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White Lake, NY - Hasidic Colony Board Member Links Treatment By Town To Iran |
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The owner of a bungalow colony obtained a permit to build this community center and shul, but town officials say colony members do not have permission to use the building, and an engineer says it's unsafe. Times Herald-Record/DOMINICK FIORILLE
"The stop work order and order to vacate is posted in the window, and we expect it to be complied with," Supervisor Dan Sturm told two Hasidic men while others strolled in an out of the unfinished building off Route 17B holding prayer books. "It will be complied with."
Residents of the colony on Schultz Road last week started using the large center without a certificate of occupancy, Sturm said.
The colony is owned by United Talmudical Academy Torah Neyirah, which has a Brooklyn mailing address, according to town records. Colony board member Isaac Berger likened the treatment by the town to "Iran with one faction persecuted."
Berger said town building officials promised to give the colony a temporary certificate when some minor conditions were met. He said the building was regularly inspected while under construction over the past two months.
"The town reneged on their promise," he said.
The brick building, located about 1,000 feet off Route 17B, is in plain view. Bethel residents have lodged numerous complaints that colony members were using the building. UTA has a permit to build the 6,900-square-foot center, but it had not been finished or given a final inspection, town officials say.
Engineer Michael Weeks, of McGoey, Hauser and Edsall, visited the property Tuesday evening and deemed it unsafe. Weeks wrote in a letter that he noticed several people coming and going and numerous vehicles parked in front.
The unfinished parking area had steep side slopes. The lot hasn't been graded.
"At present, this site poses a clear danger to its users and other members of the public," he wrote.
Sturm said the town will issue violations as long as the colony continues to violate the order not to use the building. The town also plans a detailed site plan and building review to determine if the colony has complied with the building permit.
"The fact they are using the building is obviously a violation of the town code," Sturm said while standing and watching people come and go. "Obviously, they have a difference of opinion."
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Read Comments (42) — Post Yours »
1
Jul 18, 2009 at 10:44 PM Anonymous Says:
It is very common for towns and localities to delay issueing COs on newly constructed properties. Anyone involved in real estate knows and understands this. Obviously the colony did not start building early enough to complete the project before the summer season. They have no right though to disobey the law and aithoriteis in such a flagrant manner. This causes a chillul Hashem and more animosity between Jews, and especially Orthodox Jews, and their neighbors.
2
Jul 18, 2009 at 10:42 PM Anonymous Says:
Why do Chasidim think they're above the law?
3
Jul 18, 2009 at 10:41 PM hershy Says:
Now I smell they are guilty, to speak with such a naive mind against the local municipal town, undefensble.
Now, why did he say iran? what has the code with a local town with iran? what has defying orders with a dictator of iran? only to make them look like animals.
Chillul hashem and shame for such behavior.
4
Jul 18, 2009 at 10:53 PM abe Says:
I know from inside info that there is no reason to stop them from getting the c of o every thing is legally good. The only reason is cuz the supervisor is before elections an he has pressure from the near by neighbors to stop them. In a letter what neighbors(known as anti semitic) which was send to the supervisor complaining about that shul they wrote We hate jews" . An escpecially when they are expanding in our view.
And the town there is fully corrupted so they trying to get more votes for thier side.
5
Jul 18, 2009 at 10:39 PM Anonymous Says:
It seems like every community in the Catskills is trying to get rid of these chassidim from Brooklyn who show up every summer and act like the laws don't apply to them. With their recent behavior, its no wonder no one wnats them nearby and tries to get rid of them by any legal means. Maybe if yiddin would stop acting with arrogance and followed the rules, they wouldn't be the target of such "harassment".
6
Jul 18, 2009 at 10:39 PM na nach Says:
if its unsafe, dont go in!! the inspectors would know if its unsafe. what if s/o got hurt in there, we will hear "its the 3 weeks" or " we must stop saying lashon hora" just do it according to code and it will be safe to use for many years
7
Jul 18, 2009 at 10:34 PM Big Masmid Says:
I see Hisgarus Beimos is only allowed by Satmar but not by the Zionists.
8
Jul 18, 2009 at 10:33 PM cp Says:
If we just had a little respect for local governments, we would not wind up with these problems. IS IT SO HARD TO BE EHRLICH?!?!
9
Jul 18, 2009 at 10:59 PM who needs moshiach Says:
if we feel that
we're baleybatim
here, y daven 4
the geula shleyma?
10
Jul 18, 2009 at 10:58 PM Anonymous Says:
This has nothing to do with code. It all about a nighbor who is is a big developer and tries to stop this shul.
11
Jul 18, 2009 at 11:23 PM Anonymous Says:
they don't want us. but they want our taxes and water charges.
its all curopted they will only understand if we take action
12
Jul 18, 2009 at 11:18 PM Anonymous Says:
A real Chillul Hashem, the people who are doing this Chillul Hashem are the same people who are constantly busy criticizing Kiryas Joel for not following building codes and making a Chillul Hashem,
what hypecrites!
practice what preach!
13
Jul 18, 2009 at 11:45 PM Anonymous Says:
“ This has nothing to do with code. It all about a nighbor who is is a big developer and tries to stop this shul. ”
It is stupid to argue that a developer is trying to stop this construction, if the construction plans were reviewed and permitted, them there is no way they could stop the occupancy, only if they did not complete the inspections, there are times if there is only a few small items outstanding, the building department could give you 30 day temp CO, however from the above article it sound like the parking lot was not even started, that alone will hold back even a temp CO, in every locality in every state (except in KJ), I could tell you that for a fact.
This is noting more them Satmer is trying to arm twist the inspectors and the town.
14
Jul 18, 2009 at 11:42 PM Anonymous Says:
Which colony is this?
15
Jul 18, 2009 at 11:56 PM mewhoze Says:
vote upstate BUT follow the rules!
16
Jul 19, 2009 at 12:41 AM jay Says:
I am working for the person who build that shul.
So i know it pest the inspection 100%
An then we ask for the CO they replyd sorry I can't give. so we ask them tell us what's wrong an we will fix right away so the answer was I know thet every think is 100%good but I can't give you a co cuz we have heat from the neighbors
17
Jul 19, 2009 at 12:32 AM Anonymous Says:
“ I see Hisgarus Beimos is only allowed by Satmar but not by the Zionists. ”
It doesn't really matter what Satmar will or will not do, you're always here just to criticize satmar and all frum yidden.
18
Jul 19, 2009 at 12:27 AM moshe Says:
it time that that the summer residents change their adress to be able to vote buy the local election in september (as long as you live their 30 days its as you live their ).i promise u the whole situation will change . these problems are hapening all over the catskils & it is unjustifeid .the local towns are reaping big time from the orthodok community ,the jobs & taxes let's start like gas /telephone service /lumber /plumbers /satitation companies & all the sale taxes at the department stores. rabosai wake up register to vote & go to vote
19
Jul 19, 2009 at 12:26 AM Anonymous Says:
“ It seems like every community in the Catskills is trying to get rid of these chassidim from Brooklyn who show up every summer and act like the laws don't apply to them. With their recent behavior, its no wonder no one wnats them nearby and tries to get rid of them by any legal means. Maybe if yiddin would stop acting with arrogance and followed the rules, they wouldn't be the target of such "harassment". ”
Thay don't want to get rid of us, they live off our money all year! without the summer life up there, there would be deserted with no business and no income. and to tell you even more, we live in very good terms with most residents/neighbors. there are just a few bad ones that like to pinch when ever they have a chance to..
20
Jul 19, 2009 at 12:22 AM Anonymous Says:
They completed a punch list that the town inspector thta at the day of completing that list they will get a temp C.O., in fact they completed that punch list, but the process of giving the CO was stalled, but since they knew they've done all the inspector asked for its safe to use it, "the means are done, they're just waiting for the piece of paper".
Comparing to Iran (if its true that someone said it) is plain stupid.
21
Jul 19, 2009 at 12:21 AM embarresed Says:
i just dont understand why these people feel that they`re above the law. so sad. such a chilul hashem. and then they wonder why the goyim hate them, and are out to get them. obey the laws.
22
Jul 19, 2009 at 12:18 AM Sam Says:
“ It is very common for towns and localities to delay issueing COs on newly constructed properties. Anyone involved in real estate knows and understands this. Obviously the colony did not start building early enough to complete the project before the summer season. They have no right though to disobey the law and aithoriteis in such a flagrant manner. This causes a chillul Hashem and more animosity between Jews, and especially Orthodox Jews, and their neighbors. ”
I don't comment often but I need to stick in my two cents. First of all, enough with the Chillul Hashems (or however you would pluralize the verb). Building codes are complicated and you need to follow the local laws, so do it. Second of all, poster #1 uses an expression which is a pet peeve of mine. He (or she) writes, "They have no right..." Actually one has the right to violate a law and the authorities have a right (and an obligation) to arrest you. The term "right" is a loaded constitutional term and I wish that people would stop over-using the term.
23
Jul 19, 2009 at 12:16 AM John the Farmer Says:
Why are jews coming to our communities for a couple of months a year and destroying our peaceful & quiet way of Life? Why do they think they can have special treatment? If they live & act like animals in New York City, that is their problem.. why do we have to suffer?
24
Jul 18, 2009 at 11:52 PM Anonymous Says:
“ A real Chillul Hashem, the people who are doing this Chillul Hashem are the same people who are constantly busy criticizing Kiryas Joel for not following building codes and making a Chillul Hashem,
what hypecrites!
practice what preach! ”
Please explain yourself the opposite, these people are acting like KJ they think they could dismiss the local codes or even National Building Codes and Industry Standards
25
Jul 19, 2009 at 06:53 AM Avrohom Abba Says:
Advice...they are definitely not being nice, but be a better mentch and show them that you are definitely being nice.
Bmakom sheayn sham ish, hishtadel lihyos ish.
In my opinion, the shul should grade the sides of the parking lot properly and comply with the law. If they find a new violation, comply again. This is not such a strange slowdown in the process, in any township. Relax, they will eventually approve, so why enter the town on a bad foot?
Thay have to be flooded with niceness and cooperation, until they have no alternative but to allow the shul to function fully.
You will spend much less money if you fix the vioalations, than you will spend for legal fees and lawyers and then of course, the usual, expected appeals, and then the future additional appeals and then you'll have to fix the violations anyway.
Knowing that, smile, and fix the problems and then smile again.
26
Jul 19, 2009 at 06:29 AM UBET Says:
They call it Toraa Neyirah. Is that suppsed to be Tora V'yira as in Satmar? ( UTA? )
27
Jul 19, 2009 at 07:57 AM Anonymous Says:
“ They call it Toraa Neyirah. Is that suppsed to be Tora V'yira as in Satmar? ( UTA? ) ”
Gei Leren Mit Ah Goy Bartenura.
28
Jul 19, 2009 at 07:57 AM Anonymous Says:
“ I see Hisgarus Beimos is only allowed by Satmar but not by the Zionists. ”
Interesting point!
29
Jul 19, 2009 at 03:52 AM Shlomo Says:
“ I am working for the person who build that shul.
So i know it pest the inspection 100%
An then we ask for the CO they replyd sorry I can't give. so we ask them tell us what's wrong an we will fix right away so the answer was I know thet every think is 100%good but I can't give you a co cuz we have heat from the neighbors ”
So, you have a second-hand story that it is "100% good" but that there is "heat from the neighbors." I don't care about stories: I want the paperwork. Governments are bound by documentation: they have to provide details as to why the building didn't pass code for the C of O. If they don't have documentation, they must issue at least at temporary C of O.
30
Jul 19, 2009 at 08:39 AM Anonymous Says:
Doea any body know a person in this colony with this name? he's quoted with such a hard accusation comparing building inspectors to Iran, and still there's no such a person in this colony..
Is there something fishy with this story?
31
Jul 19, 2009 at 02:35 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Why are jews coming to our communities for a couple of months a year and destroying our peaceful & quiet way of Life? Why do they think they can have special treatment? If they live & act like animals in New York City, that is their problem.. why do we have to suffer? ”
What kind of farm do u have ? And can I come with my kids apple picking ?or is it a corn field ?you are a farmer like I'm a cheese manufacture
32
Jul 19, 2009 at 02:29 AM Anonymous Says:
“ They completed a punch list that the town inspector thta at the day of completing that list they will get a temp C.O., in fact they completed that punch list, but the process of giving the CO was stalled, but since they knew they've done all the inspector asked for its safe to use it, "the means are done, they're just waiting for the piece of paper".
Comparing to Iran (if its true that someone said it) is plain stupid. ”
Again how can you claim that all the items on PL was done, when the article said that that the grading for parking lot was not even started, that tells me that your are talking none sense, don’t think we are all stupid.
33
Jul 19, 2009 at 09:12 AM Zevsky Rebbe Says:
This is just another case of the growing anti-semitism which will soon become unbearable and will force the Jews to start moving to Eretz Yisroel. With Obama in office the gentiles have been enboldened and can now start showing their true anti-semitic colors.
I am begining to feel and smell the growing anti-semitism in the air and sure I'm not the only one. The gentiles are poised to let out their wrath on the Jews for their economic woes. As the economy contibues to melt down we will feel an increase in anti-semitism which most of us thought was never possible.
To be continued......
34
Jul 19, 2009 at 02:23 AM Anonymous Says:
“ I am working for the person who build that shul.
So i know it pest the inspection 100%
An then we ask for the CO they replyd sorry I can't give. so we ask them tell us what's wrong an we will fix right away so the answer was I know thet every think is 100%good but I can't give you a co cuz we have heat from the neighbors ”
Well let me put it is way; I am familiar with retail construction, that is what I do for a living. I don’t know what your boss told you, however let me assure you if your boss passed his inspection and if there is no other outstanding contractors, then there is no way the city will refuse the final CO.
This is what I speculate happened, there is two general contractors, one on the site, on the building, and an other for the outside parking lot, which is normal, even if your GC completed 100% the building, the landlord will not get the CO or a temp CO unless the exterior site passed all the inspection, I don’t care how you shake it, that is the norm in all municipalities. So stop talking like you know the outstanding issues, you don’t.
35
Jul 19, 2009 at 01:36 AM Anonymous Says:
(Reply to #18)
That's why they got the stop order cuz the neighbors around there are resisted voters an now is before elections in town of bathle so neighbors are all against building that
Biys hamedresh
Bottom line we need to register to vote an that will help a lot for camps country's in upstate
36
Jul 19, 2009 at 09:17 AM shmuel Says:
why should they obey the towns safety and legal codes??... it must be anti semitism and anti-hasidism...by calling the town inspectors iranian and the like they are showing them who is boss...building and safety codes are for goyim and irreligious jews..afterall we know better and ofcourse hashem will protect us regardless..they did more then required by obtaining a building permit....
37
Jul 19, 2009 at 09:21 AM Anonymous Says:
“ Why are jews coming to our communities for a couple of months a year and destroying our peaceful & quiet way of Life? Why do they think they can have special treatment? If they live & act like animals in New York City, that is their problem.. why do we have to suffer? ”
I spoke to one of the managers at Wal-Mart before the season started. I asked if it's difficult for him when it gets crowded with Yidden upstate. He answered " I would be out of a job if they didn't show up. I'm very happy that they come up here."
Yes, we do have to learn to be kinder, friendlier and basically a mentch, even when dealing with people who are not from our community. All around though, wer'e doing pretty good. Nowhere else in the world would you see such an influx of people coming every summer and hardly raising the crime level at all. We bring our own volunteer ambulance service etc. The locals enjoy the kosher stores, Sox and More and so on.
I'm sure that if Lapidus would reach out to their neighbors on a constant basis. they would not have to deal with all of this baloney. Their is no doubt that the building department is under pressure from neighbors. Anyone who deals with them knows that they usually allow you to use a building temporarily until the c/o is completed.
Satmar people generally have to learn to deal with the outside world alot better.
It can only be to their benefit.
38
Jul 19, 2009 at 10:31 AM APY Says:
Now if somebody will be hurt under the unsafe conditions, they will call a ypm tefila.
39
Jul 19, 2009 at 11:48 AM Big Masmid Says:
“ This is just another case of the growing anti-semitism which will soon become unbearable and will force the Jews to start moving to Eretz Yisroel. With Obama in office the gentiles have been enboldened and can now start showing their true anti-semitic colors.
I am begining to feel and smell the growing anti-semitism in the air and sure I'm not the only one. The gentiles are poised to let out their wrath on the Jews for their economic woes. As the economy contibues to melt down we will feel an increase in anti-semitism which most of us thought was never possible.
To be continued...... ”
I feel the same way, by the time his first term will come to end we will be in big
trouble here R'L, Hope moshiach comes very soon.
I hope he will be thrown out of office after his first term just like Carter.
40
Jul 19, 2009 at 03:49 PM Anonymous Says:
It seems that many chassidim live by the sword. Ignore the inspectors in the Catskills. Do what you want in KJ. Meah Shearim is a free-for-all. We chassidim understand Munchausens. We know building safety rules. We know everything about everything. We know that burning plastics in Yerushalayim doesn't really release toxins that are bad for you. No. That is a zionist rumour too.
You know what? The chassidim may have to escape the antisemitic persecution of upstate New York and yerushalayim and move back to Hungary where they can live in peace like there ancestors.
Only then will there be shalom beyisrael. At least for the rest of us.
41
Jul 19, 2009 at 04:10 PM Anonymous Says:
“ It seems that many chassidim live by the sword. Ignore the inspectors in the Catskills. Do what you want in KJ. Meah Shearim is a free-for-all. We chassidim understand Munchausens. We know building safety rules. We know everything about everything. We know that burning plastics in Yerushalayim doesn't really release toxins that are bad for you. No. That is a zionist rumour too.
You know what? The chassidim may have to escape the antisemitic persecution of upstate New York and yerushalayim and move back to Hungary where they can live in peace like there ancestors.
Only then will there be shalom beyisrael. At least for the rest of us. ”
Went around this morning looking for "Isaac Berger" (the name quoted saying this stupid statement), and there's no such person there!
this was either a provocation by someone, or a dirty trick of someone that wanted to make this colony look bad.
The people there were outraged that someone could've said such a statement to compare those nice and understanding officials to Iran.
42
Jul 19, 2009 at 07:50 PM A. Nuran Says:
If you can't be bothered to obey the law you need to expect this kind of thing. Screw 'em.