Sioux Falls, SD - Rubashkin Found Guilty, Taken Into Custody |
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Last updated on: November 12, 2009 08:30 PM
News Source: VIN News Des Moines Register
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Sioux Falls, SD - A jury has convicted Sholom Rubashkin of 86 federal charges for his part in a massive fraud scheme at his former meat plant in Postville.
Jurors declared Rubashkin guilty of bank fraud, making false statements to a bank, wire fraud, mail fraud, and money laundering and aiding of abetting.
The jury found him not guilty of five counts of violating a law requiring payment of livestock providers within 24 hours.
Rubashkin’s attorney, Guy Cook, said they will appeal the decision.
Rubashkin, 50, was immediately taken into custody. As he was led out of the courtroom, he blew a kiss to his family and well-wishers.
A federal judge will sentence Rubashkin Nov. 18 in Cedar Rapids.
Rubashkin had been offered a plea deal by federal prosecutors prior to the start of the trial, but told supporters that he would not accept because he was innocent, a close family friend told The Des Moines Register today.
The Rabbi Shea Hecht, chairman of the National Committee for Furtherance of Jewish Education, said Rubashkin¹s supporters urged him to take the offer, which would have included prison time.
But Rubashkinmeat plant in Postville, had ³moral problems² with the proposal and insisted that he had done nothing illegal, Hecht said.
The plea-deal conversation took place during a meeting with Rubashkin and his lawyers in Crown Heights, a Brooklyn, N.Y., neighborhood and Rubashkin family stronghold, Hecht said. Hecht said it happened shortly before Yom Kippur, a major Jewish holiday, which this year began at sunset on Sept. 27.
Hecht said Rubashkin¹s legal expenses ‹ paid by a Brooklyn-based defense committee, of which he is a member ‹ have already exceeded $1 million.
Prosecutors alleged during the trial that Rubashkin falsified sales records to defraud the plant¹s St. Louis-based lender. The fake invoices and shipping papers created the illusion of sales that had never happened, and allowed Rubashkin to borrow more out of a $35 million credit line.
Rubashkin also allegedly diverted customer payments into the wrong bank account, when the money should have gone directly to lender. Prosecution witnesses testified that Rubashkin used the money for personal expenses and to keep the plant running.
The five-man, seven-woman jury began deliberations on the case Monday afternoon after a nearly month-long trial with more than 60 witnesses and reams of financial documents. They continued deliberations on Tuesday, had Wednesday off in observance of Veterans Day, returning on Thursday. The jury returned to the courtroom at about 4:40 p.m. Thursday.
Rubashkin still faces 72 immigration-related federal charges as well as state allegations that he violated child labor laws. The federal immigration trial is set to begin in December in Sioux Falls.
Agriprocessors Inc. was the site of a May 2008 immigration raid that led to the arrest of 389 immigrant workers. Rubashkin was first charged in late October 2008, but insisted that he was innocent
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Read Comments (336) — Post Yours »
1
Nov 12, 2009 at 06:52 PM say tehillim Says:Report as Inappropriate
it helps
2
Nov 12, 2009 at 06:49 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Bezras hashem will be Didan Notzach!
3
Nov 12, 2009 at 06:47 PM Zindel Says:Report as Inappropriate
Affilu cherev chadu munachas... Al yisyaaish...
We can still be misspalail for his complete yeshuah.
4
Nov 12, 2009 at 06:47 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Lets just all daven for the best of this good man!!!!!!!!
5
Nov 12, 2009 at 06:59 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Please hashem let this man walk out a free man!!
6
Nov 12, 2009 at 06:56 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
I hope it's only good news beazras hashem
7
Nov 12, 2009 at 06:44 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
PLEASE DAVEN!
8
Nov 12, 2009 at 06:42 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Please keep saying Tehillim for Shalom Mordchai halevi ben Rivkah.
9
Nov 12, 2009 at 06:41 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
lets say a kapital tehlim i am very much afraid its not good
10
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:04 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Please please let this good man go out a free man
11
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:01 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Not looking good
12
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:05 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ lets say a kapital tehlim i am very much afraid its not good ”
Think good Hashem is big and begger than we can imagine.
13
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:08 PM lm Says:Report as Inappropriate
Chevra ;cish echod blaiv echod "may hashem give him ale broches ad dlo yada.
14
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:07 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ lets say a kapital tehlim i am very much afraid its not good ”
If OJ Simpson is free, why not Shalom?
15
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:07 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Wow how scary
16
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:13 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Chaval chaval
17
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:13 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
American Justice stinks, this was a real hatchet job by the feds. We will win the appeal IMH.
18
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:21 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
so what now?
19
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:21 PM oy Says:Report as Inappropriate
oh no...hashem yerachem....so sad, my heart goes out to him and his family
20
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:20 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
how many yrs is that?????????
21
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:20 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Hashem Yeracheim....
Afilu Cherev Chaduh....
22
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:19 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ If OJ Simpson is free, why not Shalom? ”
OJ Simpson is in jail, but not for the murder of his wife, but for an incident that happened in Las Vegas.
23
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:27 PM Dave Says:Report as Inappropriate
Guilty on all charges except the "failing to for livestock within 24 hours" charges.
24
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:27 PM boroparker Says:Report as Inappropriate
This is the way things happen if the government wants! , I don’t know if he is guilty or not , but the way the government went and send in undercover agents to try and make sure that he should hire illegal workers ,shows that they will not stop until they will put him away one way or another , what a shame this place that was called the golden medina is turned into
25
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:31 PM Green Tea Says:Report as Inappropriate
whether he was guilty or not is one thing, but the way people are gleefuly watching this "spectacle" as a matter of entertainment is remeniscent of the auto-da- fe of spain in the middle ages.
People please!
26
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:29 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
A Shrek!!!!! Hashem please help your children in Galus!
27
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:29 PM lishma Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ If OJ Simpson is free, why not Shalom? ”
its simple a jew has to show by example his honesty to the rest of the world especially an orthodox jew even more so by the way oj is also sitting in jail
28
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:28 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Let the one who Massered get whats coming to him!!
29
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:24 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
found guilty by a jury of jew haters prosicuted by a da jew hater a judge jew hater we need to all come home to israel or we will all end up in jail
30
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:23 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ If OJ Simpson is free, why not Shalom? ”
He spent allot more on his team of lawyers. They could still use more experianced Federal Attorneys.
31
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:35 PM Bitachon & Emunah Says:Report as Inappropriate
May hashem give him and his family to keep their heads during this ordeal
32
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:35 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
What happened to "trial by jury"
33
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:34 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
As I said a week ago that I am willing to go out on a limb and predict that he will be found not guilty on the charges that he failed to pay for the cattle in a timely manner
Here is the information “The jury found him not guilty of five counts of violating a law requiring payment of livestock providers within 24 hours”. As others said on this blog that the prudent thing to do was to take a plea but this is what you get if you don’t feel that the laws apply to you. Yes my heart is in pain for his family and particular his young children, who need a father figure in the house. But now it is too late.
34
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:34 PM Shaul in Monsey Says:Report as Inappropriate
The overwhelming sadness of this news comes on many levels. Sadness that arrogance can blind a person who is now looking at far more than what the prosecutors offered in a plea deal. Any time Rubashkin sits over 15 years is on his handlers and the defense that failed him.
Sadness that yiddin think that they can do whatever they want and get away with it.
Sadness that by using incendiary phrases like "blood libel" and "witch hunt" and conspiracy you insult the dead and do nothing for the accused. There never was a war on shechita. There was a government investigation that revealed criminal activity.
Yes this is sad news, and even sadder because it will get worse, not better for SMR. Call me what you want, I laugh at every name you call me. Bottom line, I was right. The plea should have been taken because the mismanagement was criminal. All you pathetic bloggers yelling at me and calling me names, did nothing to help SMR. Now is really the time to say tehillim.
35
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:33 PM Toras Moshe Emess Says:Report as Inappropriate
Is anyone surprised? There is rarely justice for Jews in earthly courts. Reb Sholom was targeted by the government and the government got what it wanted. IY"H the conviction will be overturned on appeal.
36
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:33 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Chukas sadom vaamoyrah
37
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:32 PM attorney Says:Report as Inappropriate
If 12 jurors found him culpable beyond a reasonable doubt, why should he walk free? These are serious charges and his attorneys were unable to convince these 12 jurors that he was even .2% guilt free (beyond a reasonable doubt = 99.9%; anything less is not guilty).
But, whether or not Rubashkin was aware of what was going on, it does not matter because, as the head of the company, he assumed all the responsibility.
He is a frum Yid; why should he be held above the law or impervious to it? If this was occurring to another individual, an Anglo-Saxon, or a Latino, or African American, if that individual was found not guilty, the message boards here would be spewing fire that "the legal system doesn't work!" But, it works.
38
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:32 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Nebach. May hashem give him koach. Please continue to say tehillim to help with the sentencing.
39
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:32 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ If OJ Simpson is free, why not Shalom? ”
Bec he didn't murder inocent lives. With todays justice if u mess with the goverment its much worse than if u whouldive killed peaple
40
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:31 PM sad and scared Says:Report as Inappropriate
Ppl must realize that what happened here can happen to you!!!! How terrible to be in a country where murderers like Lemrik Nelson go free (and even if convicted of rapebthey get only tens of years) but for the supposed crime involving the Holy Dollar you get put away for life!!!!
This is terrible, I'm really sad!
41
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:47 PM a gevald Says:Report as Inappropriate
if 91 charges was 1280 yrs behind bars..wat is 86 charges???
nebach...
a young man with many yrs to come still iyh...with little kids at home...
nebach...may hashem send him and his family and gantz klal yisroel much hatzlacha!!!
42
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:46 PM heartbroken yid Says:Report as Inappropriate
I'm sure there are many of them tonight- what a rachmonus on his family and of course on him. I cannot imagine the pain they're going through. I didn't know R' Sholom but I'm devestated to think short of a 'ness' what's waiting him.
43
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:46 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
"Breaking News"
It sure is "heart" breaking news to hear what happend, may hashem give sholom and his family the koach to persevere in these though times
44
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:49 PM hashem yishmar Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ whether he was guilty or not is one thing, but the way people are gleefuly watching this "spectacle" as a matter of entertainment is remeniscent of the auto-da- fe of spain in the middle ages.
People please!
”
o come on!!!do u really think that everyone is keeping up for entertainment purposes only?????????
were just all davening, so we want to see what the outcome is...!!!!!!!
please dont compare it to the auto-de-fa!!!!chas veshalom...were yidden, were rachmanim!!!
were just caring about our fellow jew!!!!
45
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:48 PM anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
you people ever heard of stadlonis instead of appearing in court with his entourage who were dressed in full garb he should have followed a posuk which says "eyze chochom haroye eyz haneulad" and hashem would have yerachem. He created a spectacle and the notion that if you just follow chullin without considering bava metzia was stupid.
46
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:45 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
My heart breaks for him and his family. May Ha-Shem help them through this terribly difficult time. Perhaps it's a small nechama to the family, that complete strangers the world over, are davenning for him daily. May we be zoche to see the answer to our tefillos.
This is a victory for PETA. And a loss to all of Klal Yisroel. PETA will not stop here. C"V, the banning of kapporos, shechita and streimlich is next on their agenda.
We are in galus, and nothing is secure.
SO while we continue davenning for Mr. Rubashkin and his family, we should daven for ourselves too, and for the future of our religious freedoms in America.
47
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:45 PM Yitzchok Says:Report as Inappropriate
Nothing short of a modern day blood libel.. Anti Semitism is alive and well in America's heartland.. This should be a wake up. that no matter how you see yourself they still hate us!!! Berny Maddoff 150 years Rubashkin 1280.00 what a mockery of the US Judicial system it's a monkey court!!
48
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:44 PM GASP! Says:Report as Inappropriate
gasp! I am sure this wasn't quite a fair trial as I am sure it was already prejudged by the judge and jury.
49
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:44 PM Crying but it doesn't help. Says:Report as Inappropriate
I went to the Ohel on Tuesday with my friend to Daaven for the Rubashkin trial. I bumped into SM's sister. She was coming out of the Ohel. She had a huge smile on her face, when I told her I was texted (with wrong information about the verdict coming in) she knew it is all going to be ok. She told me that she was going to sit down and say some more Tehillim. Aibishter, they are such incredible human beings,, You tested them, they passed,, Ub'chol zois,, shimcha loi shochochnu.... Time to bring Moshiach NOW!
50
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:41 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ If OJ Simpson is free, why not Shalom? ”
Was free- sitting in jail at present for another crime.
51
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:41 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
the same reason why the beis hamikdash was destroyed, and the same reason moshiach did not come yet; sinas chinam, once again rears its ugly head. may the one who maasered get whats coming to him
52
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:40 PM Ron Says:Report as Inappropriate
This is not a good man, he violated child labor and federal immigration laws, believed that he could lie with impunity to lenders willing to give him $35,000,000 based upon his "supposed" integrity, embarrassed all Torah observant Jews with a shameless display of greed and arrogance, and still is unrepentant. This is not a good man.
53
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:39 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
if he would be Muslim Obama would pardon him.
54
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:31 PM Dave Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Guilty on all charges except the "failing to for livestock within 24 hours" charges. ”
Correction, guilty on the bulk of those as well. Not guilty on five of them.
55
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:31 PM Menachem Says:Report as Inappropriate
Get out to the streets and demonstrate about this grave injustice!!!
56
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:31 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Heshem yarachem, unbelievable, he seems to be much worse than Madoff and a terrible threat for society so he needs to be locked in....
57
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:18 PM simcha Says:Report as Inappropriate
i wonder if a jury would come to a guilty decision as fast as in say the case of the terrorist attacks at ft hood....
58
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:18 PM MIESQ Says:Report as Inappropriate
Nebach, may lessons from this verdict not be lost on us. There is little doubt that prosecutors' egos played a dactor in this matter. IY'H there will be appeable issues in this case.
59
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:17 PM chusidwb Says:Report as Inappropriate
If the FBI would have done their REAL jobs we would had 13 more alive soldiers in texas , instead the run after a yidel that swindled a couple of bucks , for shame!
60
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:22 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ American Justice stinks, this was a real hatchet job by the feds. We will win the appeal IMH. ”
Before you appeal you have to find a basis to appeal.
61
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:16 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
boruch dayan emes!
62
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:16 PM American 'Justice' Says:Report as Inappropriate
What else can you expect from this backwards country?
63
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:04 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
ALL OF YOU SMART ONES SAYING RUBASHKIN THINKS HE CAN GET AWAY AND THAT HE DESERVS THIS YOU ARE ALL SICK!! FIND ME ONE PERSON AND ONE COMPANY THAT NEVER MADE A MISTAKE!! ARE YOU SAYING BECAUSE HE MADE A FALSE INVOICE HE SHOULD GET 1000 YEARS IN PRISON? YOU ARE SELF HATING JEWS!! STOP BASHING THE RUBASHKINS. THEY DID NOT DO ANYTHING TO TRY AND BE ABOVE THE LAW. NOBODY IS PERFECT AND IF THE GOVT LOOKS INTO ANY COMPANY OR ANY OF YOU THEY WILL FIND THE SAME THING.
64
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:04 PM Hate to Say It Says:Report as Inappropriate
I don't know what to say... but, "Reb" Shalom was one of the biggest supporters of the "Mishichist" movement of Chabad. Much of his "tzedakah" went to them. In all the pictures, his children are wearing "Yechi" yarmulkas. And in some of the pictures, even the folders he brought to court strongly indicate he is a strong mishichist.
Maybe if he would have bitachon in the true Ribono Shel Olam, it would have done him some good. I am not sure id Reb Shach zt"l, the founder of the Yated, would be too proud of its editor at this point!!
65
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:03 PM avoidah Zoroah Says:Report as Inappropriate
so the rebbes picture in court did not help Kemohem Yeehya Oiseihem
66
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:03 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ This is not a good man, he violated child labor and federal immigration laws, believed that he could lie with impunity to lenders willing to give him $35,000,000 based upon his "supposed" integrity, embarrassed all Torah observant Jews with a shameless display of greed and arrogance, and still is unrepentant. This is not a good man. ”
Would u like to be judged d same way? watch what you're talking, the world goes round.
67
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:03 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
My heart is broken for him how is if going to manage ? Hashem please give him the strength to overcome this Nisoyon!
68
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:02 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
אבל אשמים אנחנו על אחינו where are all those who benefited from the time of the good fortune of the Rubashkin's, did we hear from them now, did they do the utmost to help as they did the utmost to benefit from them? Here we have another משלנו all too anxious to benefit from their loss and worse. Where are we, do we think we are after the גאולה?
69
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:01 PM Dag Says:Report as Inappropriate
For those who think the Jury was anti-Semitic...why the acquittal on 5 charges? Wouldn't anti-Semites putting an innocent man away find him guilty on all counts?
This looks like a fair verdict. SMR defenders claimed the Government overreached with the livestock charges. The Jury agreed and found him not guilty. Obviously there was thought put into their decision.
70
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:00 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ If 12 jurors found him culpable beyond a reasonable doubt, why should he walk free? These are serious charges and his attorneys were unable to convince these 12 jurors that he was even .2% guilt free (beyond a reasonable doubt = 99.9%; anything less is not guilty).
But, whether or not Rubashkin was aware of what was going on, it does not matter because, as the head of the company, he assumed all the responsibility.
He is a frum Yid; why should he be held above the law or impervious to it? If this was occurring to another individual, an Anglo-Saxon, or a Latino, or African American, if that individual was found not guilty, the message boards here would be spewing fire that "the legal system doesn't work!" But, it works. ”
All you think that rubashkin stole money.even the feds agree that he did not steel a penny.
When you sign up for a credit card and write that you make 100 thousand becaus you want a bigger loan you should also be sitting in jail for fraud and wiring because you did it over the internet.
This whole thing is just to get him and they don't have proper evidence.
71
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:59 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Hashem one thing we all need is betochen hashem will for sure help him and all off us till its will come the DAY may hashem help it should be soon
72
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:58 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ The overwhelming sadness of this news comes on many levels. Sadness that arrogance can blind a person who is now looking at far more than what the prosecutors offered in a plea deal. Any time Rubashkin sits over 15 years is on his handlers and the defense that failed him.
Sadness that yiddin think that they can do whatever they want and get away with it.
Sadness that by using incendiary phrases like "blood libel" and "witch hunt" and conspiracy you insult the dead and do nothing for the accused. There never was a war on shechita. There was a government investigation that revealed criminal activity.
Yes this is sad news, and even sadder because it will get worse, not better for SMR. Call me what you want, I laugh at every name you call me. Bottom line, I was right. The plea should have been taken because the mismanagement was criminal. All you pathetic bloggers yelling at me and calling me names, did nothing to help SMR. Now is really the time to say tehillim. ”
There is also much sadness, that some individuals are actually delighted with the conviction of Sholom Rubashkin.
Look at the comments posted and the language used by some, you feel their hatred of Rubashkin, or you feel the gladness in their hearts that finally Rubashkin has been convicted.
This is truly a reason for sadness.
73
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:58 PM mt mehdi Says:Report as Inappropriate
It's the Ratzoin Hashem. We need to understand what Hakodoish Barachu is trying to tell us.
74
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:57 PM anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Empire poultry is a large business and a stock company. How come they thrive?
75
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:53 PM rosh choidesh kisleiv Says:Report as Inappropriate
the sentencing is on rosh coidesh kisleiv
the fire is on the wrong side.... for now!
76
Nov 12, 2009 at 07:10 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Hashem knows what he is doing! Hakol l'tova-let it b G-ds will that he b freed of the crimes he is being charged with
77
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:17 PM Hashem Yishmor Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ This is not a good man, he violated child labor and federal immigration laws, believed that he could lie with impunity to lenders willing to give him $35,000,000 based upon his "supposed" integrity, embarrassed all Torah observant Jews with a shameless display of greed and arrogance, and still is unrepentant. This is not a good man. ”
Do you even know this man? why do you make statements about a person you don't even know.
The prosecutor brought almost 40 witnesses to testify against him, not one, not even one of them said the things you're saying.
79
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:16 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ There is also much sadness, that some individuals are actually delighted with the conviction of Sholom Rubashkin.
Look at the comments posted and the language used by some, you feel their hatred of Rubashkin, or you feel the gladness in their hearts that finally Rubashkin has been convicted.
This is truly a reason for sadness. ”
Absolutely correct. And these people are the hypocrites who soundly recite the Yud-Gimmel ikkurim every day. They don't want moshiach...they just want to be right . How many of these hateful people would maser to save their own skin or to get a buck?
80
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:15 PM to #52 Says:Report as Inappropriate
you obviously dont know SMR because he is the nicest man always giving tzedaka and always keeping his house open for guests, so dont say bad things about him if you dont know what you're talking about!
81
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:15 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Empire poultry is a large business and a stock company. How come they thrive? ”
they didn't have some slime ball from PETA rat on them to the government, everyone pulls shtick in their business to keep them afloat, welcome to the real world...just look around you...
82
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:15 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ It's the Ratzoin Hashem. We need to understand what Hakodoish Barachu is trying to tell us. ”
He is trying to tell you that you should not steal; very simple it doesn’t take physicists to figure this one out.
84
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:23 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I don't know what to say... but, "Reb" Shalom was one of the biggest supporters of the "Mishichist" movement of Chabad. Much of his "tzedakah" went to them. In all the pictures, his children are wearing "Yechi" yarmulkas. And in some of the pictures, even the folders he brought to court strongly indicate he is a strong mishichist.
Maybe if he would have bitachon in the true Ribono Shel Olam, it would have done him some good. I am not sure id Reb Shach zt"l, the founder of the Yated, would be too proud of its editor at this point!! ”
ur a sick anti Semite, Judaism, and any thing Torah stands for, and pls dont be moitze laaz on great leaders in our generation that would not have ahavas yisroel, and would care and have pity for a yid sitting behind bars, all this means that u don't give .... about torah, torah giants, i think u better quickly get down on your knees and bet mechila from everyone u have put down, and if we would work on our ahavas yisroel abit the goyim wouldn't be starting with us and moshiach would already come.
shame on you
85
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:11 PM Yoeli Says:Report as Inappropriate
Thelim helps even now Yidden thellim , Shulem is innocent all he did was provide parnnosa for 250 jewish families in postville or shall we call it putssvill Iowa
86
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:11 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ This is not a good man, he violated child labor and federal immigration laws, believed that he could lie with impunity to lenders willing to give him $35,000,000 based upon his "supposed" integrity, embarrassed all Torah observant Jews with a shameless display of greed and arrogance, and still is unrepentant. This is not a good man. ”
Would u like to be judged d same way? watch what you're talking, the world goes round.
87
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:26 PM mt mehdi Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ My heart is broken for him how is if going to manage ? Hashem please give him the strength to overcome this Nisoyon! ”
The Nisoyon of being honest in business was apparently not passed.
88
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:11 PM G-d Save the US from Itself Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ If the FBI would have done their REAL jobs we would had 13 more alive soldiers in texas , instead the run after a yidel that swindled a couple of bucks , for shame! ”
Right On! Your country is one big bad joke. This case would never ever ever go down this way in any civilized Western country. The USA has the twisted upside down laws.
You make a mockery of the word JUSTICE. Use another word. Please don't profane the English language and the Queen.
89
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:09 PM help Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Guilty on all charges except the "failing to for livestock within 24 hours" charges. ”
Not exactly. there were still another 14 of those charges that the jury found him gulty for,
What a ludicrous law! what Justice!
90
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:09 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
where is everybody...???? the Rebbes shluchim and family. is "lubavitch ein mishpocho" a fantasy of the past? when chassidim would fight hell or high water for their fellow chossid..we need to take a stand NOW!!!! its not too late to free an innocent chossid, tzaddik..the holocaust happened when fellow yidden sat back and crossed their arms..we need to take a stand now! SHLUCHIM stop being politically correct and protecting your corporate image, rather act like your meshaleach our REBBE and SCREAM THE TRUTH!!! dont be intimidated of your buddies in washington. the inquistion didnt break us neither the bolshevics. Remember RUBASHKIN is the bailus and dreyfus of our time! Let us not stop until justice prevails and our fellow chossid is FREE!!!!
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:09 PM Noach Says:Report as Inappropriate
oi nebach its heartbreaking, oi hashem this hurts more then normal.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:07 PM STOP BASHING RUBASHKIN OR OPEN YOUR BOOKS Says:Report as Inappropriate
ANYONE WHO SAYS RUBASHKIN THOUGHT HE WAS AGAINTS THE LAW AND SHOULD GO TO JAIL, I CHALLENGE YOU OPEN YOUR BOOKS AND LETS SEE WHATS GOING ON BY YOU!! IF NOT THEN KEEP QUIET
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:31 PM Liepa Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ The overwhelming sadness of this news comes on many levels. Sadness that arrogance can blind a person who is now looking at far more than what the prosecutors offered in a plea deal. Any time Rubashkin sits over 15 years is on his handlers and the defense that failed him.
Sadness that yiddin think that they can do whatever they want and get away with it.
Sadness that by using incendiary phrases like "blood libel" and "witch hunt" and conspiracy you insult the dead and do nothing for the accused. There never was a war on shechita. There was a government investigation that revealed criminal activity.
Yes this is sad news, and even sadder because it will get worse, not better for SMR. Call me what you want, I laugh at every name you call me. Bottom line, I was right. The plea should have been taken because the mismanagement was criminal. All you pathetic bloggers yelling at me and calling me names, did nothing to help SMR. Now is really the time to say tehillim. ”
I wonder what the government would find should they decide to investigate you thoroughly and then when they find something like your mortgage or credit card application isn't 100% accurate and we 'achainu bnai yisroel' will scream 'blood libel' and/or 'witch hunt' on your behalf, would you still be so outspokenly against it as you are right now?
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:33 PM bob Says:Report as Inappropriate
He shouldn't spend a second in prison. This was a hatchet job on the part of the gov. You can't run those places w/o the illegals, all U.S. agriculture depends on them. All the tzores began after the PITA-Nazis had done their evil deed.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:06 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Anyone that has knowledge of the federal judiciary knows the higher standards in jury trials. The guys was convicted by 12 random people on 86 different counts of white collar crime. D.A.s hate prosecuting white collar crimes because the evidence and trail is so difficult to put together and present to a jury in a way that will understand the complex schemes of money transfers and paper work. Stop crying antisemitism or setups by the feds, D.A.s and judges. Obviously the D.A. had solid enough case for the jury to convict on 86 charges. You can't use Spanish Inquisition or 15 century Polish pogroms against U.S. government. Rubashkin had good lawyers who couldn't muster enough excuses to explain the evidence. He has a small chance at the appeals level, but unless there is gross injustice or technical errors by the judge, the lawyers won't be able to set him off the hook.
The lesson here is that we should all be careful and not get carried away with our business practices. I pray that he will get through this tough chapter in his life.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:06 PM Sue Says:Report as Inappropriate
Lemrik Nelson is free and Shulom Rubashkin is in jail. someone help me sing GOULUS GOLUS HOW LONG ARE YOU? Im crying
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:35 PM cool masmid Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ The overwhelming sadness of this news comes on many levels. Sadness that arrogance can blind a person who is now looking at far more than what the prosecutors offered in a plea deal. Any time Rubashkin sits over 15 years is on his handlers and the defense that failed him.
Sadness that yiddin think that they can do whatever they want and get away with it.
Sadness that by using incendiary phrases like "blood libel" and "witch hunt" and conspiracy you insult the dead and do nothing for the accused. There never was a war on shechita. There was a government investigation that revealed criminal activity.
Yes this is sad news, and even sadder because it will get worse, not better for SMR. Call me what you want, I laugh at every name you call me. Bottom line, I was right. The plea should have been taken because the mismanagement was criminal. All you pathetic bloggers yelling at me and calling me names, did nothing to help SMR. Now is really the time to say tehillim. ”
Spin it any way you want, the bottom line is you don't have any rachmonus on this poor yid. Don't start acting holy than thou, because chances are........ No-one is saying mistakes were not made, but the way they went after him and leveled charges against him in the way it was done its nothing short of a 'witch-hunt' and 'bloodlibel' and yes the whole thing wreaks from anti-semitism. Its a sad day for klal yisroel that such a special individual has to go through so much.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:05 PM This is America! Says:Report as Inappropriate
Murder someone and you MIGHT go to jail.
Fuss with the banks and you will DIE there!
In this country, money is more precious than life.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:39 PM mt mehdi Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ He shouldn't spend a second in prison. This was a hatchet job on the part of the gov. You can't run those places w/o the illegals, all U.S. agriculture depends on them. All the tzores began after the PITA-Nazis had done their evil deed. ”
How does that explain the following:
"Prosecutors alleged during the trial that Rubashkin falsified sales records to defraud the plant¹s St. Louis-based lender. The fake invoices and shipping papers created the illusion of sales that had never happened, and allowed Rubashkin to borrow more out of a $35 million credit line."
This has nothing to do with illegals or PETA.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 06:37 PM Shlomie Says:Report as Inappropriate
Hopefully will be free be"h, if he is the prosecuters will probably cut a deal on the rest of the charges, looking forward for positive news.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:41 PM not guilty Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ If 12 jurors found him culpable beyond a reasonable doubt, why should he walk free? These are serious charges and his attorneys were unable to convince these 12 jurors that he was even .2% guilt free (beyond a reasonable doubt = 99.9%; anything less is not guilty).
But, whether or not Rubashkin was aware of what was going on, it does not matter because, as the head of the company, he assumed all the responsibility.
He is a frum Yid; why should he be held above the law or impervious to it? If this was occurring to another individual, an Anglo-Saxon, or a Latino, or African American, if that individual was found not guilty, the message boards here would be spewing fire that "the legal system doesn't work!" But, it works. ”
The same thing I rote to shaul from monsey applies to you btw the ''masive fraud'' as you and the sick goverment call it if it were true thareticly first what's massive about it they never accused him of steeling a peny the whole fruad consists of inflating sales to get a bigger loan of which he never missed a payment and was on the banks website as second to most succesfull loan of 2008 for the bank now tell me if all true which its not should he sit in jail from b4 rashis birth untill now and still have two hundred years left be honest than tell me this is a good justice system
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:46 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I wonder what the government would find should they decide to investigate you thoroughly and then when they find something like your mortgage or credit card application isn't 100% accurate and we 'achainu bnai yisroel' will scream 'blood libel' and/or 'witch hunt' on your behalf, would you still be so outspokenly against it as you are right now? ”
ABSOLUTELY. I would deserve it. What gives a Yid the right to "mislead" on a credit card application or a mortgage application? Look what the mortgage mess has gotten us. Jews whispering to other Jews, "don't worry, we'll appraise your house higher and you'll get the bigger mortgage." It's not just the earthly jury we should worry about. We should be 110% honest.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:47 PM Shaul in Monsey Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I wonder what the government would find should they decide to investigate you thoroughly and then when they find something like your mortgage or credit card application isn't 100% accurate and we 'achainu bnai yisroel' will scream 'blood libel' and/or 'witch hunt' on your behalf, would you still be so outspokenly against it as you are right now? ”
Liepa, you're a moron. Grow a brain. Comparing a $400 credit card to a 35 million dollar bank line is like comparing your wife to Miss America. Sure, both are women but I guarantee you the similarities end right there. And the yidden that died in true blood libels curse you from their graves when you compare them to SMR. He stole and got caught. Get over it. Sad how his arrogance destroyed him. He thought because he wore his beard and hat and gave away some of his ill gotten gains to charity, that he was above any law. Had he listened years ago when people were begging him to either make changes or sell out, things might have been different. Had he taken the plea bargain the government offered, he wouldn't be facing what he's facing now. His stubbornness, arrogance and self righteousness destroyed him. May his saga be a lesson to others who think they are above the law.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:53 PM this is agood man Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ This is not a good man, he violated child labor and federal immigration laws, believed that he could lie with impunity to lenders willing to give him $35,000,000 based upon his "supposed" integrity, embarrassed all Torah observant Jews with a shameless display of greed and arrogance, and still is unrepentant. This is not a good man. ”
I supose tou never knew him but he would of given away his very life fore you if you were in such asituation btw were not alowed to hire alians or drive them to work (even though you brobaly have one in your house) but the goverment is alllowed to give them health care and child laber pls he never forsed them to work there they were glad finaly someone gave them ajob instead of being on the street
105
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:48 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I went to the Ohel on Tuesday with my friend to Daaven for the Rubashkin trial. I bumped into SM's sister. She was coming out of the Ohel. She had a huge smile on her face, when I told her I was texted (with wrong information about the verdict coming in) she knew it is all going to be ok. She told me that she was going to sit down and say some more Tehillim. Aibishter, they are such incredible human beings,, You tested them, they passed,, Ub'chol zois,, shimcha loi shochochnu.... Time to bring Moshiach NOW! ”
Are you saying the sister and family knew that the verrdict would be guilty and they have accpeted it as it being the ratzon of hakadush borchu?
106
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:53 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ ANYONE WHO SAYS RUBASHKIN THOUGHT HE WAS AGAINTS THE LAW AND SHOULD GO TO JAIL, I CHALLENGE YOU OPEN YOUR BOOKS AND LETS SEE WHATS GOING ON BY YOU!! IF NOT THEN KEEP QUIET ”
Let’s assume you right, are you now willing to bring down a lot more Jews, just because your buddy who might have given you a few free chickens got convicted, and furthermore, you are willing to libel every Jew that they are not upright in their business dealings, but you know what, NO we are crooks we are stand with the law like it or not I will not sit back and have some anti-Semite point to your post as prove that all the Jews are a bunch of crooks, NO!!! NO!!! NO!!
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:56 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Lets try to get him pardoned.
108
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:00 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I don't know what to say... but, "Reb" Shalom was one of the biggest supporters of the "Mishichist" movement of Chabad. Much of his "tzedakah" went to them. In all the pictures, his children are wearing "Yechi" yarmulkas. And in some of the pictures, even the folders he brought to court strongly indicate he is a strong mishichist.
Maybe if he would have bitachon in the true Ribono Shel Olam, it would have done him some good. I am not sure id Reb Shach zt"l, the founder of the Yated, would be too proud of its editor at this point!! ”
There's a time and place for everything even if I don't agree with you. But this was neither the time, the place for your words or the added personal attack on Pinny Lipschutz. Didn't you learn somewhere along the line in your education about sinas chinam and ahavas yisroel? Don't be tzaddik yoseir - Hashem is the ultimate Judge. Meanwhile, many hearts, mine included are breaking at the thought of Sholom Mordechai in prison and pain for his family.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 09:07 PM Godol HaDor Says:Report as Inappropriate
I know Sholom Mordche for over 35 years and I know his family. He is poshut a tzadik from a family of tzadikim. Those that write even the slightest negative comment simply don't know him or them. Yes, they may have made some mistakes, but remeber the wonderful things they did for klal yisroel. Meat was plentiful and the prices were reasonable, he supported many torah institutions oy oy oy even as I write this I can't believe it. Sholom mordche is a medakdek bekala kebachamura and a big talmid chochom his life is immersed in ruchniyus. He lives a modest material life as do his parents. The maasim toivim the family does/did were legendary in boro park and the world over. Reb avrohom Aaron and his rebetzin are nothin but tzadikim. Ribono she'll olam. Do something!!!! You are in control you can do something great please do it. L'man shimcha hagodol.
And to all you shnooks, and holier than thous. How dare you! You nothings! You shmoes! What did any of you do for the klal? You never made a mistake?? Maybe you should feel what it means when a loved one is overcharged and under serious dangers? Hashem yerachem.
As someone said so well this is nothing less than a victory of PETA and the unions. Hashem yerachem and we should see nissim soon. Sholom mordche and family should only see happy occasions togehter gezunterheit un freilecherheit
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Nov 12, 2009 at 09:06 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I wonder what the government would find should they decide to investigate you thoroughly and then when they find something like your mortgage or credit card application isn't 100% accurate and we 'achainu bnai yisroel' will scream 'blood libel' and/or 'witch hunt' on your behalf, would you still be so outspokenly against it as you are right now? ”
After all is said and done, I could definitely say that the people like you who blame the government or the DA or the Judge fail to realizes that SMR is guilty because he was guilty, not because he is a Jew, that dog will not hunt in this great country, while you might be blinded by the long beard or the free chicken he gave to the needy, but the bottom line is, he is in this predicament only because he tried to circumvent the system, immigration, loan covenants, and plain old don’t do to others what the what you don’t want other to do to you. i.e. taking advantage of your labor force you need to treat than with respect and pay then a livable wage.
111
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:06 PM bob Says:Report as Inappropriate
A jury of 12 people found him guilty of stealing from a bank. Whats antisemitic about that? Should he get off because hes jewish, should there be one set of laws for jews and one for non jews?
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Nov 12, 2009 at 08:59 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I don't know what to say... but, "Reb" Shalom was one of the biggest supporters of the "Mishichist" movement of Chabad. Much of his "tzedakah" went to them. In all the pictures, his children are wearing "Yechi" yarmulkas. And in some of the pictures, even the folders he brought to court strongly indicate he is a strong mishichist.
Maybe if he would have bitachon in the true Ribono Shel Olam, it would have done him some good. I am not sure id Reb Shach zt"l, the founder of the Yated, would be too proud of its editor at this point!! ”
Shtus! His father is famous for throwing the Yechi people out of his store. I am a misnaged in every sense of the word, but to make someone an apikores when he is not, is motzei shem ra!
Monday morning, when you saw Acheinu by Krias Hatorah, have in mind Shalom Mordechai Halevi ben Rivka
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Nov 12, 2009 at 09:16 PM Tzvi Lang Says:Report as Inappropriate
We must have hundreds of thousand of us at ceder rapids on the 18th
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Nov 12, 2009 at 09:15 PM ish chusid hoyoh Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ found guilty by a jury of jew haters prosicuted by a da jew hater a judge jew hater we need to all come home to israel or we will all end up in jail ”
to Israel where frum yidden are dearly loved (ahem). Now I know you'll say there are reasons for this, but the fact remains that we are not so loved there either.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 09:22 PM One who wants to help Says:Report as Inappropriate
Friends
The trial is over, Sholom Mordechai has been found guilty by a jury of his peers. This is not some dictatorship or communist country. He HAS been given a FAIR TRIAL and was judged fairly
It is our job as fellow Jews to help free him as early as possible.
However, now that the trial is over, and he has been found guilty, the work will need to be done on minimizing the sentence, then parole, and other types of releases. I can't talk about all possibilities here, but I want to say one thing
All this talk about his not receiving a fair trial, calling it a hatchet job, & similar statements are neither true nor helpful. In fact, they insult our justice system, and the people involved in it, and make us look like idiots and anger the very people who will decide his fate
STOP foolish statements
Statements bashing the justice system are foolish and will hurt him not help him.
Inventing stories that make believe he did not know what was going on.. are insulting to the readers and will not help him
In dealing with the tragedy of a heimishe Yid in tfeesa... in jail, who be serving time in prison, we need the good graces of Judges & Boards who control his future
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Nov 12, 2009 at 09:08 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Liepa, you're a moron. Grow a brain. Comparing a $400 credit card to a 35 million dollar bank line is like comparing your wife to Miss America. Sure, both are women but I guarantee you the similarities end right there. And the yidden that died in true blood libels curse you from their graves when you compare them to SMR. He stole and got caught. Get over it. Sad how his arrogance destroyed him. He thought because he wore his beard and hat and gave away some of his ill gotten gains to charity, that he was above any law. Had he listened years ago when people were begging him to either make changes or sell out, things might have been different. Had he taken the plea bargain the government offered, he wouldn't be facing what he's facing now. His stubbornness, arrogance and self righteousness destroyed him. May his saga be a lesson to others who think they are above the law. ”
Get your facts straight. What didn't come out in the trial is that he made good payments on the loans from day 1 until he was forced into bankrupcy by the immigration raid. So it is very comparable to your mortgage, cc. He may have played around with loan docs, but the bank got their money. If they feds investigated every cc you applied for, your mortgage loan papers you would be going to jail together with about 100 million americans who got sub-prime loans.
117
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:57 PM anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
All you who are screaming justice to this "dishonest" man, you don't come close to the heels of this person. You cannot even fathom the greatness of this person. After such charges and his company of tears and sweat, all the houses he owned are lost, and he still walks around with a smile and with a GENUINE belief in Hashem that He is the controller of the world, and if this is what Hashem wants..and to see him able to act normal and function on a daily basis, no there are no words to describe him - Noone but no one on this site would have such acceptance and such bittul to Hashem. May Hashem show him the good in all this
118
Nov 12, 2009 at 08:56 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Murder someone and you MIGHT go to jail.
Fuss with the banks and you will DIE there!
In this country, money is more precious than life. ”
I googled Judge Reede and this is what I found, no kidding this is true, she was in on the raid there is an attorney Rockne Cole who wrote his congressman after being called to a meeting where other attorneys were also summoned to be the official defenders of the immigrants they were about to round up. There were improprieties and he walked out on them. The Judge was part of the inner circle. Please read it, it definitely looks like a conflict of interest. She definitely should not be sitting in judgement since she was in on it from the beginning. Whoever is close to the family please forward this.
http://www.courthouseforum.com/upload/phpjo0nIX.judge reade misconduct.pdf
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Nov 12, 2009 at 09:38 PM yech Says:Report as Inappropriate
as far as I'm concerned the reason the feds went after smr is cause he didn't hire union workers, as u see the feds now and obama on the top took away the entire company of GM from the share holders which owned the company and gave it to the union, wake up and see the country we live in now, it is run by the leftists, they are for the union, in the future any big company will be terrified not to hire the union after this
120
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:36 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I know Sholom Mordche for over 35 years and I know his family. He is poshut a tzadik from a family of tzadikim. Those that write even the slightest negative comment simply don't know him or them. Yes, they may have made some mistakes, but remeber the wonderful things they did for klal yisroel. Meat was plentiful and the prices were reasonable, he supported many torah institutions oy oy oy even as I write this I can't believe it. Sholom mordche is a medakdek bekala kebachamura and a big talmid chochom his life is immersed in ruchniyus. He lives a modest material life as do his parents. The maasim toivim the family does/did were legendary in boro park and the world over. Reb avrohom Aaron and his rebetzin are nothin but tzadikim. Ribono she'll olam. Do something!!!! You are in control you can do something great please do it. L'man shimcha hagodol.
And to all you shnooks, and holier than thous. How dare you! You nothings! You shmoes! What did any of you do for the klal? You never made a mistake?? Maybe you should feel what it means when a loved one is overcharged and under serious dangers? Hashem yerachem.
As someone said so well this is nothing less than a victory of PETA and the unions. Hashem yerachem and we should see nissim soon. Sholom mordche and family should only see happy occasions togehter gezunterheit un freilecherheit ”
"Sholom mordche is a medakdek bekala kebachamura and a big talmid chochom his life is immersed in ruchniyus"
That is all very nice but a jury of his peers (albeit not all of them such big talmeidi chachamim)have determined that he violated a whole range of federal laws involving stealing money from the banks through fraud and other similiar crimes. His whole defense was that he was "too stupid" to know that what he was doing was a crime. His defenders here on VIN have argued that whatever he did was no big deal since all the goyim steal so why shouldn't Sholomo Mordechai get his share since he is such a big baal tzadakah.
The real tragedy here is not Rubashkin; he will go to federal prison and serve 10 or 15 years and then be released. The real tragedy will play out over the longer term since his conviction will reinforce the sterotype that most yidden are ganovim. The rest of us and our children will be paying for his crimes long after he gets out of jail.
121
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:33 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Are you saying the sister and family knew that the verrdict would be guilty and they have accpeted it as it being the ratzon of hakadush borchu? ”
Don't be ridiculous. They had tremendous faith and bitachon that he would be acquitted because they know truths that YOU don't seem to know.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 09:28 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Do you even know this man? why do you make statements about a person you don't even know.
The prosecutor brought almost 40 witnesses to testify against him, not one, not even one of them said the things you're saying.
”
Be real. First of all, everyone had to stay to the topic and the charges on trial in these cases. Throwing up the other offenses could be were prohibitted by the judge.
Also, remember, in court, we only get to see SOME of the evidence. Each item of evidence is ruled upon. Only those allowed by the judge are entered into evidence. Usually there is MUCH more that is not entered due to rule technicalities, which could include how they were obtained. etc...
The child labor charges, and the other charges will be in another trial.. Stay tuned... LOL
123
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:43 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I googled Judge Reede and this is what I found, no kidding this is true, she was in on the raid there is an attorney Rockne Cole who wrote his congressman after being called to a meeting where other attorneys were also summoned to be the official defenders of the immigrants they were about to round up. There were improprieties and he walked out on them. The Judge was part of the inner circle. Please read it, it definitely looks like a conflict of interest. She definitely should not be sitting in judgement since she was in on it from the beginning. Whoever is close to the family please forward this.
http://www.courthouseforum.com/upload/phpjo0nIX.judge reade misconduct.pdf ”
Are you serious? This is the best you can do?
YOU GOOGLED SOMETHING ON THE JUDGE AND YOU THINK PEOPLE SHOULD CARE?
It is just astounding that you people cannot seem to accept that a trial was held and he was found guilty. You are still chattering about what kind of a person he is, and that he once gave kishka to your mother-in-law when she was hungry.
Is there ANYONE claiming that he was on trial for being a Baal Chessed? Was he charged with having bad character? For having a lousy family?
What is it that you are all defending? The trial is over. No one asked about his character, his personality or his family.
He was charged with fraud. Is he guilty? Twelve jurors said yes. He is not being tried by shteeble-yidden in Boro Park.
HE WAS FOUND FOUND GUILTY! That is not a complicated sentence (no pun intended). No one is claiming he was a bad friend or a crummy neighbor. They are claiming he is guilty of fraud. That's it.
If you can't accept it, keep comparing him to other defendants who got lucky. Keep talking about how wonderful he is.
IT DOESN'T MATTER! HE WAS FOUND GUILTY! GET OVER IT!
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Nov 12, 2009 at 09:43 PM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ where is everybody...???? the Rebbes shluchim and family. is "lubavitch ein mishpocho" a fantasy of the past? when chassidim would fight hell or high water for their fellow chossid..we need to take a stand NOW!!!! its not too late to free an innocent chossid, tzaddik..the holocaust happened when fellow yidden sat back and crossed their arms..we need to take a stand now! SHLUCHIM stop being politically correct and protecting your corporate image, rather act like your meshaleach our REBBE and SCREAM THE TRUTH!!! dont be intimidated of your buddies in washington. the inquistion didnt break us neither the bolshevics. Remember RUBASHKIN is the bailus and dreyfus of our time! Let us not stop until justice prevails and our fellow chossid is FREE!!!! ”
idiot
the holocaust Jews where killed because there where Jews
SMR jailed for crimes that he did
126
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:49 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I know Sholom Mordche for over 35 years and I know his family. He is poshut a tzadik from a family of tzadikim. Those that write even the slightest negative comment simply don't know him or them. Yes, they may have made some mistakes, but remeber the wonderful things they did for klal yisroel. Meat was plentiful and the prices were reasonable, he supported many torah institutions oy oy oy even as I write this I can't believe it. Sholom mordche is a medakdek bekala kebachamura and a big talmid chochom his life is immersed in ruchniyus. He lives a modest material life as do his parents. The maasim toivim the family does/did were legendary in boro park and the world over. Reb avrohom Aaron and his rebetzin are nothin but tzadikim. Ribono she'll olam. Do something!!!! You are in control you can do something great please do it. L'man shimcha hagodol.
And to all you shnooks, and holier than thous. How dare you! You nothings! You shmoes! What did any of you do for the klal? You never made a mistake?? Maybe you should feel what it means when a loved one is overcharged and under serious dangers? Hashem yerachem.
As someone said so well this is nothing less than a victory of PETA and the unions. Hashem yerachem and we should see nissim soon. Sholom mordche and family should only see happy occasions togehter gezunterheit un freilecherheit ”
How did Hakodoish Barachu allow such a Tzadik to make such a mistake?
127
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:47 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ "Sholom mordche is a medakdek bekala kebachamura and a big talmid chochom his life is immersed in ruchniyus"
That is all very nice but a jury of his peers (albeit not all of them such big talmeidi chachamim)have determined that he violated a whole range of federal laws involving stealing money from the banks through fraud and other similiar crimes. His whole defense was that he was "too stupid" to know that what he was doing was a crime. His defenders here on VIN have argued that whatever he did was no big deal since all the goyim steal so why shouldn't Sholomo Mordechai get his share since he is such a big baal tzadakah.
The real tragedy here is not Rubashkin; he will go to federal prison and serve 10 or 15 years and then be released. The real tragedy will play out over the longer term since his conviction will reinforce the sterotype that most yidden are ganovim. The rest of us and our children will be paying for his crimes long after he gets out of jail.
”
He stole absolutely nothing. He owes no one money. This is all about the procedures to receive loans.
The fact is that most cabinet members of the current administration didn't pay their taxes as they were suppose to. The fact is that Charlie Rangle who writes most tax laws doesn't pay his taxes. Did you ever hear anyone say jail for them? This country has become a scary similarity to what is described in "Animal Farm".
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Nov 12, 2009 at 09:46 PM Sruli Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ We must have hundreds of thousand of us at ceder rapids on the 18th
”
Yes, because packing the courtroom with Chassidim was so effective during the trial. There is something called the rule of law in this country; do you think you can fight it with a mob?
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Nov 12, 2009 at 09:44 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ "Sholom mordche is a medakdek bekala kebachamura and a big talmid chochom his life is immersed in ruchniyus"
That is all very nice but a jury of his peers (albeit not all of them such big talmeidi chachamim)have determined that he violated a whole range of federal laws involving stealing money from the banks through fraud and other similiar crimes. His whole defense was that he was "too stupid" to know that what he was doing was a crime. His defenders here on VIN have argued that whatever he did was no big deal since all the goyim steal so why shouldn't Sholomo Mordechai get his share since he is such a big baal tzadakah.
The real tragedy here is not Rubashkin; he will go to federal prison and serve 10 or 15 years and then be released. The real tragedy will play out over the longer term since his conviction will reinforce the sterotype that most yidden are ganovim. The rest of us and our children will be paying for his crimes long after he gets out of jail.
”
Well said, but you are wasting your breath.
These people are still claiming he walks on water and this is just a pogrom against Jews.
130
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:43 PM Shaul in Monsey Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I googled Judge Reede and this is what I found, no kidding this is true, she was in on the raid there is an attorney Rockne Cole who wrote his congressman after being called to a meeting where other attorneys were also summoned to be the official defenders of the immigrants they were about to round up. There were improprieties and he walked out on them. The Judge was part of the inner circle. Please read it, it definitely looks like a conflict of interest. She definitely should not be sitting in judgement since she was in on it from the beginning. Whoever is close to the family please forward this.
http://www.courthouseforum.com/upload/phpjo0nIX.judge reade misconduct.pdf ”
WHERE WERE YOU WHEN THE DEFENSE NEEDED YOU!!!!!!!!!!!! CALL GUY COOK ASAP HE NEEDS ALL THE HELP HE CAN GET!!!!! He's actually busy now counting his money and laughing at how much he'll make while they chase the appeal so call him after the weekend.
To all of SMR's "friends" where were you when you should have been telling your friend to take the deal they offered. The evidence was MASSIVE. He cut invoices to clothing stores. HELLOOOOOO he was a BUTCHER!!??&&^%$!!! You deluded SMR into believing the baloney about the conspiracy. You fed him the was on shechita nonsense. IDIOTS. Obama, Bush, Pelosi ICE they don't care about kosher meat. They care about white collar crimes and this was a doozey. Some friends you are. Now 15 years is a dream. Eizehu chochom? Not you guys.
131
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:51 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ A jury of 12 people found him guilty of stealing from a bank. Whats antisemitic about that? Should he get off because hes jewish, should there be one set of laws for jews and one for non jews? ”
Is there one set of laws for charlie Rangle and another for regular people when it comes to paying taxes?
What's needed is common sense. 1200 years in jail for what, did he murder someone? It's how the government is over-reacting that bothers most of us.
132
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:51 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ as far as I'm concerned the reason the feds went after smr is cause he didn't hire union workers, as u see the feds now and obama on the top took away the entire company of GM from the share holders which owned the company and gave it to the union, wake up and see the country we live in now, it is run by the leftists, they are for the union, in the future any big company will be terrified not to hire the union after this ”
How does that explain his fraudulently inflated sales?
133
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:49 PM david Says:Report as Inappropriate
This is a very sad story. It seems SMR did very bad things and will pay a heavy price for his flagitious behavior. We can only bemoan what drove him to these foolish acts.
What is sadder is the cheering and gloating of a known other blogger who takes immense personal pride on making 10 children orphans and the mother a living widow. Others pain is his source of holliday. His glee is not limited to this sad incident. He is filled with shade.freud and rejoices at every sin or error of any Jew anywhere in the world, like an evil archangel bent on destroying, shaming and annihilating Jews. One has to wonder how a person gets so sick and twisted. We have seen the Jew Goldstone and the Gaza report, Jews for Jesus, Neturay Karta in Iran, and Shmaya. Some of our worst enemies are our own.
Ernest Van Der Haag, a non Jew, said of the Jews "An illustrious people who brought Monotheisim to a world of pagans and barbarians. Whose physcians have have brought more cure and vitiation of disease then the rest of mankind combined. Whose brilliance have brought Einstein and Freud etc."
Sadly these self haters only denoument is when they see self shame
134
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:52 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
does anyone know how far being dan lkaf zechus goes? i assume if someone was found guilty by sanhedrin or beis din there is no reason to be dan lkak zechus. does this apply to secular court systems as well despite that their methods of determining guilt are different than that of halacha?
135
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:03 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ He stole absolutely nothing. He owes no one money. This is all about the procedures to receive loans.
The fact is that most cabinet members of the current administration didn't pay their taxes as they were suppose to. The fact is that Charlie Rangle who writes most tax laws doesn't pay his taxes. Did you ever hear anyone say jail for them? This country has become a scary similarity to what is described in "Animal Farm". ”
you have a point
charlie rangel and the treasury secretary should also sit in jail.
they should have known better
i guess the question here is should rubashkin have known better
i dont know the answer to thast one
136
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:58 PM I mean, seriously? Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ as far as I'm concerned the reason the feds went after smr is cause he didn't hire union workers, as u see the feds now and obama on the top took away the entire company of GM from the share holders which owned the company and gave it to the union, wake up and see the country we live in now, it is run by the leftists, they are for the union, in the future any big company will be terrified not to hire the union after this ”
Oh, yes, NOW I understand.
Now that you mention it, this is a conspiracy by the government, by Obama, by the unions, the only one who did nothing wrong is Rubashkin.
The judge was crooked, the jury was bought, the charges were falsified, the witnesses were coerced, and SMR is the greatest Jew that ever lived.
He loves his family, he financially supports the entire Jewish community, he's taking the blame for the rest of his family, but he's too nice to mention it.
He is too stupid to run a business and didn't know what others around him were doing, everyone else does it anyway, that's how businesses are always run, and if I ever applied for a credit card I should go to jail.instead of him.
The bank knew about the fraud so it doesn't count, they got paid so no one got hurt, the government planted employees to entrap him, and billing a clothing store for meat was just a mistake.
We should pray for our brothers, anyone who testified was maasering and should die, if I don't believe SMR was innocent I have no Jewish soul, and why is O.J. SImpson running around if SMR might get a 1,280 year (!) jail sentence.
DO I HAVE IT RIGHT NOW? DO I UNDERSTAND IT NOW?
137
Nov 12, 2009 at 09:58 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ All you who are screaming justice to this "dishonest" man, you don't come close to the heels of this person. You cannot even fathom the greatness of this person. After such charges and his company of tears and sweat, all the houses he owned are lost, and he still walks around with a smile and with a GENUINE belief in Hashem that He is the controller of the world, and if this is what Hashem wants..and to see him able to act normal and function on a daily basis, no there are no words to describe him - Noone but no one on this site would have such acceptance and such bittul to Hashem. May Hashem show him the good in all this ”
"he still walks around with a smile and with a GENUINE belief in Hashem that He is the controller of the world, and this is what Hashem wants.."
Well, maybe SMR was right. This verdict was what hashem wanted to provide a clear message to yiddin that must obey dina d'malchusa and that it is a chilul hashem if we don't obey the law and we will be punished both under civil law and dinah di'shamayim.
138
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:25 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Anyone that has knowledge of the federal judiciary knows the higher standards in jury trials. The guys was convicted by 12 random people on 86 different counts of white collar crime. D.A.s hate prosecuting white collar crimes because the evidence and trail is so difficult to put together and present to a jury in a way that will understand the complex schemes of money transfers and paper work. Stop crying antisemitism or setups by the feds, D.A.s and judges. Obviously the D.A. had solid enough case for the jury to convict on 86 charges. You can't use Spanish Inquisition or 15 century Polish pogroms against U.S. government. Rubashkin had good lawyers who couldn't muster enough excuses to explain the evidence. He has a small chance at the appeals level, but unless there is gross injustice or technical errors by the judge, the lawyers won't be able to set him off the hook.
The lesson here is that we should all be careful and not get carried away with our business practices. I pray that he will get through this tough chapter in his life.
”
Do you know what
"Red necks" and KKK are ? Do you know what the posuk says "eisev soneh layakov" ? Are you for real? Did you honestly think he had a fair chance ? This is just like the 60 when african americans were convicted no matter what the evidence showed !!! Be real and call it what it is ANTI SEMITISM and a favor for peta and the unions ,
Can you explain to me how all farmers get away with ilegals ? I can drive down a street in NYC and pick up 100 illegals without breaking a sweat...
Just the goverment looks the other way until they want.. And when they want to get you they " selectivly" endorce the law that they want to get you on .. JUSTICE is supposed to blind ... If you believe that I have a bridge to sell you
I am not saying that nothing illegal was done , what I am saying is that this was a case of "selective" enforcment , 70 years ago JEWS were also selected .. I see no diffrence except its not being done in mass yet
139
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:21 PM You are SICK Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I don't know what to say... but, "Reb" Shalom was one of the biggest supporters of the "Mishichist" movement of Chabad. Much of his "tzedakah" went to them. In all the pictures, his children are wearing "Yechi" yarmulkas. And in some of the pictures, even the folders he brought to court strongly indicate he is a strong mishichist.
Maybe if he would have bitachon in the true Ribono Shel Olam, it would have done him some good. I am not sure id Reb Shach zt"l, the founder of the Yated, would be too proud of its editor at this point!! ”
When Klal Yisroel sticks together we are strong, and our enemies are defeated, but when we fight we are weak and our enemies take advantage of us. This has been proven throughout history. It's people like you that weaken Klal Yisroel. WHEN THE BAIS HAMIKDOSH WAS DESTROYED DUE TO LACK OF AHAVAS YISROEL, IT DOESN'T MENTION THE MESHUGAS THAT EXISTED IN THOSE DAYS AS THE REASON. IT DOES MENTION AHAVAS YISROEL AS THE MAIN REASON FOR THE TURMOIL. I CAN MAKE THE ARGUMENT THAT MUSLIM FANATICISM EXIST TODAY DUE TO LACK OF AHAVAS YISROEL, WHICH EXIST FROM PEOPLE LIKE YOU.
140
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:21 PM Moshe Says:Report as Inappropriate
Hsem shuold help him and we Should pray for him.
But don’t be fanatic and stupid. This has nothing to do with Anti-semetizem.
They found him guilty on fraud. He did produce false bills in order to get credit.
Oj Simpson was 1 episode. 99% of the time, guilty people are found guilty, and innocent people are found innocent.
141
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:16 PM Everybody has an opinion Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ He stole absolutely nothing. He owes no one money. This is all about the procedures to receive loans.
The fact is that most cabinet members of the current administration didn't pay their taxes as they were suppose to. The fact is that Charlie Rangle who writes most tax laws doesn't pay his taxes. Did you ever hear anyone say jail for them? This country has become a scary similarity to what is described in "Animal Farm". ”
You apparently did not hear the news.
He was charged with fraud. The jury found him guilty.
the cabinet members, the current administration, the creatures in animal farm and Chartlie Rangel were not on the jury. They found him guilty anyway!
142
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:09 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Are you serious? This is the best you can do?
YOU GOOGLED SOMETHING ON THE JUDGE AND YOU THINK PEOPLE SHOULD CARE?
It is just astounding that you people cannot seem to accept that a trial was held and he was found guilty. You are still chattering about what kind of a person he is, and that he once gave kishka to your mother-in-law when she was hungry.
Is there ANYONE claiming that he was on trial for being a Baal Chessed? Was he charged with having bad character? For having a lousy family?
What is it that you are all defending? The trial is over. No one asked about his character, his personality or his family.
He was charged with fraud. Is he guilty? Twelve jurors said yes. He is not being tried by shteeble-yidden in Boro Park.
HE WAS FOUND FOUND GUILTY! That is not a complicated sentence (no pun intended). No one is claiming he was a bad friend or a crummy neighbor. They are claiming he is guilty of fraud. That's it.
If you can't accept it, keep comparing him to other defendants who got lucky. Keep talking about how wonderful he is.
IT DOESN'T MATTER! HE WAS FOUND GUILTY! GET OVER IT!
”
So what? This doesn't say anything positive about the country we live in. This shows the flaws that even a democracy has. No rachmanus what so ever. How can a country be so evil to put someone away for life for violating some stupid law. Did he kill someone, did he steal someones money?
143
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:28 PM Simon Says:Report as Inappropriate
He wont get 1200 years.
And to all of you, who will have kind of excuses, I urge you to move out, if you don’t respact the law of the land.
Don’t Ganve
144
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:28 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Is anyone surprised? There is rarely justice for Jews in earthly courts. Reb Sholom was targeted by the government and the government got what it wanted. IY"H the conviction will be overturned on appeal. ”
For an appeal to succeed there has to be a significant error in the trial. They do NOT reexamine the facts.
Which part of the trial was so wrong?
145
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:36 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ He stole absolutely nothing. He owes no one money. This is all about the procedures to receive loans.
The fact is that most cabinet members of the current administration didn't pay their taxes as they were suppose to. The fact is that Charlie Rangle who writes most tax laws doesn't pay his taxes. Did you ever hear anyone say jail for them? This country has become a scary similarity to what is described in "Animal Farm". ”
Why are you lying, a Jew testified that he took out a 2nd mortgagee to pay in advance for the meat for a total of $750,000 and as he said “I don’t expect to get paid back any money”, so tell me what gives you the right to be an outright liar, do you have another Torah, or are you exempted from adhering to it.
146
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:35 PM Godol HaDor Says:Report as Inappropriate
Rachmono Litzlan from some of the comments of what I can safely assume to be frum yidden. You have no yiddishe hartz, you have no yiddishe neshome, the mistakes he made did not warrant the massive charges compared to what murderers, rapists. And terrorists get.
I can't believe how Jewish children, children of avrohom yitzchok and yaakov can write words like that.
The govt, with the encouragement of the unions and peta threw the library at him, if u think big corps and businesses don't routinley do similar you're delusional.
Until such a travesty would R"L happen to someone u love u all won't understand the depth of this tragedy.
Hard core criminals get much much less than this.
Sholom Mordche is a special yungerman from a special family. Please let us takeh try to figure out what we can do. For him and his family. Start with a kapital thilim and start with a little more feeling and love for each other. Its so sa to read some of these comments shanmeful
147
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:42 PM Rachmonim Bnei Rachmonim Says:Report as Inappropriate
Everyone of us has sins. Every person in the entire country including judges congressmen senators you name have commited crimes that desrve time one way or another. The president himself never sat for smaking possesing or buying pot etc. doesn't mean he didn't do it. Yet judge jury & commener gave him a 4 year sentance in the Whitehouse.
So how is it possible people with the 3 traits of Bnei avrohom Avinu,can come out with such hate straight after the verdict. Be it that he commited crimes. What did personally benefit from those crimes? A mansion, a luxery life? I don't see it. You might call it Robin Hood. The bottom line is, he broke the eleventh commandment Thou Shalt not get caught. I am pretty sure many of the above hate filled bloggers if chas veshalom, they broke the eleventh commandment, be it on an ilegal domestic help, cash business[not filing taxes properly], credit cards they took on lies & have now settled for 20%, shortsales on houses they knew they could never pay for, you name it, somweewhere they probably intentionaly went wrong.
Bernie Maddof, spent years preaching ethics, someone once invited him to a part in Lakewood. He even spoke & against Bnei Torah's honesy
148
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:45 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ If OJ Simpson is free, why not Shalom? ”
OJ is not free, he is in prison in Nevada.
149
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:59 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
to shaul from monsey:
nebech on you & ur family. you're an arrogant fool. now go laugh. Hashem is not laughing.
150
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:59 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Are you serious? This is the best you can do?
YOU GOOGLED SOMETHING ON THE JUDGE AND YOU THINK PEOPLE SHOULD CARE?
It is just astounding that you people cannot seem to accept that a trial was held and he was found guilty. You are still chattering about what kind of a person he is, and that he once gave kishka to your mother-in-law when she was hungry.
Is there ANYONE claiming that he was on trial for being a Baal Chessed? Was he charged with having bad character? For having a lousy family?
What is it that you are all defending? The trial is over. No one asked about his character, his personality or his family.
He was charged with fraud. Is he guilty? Twelve jurors said yes. He is not being tried by shteeble-yidden in Boro Park.
HE WAS FOUND FOUND GUILTY! That is not a complicated sentence (no pun intended). No one is claiming he was a bad friend or a crummy neighbor. They are claiming he is guilty of fraud. That's it.
If you can't accept it, keep comparing him to other defendants who got lucky. Keep talking about how wonderful he is.
IT DOESN'T MATTER! HE WAS FOUND GUILTY! GET OVER IT!
”
Well did it occur to you that this is a conflict of interest and SHE was interested in following through on her initial interest from the get go. In addition did it occur to you that she manipulated the trial by not allowing evidence that could help SMR and allowing evidence like testimony about the immigration when it wasn't relevant to this trial but relevant to her interest and intentions? And did it also occur to you that she favored the prosecution for these very same reasons and if another judge would have looked at all these 91 charges they might have dismissed as many as half before it even came to trial?
Is your judgement so clouded and blinded and filled with hatred that YOU can not see even these possibilities? Do YOU honestly believe there were 91 actual valid charges worthy of him having life and after-life sentence? Do you honestly believe that the judge should throw the book at him, or knowing that she was in on it from the beginning do you still believe that SHE should decide his sentence?
151
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:54 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Are you serious? This is the best you can do?
YOU GOOGLED SOMETHING ON THE JUDGE AND YOU THINK PEOPLE SHOULD CARE?
It is just astounding that you people cannot seem to accept that a trial was held and he was found guilty. You are still chattering about what kind of a person he is, and that he once gave kishka to your mother-in-law when she was hungry.
Is there ANYONE claiming that he was on trial for being a Baal Chessed? Was he charged with having bad character? For having a lousy family?
What is it that you are all defending? The trial is over. No one asked about his character, his personality or his family.
He was charged with fraud. Is he guilty? Twelve jurors said yes. He is not being tried by shteeble-yidden in Boro Park.
HE WAS FOUND FOUND GUILTY! That is not a complicated sentence (no pun intended). No one is claiming he was a bad friend or a crummy neighbor. They are claiming he is guilty of fraud. That's it.
If you can't accept it, keep comparing him to other defendants who got lucky. Keep talking about how wonderful he is.
IT DOESN'T MATTER! HE WAS FOUND GUILTY! GET OVER IT!
”
We will never, ever get over it.
152
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:54 PM MosheG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Empire poultry is a large business and a stock company. How come they thrive? ”
they have the union on their side!
153
Nov 12, 2009 at 11:09 PM Ari Says:Report as Inappropriate
Everyone has Racmonis on him. But you can’t blame the government or the system; they have to enforce the laws.
The government goes out of there way to accommodated religious needs, and is nice and fair to everyone; until you get caught we a Geneva.
And by the way, we not talking that he didn’t pay taxes, he did worse then that.
154
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:52 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Oh, yes, NOW I understand.
Now that you mention it, this is a conspiracy by the government, by Obama, by the unions, the only one who did nothing wrong is Rubashkin.
The judge was crooked, the jury was bought, the charges were falsified, the witnesses were coerced, and SMR is the greatest Jew that ever lived.
He loves his family, he financially supports the entire Jewish community, he's taking the blame for the rest of his family, but he's too nice to mention it.
He is too stupid to run a business and didn't know what others around him were doing, everyone else does it anyway, that's how businesses are always run, and if I ever applied for a credit card I should go to jail.instead of him.
The bank knew about the fraud so it doesn't count, they got paid so no one got hurt, the government planted employees to entrap him, and billing a clothing store for meat was just a mistake.
We should pray for our brothers, anyone who testified was maasering and should die, if I don't believe SMR was innocent I have no Jewish soul, and why is O.J. SImpson running around if SMR might get a 1,280 year (!) jail sentence.
DO I HAVE IT RIGHT NOW? DO I UNDERSTAND IT NOW? ”
No, you don't understand at all! Even if he did things wrongly or purposely, he still did do MORE good than not. By losing his whole empire, he already paid his punishment. By not wishing him well you display no Jewish soul. He did not bring a chilul Hashem, he brought a kiddush Hashem when realizing how modestly he lived and how many supporters he has. With all the wrong that he did, and if his business was still here today, the banks would have all gotten their loans and the illegals would still be paying taxes and no one would get hurt. The ice did more harm with theri aggressive tactics, they surely did not display much humanity. The gov't ishould be there to help, they could have warned and helped out.
155
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:51 PM Moshe Says:Report as Inappropriate
we have a yidish Yiddish harts and we should all pray for him, that’s not the point.
The point is, it has nothing to do with anti-Semitism.
I know yiden who ganve who are not in jail, I know who are in jail.
I know nish-yiden who ganva who are in jail, and I know who are not.
By crying anti-semitsim every time. You give courage to Nazis and real anti-Semites, and hsem yismrieni.
By defending ganovim (even good people, but still a ganav) you give courage to anti-Semites.
By defending gonovim, is just stupid fanatic, and against the Roshen Hsem
156
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:51 PM Shaul in Monsey Says:Report as Inappropriate
146, "let us takeh try to figure out what we can do." You're absolutely right. Let's start with not committing bank fraud and also let's all take on not to minimize the law because "everyone does it" and "everyone lies on credit card applications." Let's start there.
And before I forget. If, and that's a BIG IF, SMR were smart, he would plea out on the remaining charges because he will lose that trial also. He still has a card left to play and that's it. Plea bargain on the illegal alien charges BEFORE sentencing on these charges next week and MAYBE the judge will run concurrent sentences. But SMR and all the yutz's here crying about antisemites and conspiracies need to cut that out and see the truth first to limit SMRs jail time. Make no mistake. He is going to do time and I was the first one to say he should have taken the 15. I was right then and I'm right now. I'm the real rachmonim bnei rachmonim because I am telling it like it is. Plea down on the remaining charges and get the prosecution to move the judge for concurrent sentencing on these verdicts. Guy Cook is a FOOL for letting this happen. Guy, you made your million now do your job and limit the damage.
157
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:47 PM Everybody has an opinion Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Rachmono Litzlan from some of the comments of what I can safely assume to be frum yidden. You have no yiddishe hartz, you have no yiddishe neshome, the mistakes he made did not warrant the massive charges compared to what murderers, rapists. And terrorists get.
I can't believe how Jewish children, children of avrohom yitzchok and yaakov can write words like that.
The govt, with the encouragement of the unions and peta threw the library at him, if u think big corps and businesses don't routinley do similar you're delusional.
Until such a travesty would R"L happen to someone u love u all won't understand the depth of this tragedy.
Hard core criminals get much much less than this.
Sholom Mordche is a special yungerman from a special family. Please let us takeh try to figure out what we can do. For him and his family. Start with a kapital thilim and start with a little more feeling and love for each other. Its so sa to read some of these comments shanmeful ”
Rahmonah litzlan, it's not for a pompous windbag to decide whether I have a jewish heart or neshama.
You are obviously unfamiliar with this case.
The mistakes he made, according to you, don't warrant the same "massive" charges as against murderers. happily for you, he wasn't charged with those. he was charged with fraud. and NOT so happily for you, he was found guilty, because you are the only one who thinks approximately 100 counts of fraud and other crimes are a teeny tiny mistake.
so I am sorry to inform you that your heavenly angel is now a convicted felon.
So sad!
158
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:41 PM Ari Says:Report as Inappropriate
#90
You are a self-centered guy, who cares only that your block (whatever you live) should be ok.
You have no respect for the law and the system of this great land.
He did produce false bills, and Hsem has shown us time and time and again that does people will go to jail
I don’t know one inncent guy who is in jail B"H
159
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:40 PM I mean, seriously? Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Do you know what
"Red necks" and KKK are ? Do you know what the posuk says "eisev soneh layakov" ? Are you for real? Did you honestly think he had a fair chance ? This is just like the 60 when african americans were convicted no matter what the evidence showed !!! Be real and call it what it is ANTI SEMITISM and a favor for peta and the unions ,
Can you explain to me how all farmers get away with ilegals ? I can drive down a street in NYC and pick up 100 illegals without breaking a sweat...
Just the goverment looks the other way until they want.. And when they want to get you they " selectivly" endorce the law that they want to get you on .. JUSTICE is supposed to blind ... If you believe that I have a bridge to sell you
I am not saying that nothing illegal was done , what I am saying is that this was a case of "selective" enforcment , 70 years ago JEWS were also selected .. I see no diffrence except its not being done in mass yet ”
"70 years ago JEWS were also selected .. I see no diffrence "
Yes, this is EXACTLY like Hitler killing the Jews, you moron.
Except that was Hitler, not 12 people too stupid to get out of jury duty,
and those were innocent Jews being killed, not a dishonest businessman charged with fraud maybe going to jail.
And if you don't see any difference, you are really, truly too stupid to live.
My family was killed by the nazis. You have the nerve to open your ignorant mouth and compare that to this?
I can't begin to express how repulsive a mental defective you are without getting thrown off VIN.
But you owe a huge, HUGE apology to over six million neshamas, and the millions and millions who lived through it, and the millions and millions and millions who were affected by it.
Except, apparently, you.
You are a menuvaldig piece of sh-t, and very lucky you kept your identity anonymous.
160
Nov 12, 2009 at 10:40 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ So what? This doesn't say anything positive about the country we live in. This shows the flaws that even a democracy has. No rachmanus what so ever. How can a country be so evil to put someone away for life for violating some stupid law. Did he kill someone, did he steal someones money? ”
"How can a country be so evil to put someone away for life for violating some stupid law. Did he kill someone, did he steal someones money?”
Yes...he stole money through the multiple frauds he committed against the banks etc. These were multiple felonies not "some stupid law". The only "stupidity" was by SMR himself. he claimed he was too stupid to know what he did was illegal and then compounded that stupidity when the prosecution offered a plea agreement which he rejected. This was not a one time, single mistake. This was a pattern of criminal activity over many years. How about some rachmonis for the jews who will suffer from persecution and antisemitism because of his crimes.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 10:39 PM Liepa Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ you have a point
charlie rangel and the treasury secretary should also sit in jail.
they should have known better
i guess the question here is should rubashkin have known better
i dont know the answer to thast one ”
Excellent point, justice isn't equal accross the board.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 10:39 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Friends
The trial is over, Sholom Mordechai has been found guilty by a jury of his peers. This is not some dictatorship or communist country. He HAS been given a FAIR TRIAL and was judged fairly
It is our job as fellow Jews to help free him as early as possible.
However, now that the trial is over, and he has been found guilty, the work will need to be done on minimizing the sentence, then parole, and other types of releases. I can't talk about all possibilities here, but I want to say one thing
All this talk about his not receiving a fair trial, calling it a hatchet job, & similar statements are neither true nor helpful. In fact, they insult our justice system, and the people involved in it, and make us look like idiots and anger the very people who will decide his fate
STOP foolish statements
Statements bashing the justice system are foolish and will hurt him not help him.
Inventing stories that make believe he did not know what was going on.. are insulting to the readers and will not help him
In dealing with the tragedy of a heimishe Yid in tfeesa... in jail, who be serving time in prison, we need the good graces of Judges & Boards who control his future ”
Just because a jury reaches a verdict does not make it just! look at OJ and Lehavdil R Meir Kahane. May Hashem have mercy on his children.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:10 PM Trustee Says:Report as Inappropriate
I am shocked...a yid convicted of numberous crimes.
erlicher menches getting the yank. Its not right...
gevaldick
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:15 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Oh, yes, NOW I understand.
Now that you mention it, this is a conspiracy by the government, by Obama, by the unions, the only one who did nothing wrong is Rubashkin.
The judge was crooked, the jury was bought, the charges were falsified, the witnesses were coerced, and SMR is the greatest Jew that ever lived.
He loves his family, he financially supports the entire Jewish community, he's taking the blame for the rest of his family, but he's too nice to mention it.
He is too stupid to run a business and didn't know what others around him were doing, everyone else does it anyway, that's how businesses are always run, and if I ever applied for a credit card I should go to jail.instead of him.
The bank knew about the fraud so it doesn't count, they got paid so no one got hurt, the government planted employees to entrap him, and billing a clothing store for meat was just a mistake.
We should pray for our brothers, anyone who testified was maasering and should die, if I don't believe SMR was innocent I have no Jewish soul, and why is O.J. SImpson running around if SMR might get a 1,280 year (!) jail sentence.
DO I HAVE IT RIGHT NOW? DO I UNDERSTAND IT NOW? ”
You got it, but you failed to mention that SMR is suffering only because the original sin and the crucifixion will come after the next trial
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:45 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ There is also much sadness, that some individuals are actually delighted with the conviction of Sholom Rubashkin.
Look at the comments posted and the language used by some, you feel their hatred of Rubashkin, or you feel the gladness in their hearts that finally Rubashkin has been convicted.
This is truly a reason for sadness. ”
Of course your right see saul in monsey,formally,omg.Don't you feel the 'pain' they are feeling like they try to claim.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:39 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
I am very sorry to hear this bad news, may hashem help him and his family and friends in this terrible time, may he be released immediately! 'נסתרים דרכי ה.
.ישיעת ה' כהרף עין. Never give up hope.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:38 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ As I said a week ago that I am willing to go out on a limb and predict that he will be found not guilty on the charges that he failed to pay for the cattle in a timely manner
Here is the information “The jury found him not guilty of five counts of violating a law requiring payment of livestock providers within 24 hours”. As others said on this blog that the prudent thing to do was to take a plea but this is what you get if you don’t feel that the laws apply to you. Yes my heart is in pain for his family and particular his young children, who need a father figure in the house. But now it is too late.
”
If you think anyone beleives your heart is in pain,you are mistaken.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:38 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ All you think that rubashkin stole money.even the feds agree that he did not steel a penny.
When you sign up for a credit card and write that you make 100 thousand becaus you want a bigger loan you should also be sitting in jail for fraud and wiring because you did it over the internet.
This whole thing is just to get him and they don't have proper evidence. ”
when u sign up for a credit card and u claim more than u make THAT IS ILLEGAL
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:52 PM murray Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Nothing short of a modern day blood libel.. Anti Semitism is alive and well in America's heartland.. This should be a wake up. that no matter how you see yourself they still hate us!!! Berny Maddoff 150 years Rubashkin 1280.00 what a mockery of the US Judicial system it's a monkey court!! ”
I agree with everything you say.........Except- "it's a monkey court"
Please show some respect for the Court, and call it what it is actually, and Not make up deragatory terms. In truth it is a KANGAROO COURT. This is Not a joke or an insult but a true definition of this court.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:50 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Oyyy what kind of stupid lawyer did he get?
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:47 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Ben Brafman said that in today's society, you get it worse if you commit white collar crimes than if you murder someone. Let this be a lesson to all those who want to commit crimes and hope askanim will save them.
This is another Chillul Hashem, like what happened in the summer.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:36 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Rachmono Litzlan from some of the comments of what I can safely assume to be frum yidden. You have no yiddishe hartz, you have no yiddishe neshome, the mistakes he made did not warrant the massive charges compared to what murderers, rapists. And terrorists get.
I can't believe how Jewish children, children of avrohom yitzchok and yaakov can write words like that.
The govt, with the encouragement of the unions and peta threw the library at him, if u think big corps and businesses don't routinley do similar you're delusional.
Until such a travesty would R"L happen to someone u love u all won't understand the depth of this tragedy.
Hard core criminals get much much less than this.
Sholom Mordche is a special yungerman from a special family. Please let us takeh try to figure out what we can do. For him and his family. Start with a kapital thilim and start with a little more feeling and love for each other. Its so sa to read some of these comments shanmeful ”
You call yourself Godol HaDor; how dare you to say “you have no yiddishe hartz, you have no yiddishe neshome,” why because we begged and cried that SMR should take a plea, but people like you who believed that because he gave away some free chickens or printed the Tanya that a miracle will happen, some of us who understood the consequences of not taking the plea said don’t rely on miracle they just don’t happened every day that is why it is called a miracle, think about it this way that during the holocaust millions of Jews said Tehillim and fasted but still six million died on Kiddish Hashem,
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:32 PM me Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ For those who think the Jury was anti-Semitic...why the acquittal on 5 charges? Wouldn't anti-Semites putting an innocent man away find him guilty on all counts?
This looks like a fair verdict. SMR defenders claimed the Government overreached with the livestock charges. The Jury agreed and found him not guilty. Obviously there was thought put into their decision.
”
Because finding him guilty on all charges would be to obvious. Anyway, I am not here to say that they are anti-Semitic , If i were in their shoes I may have had to say the same thing.
I do think that the jury system together with all its pros has its' cons. Professionals should be making the decisions not amateurs. But then again, can one find a honest professional.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:27 PM Moshe Says:Report as Inappropriate
Agree with 159 and 160.
The justice system is right 90% of the time. If you have a batter system kol hkovoed, but until then, that’s the best there is.
May hsem help him he should get a low jail sentence and be out soon.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:25 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Everyone has Racmonis on him. But you can’t blame the government or the system; they have to enforce the laws.
The government goes out of there way to accommodated religious needs, and is nice and fair to everyone; until you get caught we a Geneva.
And by the way, we not talking that he didn’t pay taxes, he did worse then that.
”
WE each have choice and WE each choose who to believe. 5 minutes ago I saw on the news how a man who served many years in jail was just released because someone lied at his trial and he was actually innocent. So those who WANT to believe that he is guilty and chooses to do so will continue take joy in the verdict. Those who believe in his innocence, or more so, who believe this was an ambitious action and objective on the part of this group of officials with extraordinary means and procedures; purposefully planned illegal and immoral practices unlike those conducted on similar businesses will continue to choose to believe that he is no more guilty than the owners or managers than Swift or Tyson and should have received the same treatment.
Had the JUDGE and the ICE and other officials who WENT after SMR with a vengeance not done so, the rest of the chapters would never have been written such as the collapse of funds, the need to divert funds, etc., etc., etc., He admits to being a sloppy and unorganized and maybe even foolish uneducated businessman who does what his more educated and experienced advisors tells him too. So he is definitely guilty of hiring the wrong people.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:24 PM Loshon Hora Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ 146, "let us takeh try to figure out what we can do." You're absolutely right. Let's start with not committing bank fraud and also let's all take on not to minimize the law because "everyone does it" and "everyone lies on credit card applications." Let's start there.
And before I forget. If, and that's a BIG IF, SMR were smart, he would plea out on the remaining charges because he will lose that trial also. He still has a card left to play and that's it. Plea bargain on the illegal alien charges BEFORE sentencing on these charges next week and MAYBE the judge will run concurrent sentences. But SMR and all the yutz's here crying about antisemites and conspiracies need to cut that out and see the truth first to limit SMRs jail time. Make no mistake. He is going to do time and I was the first one to say he should have taken the 15. I was right then and I'm right now. I'm the real rachmonim bnei rachmonim because I am telling it like it is. Plea down on the remaining charges and get the prosecution to move the judge for concurrent sentencing on these verdicts. Guy Cook is a FOOL for letting this happen. Guy, you made your million now do your job and limit the damage. ”
A few minutes after a verdict, before a sentance for a fellow Jew, this is what you think about.You really need a bedika of Yichus, you cannot be a decendent or Talmid of Avrohom Avinu, more so after rebuke you continue to jusify yourself.
I am willing to bet if you broke the 11th camandment [Thou shalt not get caught] chas veshalom, on half the laws you broke, your song would change.
Back to the point a yid is in very big tzaar, be it self inflicted or not, a family is in tzar small children have been defacto orphaned, & you go out & give musar.
You are the guy at the levaya of a young father who leaves an almona & 10 yesomin, who starts saying maybe he was on drugs or it was a suicide, he lived on a high, who asked him to have such a big family? Everything, but asking how they will continue & how could you help, & offering condolence.
You are what you are & that is best way to explain it, any other adjective would not be enough.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:24 PM Mendel From Brooklyn ( where else could Mendel be from) Says:Report as Inappropriate
I think that even those who think that they have a need to defend the system should also end their comments with a prayer for SMR. I can see where you are coming from. stop the ruthless hate. defend your point then simply say I wish everything comes out for the better - he is my brother although I do not agree with him or his actions..
I also see where others are coming from. Nothing is as clear cut as anyone of the sides make it sound ( although I know someone is going to say something to the effect as there was a fair jury etc. )
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:19 PM Menachem Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ 146, "let us takeh try to figure out what we can do." You're absolutely right. Let's start with not committing bank fraud and also let's all take on not to minimize the law because "everyone does it" and "everyone lies on credit card applications." Let's start there.
And before I forget. If, and that's a BIG IF, SMR were smart, he would plea out on the remaining charges because he will lose that trial also. He still has a card left to play and that's it. Plea bargain on the illegal alien charges BEFORE sentencing on these charges next week and MAYBE the judge will run concurrent sentences. But SMR and all the yutz's here crying about antisemites and conspiracies need to cut that out and see the truth first to limit SMRs jail time. Make no mistake. He is going to do time and I was the first one to say he should have taken the 15. I was right then and I'm right now. I'm the real rachmonim bnei rachmonim because I am telling it like it is. Plea down on the remaining charges and get the prosecution to move the judge for concurrent sentencing on these verdicts. Guy Cook is a FOOL for letting this happen. Guy, you made your million now do your job and limit the damage. ”
B"H
Shaul,
#1 stop bragging that you predicted the down fall and tzuris of another jew... its not normal to talk like that.... I don't know where you learn or what Rav you hold from but seriously think about what you would tell you father if he was charged with this crime.
#2 if someone does not feel they deserve to get a 15 year sentence because the goverment pushed them into a situation then they should not please guilty.
I hope you daven to the same G-d that I do and Hashem has the power to take care of anything including this. It will be good we just can't see how at a time like this.
By the way while I am thinking about it..... there is something inherently wrong with the same judge who last week would have given 15 years this week giving 1000.
Shaul... if you realize how wrong you are now would be a good time to open your heart (and maybe your wallet) and realize that a family with 10 kids is now going to need your help to pay tuition, etc.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:18 PM Ari Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Well did it occur to you that this is a conflict of interest and SHE was interested in following through on her initial interest from the get go. In addition did it occur to you that she manipulated the trial by not allowing evidence that could help SMR and allowing evidence like testimony about the immigration when it wasn't relevant to this trial but relevant to her interest and intentions? And did it also occur to you that she favored the prosecution for these very same reasons and if another judge would have looked at all these 91 charges they might have dismissed as many as half before it even came to trial?
Is your judgement so clouded and blinded and filled with hatred that YOU can not see even these possibilities? Do YOU honestly believe there were 91 actual valid charges worthy of him having life and after-life sentence? Do you honestly believe that the judge should throw the book at him, or knowing that she was in on it from the beginning do you still believe that SHE should decide his sentence?
”
So you are saying the charges are false? Do you have prove? Is it difficult to believe he did it? You never heard a yid doing that?
I don’t know any innocent yid sitting in jail
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:16 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ 146, "let us takeh try to figure out what we can do." You're absolutely right. Let's start with not committing bank fraud and also let's all take on not to minimize the law because "everyone does it" and "everyone lies on credit card applications." Let's start there.
And before I forget. If, and that's a BIG IF, SMR were smart, he would plea out on the remaining charges because he will lose that trial also. He still has a card left to play and that's it. Plea bargain on the illegal alien charges BEFORE sentencing on these charges next week and MAYBE the judge will run concurrent sentences. But SMR and all the yutz's here crying about antisemites and conspiracies need to cut that out and see the truth first to limit SMRs jail time. Make no mistake. He is going to do time and I was the first one to say he should have taken the 15. I was right then and I'm right now. I'm the real rachmonim bnei rachmonim because I am telling it like it is. Plea down on the remaining charges and get the prosecution to move the judge for concurrent sentencing on these verdicts. Guy Cook is a FOOL for letting this happen. Guy, you made your million now do your job and limit the damage. ”
Well did it occur to you that this is a conflict of interest and SHE was interested in following through on her initial interest from the get go. In addition did it occur to you that she manipulated the trial by not allowing evidence that could help SMR and allowing evidence like testimony about the immigration when it wasn't relevant to this trial but relevant to her interest and intentions? And did it also occur to you that she favored the prosecution for these very same reasons and if another judge would have looked at all these 91 charges they might have dismissed as many as half before it even came to trial?
Is your judgement so clouded and blinded and filled with hatred that YOU can not see even these possibilities? Do YOU honestly believe there were 91 actual valid charges worthy of him having life and after-life sentence? Do you honestly believe that the judge should throw the book at him, or knowing that she was in on it from the beginning do you still believe that SHE should decide his sentence?
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:03 AM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ If you think anyone beleives your heart is in pain,you are mistaken. ”
Are you looking for a hostile takeover from God, it is God’s job to judge me not you.
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Nov 12, 2009 at 11:59 PM Poor Guy Part 1 Says:Report as Inappropriate
Let's remember one point here, Rubashkin had no intent what so ever on stealing one dollar from the bank ( unlike sooooo many others we all know) he was working his tail off and getting kosher meat to hundreds of thousands of Jews, if not millions.
lets also not forget the hundreds of families that had bread on their tables thanks to him and his company.
testimony has shown, that for years and years he has repaid all his creditors every last dollar.
Part one
It all came crashing down because this corroupt goverment took stupid action in the worst possible financial time of all, and shut down his operations by arresting the hard working mexicans in his plant doing the work that americans dont want to do, therby causing hondreds more to be out of work looking for OBAMAS hand outs.
lets remember one thing that happens on this "Oilam Hasheker" this courrupt planet survives on lies, begining at the Presidents level where for ever American presidents have catered to special interests all for money, that probably came from illgotten gains helped by courrupt senators and congressmen passing special bills to help these big donors.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:57 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ A jury of 12 people found him guilty of stealing from a bank. Whats antisemitic about that? Should he get off because hes jewish, should there be one set of laws for jews and one for non jews? ”
He never stole from the bank the bank acctualy reported him as second to most lucrative loan of 2008 and besides if you ever went to visit a jail which I have many times you would know its no place for any human being so stop being so self rightchess
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:02 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Friends
The trial is over, Sholom Mordechai has been found guilty by a jury of his peers. This is not some dictatorship or communist country. He HAS been given a FAIR TRIAL and was judged fairly
It is our job as fellow Jews to help free him as early as possible.
However, now that the trial is over, and he has been found guilty, the work will need to be done on minimizing the sentence, then parole, and other types of releases. I can't talk about all possibilities here, but I want to say one thing
All this talk about his not receiving a fair trial, calling it a hatchet job, & similar statements are neither true nor helpful. In fact, they insult our justice system, and the people involved in it, and make us look like idiots and anger the very people who will decide his fate
STOP foolish statements
Statements bashing the justice system are foolish and will hurt him not help him.
Inventing stories that make believe he did not know what was going on.. are insulting to the readers and will not help him
In dealing with the tragedy of a heimishe Yid in tfeesa... in jail, who be serving time in prison, we need the good graces of Judges & Boards who control his future ”
So lecking judges to get your way meens a good justice system
Just addmit it america sucks in canada had this happend he would of got a fine and if jail time between 6 and 18 monthes that's justice
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:31 AM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Agree with 159 and 160.
The justice system is right 90% of the time. If you have a batter system kol hkovoed, but until then, that’s the best there is.
May hsem help him he should get a low jail sentence and be out soon.
”
The problem with your prayer is that the Federal Sentencing Guidelines is very harsh they years on each count is bad they only thing that we pray for is that the judge to have a kind heart and sentence SMR concurrently, so hopefully one day SMR will see the light of the day. But if all these idiots continue to malign the judge and the system, believe me it would not be helpful to SMR, therefore, every one of you who maligned the Judge and the system might have a direct hand in the harsh sentence he might get.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:26 AM ein oid Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I don't know what to say... but, "Reb" Shalom was one of the biggest supporters of the "Mishichist" movement of Chabad. Much of his "tzedakah" went to them. In all the pictures, his children are wearing "Yechi" yarmulkas. And in some of the pictures, even the folders he brought to court strongly indicate he is a strong mishichist.
Maybe if he would have bitachon in the true Ribono Shel Olam, it would have done him some good. I am not sure id Reb Shach zt"l, the founder of the Yated, would be too proud of its editor at this point!! ”
I was waiting for long for someone to bring up the "elephant in the room"! great comment , gives us what to think about . ein oid milvado!
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:21 AM ... you Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Liepa, you're a moron. Grow a brain. Comparing a $400 credit card to a 35 million dollar bank line is like comparing your wife to Miss America. Sure, both are women but I guarantee you the similarities end right there. And the yidden that died in true blood libels curse you from their graves when you compare them to SMR. He stole and got caught. Get over it. Sad how his arrogance destroyed him. He thought because he wore his beard and hat and gave away some of his ill gotten gains to charity, that he was above any law. Had he listened years ago when people were begging him to either make changes or sell out, things might have been different. Had he taken the plea bargain the government offered, he wouldn't be facing what he's facing now. His stubbornness, arrogance and self righteousness destroyed him. May his saga be a lesson to others who think they are above the law. ”
I rote something to you I guess they dident put it on in any event no person belongs in jail including you and that says a lot there's a reason the thorah is against jails
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:16 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ where is everybody...???? the Rebbes shluchim and family. is "lubavitch ein mishpocho" a fantasy of the past? when chassidim would fight hell or high water for their fellow chossid..we need to take a stand NOW!!!! its not too late to free an innocent chossid, tzaddik..the holocaust happened when fellow yidden sat back and crossed their arms..we need to take a stand now! SHLUCHIM stop being politically correct and protecting your corporate image, rather act like your meshaleach our REBBE and SCREAM THE TRUTH!!! dont be intimidated of your buddies in washington. the inquistion didnt break us neither the bolshevics. Remember RUBASHKIN is the bailus and dreyfus of our time! Let us not stop until justice prevails and our fellow chossid is FREE!!!! ”
Either you believe in the justice system or you dont . make up your mind already . We all know if the verdict was on his side you would be jumping up and down and parading the streets singing and celebrating . So now that it turned out that he is guilty you should except it. Not saying you should be happy but you can not have it both ways . either you hold of the system or you dont !
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:11 AM Use Your Head Says:Report as Inappropriate
To all those who are determined to defend Mr. Rubashkin no matter how true the charges may be, regardless of the fact that it is clear that fraud was committed.....to all those who say "let's see your books, everyone 'pulls shtick' to stay in business"....."everybody breaks the law"......the government and the prosecution and the jury are all anti-Semitic.....
SHAME ON YOU.
Obviously, it is sad that Mr. Rubashkin and his family are going through such a difficult time. However, the law is the law and when crime is committed, there are consequences. We should be HAPPY to live in a country where there are fair laws and these laws are upheld. Many countries in the world are far worse.
Learn the Torah - truthfulness and honesty are the very foundations of our religion (if this is not obvious to you, learn Sefer Bereishis and read about the Avos).
If you are fudging your books to stay in business, you are not living your religion. You are violating both secular law as well as the Torah laws. We're not talking about obscure rules here - we're talking about basic, explicit commandments in the Torah. All over. A truly frum Jew does NOT "pull shtick". END OF STORY.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 06:02 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ "he still walks around with a smile and with a GENUINE belief in Hashem that He is the controller of the world, and this is what Hashem wants.."
Well, maybe SMR was right. This verdict was what hashem wanted to provide a clear message to yiddin that must obey dina d'malchusa and that it is a chilul hashem if we don't obey the law and we will be punished both under civil law and dinah di'shamayim.
”
B"H for this comment. You have summed it up. SMR is a great man, because he is the one taking the heat, in order to WAKE UP all the other idiots who keep writing nonsense here.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 05:51 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
everybody should write letters to the judge in support of rubashkin it helped in other cases I mean 20,000 letters to plea for rachmons it worked and will work again.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 05:39 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Do you know what
"Red necks" and KKK are ? Do you know what the posuk says "eisev soneh layakov" ? Are you for real? Did you honestly think he had a fair chance ? This is just like the 60 when african americans were convicted no matter what the evidence showed !!! Be real and call it what it is ANTI SEMITISM and a favor for peta and the unions ,
Can you explain to me how all farmers get away with ilegals ? I can drive down a street in NYC and pick up 100 illegals without breaking a sweat...
Just the goverment looks the other way until they want.. And when they want to get you they " selectivly" endorce the law that they want to get you on .. JUSTICE is supposed to blind ... If you believe that I have a bridge to sell you
I am not saying that nothing illegal was done , what I am saying is that this was a case of "selective" enforcment , 70 years ago JEWS were also selected .. I see no diffrence except its not being done in mass yet ”
prosecutors love to go after cases that generate publicity. this way they can maximize the fear that prosecution will entail.
The government only has the resources to go after 1/1000 offenders, so they have to go after ones that will generate the most attention.
This case generated a lot of attention as the numerous comments tell, so the prosecutors chose well. How many of us will now be more careful regarding the American law.
Sholom was not worse than many people, but his public unique lifestyle made him a target.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 07:35 AM Shocked Says:Report as Inappropriate
"Obviously, it is sad that Mr. Rubashkin and his family are going through such a difficult time..."
No actually, it is not obvious by some of the cold hearted posts here, who, even after they got what they want and see a family in mourning don't have the decency to shut up for 24 hours.
Those who have posted religiously against Rubashkin here, continue to pour salt on open wounds, show not a shred of compassion and embarrass me as a Jew. They have lost complete touch with the axiomatic principles of Rachmanim Bnei Rachmanin, and they pay no heed at all to Hillel's statement. Don't do unto others... love your fellow like YOURSELF. THIS IS THE TORAH, the rest is commentary.
These awful remarks are an indictment on some in the Jewish community. It highlights a grave lack of compassion and humility.
My hope is only that when their day comes before the heavenly court, that G-d not judge them the way they judged others.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 07:45 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Hashem Yerachem - Ain lonu lehishoen ela al avinu shebashamaim
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Nov 13, 2009 at 07:47 AM writingsetc Says:Report as Inappropriate
Was a key point emphasized to the jury: that Sholom had very little English education, and, therefore, he left everything up to those he hired whom he assumed to be qualified. EVEN PRESIDENTS DO THAT! While Sholom totally immersed himself in the kosher animals issues of his business. (Hope the appeal does that.)
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Nov 13, 2009 at 07:47 AM THE LETZER DOR Says:Report as Inappropriate
THIS IS LUBAVITCH'S BUSINESS 9/11. SMR'S PERSONAL MUMBAI. THE FEDS AND THOSE SHAKRONIM YIDDEN THAT TESTIFIED GAINST HIM FOR THEIR OWN NEFARIOUS GAINS CAME WITH AN ANTI SEMITIC AGENDA TO FINISH HIM OFF L'HAROIG UL'HASHMAID.
HE WILL WIN ON APPEAL AS HE CLEARLY WAS IGNORANT, UNEDUCATED IN THE WAYS OF THE LAW AND BUSINESS. HE IS A POSHETER YID WITH A GLORIOUS AND RIGHTEOUS AND GENEROUS HEART AND TOTALLY DISTANCED FROM THE DAY TO DAY MANAGEMENT AND DECISIONS. THOSE MAMZERIM WHO TESTIFIED AGAINST HIM DID SO TO SAVE THEIR OWN LYING HIDES.THEY WILL PAY DEARLY FOR THEIR TREACHERY. MARK MY WORDS.
JUSTICE WILL BE DONE.... HE WILL WIN ON APPEAL AND BE FULLY VINDICATED KAIN YEHI ROTZOIN....DIDON NOTZACH.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 07:51 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ To all those who are determined to defend Mr. Rubashkin no matter how true the charges may be, regardless of the fact that it is clear that fraud was committed.....to all those who say "let's see your books, everyone 'pulls shtick' to stay in business"....."everybody breaks the law"......the government and the prosecution and the jury are all anti-Semitic.....
SHAME ON YOU.
Obviously, it is sad that Mr. Rubashkin and his family are going through such a difficult time. However, the law is the law and when crime is committed, there are consequences. We should be HAPPY to live in a country where there are fair laws and these laws are upheld. Many countries in the world are far worse.
Learn the Torah - truthfulness and honesty are the very foundations of our religion (if this is not obvious to you, learn Sefer Bereishis and read about the Avos).
If you are fudging your books to stay in business, you are not living your religion. You are violating both secular law as well as the Torah laws. We're not talking about obscure rules here - we're talking about basic, explicit commandments in the Torah. All over. A truly frum Jew does NOT "pull shtick". END OF STORY. ”
"Fair Laws"
Welcome to America.
A country where people get close to nothing for murder & rape and 100 years for creating a false invoice.
We must stop having so much blind faith in the "Goldeh medina", a land where justice is as unbalanced as it could get.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:04 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ "70 years ago JEWS were also selected .. I see no diffrence "
Yes, this is EXACTLY like Hitler killing the Jews, you moron.
Except that was Hitler, not 12 people too stupid to get out of jury duty,
and those were innocent Jews being killed, not a dishonest businessman charged with fraud maybe going to jail.
And if you don't see any difference, you are really, truly too stupid to live.
My family was killed by the nazis. You have the nerve to open your ignorant mouth and compare that to this?
I can't begin to express how repulsive a mental defective you are without getting thrown off VIN.
But you owe a huge, HUGE apology to over six million neshamas, and the millions and millions who lived through it, and the millions and millions and millions who were affected by it.
Except, apparently, you.
You are a menuvaldig piece of sh-t, and very lucky you kept your identity anonymous. ”
Well said! Jews have never done better anywhere in the world then the USA. To compare this trial to the Shoah is not only stupid, it's repulsive.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:10 AM Menachem Says:Report as Inappropriate
Even those that will still say America is the greatest country in the world, you will have to admit that their justice system is the worst in the civilized world.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:05 AM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ everybody should write letters to the judge in support of rubashkin it helped in other cases I mean 20,000 letters to plea for rachmons it worked and will work again. ”
there is nothing wrong with this, it does help with sentencing.
PS is does not effect guilt or innocence
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:13 AM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I googled Judge Reede and this is what I found, no kidding this is true, she was in on the raid there is an attorney Rockne Cole who wrote his congressman after being called to a meeting where other attorneys were also summoned to be the official defenders of the immigrants they were about to round up. There were improprieties and he walked out on them. The Judge was part of the inner circle. Please read it, it definitely looks like a conflict of interest. She definitely should not be sitting in judgement since she was in on it from the beginning. Whoever is close to the family please forward this.
http://www.courthouseforum.com/upload/phpjo0nIX.judge reade misconduct.pdf ”
A couple of points, one- no were in the Rockny Cole’s letter did he say that Judge Reddy was involved with the planning of the raid or evolved with the original search warrants or the subsequent arrest, what Mr. Cole is saying that there were a meeting were the court recruited defense counsel as the raid was being carried out, so far on this Mr. didn’t have a problem, the specific problem Mr. Cole had was that the DA and the defense counsel discussed the variations of the plea offers before the defense counsel met with their clients, and in his view that might product a conflict of interest for the defense counsel, as for judge Reddey he said that he doesn’t remember what if anything she said and that she was there for around 10 minutes, his problem of the Judge being there was, that according rule 11 the judge cannot participate in the plea agreement, the back and forth discussions between the prosecutor and the lawyers, and the judge could only ratify the agreement and the judge is not bound by the agreement. On page 4 Mr. Cole wrote that it is only his assumption and inference from news media that Judge Reddy was involved in the discussions on the plea deal before the defense counsel saw any detainee and as a matter of fact in the same paragraph Mr. Cole states that “I hope I am wrong on my inference” he himself wrote that it is only an inference. Two- The letter by Mr. Cole was dated July 24 2008, that is more than a year ago, SMR’s lawyers could have objected to the Judge, it seems that they came away with the conclusion that the Judge would be impartial and far too both sides.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 07:53 AM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Of course your right see saul in monsey,formally,omg.Don't you feel the 'pain' they are feeling like they try to claim. ”
sorry
we do not have any hatred for rubashkin you lie. since in realty you cannot defend his actions so you attack.
What we are mad at or at least me is Yiddin who who are just simply blind or somehow think that yiddin should be able to commit crimes and just get away with it. In addition you claim there are tzaddiki. There are 613 mizvaths not just keeping shabbos. Also if someone does not keep shabbos you would never use an excuse and say he is a tzaddik since he helped my family or gives charity.
I am mad that there is a prevailing attitude in the community that such actions fraud is permissible, acceptable and rewarded.
For those who claim the raid made him do it, sorry the false billing started years before the raid
also many white collar criminals got many years, the guys from enron just to name one.
For those some other people did the same thing are not charged, well that is life, Not every crime gets punished. Should we empty all prisons, since hey there are people who committed the same crimes are are still free?
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Nov 13, 2009 at 04:40 AM Everybody has an opinion Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Of course your right see saul in monsey,formally,omg.Don't you feel the 'pain' they are feeling like they try to claim. ”
Oh, you have nothing left to defend with, so let's start bashing those who called this correctly right from the start.
Wre you sitting and crying, saying tehillim when Bernie Madoff was convicted? Or do you pick and choose which convicted criminals you have "Ahava" for and deserve tehillim?
And please, keep insulting those people who don't agree with you - it makes your argument look much, much stronger.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:17 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ If OJ Simpson is free, why not Shalom? ”
O.J. was acquitted. Rubbishcan was convicted. Therein lies the difference.
Besides, O.J. is in the slammer for the heinous crime of stealing his stuff back which was stolen from him. He's doing more time for this "crime" than Rubbishcan will do for his multiple offenses.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 04:37 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Well did it occur to you that this is a conflict of interest and SHE was interested in following through on her initial interest from the get go. In addition did it occur to you that she manipulated the trial by not allowing evidence that could help SMR and allowing evidence like testimony about the immigration when it wasn't relevant to this trial but relevant to her interest and intentions? And did it also occur to you that she favored the prosecution for these very same reasons and if another judge would have looked at all these 91 charges they might have dismissed as many as half before it even came to trial?
Is your judgement so clouded and blinded and filled with hatred that YOU can not see even these possibilities? Do YOU honestly believe there were 91 actual valid charges worthy of him having life and after-life sentence? Do you honestly believe that the judge should throw the book at him, or knowing that she was in on it from the beginning do you still believe that SHE should decide his sentence?
”
Please you are embarrassing yourself with your complete lack of legal knowledge and procedure.
No those things can't happen, you are not Columbus discovering a new world by googling, and understand NOTHING about sentencing.
You don't even know what you are saying, and basically admit guilt by saying that another judge, according to you, would have "found him guilty" of only half the charges, which still makes him guilty (we'll leave the jury out of this for a moment.)
Oh, please, G-d, at what point are these people going to understand that SMR was found guilty, and it is not the bad judge, the bought jury, the coerced witnesses, the evil family, the corrupt administration, the anti-semitic government, the unions, the CIA, WalMart, Empire Poultry, Jimmy Hoffa, Amelia Airheart, the KKK or aliens from another dimension that caused this to happen?
If you think the judge was "in on it from the beginning", then file a complaint.
Otherwise, sit down, and, for Heaven's sake, shut up!. Finally! Please!
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Nov 13, 2009 at 04:27 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ How does that explain the following:
"Prosecutors alleged during the trial that Rubashkin falsified sales records to defraud the plant¹s St. Louis-based lender. The fake invoices and shipping papers created the illusion of sales that had never happened, and allowed Rubashkin to borrow more out of a $35 million credit line."
This has nothing to do with illegals or PETA.
”
It all happened after the raid and PETA. Until then he was paying back on time and in full.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:22 AM mt mehdi Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ everybody should write letters to the judge in support of rubashkin it helped in other cases I mean 20,000 letters to plea for rachmons it worked and will work again. ”
You are better off writing 20,000 letters to the frum OIlum to be honest in business and not violate the law.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:26 AM anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ where is everybody...???? the Rebbes shluchim and family. is "lubavitch ein mishpocho" a fantasy of the past? when chassidim would fight hell or high water for their fellow chossid..we need to take a stand NOW!!!! its not too late to free an innocent chossid, tzaddik..the holocaust happened when fellow yidden sat back and crossed their arms..we need to take a stand now! SHLUCHIM stop being politically correct and protecting your corporate image, rather act like your meshaleach our REBBE and SCREAM THE TRUTH!!! dont be intimidated of your buddies in washington. the inquistion didnt break us neither the bolshevics. Remember RUBASHKIN is the bailus and dreyfus of our time! Let us not stop until justice prevails and our fellow chossid is FREE!!!! ”
Dreyfus was accused of treason based on the testimony by Esterhazy and Bailus was accused of blood libel
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Nov 13, 2009 at 04:21 AM matzahlocal101 Says:Report as Inappropriate
Just a little history, the man was in business for twenty years with no complaints about his ethics. There were the usual environemental complaints that any large company would face and Agri actually paid for most of a sewage treatment facility that Allamakee county cannot make payments on after losing their largest employer and taxpayer. The loan was made after the raid. SMR pressured to keep the plant running took a short term loan without ever dreaming that the plant would be permanently closed and with the full intention of paying it back. The question remains why SMR was jailed on immigration charges when none of the officers of Swift or IFCO were jailed when almost 1300 illegals were arrested at each of those facilities in raids in 2006.
Furthermore, all those illegals were simply deported and not charged with aggravated identity thefteven though they had done the exact same thing as the Rubashkin illegals. No, Jews are not treated like everybody else in America.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:34 AM Shaul in Monsey Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ B"H
Shaul,
#1 stop bragging that you predicted the down fall and tzuris of another jew... its not normal to talk like that.... I don't know where you learn or what Rav you hold from but seriously think about what you would tell you father if he was charged with this crime.
#2 if someone does not feel they deserve to get a 15 year sentence because the goverment pushed them into a situation then they should not please guilty.
I hope you daven to the same G-d that I do and Hashem has the power to take care of anything including this. It will be good we just can't see how at a time like this.
By the way while I am thinking about it..... there is something inherently wrong with the same judge who last week would have given 15 years this week giving 1000.
Shaul... if you realize how wrong you are now would be a good time to open your heart (and maybe your wallet) and realize that a family with 10 kids is now going to need your help to pay tuition, etc.
”
Lubab boy, he wasn't sentenced yet. It will not be a 1000 years. Unfortunately your opinion about the plea is WRONG. The defense should have OBJECTIVELY looked at the evidence that was going to be presented at trial and then weighed the offer against what he would face if convicted. This was a TERRIBLE error in judgment.
I'm not happy with the outcome and I'm not happy he was convicted. I'm disappointed in Hecht, Chabad, the Yated, AND his family that helped convince him that this would go away. I know the law. You may not like the law, you may not agree with the law, but it is the law and this outcome was foreseeable and therefore PREVENTABLE.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:35 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ everybody should write letters to the judge in support of rubashkin it helped in other cases I mean 20,000 letters to plea for rachmons it worked and will work again. ”
Yes, letters and witnesses as to Mr. Rubashkin's good deeds may help at sentencing. However, before people start writing letters, it would be good to think about what NOT to say in those letters. If anyone starts ranting about PETA or unions or whatever, that will NOT help. There should be some advice from someone knowledgable on how to write the letters and what to cover. For example, the letters probably should say how the person knows about the good deed (i.e. was the beneficiary, witnessed it personally, etc.) and give specific examples of acts of generosity and kindness. Some proofreading, spelling and proper grammar to show respect for the court would also help. In other words, letters written like some of the rants on this blog probably will not help.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:36 AM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ where is everybody...???? the Rebbes shluchim and family. is "lubavitch ein mishpocho" a fantasy of the past? when chassidim would fight hell or high water for their fellow chossid..we need to take a stand NOW!!!! its not too late to free an innocent chossid, tzaddik..the holocaust happened when fellow yidden sat back and crossed their arms..we need to take a stand now! SHLUCHIM stop being politically correct and protecting your corporate image, rather act like your meshaleach our REBBE and SCREAM THE TRUTH!!! dont be intimidated of your buddies in washington. the inquistion didnt break us neither the bolshevics. Remember RUBASHKIN is the bailus and dreyfus of our time! Let us not stop until justice prevails and our fellow chossid is FREE!!!! ”
Good argument in Disney World.
want to vindicate him, refute the evidence piece by piece. The dreyfus affair has nothing to do with this trial (are you going to bring that up every time a id gets arrested) . Once you scream that, it really means who are lost and have really no argument to dispute the vast amount of evidence.
If you and others are getting high blood pressure now, I am sorry to tell you when the other trial comes along a think your blood pressure will explode. Because these offensie pale compared to the other stuff he is accused of.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:43 AM menachem Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Please you are embarrassing yourself with your complete lack of legal knowledge and procedure.
No those things can't happen, you are not Columbus discovering a new world by googling, and understand NOTHING about sentencing.
You don't even know what you are saying, and basically admit guilt by saying that another judge, according to you, would have "found him guilty" of only half the charges, which still makes him guilty (we'll leave the jury out of this for a moment.)
Oh, please, G-d, at what point are these people going to understand that SMR was found guilty, and it is not the bad judge, the bought jury, the coerced witnesses, the evil family, the corrupt administration, the anti-semitic government, the unions, the CIA, WalMart, Empire Poultry, Jimmy Hoffa, Amelia Airheart, the KKK or aliens from another dimension that caused this to happen?
If you think the judge was "in on it from the beginning", then file a complaint.
Otherwise, sit down, and, for Heaven's sake, shut up!. Finally! Please! ”
B"H
mr naïve
I don't know how much all of these factors have to do with it but if you don't know what some of the non lubavitch rabbis said about it u are naïve or uninformed
the govt went after smr after peta and more importantly unions went after him
unions hhave tremendous voting block and therefore huge influence in this country... they r often very corrupt...
unions were not happy that rubshkn plnt was non union
the federal govt turns blind eye to illegal immigration.... they don't enforce their own laws...
the fedgovt should be prosecuted
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Nov 13, 2009 at 09:12 AM anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
What Rubashkin and all his chasidim should have given consideration that is when you violate some portion of statue of a law you will be tried by a jury composed of people from the locality where the trial is scheduled. Check the history of Iowa is different than Boro Park of New Jersey. A black accused of anything will be judged different in Miss. than in Mass. This should have been his guidelines when he opened the plant in Iowa. Now [I am not an attorney] it is too late. Again a simple posuk from a sefer my father A'H taught me in Vienna eyze chochum hroye eyz haneulad. Just check the past Senator's from Iowa and you will have an answer. Yidden with yarmulkes, beards who shun the local population are not the most welcoming sight in Iowa. This is a fact of life
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Nov 13, 2009 at 09:01 AM concerned Says:Report as Inappropriate
this is a very sad event. But if everything happens on Hashems plan why all the hate and lashon hora from supporters and detracters? daven for him and his family. But to curse the legal system and others is sad. He wll appeal and justice by the sytem will be served. That may not be the true justice but we are in galus.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:56 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
He needs to get rid of the shysters that represented him and get new attorneys for his appeal and second trial.
219
Nov 13, 2009 at 08:45 AM Simon Says:Report as Inappropriate
There are a few hundred bank executives that are guilty of the same, yet they are living it up and still taking money from the us government on a daily basis as well as million dollar saleries. Where's the Justice here????
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:42 AM Shulem W. Says:Report as Inappropriate
The American Justice System is a travesty!
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Nov 13, 2009 at 08:41 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
My heart goes out to this family. I wish them strength.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 03:38 AM Mate Says:Report as Inappropriate
There is definitely not a fair legal system inplaced in the United States of America. The big banks get scottt free from their devious plots, but a well meaning individual who made some terrible mistakes gets convicted for life.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 03:22 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Everyone has Racmonis on him. But you can’t blame the government or the system; they have to enforce the laws.
The government goes out of there way to accommodated religious needs, and is nice and fair to everyone; until you get caught we a Geneva.
And by the way, we not talking that he didn’t pay taxes, he did worse then that.
”
Acctualy not not paying taxes is robery he is aleged to have inflated sales to get a biger loan which he paid back and never missed a payment
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:36 AM Poor Guy Part 2 Says:Report as Inappropriate
Continuation from #182.....
Then you have special interests that have hundreds of millions dollars from ill gotten gains they made in the second biggest scam of the century the stock market, as we see everyday more and more of this fraud is exposed.
Now comes the biggest scam ever, involving the US government stimulus package and corporate bailouts, along with the newest phony health care scam that will line the pockets of Unions that support OBAMA and the democrats.
And guess what all this is for what for personal greed to steal from one group (a group comprised of tens of millions of Americans) and line the pockets of others, this is the biggest crime of history.
Let’s not forget how the feds are still in the process of handing out Billions to the banks who put us in this crisis in the first place, by committing financial fraud of the highest order. All for personal greed, in order to line their pockets and help no one but themselves.
Poor Rubashkin took a loan for $35mill and had every intention to repay and would have, had the feds not shut him down, so you want to take him from his kids for 1280 years???? That is a huge crime.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:16 AM Summary of the facts Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Why are you lying, a Jew testified that he took out a 2nd mortgagee to pay in advance for the meat for a total of $750,000 and as he said “I don’t expect to get paid back any money”, so tell me what gives you the right to be an outright liar, do you have another Torah, or are you exempted from adhering to it. ”
a. Even though the gov knew that the Agri was working on filtering out illegals they choose to stage a dramatic raid.
b. The raid handicapped and suffocated the company.
c. The suffocating company (who was never accused of any impropriety before then) might have acted questionably out of sheer desperation in order to avoid total collapse and the loss of jobs to hundreds.
d. The Gov who created the crisis then steps in says "whoa we have a crime!" "Massive fraud" etc.
e. The initial wild allegations that supposedly prompted the raid, are now irrelevant, like a shark, they have found the blood they were looking for, except that THEY were the ones who caused the bleeding in the first place.
g. The government severely exacerbates the "fraud" by stepping in and taking over the company and then forcing it into bankruptcy. It is only now that the bank loses money. No bankruptcy, no loss. Bankruptcy = loss.
h. You mailed the invoice? = Mail fraud. You faxed the invoice? = wire fraud. You had illegals working there when you applied for the loan? = double triple quadruple fraud.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:14 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ He never stole from the bank the bank acctualy reported him as second to most lucrative loan of 2008 and besides if you ever went to visit a jail which I have many times you would know its no place for any human being so stop being so self rightchess ”
#183 is quite correct when observes that Shalom Rubashkin was judged by a jury comprised of 12 of #183's peers, i.e., uncaring and clueless morons.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 09:40 AM Shaul in Monsey Says:Report as Inappropriate
Why aren't you all crying for Shulem Weiss? Did he deserve 845 years? He's not home with his wife, kids, grandkids. Gave tons of tzedaka. You all have eyes but you don't see. Rubashkin made a mockery of corporate governance. Is the government raiding B and H? Are the feds breaking down the doors at IDT? Of course not. Because Rubashkin went way beyond the pale and never considered the consequences. I didn't blog him into jail. The judge and jury didn't get paid. So answer, where did the evidence come from?
White collar crime is called white collar because it is committed by people of means, with access, who present themselves as of high moral character. OF COURSE the government is going to come down hard. This is a TRAGEDY but not for the reasons most of you are articulating. It's a tragedy because a yid will sit now for a long time and some of it could have been prevented with a little SEICHEL, much of which I have illustrated and none of you have listened. You frummocks out frummed yourselves - you dreyed and dreyed while the jury came back with more guilty verdicts than I would have guessed. You should all go sit with him instead of worry about what I say.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 09:53 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ "Fair Laws"
Welcome to America.
A country where people get close to nothing for murder & rape and 100 years for creating a false invoice.
We must stop having so much blind faith in the "Goldeh medina", a land where justice is as unbalanced as it could get. ”
"A country where people get close to nothing for murder & rape and 100 years for creating a false invoice".
You are just lying, or you have no idea whats going on.
Murderes and rapist are siting in jail 15-25 years. And Robashkin will not sit in jail 100 years.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 09:53 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
to all you here who are busy with dina demalchisa dina let me tell you something you believe since you are probably not businessmen and do not and did own your own business so you have no clue and no idea what to run a business is involved and again we are not talking here doing illegal stuff just running a business there is no business in the world that if the government wants that they cant bring it down and you guys who don’t owe a business you yourself have no idea that you can be arrested as well god forbid if the government should bite in to you and start taking all your credit card application mortgage applications food stamps Medicaid applications and what not you will hit with 45 counts including mail fraud wire fraud so you dina the malcisa guys i will give you the bracha that the government should investigate you and make sure you are doing the mitzvah of dina the malchisa dina the right way
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Nov 13, 2009 at 09:40 AM Liepa Says:Report as Inappropriate
To Shaul in Monsey #103 & #178. If the law were applied to you as forcefully and vindictively as you pontificate on this sight you'd be in jail right now as we speak. I'll tell you why, because if you dig deep enough you can find shmutz on everybody, you are no exception even with your 'better than thou' atitude. Notice I didn't need to call you a moron.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 09:39 AM Fred E Says:Report as Inappropriate
He exploited the poor and helpless with concern only for himself. Torah's laws regarding ben-adam-l'adam are not JUST about how we should treat fellow Jews, but how we treat other human beings who are just as precious in God's eyes as Jews.
Hopefully, he'll learn that being a disciple of Schneerson does not place him on a higher "madreiga" than the rest of us
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Nov 13, 2009 at 09:38 AM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Yes, letters and witnesses as to Mr. Rubashkin's good deeds may help at sentencing. However, before people start writing letters, it would be good to think about what NOT to say in those letters. If anyone starts ranting about PETA or unions or whatever, that will NOT help. There should be some advice from someone knowledgable on how to write the letters and what to cover. For example, the letters probably should say how the person knows about the good deed (i.e. was the beneficiary, witnessed it personally, etc.) and give specific examples of acts of generosity and kindness. Some proofreading, spelling and proper grammar to show respect for the court would also help. In other words, letters written like some of the rants on this blog probably will not help. ”
I must say that your post gave the best advice in this thread, from the bottom of my heart I pray that the people will take your advice and with proper decorum write to the Judge and beg her to show mercy. And last but not least, SMR's lawyers need to make sure that SMR shows remorse, that would go a long way to convince the Judge to show mercy, therefore, I am inclined to agree with Shaul in Monsey that the best outcome for SMR would be if he pleads the immigration charges away and hope that with God’s help the Judge will show mercy
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Nov 13, 2009 at 09:34 AM written these letters before Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Yes, letters and witnesses as to Mr. Rubashkin's good deeds may help at sentencing. However, before people start writing letters, it would be good to think about what NOT to say in those letters. If anyone starts ranting about PETA or unions or whatever, that will NOT help. There should be some advice from someone knowledgable on how to write the letters and what to cover. For example, the letters probably should say how the person knows about the good deed (i.e. was the beneficiary, witnessed it personally, etc.) and give specific examples of acts of generosity and kindness. Some proofreading, spelling and proper grammar to show respect for the court would also help. In other words, letters written like some of the rants on this blog probably will not help. ”
I have, unfortunately, written many such letters in the past, with great success. If you want to write please remember the following:
1. Address the Judge CORRECTLY, with her full title, & RESPECTFULLY.
2. Keep it short...say what you have to say & GET OUT!!
3. PARAGRAPH...even a half-page is too long for one paragraph.
4. USE SPELLCHECK & GRAMMARCHECK. Avoid rambling run-on sentences.
5. Make sure your points are clear & RELEVANT.
6. Don't blame ANYONE: not the Judge, jury, attorneys etc.
7. Focus on the qualities of SMR & the good he has done.
8. Acknowledge his wrongdoings (whether or not you believe them, he was found
guilty.) Screaming HE'S INNOCENT, while I believe it's true, will not help & can
only harm his case.
9. If you have PERSONALLY BEEN HELPED by SMR, YOU SHOULD WRITE. Give details.
I have set up an email for anyone who wants their letters editing/proofreading. Please send AS ATTACHMENTS to justiceforsmr@gmail.com & I will be happy to help you refine them. No need to say who you are, I don't care, so leave off your signatures. I suggest these letters are sent to his lawyers: they will select the ones they think carry the most weight. Tizko L'Mitzvos.
.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 09:32 AM PMO Says:Report as Inappropriate
For all the talk of PETA and unions being against him, and for all the talk about the immigration charges, none of this had anything to do with any of those things.
I don't Rubashkin was out to defraud the banks. But he did. Criminal justice is generally not about intent, its about the act. This is why prosecutors are given leeway to offer plea deals. It allows them to objectively look at a situation and determine that maybe, even though the law says 20 years, because of the intent and the good nature of the person, we can offer 10 years. Rubashkin's lawyers failed him. The banking/financial side of this case was exceptionally strong and they knew it.
We should all be saying tehillim. B"H he will be let out of prison early.
More importantly, we learned that we should all be instilling in our children (whether Rubashkin is really guilty or not) a sense of transparency and 100% honesty in our business dealings. It also shows that educations is more important than many realize. Ignorance of the rules will never be accepted as an excuse. It is our responsibility as parents to make sure our children are properly educated to face the business world.
235
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:07 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
The justice system may not be entirely fair, but it is what it is, and since we live here, we must adjust to it or face the consequences.
236
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:13 AM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ To Shaul in Monsey #103 & #178. If the law were applied to you as forcefully and vindictively as you pontificate on this sight you'd be in jail right now as we speak. I'll tell you why, because if you dig deep enough you can find shmutz on everybody, you are no exception even with your 'better than thou' atitude. Notice I didn't need to call you a moron. ”
your argument is nonsense. If what you say would be applies then no one can even be prosecuted.
And I think a 20 dollar fraud is different than a 35,000,00 fraud.
What will be your excuse when and if he get found guilty of abuse of his workers, how much leeway should he get because he is frum?
237
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:13 AM Moshe Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ There are a few hundred bank executives that are guilty of the same, yet they are living it up and still taking money from the us government on a daily basis as well as million dollar saleries. Where's the Justice here???? ”
"Acctualy not not paying taxes is robery he is aleged to have inflated sales to get a biger loan which he paid back and never missed a payment"
Wrong, he went bankrupt, so he did miss the payment.
We all have racmanis on him and we pray for him. But you can’t ignore the fact that the Gov. must enforce the laws, especially if its tens of millions of $$’s involved.
I can show you plenty non-Jews who are in jail for white collar crimes, and I know Jews who are not. So I don’t see the anti-Semitism here
I think you all know this, you just done relieze how your passion influence’s your common sense.
238
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:04 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Wow you suer make a lot of sense you didn't blog him into jail,correct.Neither did anyone here blog into making his own desicions.
239
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:03 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ He needs to get rid of the shysters that represented him and get new attorneys for his appeal and second trial. ”
Very True. How about Ben Brafman.
240
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:01 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Why aren't you all crying for Shulem Weiss? Did he deserve 845 years? He's not home with his wife, kids, grandkids. Gave tons of tzedaka. You all have eyes but you don't see. Rubashkin made a mockery of corporate governance. Is the government raiding B and H? Are the feds breaking down the doors at IDT? Of course not. Because Rubashkin went way beyond the pale and never considered the consequences. I didn't blog him into jail. The judge and jury didn't get paid. So answer, where did the evidence come from?
White collar crime is called white collar because it is committed by people of means, with access, who present themselves as of high moral character. OF COURSE the government is going to come down hard. This is a TRAGEDY but not for the reasons most of you are articulating. It's a tragedy because a yid will sit now for a long time and some of it could have been prevented with a little SEICHEL, much of which I have illustrated and none of you have listened. You frummocks out frummed yourselves - you dreyed and dreyed while the jury came back with more guilty verdicts than I would have guessed. You should all go sit with him instead of worry about what I say. ”
A insane response from a sick man,
241
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:01 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Just a little history, the man was in business for twenty years with no complaints about his ethics. There were the usual environemental complaints that any large company would face and Agri actually paid for most of a sewage treatment facility that Allamakee county cannot make payments on after losing their largest employer and taxpayer. The loan was made after the raid. SMR pressured to keep the plant running took a short term loan without ever dreaming that the plant would be permanently closed and with the full intention of paying it back. The question remains why SMR was jailed on immigration charges when none of the officers of Swift or IFCO were jailed when almost 1300 illegals were arrested at each of those facilities in raids in 2006.
Furthermore, all those illegals were simply deported and not charged with aggravated identity thefteven though they had done the exact same thing as the Rubashkin illegals. No, Jews are not treated like everybody else in America. ”
Here is the updated news as of 1/29/09
"Superseding indictments charge 7 IFCO managers with violating federal immigration law
Today's indictments bring to 16 the number of IFCO employees and managers criminal facing charges"
Thay are non-Jews - so you are wrong
242
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:01 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ A jury of 12 people found him guilty of stealing from a bank. Whats antisemitic about that? Should he get off because hes jewish, should there be one set of laws for jews and one for non jews? ”
Bob, I will look out for your name in the news sometime soon. If your so quick to pass judgment and side with the ruling of the jury and judges you should find yourself in his situation. The mishna in Avos says, "Do not judge your fellow until you have assumed his exact position". It seems you enjoy passing judgment and rejoicing in the downfall of your fellow - on that note I wish the same to you.
243
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:17 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ a. Even though the gov knew that the Agri was working on filtering out illegals they choose to stage a dramatic raid.
b. The raid handicapped and suffocated the company.
c. The suffocating company (who was never accused of any impropriety before then) might have acted questionably out of sheer desperation in order to avoid total collapse and the loss of jobs to hundreds.
d. The Gov who created the crisis then steps in says "whoa we have a crime!" "Massive fraud" etc.
e. The initial wild allegations that supposedly prompted the raid, are now irrelevant, like a shark, they have found the blood they were looking for, except that THEY were the ones who caused the bleeding in the first place.
g. The government severely exacerbates the "fraud" by stepping in and taking over the company and then forcing it into bankruptcy. It is only now that the bank loses money. No bankruptcy, no loss. Bankruptcy = loss.
h. You mailed the invoice? = Mail fraud. You faxed the invoice? = wire fraud. You had illegals working there when you applied for the loan? = double triple quadruple fraud. ”
One of the soundest, right-on comments I've read anywhere. Good job.
244
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:24 AM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Here is the updated news as of 1/29/09
"Superseding indictments charge 7 IFCO managers with violating federal immigration law
Today's indictments bring to 16 the number of IFCO employees and managers criminal facing charges"
Thay are non-Jews - so you are wrong ”
I can see the excuse already
this is only a smoke screen to protect the feds from being called antisemitic regarding SMR. This excuse has been used many times
245
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:22 AM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
90,000 bride 27 years
for all those who think they are picking on SMR as a Jew
Ex-congressman faces prison in freezer cash case
(AP) – 54 minutes ago
ALEXANDRIA, Va. — The former Louisiana congressman who famously hid $90,000 cash in his freezer and was later convicted of federal bribery charges will soon learn his punishment.
William Jefferson, a Democrat who represented parts of New Orleans, is scheduled to be sentenced Friday afternoon in Virginia.
Jefferson was convicted on charges including bribery and racketeering. Prosecutors said he took in nearly half a million dollars in exchange for using his influence to broker business deals in Africa.
Prosecutors want the 62-year-old Jefferson to serve at least 27 years in prison, which would be the longest term ever imposed on a congressman convicted of bribery. The defense wants less than 10 years and hopes Jefferson can remain free on bond while he appeals his conviction.
246
Nov 13, 2009 at 09:28 AM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Lubab boy, he wasn't sentenced yet. It will not be a 1000 years. Unfortunately your opinion about the plea is WRONG. The defense should have OBJECTIVELY looked at the evidence that was going to be presented at trial and then weighed the offer against what he would face if convicted. This was a TERRIBLE error in judgment.
I'm not happy with the outcome and I'm not happy he was convicted. I'm disappointed in Hecht, Chabad, the Yated, AND his family that helped convince him that this would go away. I know the law. You may not like the law, you may not agree with the law, but it is the law and this outcome was foreseeable and therefore PREVENTABLE. ”
Probably mitigated but not preventable
247
Nov 13, 2009 at 09:25 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Why are you people so surprised? He could very well be very, very guilty of these crimes. But "oh no, you say, not a Yid." Fools.
248
Nov 13, 2009 at 09:24 AM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Dreyfus was accused of treason based on the testimony by Esterhazy and Bailus was accused of blood libel ”
Your complete lack of history knowledge is written on your forehead as the mark of kane and the ramblings of an ancient mind, if you cannot figure out for yourself what is the differences between the Dreyfus affair and Beilis blood libel cases with the SMR case, them how can you understand the Talmud, I refuse to change your diaper again and again you are an adult for God sakes.
249
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:39 AM Moshe Says:Report as Inappropriate
Agree with #234
"More importantly, we learned that we should all be instilling in our children (whether Rubashkin is really guilty or not) a sense of transparency and 100% honesty in our business dealings. It also shows that educations is more important than many realize. Ignorance of the rules will never be accepted as an excuse. It is our responsibility as parents to make sure our children are properly educated to face the business world"
And by the way, its not about "Dina Dmalcisa", It’s about having respect for the system and for your neighbor, and not be self-centered.
250
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:38 AM a PS to #233 Says:Report as Inappropriate
Don't send the letters directly to the judge. If she's inundated with too many it will really tick her off. Don't forget to put your full name & address, & if you have a business & dealt with Mr. Rubashkin in that capacity, use your business stationery.
Letters should be faxed to his lawyers; I don't have the fax #...does anyone? If so, please post it.
251
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:58 AM Who is doing the hating? part 1 Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ He stole absolutely nothing. He owes no one money. This is all about the procedures to receive loans.
The fact is that most cabinet members of the current administration didn't pay their taxes as they were suppose to. The fact is that Charlie Rangle who writes most tax laws doesn't pay his taxes. Did you ever hear anyone say jail for them? This country has become a scary similarity to what is described in "Animal Farm". ”
I read these posts, and am amazed. One side seems to accept that this precious Yid, with all his good points, went over the line in his business dealings and, whether he planned it in advance, or just got caught up in it, wound up breaking the law, and stealing, yes stealing millions of dollars.
This side understands that a Yid will be in Prison, and seeks to try to help him.
The first thing is to daven for a shorter sentence, than what is possible.
They understand that the next part of getting him out will be convincing a parole Board that he is worthy of parole.
Do any of you understand Parole Boards? The first thing they look for is an admission of guilt which leads to feeling sorry you committed the crime, and convince them you are truly sorry and will not do it again.
An attitude of "I did nothing wrong... there were just PROCEDURES in getting loans" is denying wrongdoing, and will keep him in prison.
The other thing is that they realize that we must not antagonize the people in Iowa by calling them names, or accusing them of antisemitism.
First of all, they DID give him a VERY fair trial. The Jury was convinced based on a mountain of good evidence, and testimony
252
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:57 AM Ari Says:Report as Inappropriate
No-one is judging R’ Sholm, and no-one is wishing him jail time CV. But you can’t blame the government for doing what they must do in order to keep the order. (Especially to does of you who claim anti-Semitism).
For those of you who complain about the faults of the system. Do you have a batter system? No system is perfect, and we have to go with the best we have.
I do agree that 15-20 years is harsh for a white collar crime though
253
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:50 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
I feel sorry for him and his family. But he admitted his guilt. his whole defense was not guilty by reason of lack of education and incompetence. That's not going to fly. Anyone committing white-collar crime who thinks making that claim will get him off scott-free has to rethink his strategy. We have enough chillulei Hashem as it is.
254
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:50 AM ish chusid hoyoh Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ where is everybody...???? the Rebbes shluchim and family. is "lubavitch ein mishpocho" a fantasy of the past? when chassidim would fight hell or high water for their fellow chossid..we need to take a stand NOW!!!! its not too late to free an innocent chossid, tzaddik..the holocaust happened when fellow yidden sat back and crossed their arms..we need to take a stand now! SHLUCHIM stop being politically correct and protecting your corporate image, rather act like your meshaleach our REBBE and SCREAM THE TRUTH!!! dont be intimidated of your buddies in washington. the inquistion didnt break us neither the bolshevics. Remember RUBASHKIN is the bailus and dreyfus of our time! Let us not stop until justice prevails and our fellow chossid is FREE!!!! ”
there is a mitzvah in the torah to have special ahavah to ones fellow jew, i never saw that there is an extra mitzvah to love ones fellow chosid more than any other yid.
255
Nov 13, 2009 at 11:14 AM Who is doing the hating? part 2 Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ He stole absolutely nothing. He owes no one money. This is all about the procedures to receive loans.
The fact is that most cabinet members of the current administration didn't pay their taxes as they were suppose to. The fact is that Charlie Rangle who writes most tax laws doesn't pay his taxes. Did you ever hear anyone say jail for them? This country has become a scary similarity to what is described in "Animal Farm". ”
so, all this talk about his not getting a fair trial is bashing the people of the Jury who are the people of Iowa. It is their friends and/or relatives who will be on the Parole Board... .Hmm... really smart
I will tell you somethings NONE of you want to hear. I have been all over the 48 contiguous states. The MOST anti-semitism I see is in BROOKLYN of one Jew against another.
The goyim do not hate us as much as we hate each other.
I am a chareidi Jew who looks very Jewish. I HAVE lived, travelled and worked all over. I would rather break down on the side of the road in a Goyishe state than in Brooklyn. They help others. They helped me many times knowing I am Jewish.
The group showing hatred is not gentiles of the US, it is Yidden from NY who seem to not only hate each other, but hate all the goyim accusing them of hideous things like anti-semitism.
my last visit to Brooklyn, I did need help. The only ones to help me were the Satmars. They helped me & my family no strings attached, only showing me love. They thought I was a Chabad person, because my hat was down.
I then went to CH and was told by Chabad how bad Satmar was. when I said I liked Satmar, I was YELLED at
256
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:47 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ He stole absolutely nothing. He owes no one money. This is all about the procedures to receive loans.
The fact is that most cabinet members of the current administration didn't pay their taxes as they were suppose to. The fact is that Charlie Rangle who writes most tax laws doesn't pay his taxes. Did you ever hear anyone say jail for them? This country has become a scary similarity to what is described in "Animal Farm". ”
Those "procedures" of yours are called FRAUD... which is STEALING
257
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:45 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Can anybody, and i mean anybody, please explain to me why he didn't hire any lawyers to represent him in this case? What in the world was he, his family and suporters thinking? I just keep on asking myself the same question over and over again!!!!!
Coudn't they hire a lawyer like Ben Brafman or the likes which, in the very least, could have put up some sort of argument in his defence?? This team of so called Lawyers which he hired were so pathetic and mindless that they're at least 50% at fault for this verdict. It's a very sad joke. One which may cost him most (if not all) of his life behind bars.
I hope that at this point they plan on hiring a new team of actuall Lawyers to try to appeal. But if they're stupid enough to keep them, then what can WE do??
Hashem Yerachem.
258
Nov 13, 2009 at 10:33 AM A Chasid Says:Report as Inappropriate
To 229 and 230.
Don’t pretend that you don’t know the difference.
Yes, a lot of people are doing some “shtick”. The difference is, if its small money the government will look away (I know people, who settled with government with a penalty etc).
But if its big money you are in big trouble. HY
I agree with shul in monsey
259
Nov 13, 2009 at 09:19 AM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ this is a very sad event. But if everything happens on Hashems plan why all the hate and lashon hora from supporters and detracters? daven for him and his family. But to curse the legal system and others is sad. He wll appeal and justice by the sytem will be served. That may not be the true justice but we are in galus.
”
so it we where not in gulaus fraud would be OK I did not know that. Source please
260
Nov 13, 2009 at 09:17 AM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ What Rubashkin and all his chasidim should have given consideration that is when you violate some portion of statue of a law you will be tried by a jury composed of people from the locality where the trial is scheduled. Check the history of Iowa is different than Boro Park of New Jersey. A black accused of anything will be judged different in Miss. than in Mass. This should have been his guidelines when he opened the plant in Iowa. Now [I am not an attorney] it is too late. Again a simple posuk from a sefer my father A'H taught me in Vienna eyze chochum hroye eyz haneulad. Just check the past Senator's from Iowa and you will have an answer. Yidden with yarmulkes, beards who shun the local population are not the most welcoming sight in Iowa. This is a fact of life ”
neither is fraud in NYC.
Federal Fraud is fraud in all states my friend. The same verdict would have been passed in NYC
261
Nov 13, 2009 at 11:14 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Please you are embarrassing yourself with your complete lack of legal knowledge and procedure.
No those things can't happen, you are not Columbus discovering a new world by googling, and understand NOTHING about sentencing.
You don't even know what you are saying, and basically admit guilt by saying that another judge, according to you, would have "found him guilty" of only half the charges, which still makes him guilty (we'll leave the jury out of this for a moment.)
Oh, please, G-d, at what point are these people going to understand that SMR was found guilty, and it is not the bad judge, the bought jury, the coerced witnesses, the evil family, the corrupt administration, the anti-semitic government, the unions, the CIA, WalMart, Empire Poultry, Jimmy Hoffa, Amelia Airheart, the KKK or aliens from another dimension that caused this to happen?
If you think the judge was "in on it from the beginning", then file a complaint.
Otherwise, sit down, and, for Heaven's sake, shut up!. Finally! Please! ”
Are you so ignorant that you can't read and understand a document written by an attorney who was present at a planning meeting at which the judge was present and he sent a letter of complaint and impropriety to Washington? I don't THINK this happened I KNOW this happened and it was the catalyst that started the entire situation.
Let me ask you what you are saying or better yet let me ask you if you can answer this question. At the time when Judge Reade was planning to invade the plant exactly what fraud had SMR committed? Other than illegal workers which was common practice and were hired by Bellimeyer, as were hired by Tyson and Swift, what FRAUD had SMR committed that you can prove?
262
Nov 13, 2009 at 11:14 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I have, unfortunately, written many such letters in the past, with great success. If you want to write please remember the following:
1. Address the Judge CORRECTLY, with her full title, & RESPECTFULLY.
2. Keep it short...say what you have to say & GET OUT!!
3. PARAGRAPH...even a half-page is too long for one paragraph.
4. USE SPELLCHECK & GRAMMARCHECK. Avoid rambling run-on sentences.
5. Make sure your points are clear & RELEVANT.
6. Don't blame ANYONE: not the Judge, jury, attorneys etc.
7. Focus on the qualities of SMR & the good he has done.
8. Acknowledge his wrongdoings (whether or not you believe them, he was found
guilty.) Screaming HE'S INNOCENT, while I believe it's true, will not help & can
only harm his case.
9. If you have PERSONALLY BEEN HELPED by SMR, YOU SHOULD WRITE. Give details.
I have set up an email for anyone who wants their letters editing/proofreading. Please send AS ATTACHMENTS to justiceforsmr@gmail.com & I will be happy to help you refine them. No need to say who you are, I don't care, so leave off your signatures. I suggest these letters are sent to his lawyers: they will select the ones they think carry the most weight. Tizko L'Mitzvos.
. ”
Does anyone have an address to where we can mail our letters to?
263
Nov 13, 2009 at 09:17 AM Livingston Says:Report as Inappropriate
The only sane bloggers here are shaul in money, formally and OMG. Everyone else yelling and cursing at them is doing so because it’s obvious there is no other defense to this guy. What’s wrong with all of you? This is America, the greatest country for Jews ever. It’s not the judge, the jury, the government, the kkk, it’s Rubashkin breaking the law. If you people were truly ethical you would return all the charity he gave you because it was stolen money.
264
Nov 13, 2009 at 01:24 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Are you serious? This is the best you can do?
YOU GOOGLED SOMETHING ON THE JUDGE AND YOU THINK PEOPLE SHOULD CARE?
It is just astounding that you people cannot seem to accept that a trial was held and he was found guilty. You are still chattering about what kind of a person he is, and that he once gave kishka to your mother-in-law when she was hungry.
Is there ANYONE claiming that he was on trial for being a Baal Chessed? Was he charged with having bad character? For having a lousy family?
What is it that you are all defending? The trial is over. No one asked about his character, his personality or his family.
He was charged with fraud. Is he guilty? Twelve jurors said yes. He is not being tried by shteeble-yidden in Boro Park.
HE WAS FOUND FOUND GUILTY! That is not a complicated sentence (no pun intended). No one is claiming he was a bad friend or a crummy neighbor. They are claiming he is guilty of fraud. That's it.
If you can't accept it, keep comparing him to other defendants who got lucky. Keep talking about how wonderful he is.
IT DOESN'T MATTER! HE WAS FOUND GUILTY! GET OVER IT!
”
someone who has felings cant just get over somethin like this in other words a yid because yiden are rachmonim so keep on publisizing you ilegitamacy on the web
265
Nov 13, 2009 at 01:19 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
A Jew who violates dinei mamonos and the simple halacha "dina l'malchusa la dina" is as irreligious as a Jew who eats ham. It is a shame that he caused irrevocable damage to his community/sect, the Jewish people, and mankind as a whole. He ruined countless lives of countless Tzlemei Elokim. Pray that he learns something from being in prison. He can become a talmid chacham behind bars- learning is the best way to pass the time away.
266
Nov 13, 2009 at 01:14 AM sick in the head Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ "Sholom mordche is a medakdek bekala kebachamura and a big talmid chochom his life is immersed in ruchniyus"
That is all very nice but a jury of his peers (albeit not all of them such big talmeidi chachamim)have determined that he violated a whole range of federal laws involving stealing money from the banks through fraud and other similiar crimes. His whole defense was that he was "too stupid" to know that what he was doing was a crime. His defenders here on VIN have argued that whatever he did was no big deal since all the goyim steal so why shouldn't Sholomo Mordechai get his share since he is such a big baal tzadakah.
The real tragedy here is not Rubashkin; he will go to federal prison and serve 10 or 15 years and then be released. The real tragedy will play out over the longer term since his conviction will reinforce the sterotype that most yidden are ganovim. The rest of us and our children will be paying for his crimes long after he gets out of jail.
”
A father of ten a tzadik sitting in jail is not the real tragety are you sick in the head you seem to prety stupid also because if you read the precedings of the case u would know he dident steal a peny
The reason for anti-semitetism is halocho eisov sonei leyakov you donÞ agree argue it out with the rashbi all the rest is theyr excusess
267
Nov 13, 2009 at 11:21 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ 90,000 bride 27 years
for all those who think they are picking on SMR as a Jew
Ex-congressman faces prison in freezer cash case
(AP) – 54 minutes ago
ALEXANDRIA, Va. — The former Louisiana congressman who famously hid $90,000 cash in his freezer and was later convicted of federal bribery charges will soon learn his punishment.
William Jefferson, a Democrat who represented parts of New Orleans, is scheduled to be sentenced Friday afternoon in Virginia.
Jefferson was convicted on charges including bribery and racketeering. Prosecutors said he took in nearly half a million dollars in exchange for using his influence to broker business deals in Africa.
Prosecutors want the 62-year-old Jefferson to serve at least 27 years in prison, which would be the longest term ever imposed on a congressman convicted of bribery. The defense wants less than 10 years and hopes Jefferson can remain free on bond while he appeals his conviction. ”
Thanks for proving the point,he's a minority person,african american,thank you.
268
Nov 13, 2009 at 11:18 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
how many years in Jail was he offered in a plea?
269
Nov 13, 2009 at 11:28 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ "Acctualy not not paying taxes is robery he is aleged to have inflated sales to get a biger loan which he paid back and never missed a payment"
Wrong, he went bankrupt, so he did miss the payment.
We all have racmanis on him and we pray for him. But you can’t ignore the fact that the Gov. must enforce the laws, especially if its tens of millions of $$’s involved.
I can show you plenty non-Jews who are in jail for white collar crimes, and I know Jews who are not. So I don’t see the anti-Semitism here
I think you all know this, you just done relieze how your passion influence’s your common sense.
”
Are you missing the point that the government forced him into bankruptcy and therefore he missed the payments and.......
270
Nov 13, 2009 at 11:22 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
i dont think his sentence will be as harsh as some of you think,
271
Nov 13, 2009 at 12:18 PM concerned Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Are you missing the point that the government forced him into bankruptcy and therefore he missed the payments and....... ”
you are wrong. The rais and bankruptcy hurt but agris was headed down the slope of eceonomic collapse before the raid. Tha raid broke their backs and exposed the books to the government.
272
Nov 13, 2009 at 12:16 PM concerned Says:Report as Inappropriate
“
Can anybody, and i mean anybody, please explain to me why he didn't hire any lawyers to represent him in this case? What in the world was he, his family and suporters thinking? I just keep on asking myself the same question over and over again!!!!!
Coudn't they hire a lawyer like Ben Brafman or the likes which, in the very least, could have put up some sort of argument in his defence?? This team of so called Lawyers which he hired were so pathetic and mindless that they're at least 50% at fault for this verdict. It's a very sad joke. One which may cost him most (if not all) of his life behind bars.
I hope that at this point they plan on hiring a new team of actuall Lawyers to try to appeal. But if they're stupid enough to keep them, then what can WE do??
Hashem Yerachem. ”
he had lawyers and his defense teams arguement was a one way ticket to a cell. Ignorance is no defense. It was absurd defense.
273
Nov 13, 2009 at 12:23 PM Longwave Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Are you missing the point that the government forced him into bankruptcy and therefore he missed the payments and....... ”
He was forced into bankruptcy because ......... Fill in the blanks. Like, the dog ate my homework, etc.
He had financial problems long before the raid. He had a 35 million dollar loan long before the raid. He had no competition to speak of and he factored his receivables (a clear sign tha tthe business is in trouble)
He went bankrupt because, as he said, he is a rabbi, not a businessman.
And, he did not miss payments. He intentionally diverted them to his yeshiva and grocery store. Now we know that he did it. He was tried and convicted in a court of law.
What point were you trying to make?
274
Nov 13, 2009 at 12:13 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ a. Even though the gov knew that the Agri was working on filtering out illegals they choose to stage a dramatic raid.
b. The raid handicapped and suffocated the company.
c. The suffocating company (who was never accused of any impropriety before then) might have acted questionably out of sheer desperation in order to avoid total collapse and the loss of jobs to hundreds.
d. The Gov who created the crisis then steps in says "whoa we have a crime!" "Massive fraud" etc.
e. The initial wild allegations that supposedly prompted the raid, are now irrelevant, like a shark, they have found the blood they were looking for, except that THEY were the ones who caused the bleeding in the first place.
g. The government severely exacerbates the "fraud" by stepping in and taking over the company and then forcing it into bankruptcy. It is only now that the bank loses money. No bankruptcy, no loss. Bankruptcy = loss.
h. You mailed the invoice? = Mail fraud. You faxed the invoice? = wire fraud. You had illegals working there when you applied for the loan? = double triple quadruple fraud. ”
The fact is THIS business was built on the BACKS OF OTHERS.
Gnevas Daas is not a FELONY.
The RS"O has his own cheshbonos
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:09 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Dor Yotze Dor Ba,
The day Shalom M Rubashkin was found guilty of federal charges his nephew Shalom Rubashkin was released from federal prison.
We get to say lech leshalom to Shalom and according to the commentators on this blog lech beshalom to Shalom M.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:06 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Agree with #234
"More importantly, we learned that we should all be instilling in our children (whether Rubashkin is really guilty or not) a sense of transparency and 100% honesty in our business dealings. It also shows that educations is more important than many realize. Ignorance of the rules will never be accepted as an excuse. It is our responsibility as parents to make sure our children are properly educated to face the business world"
And by the way, its not about "Dina Dmalcisa", It’s about having respect for the system and for your neighbor, and not be self-centered.
”
moshe
can i take a look at your books are you 100 percnet straight well i knwo you think so ltrust me you can be thorwn in to jail if the feds really want to bring you down even you now think and is convinced that you are 100 percent legit you are not
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:04 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“
A couple of points, one- no were in the Rockny Cole’s letter did he say that Judge Reddy was involved with the planning of the raid or evolved with the original search warrants or the subsequent arrest, what Mr. Cole is saying that there were a meeting were the court recruited defense counsel as the raid was being carried out, so far on this Mr. didn’t have a problem, the specific problem Mr. Cole had was that the DA and the defense counsel discussed the variations of the plea offers before the defense counsel met with their clients, and in his view that might product a conflict of interest for the defense counsel, as for judge Reddey he said that he doesn’t remember what if anything she said and that she was there for around 10 minutes, his problem of the Judge being there was, that according rule 11 the judge cannot participate in the plea agreement, the back and forth discussions between the prosecutor and the lawyers, and the judge could only ratify the agreement and the judge is not bound by the agreement. On page 4 Mr. Cole wrote that it is only his assumption and inference from news media that Judge Reddy was involved in the discussions on the plea deal before the defense counsel saw any detainee and as a matter of fact in the same paragraph Mr. Cole states that “I hope I am wrong on my inference” he himself wrote that it is only an inference. Two- The letter by Mr. Cole was dated July 24 2008, that is more than a year ago, SMR’s lawyers could have objected to the Judge, it seems that they came away with the conclusion that the Judge would be impartial and far too both sides.
”
Don't try to interpret the letter for others because you are lying that is NOT what Mr. Cole said at all. He said they needed a judge to sign off on various issues of the raid and the fast tracking of the immigrants, hence Judge Reade! He also said that he did not know how long the Judge was there since he left before her and he didn't state how long he was there.
It is questionable whether or not the defense knew that the Judge was involved from the get go and I highly doubt that the judge or prosecution was forthcoming with this information. It would have been more honest and appropriate for the Judge to recuse herself from this case to assure that SMR had a fair and unbiased trial.
If you are so keen on honesty and propriety then expect it from both sides.
Stop bending over backwards to defend the prosecution!
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Nov 13, 2009 at 11:55 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Are you serious? This is the best you can do?
YOU GOOGLED SOMETHING ON THE JUDGE AND YOU THINK PEOPLE SHOULD CARE?
It is just astounding that you people cannot seem to accept that a trial was held and he was found guilty. You are still chattering about what kind of a person he is, and that he once gave kishka to your mother-in-law when she was hungry.
Is there ANYONE claiming that he was on trial for being a Baal Chessed? Was he charged with having bad character? For having a lousy family?
What is it that you are all defending? The trial is over. No one asked about his character, his personality or his family.
He was charged with fraud. Is he guilty? Twelve jurors said yes. He is not being tried by shteeble-yidden in Boro Park.
HE WAS FOUND FOUND GUILTY! That is not a complicated sentence (no pun intended). No one is claiming he was a bad friend or a crummy neighbor. They are claiming he is guilty of fraud. That's it.
If you can't accept it, keep comparing him to other defendants who got lucky. Keep talking about how wonderful he is.
IT DOESN'T MATTER! HE WAS FOUND GUILTY! GET OVER IT!
”
So lets talk about the "jury". A person is entitled to be judged by a jury of his peers. Can you honestly say that any one was his peer? Do we know anything about the jury that YOU are so satisfied that they were capable of understanding his situation. Are any of them business owners of a an agricultural small town business? Do any of them employ 1000 some odd employees? Do any off them come from a similar background as SMR?
Another question, is it normal that the trial be moved to another venue but the judge from Iowa move with the trial to South Dakota? Why should the judge be so embedded and interested in the outcome that she moves along with the trial? Just asking. And why would the same judge who was involved in the raid be allowed to sit in judgement of the trial? How can there possibly not be any bias?
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Nov 13, 2009 at 11:51 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ To 229 and 230.
Don’t pretend that you don’t know the difference.
Yes, a lot of people are doing some “shtick”. The difference is, if its small money the government will look away (I know people, who settled with government with a penalty etc).
But if its big money you are in big trouble. HY
I agree with shul in monsey
”
i will never forget this story it goes back like 7 to 8 years ago when a yid nebech was in hot water with the law bassicly on bank fraud and he went in to jail for 3 years a nice prmoinet family and i spoke to a freind that also had a big buissness and my friend tells me let him rot in jail you dont have to steal he is making a chill hashem i have buisness i dont steal you can make money the kosher way same as lots of so called smart self hating jewish brother writers here and guess what 3 years after our conversation his buisness started slowing down and got worse and yes you guessed he could not face to close the buisness and he provided faluse invoice to keep his credit line open untill the ballon busted and long story short he pleae bargined and went in for 2 in half year in jail and you should hear him talk now when a yid gets in to trouble its not the same as he used to talk so all you guys here with dina demalchias dina and this hating statmnets good let him not steal he should of known let hin rot in jail he bought it upon himself watch it might come to you or one of your family members
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Nov 13, 2009 at 11:49 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Please you are embarrassing yourself with your complete lack of legal knowledge and procedure.
No those things can't happen, you are not Columbus discovering a new world by googling, and understand NOTHING about sentencing.
You don't even know what you are saying, and basically admit guilt by saying that another judge, according to you, would have "found him guilty" of only half the charges, which still makes him guilty (we'll leave the jury out of this for a moment.)
Oh, please, G-d, at what point are these people going to understand that SMR was found guilty, and it is not the bad judge, the bought jury, the coerced witnesses, the evil family, the corrupt administration, the anti-semitic government, the unions, the CIA, WalMart, Empire Poultry, Jimmy Hoffa, Amelia Airheart, the KKK or aliens from another dimension that caused this to happen?
If you think the judge was "in on it from the beginning", then file a complaint.
Otherwise, sit down, and, for Heaven's sake, shut up!. Finally! Please! ”
Actually I didn't say that another judge would have found him guilty of "half" the charges, I said that another judge would have "thrown out" have the charges before it went to trial.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:21 PM Richard Nixon Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ so, all this talk about his not getting a fair trial is bashing the people of the Jury who are the people of Iowa. It is their friends and/or relatives who will be on the Parole Board... .Hmm... really smart
I will tell you somethings NONE of you want to hear. I have been all over the 48 contiguous states. The MOST anti-semitism I see is in BROOKLYN of one Jew against another.
The goyim do not hate us as much as we hate each other.
I am a chareidi Jew who looks very Jewish. I HAVE lived, travelled and worked all over. I would rather break down on the side of the road in a Goyishe state than in Brooklyn. They help others. They helped me many times knowing I am Jewish.
The group showing hatred is not gentiles of the US, it is Yidden from NY who seem to not only hate each other, but hate all the goyim accusing them of hideous things like anti-semitism.
my last visit to Brooklyn, I did need help. The only ones to help me were the Satmars. They helped me & my family no strings attached, only showing me love. They thought I was a Chabad person, because my hat was down.
I then went to CH and was told by Chabad how bad Satmar was. when I said I liked Satmar, I was YELLED at ”
If you want to see real ahavas yisroel go see the satmar bikur cholim at work. They'll take care of every yid, frum or frei, litvish, yekkish, chassidish, sephardisheh, anyone, even chabad, no questions asked, and they don't shri 'satmar does it better' every time someone mentions bikur cholim.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:15 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ "70 years ago JEWS were also selected .. I see no diffrence "
Yes, this is EXACTLY like Hitler killing the Jews, you moron.
Except that was Hitler, not 12 people too stupid to get out of jury duty,
and those were innocent Jews being killed, not a dishonest businessman charged with fraud maybe going to jail.
And if you don't see any difference, you are really, truly too stupid to live.
My family was killed by the nazis. You have the nerve to open your ignorant mouth and compare that to this?
I can't begin to express how repulsive a mental defective you are without getting thrown off VIN.
But you owe a huge, HUGE apology to over six million neshamas, and the millions and millions who lived through it, and the millions and millions and millions who were affected by it.
Except, apparently, you.
You are a menuvaldig piece of sh-t, and very lucky you kept your identity anonymous. ”
You were too polite to the jerk. Too bad he didn't say that to some of the survivors in the shteebel in the neighborhood in which I grew up.
He'd never make that (or any other) mistake again.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:08 PM thank you Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ "Acctualy not not paying taxes is robery he is aleged to have inflated sales to get a biger loan which he paid back and never missed a payment"
Wrong, he went bankrupt, so he did miss the payment.
We all have racmanis on him and we pray for him. But you can’t ignore the fact that the Gov. must enforce the laws, especially if its tens of millions of $$’s involved.
I can show you plenty non-Jews who are in jail for white collar crimes, and I know Jews who are not. So I don’t see the anti-Semitism here
I think you all know this, you just done relieze how your passion influence’s your common sense.
”
You proved my point as I mentioned in an earleir post on the banks website this loan was stated as the banks second to most lucrative loan of2008 yet the feds puled the plug on him so who's wrong here
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:29 PM I mean, seriously? Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ B"H
mr naïve
I don't know how much all of these factors have to do with it but if you don't know what some of the non lubavitch rabbis said about it u are naïve or uninformed
the govt went after smr after peta and more importantly unions went after him
unions hhave tremendous voting block and therefore huge influence in this country... they r often very corrupt...
unions were not happy that rubshkn plnt was non union
the federal govt turns blind eye to illegal immigration.... they don't enforce their own laws...
the fedgovt should be prosecuted
”
Yeah, and they infiltrated the jury? The JURY now has an agenda?
Sriously? twelve people too stupid to get off jury duty, and they are puppets of the government?
In medicine, they teach "when you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras".
Either the whole country, the entire government, and every goy is plotting this particular pogrom, or YOUR BOY IS SIMPLY GUILTY OF FRAUD!
This is not rocket science!
Get together, sing some songs, say some tehillim to make you feel better, and go home.
And for heaven's sake, PLEASE stop asking people to pray to Gd begging him to release a convicted felon, no matter how much you like or make money off the guy!
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:24 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ so, all this talk about his not getting a fair trial is bashing the people of the Jury who are the people of Iowa. It is their friends and/or relatives who will be on the Parole Board... .Hmm... really smart
I will tell you somethings NONE of you want to hear. I have been all over the 48 contiguous states. The MOST anti-semitism I see is in BROOKLYN of one Jew against another.
The goyim do not hate us as much as we hate each other.
I am a chareidi Jew who looks very Jewish. I HAVE lived, travelled and worked all over. I would rather break down on the side of the road in a Goyishe state than in Brooklyn. They help others. They helped me many times knowing I am Jewish.
The group showing hatred is not gentiles of the US, it is Yidden from NY who seem to not only hate each other, but hate all the goyim accusing them of hideous things like anti-semitism.
my last visit to Brooklyn, I did need help. The only ones to help me were the Satmars. They helped me & my family no strings attached, only showing me love. They thought I was a Chabad person, because my hat was down.
I then went to CH and was told by Chabad how bad Satmar was. when I said I liked Satmar, I was YELLED at ”
So what's your point goyim are good and chabad is bad in that case start drerssing like a goy and stop dressing like chabad
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:36 PM I mean, seriously? Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ to all you here who are busy with dina demalchisa dina let me tell you something you believe since you are probably not businessmen and do not and did own your own business so you have no clue and no idea what to run a business is involved and again we are not talking here doing illegal stuff just running a business there is no business in the world that if the government wants that they cant bring it down and you guys who don’t owe a business you yourself have no idea that you can be arrested as well god forbid if the government should bite in to you and start taking all your credit card application mortgage applications food stamps Medicaid applications and what not you will hit with 45 counts including mail fraud wire fraud so you dina the malcisa guys i will give you the bracha that the government should investigate you and make sure you are doing the mitzvah of dina the malchisa dina the right way ”
He committed fraud. He got caught. He went to trial, and was found guilty!
Get over it! What's your problem?
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:58 PM Everybody has an opinion Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Are you missing the point that the government forced him into bankruptcy and therefore he missed the payments and....... ”
Yeah, yeah, we got it, he's completely blameless, it's the govts fault.
heard that. laughed at it, didn't play in Iowa, doesn't play here. So sorry, so sad!
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:53 PM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ i will never forget this story it goes back like 7 to 8 years ago when a yid nebech was in hot water with the law bassicly on bank fraud and he went in to jail for 3 years a nice prmoinet family and i spoke to a freind that also had a big buissness and my friend tells me let him rot in jail you dont have to steal he is making a chill hashem i have buisness i dont steal you can make money the kosher way same as lots of so called smart self hating jewish brother writers here and guess what 3 years after our conversation his buisness started slowing down and got worse and yes you guessed he could not face to close the buisness and he provided faluse invoice to keep his credit line open untill the ballon busted and long story short he pleae bargined and went in for 2 in half year in jail and you should hear him talk now when a yid gets in to trouble its not the same as he used to talk so all you guys here with dina demalchias dina and this hating statmnets good let him not steal he should of known let hin rot in jail he bought it upon himself watch it might come to you or one of your family members ”
what you say can be said of every single criminal in the world, so according to you no one should ever be punished for their crimes.
Every criminal has a family that loves then and is devastated that their father , brother, son is in jail, that is live .
Smr is not special he is like every other person who get caught in a crime
289
Nov 13, 2009 at 02:01 PM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
why do people keep on saying the Rubahkins are zhadikium this is the third family member that was convicted of fraud. How many more need to be convicted before you finally see that they are far from tzhadikein, just a family that is involved in fraud and just acts frum
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:50 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
Eradicate evil in your midst.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:46 PM I mean, seriously? Says:Report as Inappropriate
“
Can anybody, and i mean anybody, please explain to me why he didn't hire any lawyers to represent him in this case? What in the world was he, his family and suporters thinking? I just keep on asking myself the same question over and over again!!!!!
Coudn't they hire a lawyer like Ben Brafman or the likes which, in the very least, could have put up some sort of argument in his defence?? This team of so called Lawyers which he hired were so pathetic and mindless that they're at least 50% at fault for this verdict. It's a very sad joke. One which may cost him most (if not all) of his life behind bars.
I hope that at this point they plan on hiring a new team of actuall Lawyers to try to appeal. But if they're stupid enough to keep them, then what can WE do??
Hashem Yerachem. ”
"What can we do?"
Accept the fact that he is guilty, was tried and found guilty, and move on. He's not the first Jew to make a mistake in ethics and have to be punished for it, and likely not the last. Stop trying to make him one of the Lamed Vov.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 01:41 PM anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
THE CRIME IS THE GOVERMENT!!! I JUST WATCHED A NEW'S SHOW WHERE A NON JEWISH FARMER WAS TELLING THE NEWS CASTER THAT HE LOOKS THE OTHER WAY WHEN HIRING ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT'S WHY ISN'T HE IN TROUBLE THE GOVERNMENT PICK'S AND CHOOSES !!! AND TO PLANT SECRET PEOPLE IN THE BUSINESS TO SPY????? WHAT IS THAT!!!!!!!
THERE ARE SUCH BAD PEOPLE IN THIS WORLD AND SMR IS NOT ONE OF THEM!!!! THE SENTENCE DOES NOT EVEN MATCH THE CRIME!!!!!! EVEN IF THERE WAS A CRIME!!!! AND ALL YOU SELF HATING JEW'S SHOULD LOOK IN THE MIRROR TO COMPARE HIM TO O.J. ARE U KIDDING ME!!!
WE ALL NEED TO PRAY TO HA-SHEM FOR THIS MAN AND HIS FAMILY!!!! THAT HE GET AN AQUITTAL ASAP!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:49 PM your sick Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Why aren't you all crying for Shulem Weiss? Did he deserve 845 years? He's not home with his wife, kids, grandkids. Gave tons of tzedaka. You all have eyes but you don't see. Rubashkin made a mockery of corporate governance. Is the government raiding B and H? Are the feds breaking down the doors at IDT? Of course not. Because Rubashkin went way beyond the pale and never considered the consequences. I didn't blog him into jail. The judge and jury didn't get paid. So answer, where did the evidence come from?
White collar crime is called white collar because it is committed by people of means, with access, who present themselves as of high moral character. OF COURSE the government is going to come down hard. This is a TRAGEDY but not for the reasons most of you are articulating. It's a tragedy because a yid will sit now for a long time and some of it could have been prevented with a little SEICHEL, much of which I have illustrated and none of you have listened. You frummocks out frummed yourselves - you dreyed and dreyed while the jury came back with more guilty verdicts than I would have guessed. You should all go sit with him instead of worry about what I say. ”
The fact that he could be going to jail is not a trgity
The tragity is that your ego dident prevail that noone lisend to you and had he just gone to jail for 15 years that's not a tragity tell me are you totaly sick in the head have you no children of your own
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Nov 13, 2009 at 12:45 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
While I feel horrible that a fellow Jew has to go to prison, look at this from the government's perspective. There was no admission of guilt, but an admission of "mistakes" which nevertheless entailed violation of a contract with the bank and, evidently, a violation of bank and mail fraud statutes. The message to the rest of the US is that you cannot do this and get away with it. That is one of the points of the criminal justice system in the US. Regardless of whether the bank loses money as a result or not (which it did, assuming the allegations were correct, since it did not get its money back sooner - time value of money and the bank having less money at risk has value) - once someone gets off on these sorts of charges - it opens the door for others to commit worse crimes.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 11:45 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Don't send the letters directly to the judge. If she's inundated with too many it will really tick her off. Don't forget to put your full name & address, & if you have a business & dealt with Mr. Rubashkin in that capacity, use your business stationery.
Letters should be faxed to his lawyers; I don't have the fax #...does anyone? If so, please post it. ”
I'm not so sure letters should be faxed. Signed originals might be better. Wait to get some advice. There is time before the sentencing process.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 11:42 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ To 229 and 230.
Don’t pretend that you don’t know the difference.
Yes, a lot of people are doing some “shtick”. The difference is, if its small money the government will look away (I know people, who settled with government with a penalty etc).
But if its big money you are in big trouble. HY
I agree with shul in monsey
”
excuse me what do you mean by small money this guy did not steal any money dont you get it he did not kill anybody this do you know how many peaple had jobs because of this yid even the non jews its stupid to take down a good going buisness and to throw the book at somebody who did not steal or kill and dont you are dead wrong when you say if its small money they leave you go i knwo a yingerman who is going in for 2 years for real small mortgage money
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Nov 13, 2009 at 11:36 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Liepa, you're a moron. Grow a brain. Comparing a $400 credit card to a 35 million dollar bank line is like comparing your wife to Miss America. Sure, both are women but I guarantee you the similarities end right there. And the yidden that died in true blood libels curse you from their graves when you compare them to SMR. He stole and got caught. Get over it. Sad how his arrogance destroyed him. He thought because he wore his beard and hat and gave away some of his ill gotten gains to charity, that he was above any law. Had he listened years ago when people were begging him to either make changes or sell out, things might have been different. Had he taken the plea bargain the government offered, he wouldn't be facing what he's facing now. His stubbornness, arrogance and self righteousness destroyed him. May his saga be a lesson to others who think they are above the law. ”
Shaul from Monsey, if you can actually gloat over SMR's fate, and with such vitriol, that says a lot about the hole inside you where your heart should be. Please spare people the stomach-turning reminder that some people get their gratification in life from smugly reminding the fallen "I told you so."
The truth is, had the defense been given a chance to present some of their strongest testimony, SMR would have had a decent chance of acquittal. Unfortunately, he was subject to a judge who used contrived maneuvers to bar critical defense witnesses from testifying. Let's remember that SMR admitted to creating false invoices and misleading the bank. But what he claimed --and what his laywer proved--was that the bank was an accomplice to this deception by deliberately looking the other way. Yes, what he did was dishonest but it was not fraud. There's a very crucial legal difference here. Furthermore, the bank launched its own lawsuit against the former owners of Agri to get their money, but surprisingly, their lawsuit does NOT charge fraud. That speaks volumes about how the feds pounced at the chance to wrongly turn a civil litigation affair into a massive fraud scheme.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 11:33 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ your argument is nonsense. If what you say would be applies then no one can even be prosecuted.
And I think a 20 dollar fraud is different than a 35,000,00 fraud.
What will be your excuse when and if he get found guilty of abuse of his workers, how much leeway should he get because he is frum? ”
The problems here is that a person has to be found guilty without a shadow of a doubt and there is a lot of doubt in this case. Starting from the fact that Judge Reade was involved from the beginning and that had the government not treated Agri differently than the treif slaughterhouses there would not be bank fraud and other fraud charges being levied against SMR.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 03:50 PM Shaul in Monsey Says:Report as Inappropriate
Nebach on you people. Its the judge, the jury, the feds, everyone but Rubashkin. "If only he could have told the jury this." If only a different judge. You want the real "If only?" If only he hadn't washed money through his yeshiva in the millions, and if only he hadn't billed fake invoices. That's the real if only. But you are so drunk on kool aid, so blinded by your own arrogance and holier than thou attitude that you will be never accept the truth. Obtuse thinking, ridiculous excuses, refusal to take blame. Chabad went from being a great community to becoming a children's playground. B'H the rebbe zal is not here to see this. His xray vision saw the penimius of every yid and never would have let this churban happen.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 03:47 PM formally Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ excuse me what do you mean by small money this guy did not steal any money dont you get it he did not kill anybody this do you know how many peaple had jobs because of this yid even the non jews its stupid to take down a good going buisness and to throw the book at somebody who did not steal or kill and dont you are dead wrong when you say if its small money they leave you go i knwo a yingerman who is going in for 2 years for real small mortgage money ”
when you get to the next trial you will see he did steal money, if true
Shorting hours, not paying for hours working overtime. Deducting money for health insurance from pay checks, the problem was there is no health insurgence. So not only did the workers pay for insurance they did not have, but when they got sick could not get treated since the insurance they thought they had was a fictions.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 03:26 PM anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Even those that will still say America is the greatest country in the world, you will have to admit that their justice system is the worst in the civilized world. ”
Your mental outlook which is the cause of Mr. Rubashkin being in court and convicted. I arrived in this country in 1950 from concentration camp. I attended college here. I worked for forty years for the federl government and was the first speaker at a holocause observance. I did not receive certain awards but an outstanding award for technical performance and other awards. I retired after 40 years of federal service. I kept my nose clean and did not worry what others do. I never was convicted of any offense in state or federal court. You don't know justice system across the world otherwise you would not have that ignorant statement Everybody knew at the agency that I am observant and they made provisions that on parties I receive kosher food.What you expect that the agency should have the Rebbe's picture in each room?
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Nov 13, 2009 at 04:28 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Are you so ignorant that you can't read and understand a document written by an attorney who was present at a planning meeting at which the judge was present and he sent a letter of complaint and impropriety to Washington? I don't THINK this happened I KNOW this happened and it was the catalyst that started the entire situation.
Let me ask you what you are saying or better yet let me ask you if you can answer this question. At the time when Judge Reade was planning to invade the plant exactly what fraud had SMR committed? Other than illegal workers which was common practice and were hired by Bellimeyer, as were hired by Tyson and Swift, what FRAUD had SMR committed that you can prove? ”
You are a lying sack of >>>>, Mr. Cole wrote in page 1 “at 9:30 in the morning, my partner, Dan Vondra, knocked on my door, and told me “that the raids had begun” and the next paragraph he wrote the he was told that the special meeting with defense counsel will be held in the courthouse at 1:30 PM, you explain to us how is it possible that he saw the Judge participate and planning the raid, the fact is that Mr. Cole himself wrote that it was known it the whole community that the Feds were marshaling and a raid was pending, and the court anticipated up to 700 people would be arrested, and the prudent thing to do would be plan ahead, and have defense counsel on standby, so every detainee would be able to have counsel and a plea offer ASAP, the only issue what Mr. Cole had with the Judge that because the Judge was in the room for 10 minutes it appears that the Judge might be involved with negotiations and the ratification of the plea agreement, which would be against the rules, and Mr. Cole purposely used italics for the word apparently, and specifically Mr. Cole states that “I can infer” nowhere did Mr. Cole stated that he saw any violation of the law, he always used a word which means, he is speculating. Stop bemoaning the outcome, while SMR’s attorneys demanded a change of venue and they got the trial moved to this Judge, and if your assertions were half true they could easily demand that the judge recues herself, but they didn’t, because they know, what you are clamming is not what happened.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 05:28 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
After 300 or so posts, I didn’t see one cohesive and logical argument that it was not a just verdict, which tells me that by in large the people who complain either are dimwits or just plan ill informed as to the facts of the case or the legal system.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 05:05 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ The problems here is that a person has to be found guilty without a shadow of a doubt and there is a lot of doubt in this case. Starting from the fact that Judge Reade was involved from the beginning and that had the government not treated Agri differently than the treif slaughterhouses there would not be bank fraud and other fraud charges being levied against SMR. ”
Wrong!!!! Get your facts together beyond a reasonable doubt not beyond a shadow of doubt, let me ask you a if someone harms you or your family would you still argue that the movement burden of prove should be beyond any shadow of doubt, no way you probably would demand his head even if the evidence is only the passes the preponderance.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 04:52 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ So lets talk about the "jury". A person is entitled to be judged by a jury of his peers. Can you honestly say that any one was his peer? Do we know anything about the jury that YOU are so satisfied that they were capable of understanding his situation. Are any of them business owners of a an agricultural small town business? Do any of them employ 1000 some odd employees? Do any off them come from a similar background as SMR?
Another question, is it normal that the trial be moved to another venue but the judge from Iowa move with the trial to South Dakota? Why should the judge be so embedded and interested in the outcome that she moves along with the trial? Just asking. And why would the same judge who was involved in the raid be allowed to sit in judgement of the trial? How can there possibly not be any bias? ”
Your and all your ignorant brothers don’t have any idea what jury of your peers means, it is not to say that everybody should be from the same sex, color, or religion, it is a reference going back almost 800 years ago in common law it refers to class that it used to be that the jury would be aristocrats judging commoners, since the change commoners judge each other.
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Nov 13, 2009 at 04:46 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You proved my point as I mentioned in an earleir post on the banks website this loan was stated as the banks second to most lucrative loan of2008 yet the feds puled the plug on him so who's wrong here ”
So what the bank used Agri as an advertisement, I am sure that before Madoff’s Ponzi scheme was exposed he got accolades and some investors used his connections for advertisement purposes. Oh God what happened with the Gamora Kaup
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Nov 13, 2009 at 04:36 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ you are wrong. The rais and bankruptcy hurt but agris was headed down the slope of eceonomic collapse before the raid. Tha raid broke their backs and exposed the books to the government. ”
Not correct the bankruptcy trustee exposed the massive fraud; the trustee testified in court that when he tried to collect from the vendors their outstanding balances he found out about the fraud. Oh I forgot he must had worked either for PETA or the Union or better yet the DNC
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Nov 14, 2009 at 07:24 PM No Justice! Says:Report as Inappropriate
It is obvious for any one who cares that SMR did not receive a fair trial. Shock, gasp, even in the USA there is such a thing as not receiving a fair trial.
The judge did not allow crucial evidence to be heard by the jury that would have been favorable to SMR. The judge has a long record of being overzealous and cruel. You can google her yourself.
The fact is that even after he has been locked up, OMG and others are not satisfied but continue to try to demonize the man. The vehemence with which this is done is shocking and revolting. The enthusiastic persecution from some bloggers exceeds that of the prosecution.
It is revolting and disgusting.
These bloggers can handle and abide NO defense of SMR, summarily skipping logically well presented defenses and instead highlight the more emotionally charged plaints.
If anything, the fact that so many continue to vouch for this man is in of itself the greatest testament to his goodness, greatness, kindness, fairness, righteousness and uprightness.
A great miscarriage of justice has occurred. And fair-minded people will not rest until he is exonerated.
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Nov 14, 2009 at 07:38 PM THE LETZER DOR Says:Report as Inappropriate
how was it even possible to have a fair trial anywhere. SMR hopeless defense council NEVER HIGHLIGHTED THE FACT TO THE JUDGE that when obama publicy stated, while running for office and heard by the entire nation, that bad business practises like hiring illegal immigrants and child workers like the meat factory in postville iowa will be outlawed if he is elected. OBAMA pronounced as judge and jury in front of a world wide captive audience that the heads of that company i.e agri was guilty, severly prejudicing the impartiality of SMR's case, and no one in his defense team challenged the effect of Obama's outrageous statement as prejucing a fair trial for SMR. and what about obama's illegal relative here in the US, why hasn't she been dragged in front of a jury for claiming benefits etc, having no visa.............
MAKES YOU WONDER WHAT THE H--L HIS DEFENSE TEAM WERE PAID 1M BUCKS FOR.
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Nov 14, 2009 at 08:17 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ everybody should write letters to the judge in support of rubashkin it helped in other cases I mean 20,000 letters to plea for rachmons it worked and will work again. ”
This judge was in on it from the beginning and her actions during this trial showed prejudice in favor of the prosecution. Sending letters to her will not help SMR. Maybe sending letters to the Federal District Court System or the Desmoine Register or Souix Falls newspapers asking pertinent questions such as how can a Judge who was involved in a planning meeting of the raid sit in judgement of the defendant?
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Nov 14, 2009 at 08:24 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ B"H
mr naïve
I don't know how much all of these factors have to do with it but if you don't know what some of the non lubavitch rabbis said about it u are naïve or uninformed
the govt went after smr after peta and more importantly unions went after him
unions hhave tremendous voting block and therefore huge influence in this country... they r often very corrupt...
unions were not happy that rubshkn plnt was non union
the federal govt turns blind eye to illegal immigration.... they don't enforce their own laws...
the fedgovt should be prosecuted
”
The union has a whole website on SMR, I wonder why?
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Nov 14, 2009 at 08:52 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ What Rubashkin and all his chasidim should have given consideration that is when you violate some portion of statue of a law you will be tried by a jury composed of people from the locality where the trial is scheduled. Check the history of Iowa is different than Boro Park of New Jersey. A black accused of anything will be judged different in Miss. than in Mass. This should have been his guidelines when he opened the plant in Iowa. Now [I am not an attorney] it is too late. Again a simple posuk from a sefer my father A'H taught me in Vienna eyze chochum hroye eyz haneulad. Just check the past Senator's from Iowa and you will have an answer. Yidden with yarmulkes, beards who shun the local population are not the most welcoming sight in Iowa. This is a fact of life ”
Chuchum, I want to ask you this, did your father teach you that if you did an aveirah but you were not aware that it was an aveirah you are not mechuyav? So for instance if you ate a piece of chocolate that you didn't know was milchig after fleishig it is not the same as if you knowingly and intentionally chose to eat a piece of milchig chocolate after fleishigs choosing to do the aveirah. Or if you opened the door and caused the thermostat to turn on the air-conditioning not knowing that it would happen? Or you did not know that you are not allowed to take the mail in on Shabbos? Or thousand other things that one needs to learn one issue at a time, maybe in school, maybe at home, maybe from a friend or spouse or in a shiur.
Maybe because we are uneducated, undereducated or we were not up to it yet. But WE have halachas too, and we have built-in compassion and failsafes. So according to Halacha if SMR did not know he was committing a crime, if he truly trusted those around him 100% and trusted that they were steering him right is he guilty or not? So if he trusted them and believed he was not guilty because he did not know he was wrong he pleads not guilty halachicly.
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Nov 14, 2009 at 09:06 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ your argument is nonsense. If what you say would be applies then no one can even be prosecuted.
And I think a 20 dollar fraud is different than a 35,000,00 fraud.
What will be your excuse when and if he get found guilty of abuse of his workers, how much leeway should he get because he is frum? ”
Well, I think ALL the 380 some odd workers should be questioned individually by a non-biased individual as well as the rest of the 1,000 some odd workers. After all, SMR is facing over 1,280 years in jail. If the outcome of these interviews prove these allegations to be false then it will also prove that many of the other allegations are also false, lies and trumped up.
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Nov 14, 2009 at 09:00 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ He exploited the poor and helpless with concern only for himself. Torah's laws regarding ben-adam-l'adam are not JUST about how we should treat fellow Jews, but how we treat other human beings who are just as precious in God's eyes as Jews.
Hopefully, he'll learn that being a disciple of Schneerson does not place him on a higher "madreiga" than the rest of us ”
Really? Where is your proof? Show it to us!
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Nov 14, 2009 at 09:09 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ "Acctualy not not paying taxes is robery he is aleged to have inflated sales to get a biger loan which he paid back and never missed a payment"
Wrong, he went bankrupt, so he did miss the payment.
We all have racmanis on him and we pray for him. But you can’t ignore the fact that the Gov. must enforce the laws, especially if its tens of millions of $$’s involved.
I can show you plenty non-Jews who are in jail for white collar crimes, and I know Jews who are not. So I don’t see the anti-Semitism here
I think you all know this, you just done relieze how your passion influence’s your common sense.
”
HE didn't plan on going bankrupt and not paying, that was initiated by the FEDS, HE had every intention of paying the bank back, it was a legitimate transaction. You can't hold it against him that he failed or missed a payment because he was bankrupt that was out of his control.
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Nov 14, 2009 at 08:36 PM Anon Says:Report as Inappropriate
Can someone who was actually at the trial write his/her opinion on whether or not it was biased?
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Nov 14, 2009 at 09:23 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ He was forced into bankruptcy because ......... Fill in the blanks. Like, the dog ate my homework, etc.
He had financial problems long before the raid. He had a 35 million dollar loan long before the raid. He had no competition to speak of and he factored his receivables (a clear sign tha tthe business is in trouble)
He went bankrupt because, as he said, he is a rabbi, not a businessman.
And, he did not miss payments. He intentionally diverted them to his yeshiva and grocery store. Now we know that he did it. He was tried and convicted in a court of law.
What point were you trying to make? ”
Wow all these experts here but conflicting reports to prove all your reports. "he took out the loan after the raid so its fraud", "he took out the loan before the raid so it had nothing to do with the Fed's bankrupting him".... Hey SMR haters, get your facts straight. Will one of you finally come up with some legitimate proof of what you are saying?
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Nov 14, 2009 at 10:24 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You are a lying sack of >>>>, Mr. Cole wrote in page 1 “at 9:30 in the morning, my partner, Dan Vondra, knocked on my door, and told me “that the raids had begun” and the next paragraph he wrote the he was told that the special meeting with defense counsel will be held in the courthouse at 1:30 PM, you explain to us how is it possible that he saw the Judge participate and planning the raid, the fact is that Mr. Cole himself wrote that it was known it the whole community that the Feds were marshaling and a raid was pending, and the court anticipated up to 700 people would be arrested, and the prudent thing to do would be plan ahead, and have defense counsel on standby, so every detainee would be able to have counsel and a plea offer ASAP, the only issue what Mr. Cole had with the Judge that because the Judge was in the room for 10 minutes it appears that the Judge might be involved with negotiations and the ratification of the plea agreement, which would be against the rules, and Mr. Cole purposely used italics for the word apparently, and specifically Mr. Cole states that “I can infer” nowhere did Mr. Cole stated that he saw any violation of the law, he always used a word which means, he is speculating. Stop bemoaning the outcome, while SMR’s attorneys demanded a change of venue and they got the trial moved to this Judge, and if your assertions were half true they could easily demand that the judge recues herself, but they didn’t, because they know, what you are clamming is not what happened. ”
My next question focused on the presentence investigation reports. I have probably represented about 5-7 federal defendants on fake papers charge in the past. In the typical case, the client had entered without inspection, and consequently had no legal status in the United States to protect. They often had already admitted to possession of the fake identification document, and consequently such cases were difficult to defend. Most resulted in “time served” lea deals. In those simple cases, we had often complained to probation about why they needed to do a full pre-sentence investigation report on the Defendants IF they chose to get deported as soon as possible. In fact, at one conference last year, United States District Court Judge John Jarvey even told one of the probation officers that a full presentence report was not necessary in the run of the mill case. The United States Attorney’s Office and the Probation Office had often strongly resisted waiver of presentence reports on two grounds. First, they did not want to miss prior criminal convictions, which can increase the prison sentence. con't next post
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Nov 14, 2009 at 10:22 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You are a lying sack of >>>>, Mr. Cole wrote in page 1 “at 9:30 in the morning, my partner, Dan Vondra, knocked on my door, and told me “that the raids had begun” and the next paragraph he wrote the he was told that the special meeting with defense counsel will be held in the courthouse at 1:30 PM, you explain to us how is it possible that he saw the Judge participate and planning the raid, the fact is that Mr. Cole himself wrote that it was known it the whole community that the Feds were marshaling and a raid was pending, and the court anticipated up to 700 people would be arrested, and the prudent thing to do would be plan ahead, and have defense counsel on standby, so every detainee would be able to have counsel and a plea offer ASAP, the only issue what Mr. Cole had with the Judge that because the Judge was in the room for 10 minutes it appears that the Judge might be involved with negotiations and the ratification of the plea agreement, which would be against the rules, and Mr. Cole purposely used italics for the word apparently, and specifically Mr. Cole states that “I can infer” nowhere did Mr. Cole stated that he saw any violation of the law, he always used a word which means, he is speculating. Stop bemoaning the outcome, while SMR’s attorneys demanded a change of venue and they got the trial moved to this Judge, and if your assertions were half true they could easily demand that the judge recues herself, but they didn’t, because they know, what you are clamming is not what happened. ”
or violent histories. I do not recall the specific felony that had to plead to but all the felonies were basically some variation on the use of forged identification card to get a job.
At one point , I asked if she had considered that any of the defendants were innocent. She replied that they could opt out and proceed on the regular docket if they wanted to. I do not recall at that time whether she indicated that the United States was threatening an aggravated identity theft charge if they opted out. I have subsequently learned that any defendant refusing such a deal could face the aggravated identity theft. Con't...
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Nov 14, 2009 at 10:35 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You are a lying sack of >>>>, Mr. Cole wrote in page 1 “at 9:30 in the morning, my partner, Dan Vondra, knocked on my door, and told me “that the raids had begun” and the next paragraph he wrote the he was told that the special meeting with defense counsel will be held in the courthouse at 1:30 PM, you explain to us how is it possible that he saw the Judge participate and planning the raid, the fact is that Mr. Cole himself wrote that it was known it the whole community that the Feds were marshaling and a raid was pending, and the court anticipated up to 700 people would be arrested, and the prudent thing to do would be plan ahead, and have defense counsel on standby, so every detainee would be able to have counsel and a plea offer ASAP, the only issue what Mr. Cole had with the Judge that because the Judge was in the room for 10 minutes it appears that the Judge might be involved with negotiations and the ratification of the plea agreement, which would be against the rules, and Mr. Cole purposely used italics for the word apparently, and specifically Mr. Cole states that “I can infer” nowhere did Mr. Cole stated that he saw any violation of the law, he always used a word which means, he is speculating. Stop bemoaning the outcome, while SMR’s attorneys demanded a change of venue and they got the trial moved to this Judge, and if your assertions were half true they could easily demand that the judge recues herself, but they didn’t, because they know, what you are clamming is not what happened. ”
Secondly, the probation office did not get full credit for an abbreviated presentence report. So they wanted to do a full presentence report to keep their funding up for more probation staffing.
I asked Ms. Rose how they could be doing such a quick guilty plea process when they had so strenuously resisted abbreviated reports in the past. I asked her why they were not concerned about missing criminal convictions as they had in the past. She replied that these were Rule 11 (c) (1)(C) plea deals. In the typical plea deal, the court is not bound by the sentencing recommendations of each party. She is only limited by the statutory maximum penalty and the advisory sentencing guidelines. A Rule 11 (c)(1)(C) allows the court to b bound to the sentencing recommendations of the United States and the defendant. At the guilty plea hearing, the court notifies the parties if she will accept the guilty plea, and if she does, she is bound to the sentencing recommendation of the Parties. If not, the defendant can withdraw the plea. This effectively guarantees that the defendant will get the agreed upon sentence on the plea bargain, and avoid the risk of a longer sentence before the judge
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Nov 14, 2009 at 10:35 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You are a lying sack of >>>>, Mr. Cole wrote in page 1 “at 9:30 in the morning, my partner, Dan Vondra, knocked on my door, and told me “that the raids had begun” and the next paragraph he wrote the he was told that the special meeting with defense counsel will be held in the courthouse at 1:30 PM, you explain to us how is it possible that he saw the Judge participate and planning the raid, the fact is that Mr. Cole himself wrote that it was known it the whole community that the Feds were marshaling and a raid was pending, and the court anticipated up to 700 people would be arrested, and the prudent thing to do would be plan ahead, and have defense counsel on standby, so every detainee would be able to have counsel and a plea offer ASAP, the only issue what Mr. Cole had with the Judge that because the Judge was in the room for 10 minutes it appears that the Judge might be involved with negotiations and the ratification of the plea agreement, which would be against the rules, and Mr. Cole purposely used italics for the word apparently, and specifically Mr. Cole states that “I can infer” nowhere did Mr. Cole stated that he saw any violation of the law, he always used a word which means, he is speculating. Stop bemoaning the outcome, while SMR’s attorneys demanded a change of venue and they got the trial moved to this Judge, and if your assertions were half true they could easily demand that the judge recues herself, but they didn’t, because they know, what you are clamming is not what happened. ”
What I found most astonishing is that apparently Chief Judge Linda Read had already ratified these deals prior to one lawyer even talking ot his or her client. Judge Reade’s presence at the meeting seemed to confirm as much. This directly violates Rule 11 plea procedure, which provides that the “court must not participate in these (plea) discussions.” Moreover, this ratification appeared to be ex parte with the United states Attorney’s office. Indeed, it had to have been ex parte because no lawyers had even met with their clients prior to these Rule 11 (c)(1)(C) plea bargains being announced.
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Nov 14, 2009 at 10:36 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Wow all these experts here but conflicting reports to prove all your reports. "he took out the loan after the raid so its fraud", "he took out the loan before the raid so it had nothing to do with the Fed's bankrupting him".... Hey SMR haters, get your facts straight. Will one of you finally come up with some legitimate proof of what you are saying? ”
I don’t need to come up with any prove he was convicted by 12 people who saw the evidences, so it is irrelevant what all the VIN posters write, the Judge will someday sentence SMR and we hope that she will have some compassion on his young family. The only thing we still could debate should he plea out the next trial or go ahead and pray for a miracle which didn’t happen during the first trial, otherwise, I don’t need to prove nothing to you, I don’t get paid to do your thinking, think for yourself and come to your own conclusion, regardless, if you’re right or wrong I will not lose a minute of sleep either way
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Nov 14, 2009 at 10:13 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You are a lying sack of >>>>, Mr. Cole wrote in page 1 “at 9:30 in the morning, my partner, Dan Vondra, knocked on my door, and told me “that the raids had begun” and the next paragraph he wrote the he was told that the special meeting with defense counsel will be held in the courthouse at 1:30 PM, you explain to us how is it possible that he saw the Judge participate and planning the raid, the fact is that Mr. Cole himself wrote that it was known it the whole community that the Feds were marshaling and a raid was pending, and the court anticipated up to 700 people would be arrested, and the prudent thing to do would be plan ahead, and have defense counsel on standby, so every detainee would be able to have counsel and a plea offer ASAP, the only issue what Mr. Cole had with the Judge that because the Judge was in the room for 10 minutes it appears that the Judge might be involved with negotiations and the ratification of the plea agreement, which would be against the rules, and Mr. Cole purposely used italics for the word apparently, and specifically Mr. Cole states that “I can infer” nowhere did Mr. Cole stated that he saw any violation of the law, he always used a word which means, he is speculating. Stop bemoaning the outcome, while SMR’s attorneys demanded a change of venue and they got the trial moved to this Judge, and if your assertions were half true they could easily demand that the judge recues herself, but they didn’t, because they know, what you are clamming is not what happened. ”
AUSA Rose began the meeting by scanning the audience for media officials. After shed determined that no media were present, she began the presentation. She immediately began discussing the so called “representation plan.” She indicated each attorney would be assigned a group consisting of 10 clients. She indicted that we could be expected to represent up to 40 defendants, and that they were expecting possibly 700 defendants. As it turns out, I believe the Des Moines Register confirmed an average of 17 clients per attorney.
She then described the four possible peas deals being offered to each group. The first deal was a plea to a felony (I do not recall which), and immediate placement in the custody of Bureau of Immigration and Customs Enforcement. So in other words, the defendant was offered no jail time, but the client would have a felony in the record. The second deal, and apparently most common, was a five month jail sentence to be followed by immediate deportation to their home countries. The third category was 12 months and one day. I believe the fourth category was reserved for defendants with significant aggravating facts such as prior aggravated felonies, ...con't
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Nov 14, 2009 at 10:11 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You are a lying sack of >>>>, Mr. Cole wrote in page 1 “at 9:30 in the morning, my partner, Dan Vondra, knocked on my door, and told me “that the raids had begun” and the next paragraph he wrote the he was told that the special meeting with defense counsel will be held in the courthouse at 1:30 PM, you explain to us how is it possible that he saw the Judge participate and planning the raid, the fact is that Mr. Cole himself wrote that it was known it the whole community that the Feds were marshaling and a raid was pending, and the court anticipated up to 700 people would be arrested, and the prudent thing to do would be plan ahead, and have defense counsel on standby, so every detainee would be able to have counsel and a plea offer ASAP, the only issue what Mr. Cole had with the Judge that because the Judge was in the room for 10 minutes it appears that the Judge might be involved with negotiations and the ratification of the plea agreement, which would be against the rules, and Mr. Cole purposely used italics for the word apparently, and specifically Mr. Cole states that “I can infer” nowhere did Mr. Cole stated that he saw any violation of the law, he always used a word which means, he is speculating. Stop bemoaning the outcome, while SMR’s attorneys demanded a change of venue and they got the trial moved to this Judge, and if your assertions were half true they could easily demand that the judge recues herself, but they didn’t, because they know, what you are clamming is not what happened. ”
We don't need your opinionated interpretation here is the letter continuing from your quote:
“We anticipated that the raid would probably proceed like the Swift plant packing raid in Marshaltown, Iowa last year. I then checked the internet, looked at the itial phots, and then went back to work.”
“Ms. Pickens told e that there was going to be a special meeting t the United States District Courthouse in Cedar Rapids at 1:30 p.m. that afternoon, and that I should not tell anyone about the meeting. So I drove up to Cedar Rapids to see what this meeting was about.
I went up to the Main Courtroom on the 3rd Floor. I saw approximately 10-15 defense lawyers whom I knew to be on the Criminal Justice Act Panel in Cedar Rapids. I also saw: Assistant United States Attorney (AUSA) Stephanie Rose; Chief clerk of Court Robert Phelps; some Unites Staqtes marshals, and I believe some probation officials. At some point early in the presentation, Chief Clerk Phelps handed out what I can only characterize as guilty plea handbooks. These handbooks described all of the elements of offenses, and essentially contained a book of waivers of various rights of the defendants..... cont'd next post
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Nov 14, 2009 at 10:49 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You are a lying sack of >>>>, Mr. Cole wrote in page 1 “at 9:30 in the morning, my partner, Dan Vondra, knocked on my door, and told me “that the raids had begun” and the next paragraph he wrote the he was told that the special meeting with defense counsel will be held in the courthouse at 1:30 PM, you explain to us how is it possible that he saw the Judge participate and planning the raid, the fact is that Mr. Cole himself wrote that it was known it the whole community that the Feds were marshaling and a raid was pending, and the court anticipated up to 700 people would be arrested, and the prudent thing to do would be plan ahead, and have defense counsel on standby, so every detainee would be able to have counsel and a plea offer ASAP, the only issue what Mr. Cole had with the Judge that because the Judge was in the room for 10 minutes it appears that the Judge might be involved with negotiations and the ratification of the plea agreement, which would be against the rules, and Mr. Cole purposely used italics for the word apparently, and specifically Mr. Cole states that “I can infer” nowhere did Mr. Cole stated that he saw any violation of the law, he always used a word which means, he is speculating. Stop bemoaning the outcome, while SMR’s attorneys demanded a change of venue and they got the trial moved to this Judge, and if your assertions were half true they could easily demand that the judge recues herself, but they didn’t, because they know, what you are clamming is not what happened. ”
Responsibility 32:1.7(a) and (b) provides that a lawyer shall not represent a client if there is a significant risk of conflict, and that any consent to conflict shall be in writing. The potential conflicts were obvious. For example, suppose, under the group representation plan, that an attorney simultaneously represents a woman with a Violence against Women act adjustment case against her husband, and her husband in a different group. In this situation, the wife may have a good claim to adjust status, and remain in the United States on the basis of her status as a victim of domestic violence. Her husband will likely be prosecuted for domestic abuse, and could be deported on the basis of being the abuser. Their interests directly conflict. Other examples come to mind. What if one of the workers helped the other to obtain the false paper? That person would certainly be a witness for either the defense, or the United States. Moreover, if such potential conflicts existed, the 6th Amendment compels disclosure to the Court, and on the record colloquy by the District Court to ensure the client’s right to conflict free counsel. See Holloway v. Arkansas 435 U.S. 475, 485-486 (1978) (defense attorneys have the obligation, upon discovering a conflict of interests, to advise the court at once of the problem). Under these circumstances, it would have impossible to meaningfully assess conflict of interest issues in seven days.
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Nov 14, 2009 at 10:48 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You are a lying sack of >>>>, Mr. Cole wrote in page 1 “at 9:30 in the morning, my partner, Dan Vondra, knocked on my door, and told me “that the raids had begun” and the next paragraph he wrote the he was told that the special meeting with defense counsel will be held in the courthouse at 1:30 PM, you explain to us how is it possible that he saw the Judge participate and planning the raid, the fact is that Mr. Cole himself wrote that it was known it the whole community that the Feds were marshaling and a raid was pending, and the court anticipated up to 700 people would be arrested, and the prudent thing to do would be plan ahead, and have defense counsel on standby, so every detainee would be able to have counsel and a plea offer ASAP, the only issue what Mr. Cole had with the Judge that because the Judge was in the room for 10 minutes it appears that the Judge might be involved with negotiations and the ratification of the plea agreement, which would be against the rules, and Mr. Cole purposely used italics for the word apparently, and specifically Mr. Cole states that “I can infer” nowhere did Mr. Cole stated that he saw any violation of the law, he always used a word which means, he is speculating. Stop bemoaning the outcome, while SMR’s attorneys demanded a change of venue and they got the trial moved to this Judge, and if your assertions were half true they could easily demand that the judge recues herself, but they didn’t, because they know, what you are clamming is not what happened. ”
What I found most astonishing is that apparently Chief Judge Linda Read had already ratified these deals prior to one lawyer even talking to his or her client. Judge Reade’s presence at the meeting seemed to confirm as much. This directly violates Rule 11 plea procedure, which provides that the “court must not participate in these (plea) discussions.” Moreover, this ratification appeared to be ex parte with the United states Attorney’s office. Indeed, it had to have been ex parte because no lawyers had even met with their clients prior to these Rule 11 (c)(1)(C) plea bargains being announced.
Ms. Rose concluded by stating that plea status hearings would begin by Saturday, May 17, 20008, and that the clients would have seven days to accept offer. She justified the quick time line because they were concerned about getting the defendants back to their families in Guatemala as soon as possible. Especially considering this extremely rushed process, I realized that the acceptance of such an appointment would have required me to immediately report myself to the Iowa Bar Association for failing to protect a client’s right to conflict free counsel. Iowa Rule of Professional con't
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Nov 14, 2009 at 11:12 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Not correct the bankruptcy trustee exposed the massive fraud; the trustee testified in court that when he tried to collect from the vendors their outstanding balances he found out about the fraud. Oh I forgot he must had worked either for PETA or the Union or better yet the DNC ”
Then that must be a public record if YOU know about it so prove it.
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Nov 15, 2009 at 12:04 AM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Then that must be a public record if YOU know about it so prove it. ”
I could lead you to the water but I can’t make you drink it.
WCFCourier Monday, October 26, 2009 9:00 am
Investigators discovered the financial problems when the plant's court-appointed bankruptcy trustee tried to collect customer debts shown in the company's records.
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Nov 14, 2009 at 11:04 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You are a lying sack of >>>>, Mr. Cole wrote in page 1 “at 9:30 in the morning, my partner, Dan Vondra, knocked on my door, and told me “that the raids had begun” and the next paragraph he wrote the he was told that the special meeting with defense counsel will be held in the courthouse at 1:30 PM, you explain to us how is it possible that he saw the Judge participate and planning the raid, the fact is that Mr. Cole himself wrote that it was known it the whole community that the Feds were marshaling and a raid was pending, and the court anticipated up to 700 people would be arrested, and the prudent thing to do would be plan ahead, and have defense counsel on standby, so every detainee would be able to have counsel and a plea offer ASAP, the only issue what Mr. Cole had with the Judge that because the Judge was in the room for 10 minutes it appears that the Judge might be involved with negotiations and the ratification of the plea agreement, which would be against the rules, and Mr. Cole purposely used italics for the word apparently, and specifically Mr. Cole states that “I can infer” nowhere did Mr. Cole stated that he saw any violation of the law, he always used a word which means, he is speculating. Stop bemoaning the outcome, while SMR’s attorneys demanded a change of venue and they got the trial moved to this Judge, and if your assertions were half true they could easily demand that the judge recues herself, but they didn’t, because they know, what you are clamming is not what happened. ”
After Ms. Rose described the plea deals, a United States marshal began describing the Orwellian security plan. Each attorney accepting an appointment had to arrive early the following day at the Cattle congress for processing and to obtain a photo identification card. I think these cards were similar to a necklace type press credential/ He then told us that attorneys would be able to meet with clients in a designated representation zone. He indicated that each attorney could not walk around Cattle congress grounds without an escort by a United States marshal. He also advised us of an evacuation plan in case of any disturbance. At that point, I felt that I could not participate in the mass violation of rights. I informed Mr. Phelp that I would nt be participating. He said, “OK, please turn in your 3-ring binder. I then walked out in disgust. Chief Judge Reade was there for at least 10 minutes. I do not recall at which point she left. I think at some point AUSA Stephanie Rose advised her it would be a good time to leave as people began asking about the details of these deals. con't
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Nov 14, 2009 at 11:06 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You are a lying sack of >>>>, Mr. Cole wrote in page 1 “at 9:30 in the morning, my partner, Dan Vondra, knocked on my door, and told me “that the raids had begun” and the next paragraph he wrote the he was told that the special meeting with defense counsel will be held in the courthouse at 1:30 PM, you explain to us how is it possible that he saw the Judge participate and planning the raid, the fact is that Mr. Cole himself wrote that it was known it the whole community that the Feds were marshaling and a raid was pending, and the court anticipated up to 700 people would be arrested, and the prudent thing to do would be plan ahead, and have defense counsel on standby, so every detainee would be able to have counsel and a plea offer ASAP, the only issue what Mr. Cole had with the Judge that because the Judge was in the room for 10 minutes it appears that the Judge might be involved with negotiations and the ratification of the plea agreement, which would be against the rules, and Mr. Cole purposely used italics for the word apparently, and specifically Mr. Cole states that “I can infer” nowhere did Mr. Cole stated that he saw any violation of the law, he always used a word which means, he is speculating. Stop bemoaning the outcome, while SMR’s attorneys demanded a change of venue and they got the trial moved to this Judge, and if your assertions were half true they could easily demand that the judge recues herself, but they didn’t, because they know, what you are clamming is not what happened. ”
Obviously, I am fairly reluctant to openly criticize Judge Reade. I have pretty much resigned myself to not taking any more appointments in her district. However, in spite of the financial repercussion for taking this position, I simply could not stay silent on this issue. The Clerk of Court issued a press release talking about the roundup of illegal aliens. This process: presumed guilt; deprived defendants of their right to due process; and interfered with their basic right to choose their own counsel. The court appointed attorney’s role appeared to be only to act as a guilty plea processing clerk, and served only to expedite the mass waiver of rights. From what I can infer based upon the facts from the initial meeting as well as subsequent media reports, Judge Reade, and the United State Attorney’s office coordinated the mass detention, roundup, representation plan, plea deals, and sentencing PRIOR to one single attorney consulting with a client. I hope I am wrong about that inference, but the overwhelming facts suggest a breathtaking level of coordination between the United States District court Judge and the Department of Justice. I nevertheless strongly encourage cont.
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Nov 15, 2009 at 01:40 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I don’t need to come up with any prove he was convicted by 12 people who saw the evidences, so it is irrelevant what all the VIN posters write, the Judge will someday sentence SMR and we hope that she will have some compassion on his young family. The only thing we still could debate should he plea out the next trial or go ahead and pray for a miracle which didn’t happen during the first trial, otherwise, I don’t need to prove nothing to you, I don’t get paid to do your thinking, think for yourself and come to your own conclusion, regardless, if you’re right or wrong I will not lose a minute of sleep either way ”
There is an investigation going on in regard to Judge Reade and her involvement in the raid.
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Nov 15, 2009 at 01:48 AM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ I don’t need to come up with any prove he was convicted by 12 people who saw the evidences, so it is irrelevant what all the VIN posters write, the Judge will someday sentence SMR and we hope that she will have some compassion on his young family. The only thing we still could debate should he plea out the next trial or go ahead and pray for a miracle which didn’t happen during the first trial, otherwise, I don’t need to prove nothing to you, I don’t get paid to do your thinking, think for yourself and come to your own conclusion, regardless, if you’re right or wrong I will not lose a minute of sleep either way ”
The more research you do, the more complaints you find about the illegalities of the raid and investigations currently being conducted.
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Nov 15, 2009 at 02:11 AM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ There is an investigation going on in regard to Judge Reade and her involvement in the raid. ”
Kind of interesting Judge was hired in 1986 as an assistant US Attorney under Reagan Justice Department, and was appointed to the Federal by President George W. Bush, sounds to me like a Republican,
As to her being investigate I cannot find anything but the Mr. Coles letter, if you have morne information next time cite the source otherwise don’t make up stories.
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Nov 15, 2009 at 01:50 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Nebach on you people. Its the judge, the jury, the feds, everyone but Rubashkin. "If only he could have told the jury this." If only a different judge. You want the real "If only?" If only he hadn't washed money through his yeshiva in the millions, and if only he hadn't billed fake invoices. That's the real if only. But you are so drunk on kool aid, so blinded by your own arrogance and holier than thou attitude that you will be never accept the truth. Obtuse thinking, ridiculous excuses, refusal to take blame. Chabad went from being a great community to becoming a children's playground. B'H the rebbe zal is not here to see this. His xray vision saw the penimius of every yid and never would have let this churban happen. ”
Binfol oivecha al tismach uvekashlom al yogel libecha so for what ever reason u picked this erliche yungerman as your greatest enemy your still wrong
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Nov 15, 2009 at 03:02 PM USA? Says:Report as Inappropriate
SHOCKING: Thursday evening, after sitting through an hour-long recitation of the jury’s verdicts in Sioux Falls, Iowa, Reb Shalom Mordechai Rubashkin was detained pending a bail hearing at the insistence of Peter Deegan. If that were not shocking enough, the ordeal he was subsequently put through is positively offensive, contemptible, and a black mark on the justice system of the United States.
Reb Shalom Mordechai was taken by the US Marshals service to South Dakota State penitentiary in Sioux Falls pending transfer to Iowa. He was not allowed to make a phone call to inform his lawyers or his family of his location. One of the Marshals, upon learning of this, was nice enough to call the family. They would have otherwise not known where he was.
As part of the entry process into the jail, Reb Shalom Mordechai was asked to disrobe and change into the prison uniform. He complied, but stopped short of removing his tzitzis and yarmulka, explaining that, as a religious Jew, he was required to wear these garments at all times, that it is permitted under federal law, and that he would not take them off.
The staff immediately conferred with their superiors and confirmed that they would not allow him to wear his religious clothing. At this point, six burly, intimidating prison guards entered with riot shields. They took a video of this interaction.
The warden at the prison then decided that he would be allowed to wear his yarmulka, but not his tzitzis. Reb Shalom Mordechai explained that although he had no interest in making trouble, he would not remove his tzitzis for religious reasons and his religion does not allow him to even walk around withouttzitzis.
The prison staff belligerently insisted that he nevertheless remove them or they would be removed by force and he would be placed in a disciplinary area alone.
Reb Shalom Mordechai explained that he was not fighting with them, but he would not remove them himself. He was not trying to give them a hard time, but he was insisting on his religious rights. He also took the opportunity to inform them of his other religious needs, namely, the tallis and tefillin required fordavening Shacharis, before which he would be unable to eat. They responded by yelling at him for threatening a hunger strike. “Do you know where you are?!” they shouted
They then removed his tzitzis. He was given only a thin sheet to cover himself and they brought a wheelchair to move him, since he had said that he would not be allowed to walk without his tzitzis.
The staff took him to the disciplinary area, where a woman asked him questions from a form, and then disregarded his answers, writing in whatever she wanted to over his objections.
They left him to sleep with no clothes - only the thin sheet and his yarmulka and another sheet to cover himself.
In the morning, they brought him papers to sign, which he would not do without his lawyers.
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Nov 15, 2009 at 05:20 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Kind of interesting Judge was hired in 1986 as an assistant US Attorney under Reagan Justice Department, and was appointed to the Federal by President George W. Bush, sounds to me like a Republican,
As to her being investigate I cannot find anything but the Mr. Coles letter, if you have morne information next time cite the source otherwise don’t make up stories.
”
Wow, that's like the pot calling the kettle black! You have not backed up anything or any information YOU reported here. Actually I listed many of the websites not all were posted. But you can do a google search as well on Federal District Court Judge Linda Reade and see what you come up with like I did. I also included Postville.
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Nov 15, 2009 at 06:28 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ does anyone know how far being dan lkaf zechus goes? i assume if someone was found guilty by sanhedrin or beis din there is no reason to be dan lkak zechus. does this apply to secular court systems as well despite that their methods of determining guilt are different than that of halacha? ”
notice how no one bothered to respond to you. why? because no one gives a damn about what right or wrong halchalicly. they just wanna spew their opinions like verbal diarhea. no one thinks just talk talk untill it keeps on flowing like they just took colon blow.
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Nov 15, 2009 at 06:18 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Wow, that's like the pot calling the kettle black! You have not backed up anything or any information YOU reported here. Actually I listed many of the websites not all were posted. But you can do a google search as well on Federal District Court Judge Linda Reade and see what you come up with like I did. I also included Postville. ”
You could say whatever you want because you hide under the Anonymous name, but I did my search and no I cannot find any information other then she is pro prosecutor judge nothing about being investigate by the judicial system or the bar or the legislative body, I cannot prove to you a negative but you could prove a positive but you failed to cite even one source which states that "the judge is under any investigation", as long as you don’t cite a source I shall ignore your rantings.
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Nov 16, 2009 at 07:14 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ You could say whatever you want because you hide under the Anonymous name, but I did my search and no I cannot find any information other then she is pro prosecutor judge nothing about being investigate by the judicial system or the bar or the legislative body, I cannot prove to you a negative but you could prove a positive but you failed to cite even one source which states that "the judge is under any investigation", as long as you don’t cite a source I shall ignore your rantings.
”
"You could say whatever you want because you hide under the Anonymous name,"
Once again you proved my point, OMG is not listed in the white pages. lol.
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Nov 16, 2009 at 09:36 PM OMG Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ "You could say whatever you want because you hide under the Anonymous name,"
Once again you proved my point, OMG is not listed in the white pages. lol. ”
Which State phone book did you check? the point that under Anonymous we do not know where you stand on a host of issues and in particular the SMR trail nobody know what your overall argument, or position you took, however, my position in this case is well known and I make a point to answer with citations and you failed again to refute any of my point with a citation. Therefore I will not reply to you if I know from your writing that you are on the other end.
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Nov 17, 2009 at 05:14 PM Anonymous Says:Report as Inappropriate
“ Which State phone book did you check? the point that under Anonymous we do not know where you stand on a host of issues and in particular the SMR trail nobody know what your overall argument, or position you took, however, my position in this case is well known and I make a point to answer with citations and you failed again to refute any of my point with a citation. Therefore I will not reply to you if I know from your writing that you are on the other end. ”
Sounds good to me, in the mean time YOU or anyone else can choose to read any of the web sites I brought here and a much more interesting one the Congressional hearings on the Postville Raid!