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New York - Undermining the Talmud Bavli By Arguing The Halacha For Lulav On Shabbos

Published on: October 1, 2009 12:58 PM
By: VIN News by Rabbi Yair Hoffman
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New York - Sometimes the worldviews of sociologists and religious leaders are miles and miles apart.  Where a sociologist would cheer, a Torah leader would shed tears.Example: A sociologist would be overjoyed in seeing the birth of a new religious or schismatic movement.  A Rabbi would be deeply saddened at the loss.

First century (letaaricham) Jerusalem would have been a prime example.  Mecca and Medina in the 7th century when Islam was born is another example.  Hamburg, Germany in the late 1700’s was where Reform Jewry was born.  Haskalah, throughout Europe, in the 18th, 19th, and early 20th century, was another such treasure trove.  The turn of the twentieth century in the United States was when the conservative movement was born. 
Sociologists would love to observe these schismatic movements in their nascent form. 

Religious leaders, on the other hand, shed numerous tears.  Why?  The “what if?’s” of course.  Imagine if all the major maskilim, reform and conservative Jews would have used their creative minds and talents in Torah instead of the schismatic movements and their theologies.  The world would be a different place, surely.

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This same duality exists in the latest manifestation of schismatic movements as well. 

For some reason there is a new movement that tries to do away with the logic and authority of the Talmud Bavli and grasp on to minhagim of our people’s past that once existed and give rise to them again.  It seems that every Yom Tov we find people adopting practices that normative Judaism no longer practices. 

The latest case in point is an article published by Yediot Ahronot  and posted by VIN News about taking the Lulav on the first day of Yom Tov when it falls on Shabbos.  According to the Bavli (Sukkah 43b), Shulchan Aruch, Mishna Brura and an entire cadre of Rishonim and Achronim the move is utterly ridiculous.

Chazal specifically wanted the halacha as practiced in Eretz Yisroel to be exactly like that practiced in Chutz LaAretz.  Nonetheless, there is a persistence on the part of some people to move forward and carry the Lulav on Shabbos. 

To quote the article posted on VIN News:
This year I will add another mitzvah to that list: taking the lulav on Shabbat. Although I will take the lulav in my sukka, before I go to synagogue, I pray for the day when all of the people of Israel will be ready to fulfil the mitzvah of lulav on Shabbat..

The question is what are the sociological factors that have led to this attempt to unshackle themselves from the guidance and authority of the Bavli? 

It would seem that it is a combination of a number of factors.  Firstly, the rise in Israeli nationalism is a contributing factor – people wish to display new fervor in the fact that we have a Jewish state under Jewish auspices.  At the same time they wish to move beyond the areas in which the chief rabbinate have moved in regard to anything remotely having a nationalistic theme.

Another factor is the idea that there is a resentment in the fact that expertise and leadership in halacha is now relegated to a limited circle.  In the secular world, a lawyer can argue a case and influence the world in case law.  Later they can make changes in normative legal practice as judges.  Not so in halacha.  There is a growing sense of frustration among these people and they need a venue of expression. 

Finally, the third factor may be a certain sense of haughtiness.  It takes guts to take on established authoritiy.  It takes sheer haughtiness however to disagree with Rashi.  Rashi tells us (Sukkah 44a) that Chazal felt that in order to keep Jewish Achdus chazal changed the halacha for Eretz Yisroel and made them conform to our halachos of not using the Lulav on Shabbos.  The concern, according to Rashi, Achdus – Jewish unity.

Imagine if we in the golus and those Jews in Israel had different Yamim Tovim.  It would lead to a dismemberment of the Jewish world.  A catastrophic scenario the implications of which Chazak were quire aware.

So please, out there, let’s cut the garbage, and give the Talmud Bavli the respect it deserves.

The author can be reached at yairhoffma2@gmail.com


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1

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:04 PM OJoe Says:

Decent article overall, but he writes "Imagine if we in the golus and those Jews in Israel had different Yamim Tovim"

We do. Its called Yom Tov sheni.

2

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:05 PM Anonymous Says:

well written

3

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:18 PM Anonymous Says:

We are making too much of a broigas over somthing as trivial as whether or not to bench lulav and esrog in the privacy of one's sukkah next shabbos. There is a lot more these rabbonim and baalabtim can do for achdus in klal yisroel than elevating this to a significance beyond what it deserves.

4

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:20 PM Lawyer Says:

The Rambam in his introduction to Mishneh Torah writes that the beis din of Ravina and Rav Ashi was the last beis din to be acceptable by all of klal yisroel, and that is why their psak is authorative and binding. R. Chaim Brisker explained that the Rambam means that any such beis din (accepted by all of klal yisroel) has the status of the beis din ha gadol -- and their psak accordingly must be followed under the possuk of lo sassur. That is what is meant by Ravina and Rav Ashi sof horaa.

5

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:20 PM Chaim S. Says:

Kol hamoidif goreah. I really know that Chazal knew exactly what they were doing when they said no lulav and no shofar on shabbos. The act of denying the authority of chazal by saying I'll be frummer than chazal and I will take a lulav brings with it the possibility of denying other rabbinical rules. After all I am rationalizing my acts by saying they really don't know.

7

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:34 PM Lawyer Says:

Reply to #3  
Anonymous Says:

We are making too much of a broigas over somthing as trivial as whether or not to bench lulav and esrog in the privacy of one's sukkah next shabbos. There is a lot more these rabbonim and baalabtim can do for achdus in klal yisroel than elevating this to a significance beyond what it deserves.

Completely disagree. Remember the story of R. Tarfon, who was machmir like Beis Shammai to lean on his side when he read kriyas shema in the evening. The Chachamim said he should have been chayyav misa for that!

Chazal made a gezirah: don't take a lulav (or blow shofar) on Shabbos because we are concerned someone may carry it and thereby be mechallel Shabbos. That is the psak of the Talmud Bavli. This person is saying, no, we don't need to worry about that, let's take one anyway. That is a direct challenge to the authority of Chazal. Might as well burn the Talmud while you are at it.

Not to mention that if followed the psak will in some cases lead to Chillul Shabbos.

(Also, the acharonim has a safeik if one does the mitzvah anyway whether you have fulfilled the mitzvah or not. The issue came up with respect to blowing shofar, where some Rishonim, notably the Rif, say you should blow it on Shabbos where there is a beis din. We do not follow that psak. About 100 years ago, someone in Yerushalayim wanted to be noheig that way. Many rabbonim opposed it. Many argued that under these circumstances there is no kiyyum ha mitzvah.

If, as may acharonim hold, you do not fufill a mitzvah if you do so in violation of a gezeirah, then the beracha is le vatalah. Think about that.)

8

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:47 PM Anonymous Says:

there have been many new movements that have been accepted. chassidus, the mussar movement, charedism...

9

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:57 PM Anonymous Says:

"It would seem that it is a combination of a number of factors. Firstly, the rise in Israeli nationalism is a contributing factor – people wish to display new fervor in the fact that we have a Jewish state under Jewish auspices. At the same time they wish to move beyond the areas in which the chief rabbinate have moved in regard to anything remotely having a nationalistic theme." As a firm AntiZionist Yid I find this to be further evidence that Zionism is NOT Judaism and if anything fosters an environment for apikorsim to thrive! A Jew becomes Israeli first and Jew second! They no longer know their right hand from their left!

10

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:57 PM YOSSIE Says:

i fail to understand the hangup about these people wanting to bentch lulav on shabbos
what is driving these people
i really dont thimk its the extreme love for the mitzvah but more to show that eretz yisroel today is the same as in the time of the bais hamikdash
this is very dangerous
and to deviate from halach even one iota is bordering on being a ciofer
these people need to get a life

11

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:56 PM Shtus Says:

This year, I am going to schect my korban pesach in the sukkah on shabbos, waive my arba minim over it and blow a shofar after bentching shehakol on the rice and kitnyos while wearing my techelis tzisis on a linen talis, but only after kissing the silkscreened mezuza. Following the afikoman, we are serving peacock heads in cream sauce. All are invited. The ladies will be given aylias to the Torah only if they wear tefilin and make the berachas two at a time in unison.

12

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:54 PM Charlie Hall Says:

While I totally agree that we should not take the lulav on Shabat, halachah isn't quite so simple as following the last decision in the Bavli. There exist situations in which normative practice is contrary to definitive opinions stated there. We need to do a better job of explaining them.

13

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:54 PM totally out of context Says:

ok, i know this is totally out of context, but maybe someone can help me!!!! my esrog is green and i really want to ripen it/ turn it yellow. i did the apple in a drawer thingy but it didnt' really help. any help? (sorry for this random post... but kudn't find anywhere with the answer.......)

14

 Oct 01, 2009 at 02:04 PM Anonymous Says:


Radical Swings in Halacha are not only the purview of sociologists.

Not many years ago the water was "safe" to drink in New York as it had been for 300 years and in the rest of the world bere filtration since Adam.

Until this week Shabbos Elevators had been in wide spread use for decades

15

 Oct 01, 2009 at 01:41 PM Yosef Says:

Reply to #1  
OJoe Says:

Decent article overall, but he writes "Imagine if we in the golus and those Jews in Israel had different Yamim Tovim"

We do. Its called Yom Tov sheni.

oddly enough Yom Tov Sheni doesn't seem to have led to "a dismemberment of the Jewish world"

16

 Oct 01, 2009 at 02:31 PM dont do it Says:

Reply to #13  
totally out of context Says:

ok, i know this is totally out of context, but maybe someone can help me!!!! my esrog is green and i really want to ripen it/ turn it yellow. i did the apple in a drawer thingy but it didnt' really help. any help? (sorry for this random post... but kudn't find anywhere with the answer.......)

do absolutely nothing, there is no halacha that a esrog must be yellow, only that it can turn yellow. hastening the process can turn the esrog into mush, pasuling it for certain.

17

 Oct 01, 2009 at 02:31 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #14  
Anonymous Says:


Radical Swings in Halacha are not only the purview of sociologists.

Not many years ago the water was "safe" to drink in New York as it had been for 300 years and in the rest of the world bere filtration since Adam.

Until this week Shabbos Elevators had been in wide spread use for decades

You are obviously not aware of the issues pertaining to the water. Perhaps educate yourself before making such broad accusations

18

 Oct 01, 2009 at 02:29 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #3  
Anonymous Says:

We are making too much of a broigas over somthing as trivial as whether or not to bench lulav and esrog in the privacy of one's sukkah next shabbos. There is a lot more these rabbonim and baalabtim can do for achdus in klal yisroel than elevating this to a significance beyond what it deserves.

Well the Torah relegates the issues of achdus specifically to the realm of Halacha. ge Lo Sisgodido. This is a very vital issue. This is all beside the obvious point here that those in pursuit of these types of changes have a broader agenda against the reverence in which we hold the Shulchan Aruch. Just another method of creating schism or shall I say "ism" as was the result of all those who attempted such things in the past

19

 Oct 01, 2009 at 02:26 PM Charlie Hall Says:

Reply to #14  
Anonymous Says:


Radical Swings in Halacha are not only the purview of sociologists.

Not many years ago the water was "safe" to drink in New York as it had been for 300 years and in the rest of the world bere filtration since Adam.

Until this week Shabbos Elevators had been in wide spread use for decades

Actually the New York water system only dates to the mid-19th century, but your point is well taken. Whether we take into account new discoveries that it was impossible for the earlier deciders to have known is itself a halachic controversy.

20

 Oct 01, 2009 at 02:33 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #15  
Yosef Says:

oddly enough Yom Tov Sheni doesn't seem to have led to "a dismemberment of the Jewish world"

Nothing odd about it. The same Chazal that required 1 day in EY required 2 days in the diapora. And for reasons that didn't apply in EY. I suggest you read up on the subject

21

 Oct 01, 2009 at 02:28 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #13  
totally out of context Says:

ok, i know this is totally out of context, but maybe someone can help me!!!! my esrog is green and i really want to ripen it/ turn it yellow. i did the apple in a drawer thingy but it didnt' really help. any help? (sorry for this random post... but kudn't find anywhere with the answer.......)

If you take the esrog with your lulav into your sukah on Shabbos before shachris, it will quickly turn yellow.

23

 Oct 01, 2009 at 03:08 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #20  
Anonymous Says:

Nothing odd about it. The same Chazal that required 1 day in EY required 2 days in the diapora. And for reasons that didn't apply in EY. I suggest you read up on the subject

Chasidus teaches that it takes one day to download the energy associated with that Yom Tov, while in chutz le'Arutz it takes two days.

24

 Oct 01, 2009 at 03:04 PM Robert Says:

Reply to #9  
Anonymous Says:

"It would seem that it is a combination of a number of factors. Firstly, the rise in Israeli nationalism is a contributing factor – people wish to display new fervor in the fact that we have a Jewish state under Jewish auspices. At the same time they wish to move beyond the areas in which the chief rabbinate have moved in regard to anything remotely having a nationalistic theme." As a firm AntiZionist Yid I find this to be further evidence that Zionism is NOT Judaism and if anything fosters an environment for apikorsim to thrive! A Jew becomes Israeli first and Jew second! They no longer know their right hand from their left!

most people believe that gentile anti-zionism is essentially anti semitism

your quote " As a firm AntiZionist Yid " strikes me as either an oxymoron or narshkeit.

one of the essential differences between reform vs orthodox judaism is the concept of nationalism.. reform judaism has taken jewish nationalism out of the equation.. our job as orthodox jews is to merge authentic religion into zionism to make both more whole and complete.

you are correct in stating zionism is not judaism however true judaism includes much zionist philosophy and action.. it says ki mi tzion taytsei torah.
our goal should be to make the term religious zionism essentially redundant.

25

 Oct 01, 2009 at 02:58 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #8  
Anonymous Says:

there have been many new movements that have been accepted. chassidus, the mussar movement, charedism...

those movements wont be mourned as destructive for at least 100 years

after we all see how their influence plays out in history

remember the famous quote

history is written by the victors

26

 Oct 01, 2009 at 02:55 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #9  
Anonymous Says:

"It would seem that it is a combination of a number of factors. Firstly, the rise in Israeli nationalism is a contributing factor – people wish to display new fervor in the fact that we have a Jewish state under Jewish auspices. At the same time they wish to move beyond the areas in which the chief rabbinate have moved in regard to anything remotely having a nationalistic theme." As a firm AntiZionist Yid I find this to be further evidence that Zionism is NOT Judaism and if anything fosters an environment for apikorsim to thrive! A Jew becomes Israeli first and Jew second! They no longer know their right hand from their left!

And firm AntiZionism is also not Yiddishkeit.

27

 Oct 01, 2009 at 03:47 PM Authentic Londoner Says:

The Vilna Gaon also had strong views on what was and what was not Yiddishkeit

28

 Oct 01, 2009 at 03:52 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #26  
Anonymous Says:

And firm AntiZionism is also not Yiddishkeit.

In the topsy turvy world today unfortunately zionism is yiddishkeit... That withstanding it is by no means authentic Torah Judaism!

29

 Oct 01, 2009 at 03:57 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #24  
Robert Says:

most people believe that gentile anti-zionism is essentially anti semitism

your quote " As a firm AntiZionist Yid " strikes me as either an oxymoron or narshkeit.

one of the essential differences between reform vs orthodox judaism is the concept of nationalism.. reform judaism has taken jewish nationalism out of the equation.. our job as orthodox jews is to merge authentic religion into zionism to make both more whole and complete.

you are correct in stating zionism is not judaism however true judaism includes much zionist philosophy and action.. it says ki mi tzion taytsei torah.
our goal should be to make the term religious zionism essentially redundant.

"most people believe that gentile anti-zionism is essentially anti semitism" Eliyahu HaNavi didnt care what most people thought when they worshiped Hashem and Baal. Neither do I! Zionism is this generations Golden Calf! We need to make Teshuva before it corrupts Torah Judaism! Reform sought to be liek the other nations and zionism was born out of that. Now we have our independent nation just like the nations rather then a Torah Nation whose borders are the Torah and were founded at Har Sinai!

30

 Oct 01, 2009 at 04:09 PM me Says:

So if we are against radical changes, should a visitor to EY now hold only one day of Yom Tov, and should a resident of EY only hold one day of Rosh Hashanah, since they are both of "modern" innovation?

31

 Oct 01, 2009 at 04:31 PM a yid Says:

Reply to #8  
Anonymous Says:

there have been many new movements that have been accepted. chassidus, the mussar movement, charedism...

they didn't change anything from torah/chazal ,only inspired it!
chareidisem as you call it, is nothing new, it just started to be called this way, after the so called "new" modern ortho. was created, just as we started to be called orthodox, after Conservative and reform were created!

32

 Oct 01, 2009 at 04:29 PM esther Says:

it seems to me that this is a misguided case of wanting to be more frum then the rest-it says in chasidus that sometimes the yaitzer hara comes dressed up in a bekeshe and black hat.

33

 Oct 01, 2009 at 04:25 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #3  
Anonymous Says:

We are making too much of a broigas over somthing as trivial as whether or not to bench lulav and esrog in the privacy of one's sukkah next shabbos. There is a lot more these rabbonim and baalabtim can do for achdus in klal yisroel than elevating this to a significance beyond what it deserves.

you should never have achdus with such jews!

34

 Oct 01, 2009 at 06:41 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #11  
Shtus Says:

This year, I am going to schect my korban pesach in the sukkah on shabbos, waive my arba minim over it and blow a shofar after bentching shehakol on the rice and kitnyos while wearing my techelis tzisis on a linen talis, but only after kissing the silkscreened mezuza. Following the afikoman, we are serving peacock heads in cream sauce. All are invited. The ladies will be given aylias to the Torah only if they wear tefilin and make the berachas two at a time in unison.

Excellent.
Love it!
Please post more often.

35

 Oct 01, 2009 at 06:26 PM Anonymous Says:

Spot on !If in the past the challenge was from reform disputing torah,now the yetzer hora has enclothed himself in the subtle form of "lets go back to the original way it was,"this is a case of corrupt secular zionism clothing itself in torah,the rabbanim must do something about this!!

36

 Oct 01, 2009 at 07:24 PM Anonymous Says:

The Gemara in the Bavli that deals with this issue makes the claim that those in Eretz Yisrael must do as the Jews of Bavel and not wave lulav on Shabbath-Rav Bar-Hayim points out that this Gemara reverses the Gemara's previous position and tells us that this is for historic reasons related to the rivalry between Bavel and Eretz Yisrael.

Rav Bar-Hayim incisively points out that if it were true that the Gemara's position here is truly to prevent lack of uniformity between the practices of Bavel and Eretz Yisrael then why is it that there is Yom Tov Sheni? Why are there two sedarim? Clearly, the Bavli chachamim wanted Eretz Yisrael to "toe the line" since they felt that their Torah must dominate since they were the predominant Torah community.

Nowadays, as of recent decades the Torah world's focus has shifted to Eretz Yisrael. Thus, even according to the Bavli's logic we should now be shifting to the Talmud Yerushalmi.

37

 Oct 01, 2009 at 07:05 PM Moshe Says:

Rav David Bar-Hayim is a monumental Torah scholar who happens to want us to be loyal to hazal. His Torah is the logical conclusion of Rav Kook who said that as we return to Eretz Yisrael we will return to the Talmud Yerushalmi. Also, do note that Rav Bar-Hayim has the utmost repsect for Rishonim and most of the time he paskens like the Rambam

38

 Oct 01, 2009 at 09:06 PM Robert Says:

Reply to #29  
Anonymous Says:

"most people believe that gentile anti-zionism is essentially anti semitism" Eliyahu HaNavi didnt care what most people thought when they worshiped Hashem and Baal. Neither do I! Zionism is this generations Golden Calf! We need to make Teshuva before it corrupts Torah Judaism! Reform sought to be liek the other nations and zionism was born out of that. Now we have our independent nation just like the nations rather then a Torah Nation whose borders are the Torah and were founded at Har Sinai!

again, zionism in its current form can be improved, but as the saying goes dont through the baby out with the bathwater..
lets make zionism conform with judaism where yishuv of the land of israel is as important a mitzvah like keeping kosher.

39

 Oct 01, 2009 at 09:15 PM Robert Says:

Reply to #29  
Anonymous Says:

"most people believe that gentile anti-zionism is essentially anti semitism" Eliyahu HaNavi didnt care what most people thought when they worshiped Hashem and Baal. Neither do I! Zionism is this generations Golden Calf! We need to make Teshuva before it corrupts Torah Judaism! Reform sought to be liek the other nations and zionism was born out of that. Now we have our independent nation just like the nations rather then a Torah Nation whose borders are the Torah and were founded at Har Sinai!

second point to you
you may feel that gentile anti-zionism / antisemitism is irrelevant to you and i respect your position even if it is putting your head in the sand..
anti semites for generations have used all kinds of excuses for killing jews and being just anti-zionist is the latest PC fad for them..

make no mistake- they hate you more than esau hated jacob. and they would love to spray zyklon B gas up your nose..

if you dont like the current independent jewish state that again is your perogative.. just dont live there
but it is no worse a place than the USA germany russia or wherever we all come from...
i challenge you to try to make it (the state of israel) better and more religious if you do want to live there...

as for your comment regarding elijah the prophet i dont understand its relevance my friend
have a gmar tov

40

 Oct 01, 2009 at 08:47 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #5  
Chaim S. Says:

Kol hamoidif goreah. I really know that Chazal knew exactly what they were doing when they said no lulav and no shofar on shabbos. The act of denying the authority of chazal by saying I'll be frummer than chazal and I will take a lulav brings with it the possibility of denying other rabbinical rules. After all I am rationalizing my acts by saying they really don't know.

Doesn't this apply to the new innovotions in Kashrus? The Kashrus Orgnizations of today are no longer about Halacha, they are about being frummer than chazal (e.g. checking the water and strawberries with a magnifier when Shulchan Aruch specifically states not to that). Why is there no outrage when politically correct Rov paskens new innovation?

41

 Oct 01, 2009 at 06:42 PM Shimshon Says:

I find it intereresting that those anonymous posters who choose to disagree the premise by quoting "halacha," obviously know nothing about the halachot of Ona'at Devarim, Lashon Hara or Motzi Shem Rah. Rav David Bar-Hayim gave the psak and he is a true talmid chacham. Have you even studied the Yerushalmi and Bavli or are you relying on the Artscroll English? It is a shame that you all have chosen to remain in Egypt to eat leeks, cucumbers and fish rather than accept the gift that HaShem has bestowed upon His people.

42

 Oct 01, 2009 at 11:20 PM matzahlocal101 Says:

Reply to #15  
Yosef Says:

oddly enough Yom Tov Sheni doesn't seem to have led to "a dismemberment of the Jewish world"

#15,
No it just led to the reform removing themselves from klal yisroel. one of the first jabs at normative hlalcha was in fact the attempt at abrogating the second day of yomtov I galus. On an even stranger note I once saw a sign on a reform temple "In solidarity with our Israeli brethren we will be keeping one day rosh hashana Sunday...." (the second day of R"H). The last person of stature that argued on Chazal was Rebbi Yishmael. The Chochomim forbade reading by the light of an oil lamp on Shabbos lest someone adjust the wick and desecrate the Shabbos. Rebbi Yishmael, knowing how alert he was to these matters said I will read and not move the wick. He read and moved the wick. Following which he said "great is the power of the sages." his intent was not that the sages had great foresight, but rather that because the sages had ruled thusly and this became a halacha and a part of Torah, It became a fact, that a person who reads to the light of an oil lamp is likely to adjust the wick, even if if it was something that he had never done before as in the case of Rebbi Yishmael. Great is the power of the sages, don't mess with them.

43

 Oct 01, 2009 at 11:33 PM matzahlocal101 Says:

Reply to #37  
Moshe Says:

Rav David Bar-Hayim is a monumental Torah scholar who happens to want us to be loyal to hazal. His Torah is the logical conclusion of Rav Kook who said that as we return to Eretz Yisrael we will return to the Talmud Yerushalmi. Also, do note that Rav Bar-Hayim has the utmost repsect for Rishonim and most of the time he paskens like the Rambam

I'm sure the Rambam really appreciates that. In the meantime anyone who suggests the sages of the Bavli and Yerushalmi had a ego trip vying the right to be called the true torah, really has no clue what Torah lishma is no appreciation of the talmudic aprobation "if the earlier generations were like angels, we are mere people. If the earlier generations were like people, we are like donkeys, and not even like the Donkey of Pinchas ben Yair. In the generation past, that gap has widen to more than the distance between angels and donkey, yet some people are arrogant enough to suggest that they are angels and chazal were simply people. No more needs to be said.

44

 Oct 02, 2009 at 03:30 PM Jimmy37 Says:

Achdus? That's why Sholosh Regalim are celebrated with 2 days in Chutz Laaretz, and one day in Israel, even though we know, without question, when the lunar month beginnings.

45

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