Kehillas Lubavitch in Crown Heights not to listen to any music whatsoever during the Three Weeks . . . live, recorded, Jewish . . . none.
I miss him.
25
Jul 09, 2009 at 12:55 PM Shimon Max Says:
Would Rav Hoffman Shlita consider a possible answer to the Stira that Rav Elyashiv (and possibly Hagoan Rav Minashe Klein) that there are two Dinim in recorded "Sfira Music" one that bangs and uses mouth sounds that mimics music but is not quite music and one that the singer just sings.
26
Jul 09, 2009 at 01:25 PM Alan Says:
As A person whose whole like working and non working has been dedicated to music, I asked my Rav for his opinion about my job as a classical music radio DJ. My primary task was to listen and present music to the audience and I could not afford to quit or take a leave of absence. As my primary task was for parnossah, he told me to continue, Any pleasure and satisfaction was incidental to doing my work and as long as I refrained from listening to music for the pure pleasure outside work it was ok.
27
Jul 09, 2009 at 01:36 PM Anonymous Says:
“ I don't understand. Rav Elyashiv is alive and well -- why doesn't someone just ask him what he really thinks??? ”
It would not be appropriate to ask the rebbe to clarify conflicts in his multiple psaks on this issue. The best we can do is to seek to understand what he might have meant
28
Jul 09, 2009 at 01:27 PM Anonymous Says:
why do we need to listen to music during the three weeks--CHURBAN HABAYIS!!!!!
29
Jul 09, 2009 at 02:14 PM Anonymous Says:
There is Definitely a difference how we view music today.
Wherever you go there is music playing. Subconsciouly we live with music most of our day.
I work in a place where goyishe music is played all day. Am I not allowed to listen to kosher music instead?
I know my situation is different, but my point is that music nowadays is not merely for pleasure.
30
Jul 09, 2009 at 02:08 PM Anonymous Says:
"Clearly, (and unfortunately) we have a contradiction between Rav Freund and Rav Morgenstern as to Rav Elyashiv’s position."
Did no one ever hear of a telephone...Pick up the phone and call the rav and say, "can frumme yidden listen to tapes of singing without music, Yes or No". I'm sure the rav would answer. Why do all these rabbonim waste everyon'e time time arguing what Rav Eliyashv did say, didn't say, might have said etc. Just ask him!!
31
Jul 09, 2009 at 01:48 PM Meir Says:
“ It would not be appropriate to ask the rebbe to clarify conflicts in his multiple psaks on this issue. The best we can do is to seek to understand what he might have meant ”
Why not? Most of the stirot are probably due to transmission issues not with a problem at the source of the psak. Also, there me be an apparent due to differences in the fact pattern presented with the question. The best way is to ask and not use this as a Rorschach unto which we project our own preferences.
32
Jul 09, 2009 at 03:23 PM Anonymous Says:
“ It would not be appropriate to ask the rebbe to clarify conflicts in his multiple psaks on this issue. The best we can do is to seek to understand what he might have meant ”
What??? We are not accusing The Rov of inconsistency; we are looking to better understand if perhaps the Rov saw a chiluk between diff situations which make it appear to us as if there is a stira. Often, though not always, our questions about the 'inconsistencies' of Torah greats are really just a reflection of our own relatively weak tfisa. Also, the question would be worded in a respectful, open ended way--one that invites the Rov to share his general views on the subject . Chances are, this in itself would clarify matters and if it doesnt there are perfectly respectful ways to seek the answers we need without even referencing past comments. Everything is about how the question is stated!
33
Jul 09, 2009 at 01:47 PM Anonymous Says:
“ why do we need to listen to music during the three weeks--CHURBAN HABAYIS!!!!! ”
For many yiddin, music is as important as food. It is nourishment for the neshame. We listen to the Chazen on shabbos chanting the haftorah in a mournful nigun. What would be the difference in listening to the Requiem symphony or other mournful music that evokes sadness.
34
Jul 09, 2009 at 01:45 PM Lipa Fan Says:
Do not ban Lipa's music, as this is a work of art, and alot of talent goes into it.
35
Jul 09, 2009 at 03:36 PM Anonymous Says:
“ Do not ban Lipa's music, as this is a work of art, and alot of talent goes into it. ”
You are either joking or a legitimate am'haoretz. We are not "banning" any music or artists and I don't know if the Rav involved in this article was among those who signed the letter against the LIPA concert last year without knowing what was in the letter and later claimed their names were inserted without permission. This is only a minhag about not listening to music for the 3 weeks before tisha ba'av. Afterwards, you can go back an listen to your LIPA tapes 24x7.
36
Jul 09, 2009 at 04:39 PM Anonymous Says:
Okay, listen. If a person is really upset about something, is really in mourning, is really sad, they're not going to WANT to listen to music, get their hair cut, or go to a party. So this whole conversation really angers me. If you're upset about the Bait HaMikdash, then don't listen to any kind of music. If you're not, then does it really matter? A capella, instrumental, live...it doesn't matter because you're only doing letter of the law and not spirit of the law. If you have to ask, you're not doing what you should be doing.
37
Jul 09, 2009 at 05:18 PM Philologos Says:
“ kaplan is NOT related to the french word "chaplain", it is a corruption of the hebrew/aramaic word "Kablan" (artisan) ”
#17's etiology is at least as mistabra than yours. As many European yiddishe names have latin/greek roots as have hebrew/aramaic roots.
38
Jul 09, 2009 at 06:48 PM Anonymous Says:
#36 said
"If you have to ask, you're not doing what you should be doing."
You are not of the opinion that it is important to have a clear understanding of the details of halacha?
39
Jul 09, 2009 at 07:58 PM Bon Venusti Says:
“ kaplan is NOT related to the french word "chaplain", it is a corruption of the hebrew/aramaic word "Kablan" (artisan) ”
No. You are wrong. Kaplan is polish for Priest. Many Cohanim are in fact named Kaplan and variations thereof.
40
Jul 09, 2009 at 07:43 PM Anonymous Says:
Here's another spin on things: what about the synthesizer that most of them use to make their voices sound like real instruments? I see absolutely no difference halachikly between the synthesizer/computer and a real instrument.
41
Jul 09, 2009 at 07:42 PM Anonymous Says:
“ #36 said
"If you have to ask, you're not doing what you should be doing."
You are not of the opinion that it is important to have a clear understanding of the details of halacha?
”
I had a feeling someone was going to ask that. But if someone really thinks that there's a difference between listening to live music and listening to music on a cd, then they don't really know what the feeling of mourning is. When you're upset-truly upset-about something, you wouldn't even think of listening to music in any form. It would physically and emotionally "hurt" to do so. For example-I needed a haircut (this is true). I looked at the calendar last Friday and saw that the last day I could get a haircut before 17 b'Tmmuz was Wednesday. But Wednesday was my father's yahrzeit, and my hairdresser wasn't going to be in until that day. I didn't have to ask a Rabbi. I KNEW that I wasn't going to get a haircut on my father's yahrzeit, even if I now have to wait 3 more weeks to do so. I wouldn't THINK of doing something that brings me enjoyment, even though this was not his first yahrzeit, it was his 9th. I might have found out that it was fine. Or I might have found out that it wasn't. But I didn't need to ask because I have the genuine feeling of his yahrzeit. The details of the halacha don't matter in this case. I have the genuine, inside knowledge. Again, if you have to ask, you are not doing the right thing. And the Rabbis can demand and demand but if people don't care, it's all empty obedience.
42
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:14 PM Anonymous Says:
I like R' Hoffman, but this piece offered no insight, it was really weak, my 14 year old son could have written this.
43
Jul 09, 2009 at 10:12 PM Anonymous Says:
Several words, such as zeal, atlas, volcano, cereal, and names of planets come from the names of Greek or Roman "gods"-maybe those words shouldn't be used either. The word "office" originally meant church service.
44
Jul 09, 2009 at 10:07 PM Anonymous Says:
“ So in 2009 we can't give up 3 weeks of listening to music? How spoiled we've become... ”
Yeah, but we also lost 7 weeks due to sfira, or did your canary-sized brain forget already?
45
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:28 PM SimchaB Says:
Rav Chaim P. Sheinberg shlita publicly stated in a shiur in Bklyn about a dozen years ago that it's mutar to listen to classical music during sefira as the issur is only on dance music.
46
Jul 09, 2009 at 11:54 PM lingua franac Says:
“ Several words, such as zeal, atlas, volcano, cereal, and names of planets come from the names of Greek or Roman "gods"-maybe those words shouldn't be used either. The word "office" originally meant church service. ”
Many "jewish" words are also of greek origin. "Afikomen" is Greek. "Sanhedrin" is Greek. And there are more.
47
Jul 10, 2009 at 06:39 AM onemanband613 Says:
“ Yeah, but we also lost 7 weeks due to sfira, or did your canary-sized brain forget already? ”
Big deal. So you can't listne for 7 weeks. In truth, we're really not supposed to listen to music. PERIOD. The only reason why we do, is because we never accepted the psak. So I think we can learn to stop for 7 weeks if we must. GROW UP PEOPLE!
48
Jul 10, 2009 at 06:35 AM onemanband613 Says:
“ I had a feeling someone was going to ask that. But if someone really thinks that there's a difference between listening to live music and listening to music on a cd, then they don't really know what the feeling of mourning is. When you're upset-truly upset-about something, you wouldn't even think of listening to music in any form. It would physically and emotionally "hurt" to do so. For example-I needed a haircut (this is true). I looked at the calendar last Friday and saw that the last day I could get a haircut before 17 b'Tmmuz was Wednesday. But Wednesday was my father's yahrzeit, and my hairdresser wasn't going to be in until that day. I didn't have to ask a Rabbi. I KNEW that I wasn't going to get a haircut on my father's yahrzeit, even if I now have to wait 3 more weeks to do so. I wouldn't THINK of doing something that brings me enjoyment, even though this was not his first yahrzeit, it was his 9th. I might have found out that it was fine. Or I might have found out that it wasn't. But I didn't need to ask because I have the genuine feeling of his yahrzeit. The details of the halacha don't matter in this case. I have the genuine, inside knowledge. Again, if you have to ask, you are not doing the right thing. And the Rabbis can demand and demand but if people don't care, it's all empty obedience. ”
Well said. Shame on us for not understanding what it means to mourn. As Rabbi Orlofsky said, Ta'aneisim are viewed as "Something to get through. 'It's a ta'anis? Oy! I have to go to work with a headache!' 'It's the 3 weeks? I have to live without music?' " All of this goes through the minds of today's world, and yes, it's mainly because we are too comfortable living in Galus.
49
Jul 10, 2009 at 08:35 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Rav Chaim P. Sheinberg shlita publicly stated in a shiur in Bklyn about a dozen years ago that it's mutar to listen to classical music during sefira as the issur is only on dance music. ”
"Rav Chaim P. Sheinberg shlita publicly stated in a shiur in Bklyn about a dozen years ago that it's mutar to listen to classical music during sefira as the issur is only on dance music"
You are right. Rav. Sheinberg, Rav Binyamim Liebovitch and others have ruled that it is permissible to listen to classical music and other liturgical music but Not to pop or dance mustic during the 7 weeks. Those who want to impose their own chumrahs on this or any other form of "denial" during the 3 weeks are always free to do so and earn yichus with the ebeshter.
50
Jul 10, 2009 at 09:09 AM Anonymous Says:
As usual, these comments are filled with the same old tough guy talk from the chumra bullies. In these hard times, I believe this is one area to be quite lenient. We all need more simcha in our lives, and to the extent that music brings you simcha, go for it. If Hashem doesn't like the way we are treating his days of mourning, then He should come quickly and take them away!
51
Jul 12, 2009 at 03:06 AM Milhouse Says:
“ all this music that they play is not jewish music by just puting on some jewish word dose not make it jewish music, so jewish music says only jewish music you my not listen to all this so called music you can listen to including the 3 weeks 9 days all the time and brake a leg ”
So what does make music Jewish?
52
Jul 13, 2009 at 03:25 PM Anonymous Says:
“ It would not be appropriate to ask the rebbe to clarify conflicts in his multiple psaks on this issue. The best we can do is to seek to understand what he might have meant ”
That's ridiculous. Habayshon aino lamed.
The problem, as others have said, is that these Rabbonim don't understand how music on CDs and such are used nowadays - to keep us awake when driving, or as background fuzz. That's not comparable at all to the original issur, which comes from "Bashir lo yishtu yayin".
Anyone who wants to be machmir - tavo alav bracha; but those who don't, whatever. This is not one of the ikkarei hadas. Concentrate instead (and aderaba!) on ahavas yisrael.
53
Jul 15, 2009 at 11:01 PM Anonymous Says:
Rav Menashe Zer klien writes in his Mshuneh Halachos, tipshus.