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Jerusalem - Court Orders Guma Aguiar To Psychiatric Hospital

Published on: January 14, 2010 09:05 AM
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Guma Aguiar this past Chanukah lighting Menorah in Israel with Chabad [Photo: COL]Guma Aguiar this past Chanukah lighting Menorah in Israel with Chabad [Photo: COL]

Jerusalem - Betar Jerusalem sponsor Guma Aguiar was forcibly admitted to the Abarbanel Psychiatric Hospital overnight Wednesday following a court order.

Aguiar apparently come out with a series of seemingly bizarre remarks, including a claim to having met Gilad Schalit in Gaza.

Israel Radio reported that the Brazilian-American energy tycoon had only arrived for the last 20 minutes of Saturday’s soccer match at Teddy Stadium between Betar and Bnei Sakhnin, saying his late arrival was due to him having visited the captured IDF soldier.

Associates of the 32-year-old were quoted by the radio station as saying that they felt he was behaving in a particularly strange manner over the last couple of weeks.

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Referring to the “meeting” with the captured solider in an interview with Jerusalem weekly Kol Ha’ir Aguiar reportedly said that “I told Schalit I hope to see him home already in the next few days. He said he wanted me to tell his family how much he loves them and Israel, and that he hopes it will all be over soon. I have saved thousands of people, not only Gilad Schalit, and I want to be able to save thousands of people every day, and not only Gilad Schalit.”

Aguiar’s family released a statement Thursday morning saying, “Guma Aguiar has been subjected for a prolonged period of time to intensive emotional pressures caused by malicious court cases in the United States concerning past business dealings with his uncle.”

His family said that he was the “victim of a campaign of invasive surveillance and false accusations that generated what amounted to psychological terrorism.”

On Wednesday evening, according to the statement, “Guma’s family entered him into a healthcare facility in Israel to obtain suitable examinations and treatment as needed. He will undergo tests for the next two weeks and his situation will be closely monitored by the Aguiar family.”

In October, Aguiar said he had hired top legal expert (and Jpost.com blogger) Alan Dershowitz to defend him in a US case where he claims that police officers assaulted him.

Aguiar was arrested after allegedly driving recklessly. The American Fox News network reported that he confessed to the officers that arrested him to having smoked a marijuana cigarette.

He claimed that the police would not let him talk to either his mother or his attorneys.

Last month, Aguiar proclaimed himself the new Betar owner, five months after giving the team $4 million as a sponsor.

The 32-year-old Brazilian-American told The Jerusalem Post that Russian businessman Arkadi Gaydamak, who has owned Betar for the last four years, agreed to transfer ownership to Aguiar during meetings in Moscow this month.

Aguiar has been trying to take control of the club since the summer, but has run into legal problems due to debts incurred by Gaydamak while he was directly involved. The Russian left Israel in November 2008 after losing the Jerusalem mayoral election and has yet to return.

Despite the jubilant tone of Aguiar’s announcement one of his spokesmen denied the deal had been completed.


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Read Comments (41)  —  Post Yours »

1

 Jan 14, 2010 at 09:24 AM Anonymous Says:

ess kumt tzu emm for being mefasem such a big chillul hashem

2

 Jan 14, 2010 at 09:30 AM Loshon Hora Says:

Maybe it is a Dibuk, & the Ex chief of EJF will excort it for the right price.

3

 Jan 14, 2010 at 09:30 AM JOEY Says:

Toms Just As Crazy:)

4

 Jan 14, 2010 at 09:44 AM The truth Says:

The real one responssible for Leib Tropper's demise was Guma Aguiar. He's the one who paid for these tapes to be fabricated in order to bring shame to his uncle Tom Kaplan through Tropper. I met Aguiar once he seemed like a nice guy, but deffinettely not all there. He also said here in Israel at one time that he was Moshiach.

5

 Jan 14, 2010 at 09:45 AM AISH Says:

Isn't he the one who was honored by Aish Hatorah and Chabbad? They have to be more careful who they honor and not just go for the money.

6

 Jan 14, 2010 at 09:53 AM Anonymous Says:

Tropper stepped on this guys toe a little to hard and look what he did to Tropper. GUMA is very dangerous.
I think peple owe Tropper an apology after they see who the guy who releasd all the "evidence" is.
Guma had also claime to be Mashiach.
Enough said.

7

 Jan 14, 2010 at 09:58 AM Anonymous Says:

This is the punishment for one who is Mevazei Talmidei chachomim.

8

 Jan 14, 2010 at 10:04 AM Anonymous Says:

no need for a psych admission / give a mg. of risperdal & let him sleep it over this ussualy is a pre "mania" some a typical is all that it needs

9

 Jan 14, 2010 at 10:35 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Tropper stepped on this guys toe a little to hard and look what he did to Tropper. GUMA is very dangerous.
I think peple owe Tropper an apology after they see who the guy who releasd all the "evidence" is.
Guma had also claime to be Mashiach.
Enough said.

Yeah you said it, you said enough!!!! Shannon specifically said she only gave the tapes to Rabbonim so stop accusing Guma of releasing the tapes!!!!

11

 Jan 14, 2010 at 11:09 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #9  
Anonymous Says:

Yeah you said it, you said enough!!!! Shannon specifically said she only gave the tapes to Rabbonim so stop accusing Guma of releasing the tapes!!!!

No one owes Tropper an apology. He owes the Jewish world an apology.

12

 Jan 14, 2010 at 11:27 AM Anonymous Says:

All I can say lo lachacumim lechem

13

 Jan 14, 2010 at 11:28 AM Anonymous Says:

Wishing him a refuah shleimah. He seems to have done a lot good for a lot of good causes in Israel. He might just be suffering from an acute case of exhaustion - just wishing him well! Why people need to go overboard with overdoing makes no sense.

14

 Jan 14, 2010 at 11:32 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Tropper stepped on this guys toe a little to hard and look what he did to Tropper. GUMA is very dangerous.
I think peple owe Tropper an apology after they see who the guy who releasd all the "evidence" is.
Guma had also claime to be Mashiach.
Enough said.

How do we know that Guma released the tape or that he was involved?

15

 Jan 14, 2010 at 11:35 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #5  
AISH Says:

Isn't he the one who was honored by Aish Hatorah and Chabbad? They have to be more careful who they honor and not just go for the money.

why point out Aish and Chabbad, so many Jewish organizations do it. It would be more appropriate to call out all Jewish Organizations to be more careful who they take money from. That being said it is probably not so simple to know who a person is.

16

 Jan 14, 2010 at 11:57 AM Irrelevant Says:

What's sad is that in truth Guma Aguiars psychosis should have no bearing on what really happened. Tropper was videod and recorded doing and saying things non befitting a Frum Jew to put it lightly. Tropper admitted and never claimed the tapes were faked. They are as real as real gets. They were professionally authenticated as well not to mention that the technology to fake such a tape doesn't exist. Do the reserach if you don't believe me. Who cares if Guma helped Shannon "entrap" him? Even if he is certifiably mad it doesn't effect Troppers guilt one iota. Of course Troppers defenders don't argue with logic and after reading his defenders comments I know that they grasp at straws to defend him so nothing they argue should surprise me.

17

 Jan 14, 2010 at 12:15 PM Anonymous Says:

This man apparently is an unusual genius. Perhaps that is the source of his problems. Perhaps he is being poisoned by drugs by people seeking to control him and his billions of dollars and business operations. I hope the Physicians can help him regain control of his senses and HKBH help him find his way. Obviously he has a good heart or he would not be donating money to Yiddish charities. Rafuah shleima Guma..

18

 Jan 14, 2010 at 12:21 PM TropperIsADrek Says:

The bottom line is that Tropper is a disgrace to frummer yidden, whoever it was that was instrumental in exposing him. People who defend Tropper and attack Guma are not defenders of yiddishkeit but destroyers of yiddishkeit. Not because Guma is a tzaddik, but because they are missing the point. The point is that Tropper screamed from the rooftops that he represents authentic frum yiddishkeit, and meanwhile it turns out that this claim was very distant from the truth. Anyone who questions the authenticity of the recordings is either a rosho or they are in denial. Either way they are adding to our boosha. HaShem Yerachem! Please, HaShem, defend us from those who are trying to defend us!!

19

 Jan 14, 2010 at 12:53 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #2  
Loshon Hora Says:

Maybe it is a Dibuk, & the Ex chief of EJF will excort it for the right price.

It's called Bi-Polar. I think Guma is suffering a case of manic highs, soon to be a major depression.

20

 Jan 14, 2010 at 01:53 PM he was DRUGGED Says:

there are those who are actively trying to talk-him-out of supporting the outreach-programs of chabad & aish!

they view his open-haded charity as a threat to their GOALS with him!

this is surely the work of 2 well known "fake" friends of his!

21

 Jan 14, 2010 at 01:54 PM Mrs. Tropper Says:

Horav Tropper Shlita NEVER admitted ANY of the things he is accused of!! The Rov NEVER said the tapes are EMES and a true unaltered account of his conversations!! The Rov is a Rosh Yeshiva and a manhig - at the very least he has a chezkas kashrus. He is close with MANY gedolim who hold him with high esteem. These gedolim possess da'as Torah!!

In contrast, the accuser admits to doing unmentionable acts. Is not a kosher aidus and lacks nemonus!! To complicate matters, there might have been personal motivation to fabricate allegations.

When we put everything on the scales of emes, and add the weight of Guma's involvement, his relationship with the organization, his uncle, Horav Tropper, and the status of his wife's Jewishness...there is only one conclusion: That gedolim and da'as Torah are ALWAYS right, and the rest is nothing but a blood libel to disgrace our Yeshiva system and faith in our leadership.

Reb Leib Shlitah, keep shtark in your bitochon! Look at your supporters - the greatest gedolim in America, and shrug off the opposition who seek to snuff out Torah!!!

22

 Jan 14, 2010 at 02:03 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #7  
Anonymous Says:

This is the punishment for one who is Mevazei Talmidei chachomim.

were theirs smoke their s fire

23

 Jan 14, 2010 at 02:12 PM Anonymous Says:

Guma may be nebech not 100% and needs medical help but he is great baal tzedaka
for frum jewish causes and means well.
tropper is certified scum. Those that seek to defend him are shikkur from drinking from his drugged $$$$$ trough. It is sad to see this chillul Hashem being defended in any way. (Of course it may be tropper himself posting)

24

 Jan 14, 2010 at 02:20 PM watcher Says:

What is happening to the Brazilians? First the dybbuk case is diagnosed by the badatz' unlicensed psychiatrist as mentally ill, now its Guma.... Is it something in their water supply? A kind of montezuma's revenge? Or a mistranslation of the term brazil-nut.

25

 Jan 14, 2010 at 02:21 PM TropperIsADrek Says:

Reply to #21  
Mrs. Tropper Says:

Horav Tropper Shlita NEVER admitted ANY of the things he is accused of!! The Rov NEVER said the tapes are EMES and a true unaltered account of his conversations!! The Rov is a Rosh Yeshiva and a manhig - at the very least he has a chezkas kashrus. He is close with MANY gedolim who hold him with high esteem. These gedolim possess da'as Torah!!

In contrast, the accuser admits to doing unmentionable acts. Is not a kosher aidus and lacks nemonus!! To complicate matters, there might have been personal motivation to fabricate allegations.

When we put everything on the scales of emes, and add the weight of Guma's involvement, his relationship with the organization, his uncle, Horav Tropper, and the status of his wife's Jewishness...there is only one conclusion: That gedolim and da'as Torah are ALWAYS right, and the rest is nothing but a blood libel to disgrace our Yeshiva system and faith in our leadership.

Reb Leib Shlitah, keep shtark in your bitochon! Look at your supporters - the greatest gedolim in America, and shrug off the opposition who seek to snuff out Torah!!!

Not only is Tropper innocent of all accusations against him, but there were no gas chambers at Auschwitz either. And Lee Harvey Oswald was innocent. And Elvis never died. And Michael Jackson was just fond of little children.

26

 Jan 14, 2010 at 02:22 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #9  
Anonymous Says:

Yeah you said it, you said enough!!!! Shannon specifically said she only gave the tapes to Rabbonim so stop accusing Guma of releasing the tapes!!!!

If your going by what that women said. Then LT is totaly innocent.
If not... her geirus is not valid. The Beis Din that did the Geirus knows that better than anyone. They went over the tapes and decided that they were NOT authentic, thus they went forth with the geirus. Had they been authentic they wold never have done such a geirus.
Guma reliesed the tapes. The email's were traced back to him by may people.
There is noone that even claims that he didnt release them. The question was were they authentic. Which they were proven not to be.
He gave food to LT's enemies to try and destroy him and his family.
That is a terrible sin.

27

 Jan 14, 2010 at 02:43 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #16  
Irrelevant Says:

What's sad is that in truth Guma Aguiars psychosis should have no bearing on what really happened. Tropper was videod and recorded doing and saying things non befitting a Frum Jew to put it lightly. Tropper admitted and never claimed the tapes were faked. They are as real as real gets. They were professionally authenticated as well not to mention that the technology to fake such a tape doesn't exist. Do the reserach if you don't believe me. Who cares if Guma helped Shannon "entrap" him? Even if he is certifiably mad it doesn't effect Troppers guilt one iota. Of course Troppers defenders don't argue with logic and after reading his defenders comments I know that they grasp at straws to defend him so nothing they argue should surprise me.

1. He was NEVER videod/ recorded doing anything not befitting a frum jew.
2.He NEVER admited anything.
3.The tapes were proven to be false.
4. They were NEVER proven to be authentic. Not by a professional nor by his lowlife enemies.
5.The technology very much exits. Did you ever watch a hollywood movie? They are 100% cut and paste, plus voice impersonation. Nothing a billionaire cant get done to his worst enemy (that he has vowd revenge to) for a couple of bucks.
6. Do YOUR research.
7. Rabbi Tropper was never "entraped". The whole story is bogus.
8. His enemies don't argue with logic and after reading his enemies comments I know that they grasp at straws to destroy him so nothing they argue should surprise me.
9. His acusers are the same guys theat never liked him to begin with. Any objective person that has looked into the facts of the case and done some backround research has concluded that not only is R' Tropper innocent, he is a tzadik!
10 Many Gedolim are standing by Tropper and fighting by him tooth and nail. Enough said. Of couse there are those that hate gedolim and know better than them. To them the answer is: Did your rebbe patch you too hard when you were a kid?

28

 Jan 14, 2010 at 03:44 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Tropper stepped on this guys toe a little to hard and look what he did to Tropper. GUMA is very dangerous.
I think peple owe Tropper an apology after they see who the guy who releasd all the "evidence" is.
Guma had also claime to be Mashiach.
Enough said.

so you mean it didn't happen? wishfull thinking

29

 Jan 14, 2010 at 03:53 PM Satmar 101 Says:

Reply to #27  
Anonymous Says:

1. He was NEVER videod/ recorded doing anything not befitting a frum jew.
2.He NEVER admited anything.
3.The tapes were proven to be false.
4. They were NEVER proven to be authentic. Not by a professional nor by his lowlife enemies.
5.The technology very much exits. Did you ever watch a hollywood movie? They are 100% cut and paste, plus voice impersonation. Nothing a billionaire cant get done to his worst enemy (that he has vowd revenge to) for a couple of bucks.
6. Do YOUR research.
7. Rabbi Tropper was never "entraped". The whole story is bogus.
8. His enemies don't argue with logic and after reading his enemies comments I know that they grasp at straws to destroy him so nothing they argue should surprise me.
9. His acusers are the same guys theat never liked him to begin with. Any objective person that has looked into the facts of the case and done some backround research has concluded that not only is R' Tropper innocent, he is a tzadik!
10 Many Gedolim are standing by Tropper and fighting by him tooth and nail. Enough said. Of couse there are those that hate gedolim and know better than them. To them the answer is: Did your rebbe patch you too hard when you were a kid?

I would like to sell you the Brooklyn Bridge..

30

 Jan 14, 2010 at 04:27 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #27  
Anonymous Says:

1. He was NEVER videod/ recorded doing anything not befitting a frum jew.
2.He NEVER admited anything.
3.The tapes were proven to be false.
4. They were NEVER proven to be authentic. Not by a professional nor by his lowlife enemies.
5.The technology very much exits. Did you ever watch a hollywood movie? They are 100% cut and paste, plus voice impersonation. Nothing a billionaire cant get done to his worst enemy (that he has vowd revenge to) for a couple of bucks.
6. Do YOUR research.
7. Rabbi Tropper was never "entraped". The whole story is bogus.
8. His enemies don't argue with logic and after reading his enemies comments I know that they grasp at straws to destroy him so nothing they argue should surprise me.
9. His acusers are the same guys theat never liked him to begin with. Any objective person that has looked into the facts of the case and done some backround research has concluded that not only is R' Tropper innocent, he is a tzadik!
10 Many Gedolim are standing by Tropper and fighting by him tooth and nail. Enough said. Of couse there are those that hate gedolim and know better than them. To them the answer is: Did your rebbe patch you too hard when you were a kid?

Why did he resign ??????
Why doesn't he come out and say "Its NOT true" ??????????
Anyone with a brain knows the emes..... We wern't born yesterday and are not
brainwashed zombies.

31

 Jan 14, 2010 at 05:34 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #27  
Anonymous Says:

1. He was NEVER videod/ recorded doing anything not befitting a frum jew.
2.He NEVER admited anything.
3.The tapes were proven to be false.
4. They were NEVER proven to be authentic. Not by a professional nor by his lowlife enemies.
5.The technology very much exits. Did you ever watch a hollywood movie? They are 100% cut and paste, plus voice impersonation. Nothing a billionaire cant get done to his worst enemy (that he has vowd revenge to) for a couple of bucks.
6. Do YOUR research.
7. Rabbi Tropper was never "entraped". The whole story is bogus.
8. His enemies don't argue with logic and after reading his enemies comments I know that they grasp at straws to destroy him so nothing they argue should surprise me.
9. His acusers are the same guys theat never liked him to begin with. Any objective person that has looked into the facts of the case and done some backround research has concluded that not only is R' Tropper innocent, he is a tzadik!
10 Many Gedolim are standing by Tropper and fighting by him tooth and nail. Enough said. Of couse there are those that hate gedolim and know better than them. To them the answer is: Did your rebbe patch you too hard when you were a kid?

1. Yes he was. You just haven't seen them. The videos are very explicit.
2. He has never denied it either - he is not someone who is backwards at coming forward!
3. No they were not, you liar.
4. Yes they have been proven authentic by several independent audio experts. Furthermore anyone who knows him knows that it is him speaking on the recordings.
5. Clearly you live in a fantasy world. Real life is not James Bond, and not even the best technology can convincingly reproduce the type of conversations that the recordings contain.
6. The research has been done. You are in denial.
7. Your brain has been entrapped. You are a moron. As are all Tropper supporters.
8. There is no one more irrational and illogical than a Tropper supporter. Nothing you say makes sense, even to a child. What do you take us all for? Morons like you?
9. Ahh! Kill the messenger! Stupid tactic. In any case, it doesn't sound like Ms Orand was Tropper's enemy when she attended his family simchos and worked for him. So what do you reckon made her change her mind? Could it be his shameless sexual exploitation of her?
10. Where are explicit letters of support from godolim in which it says that Tropper is innocent?

32

 Jan 14, 2010 at 05:37 PM satmar 101 Says:

Reply to #26  
Anonymous Says:

If your going by what that women said. Then LT is totaly innocent.
If not... her geirus is not valid. The Beis Din that did the Geirus knows that better than anyone. They went over the tapes and decided that they were NOT authentic, thus they went forth with the geirus. Had they been authentic they wold never have done such a geirus.
Guma reliesed the tapes. The email's were traced back to him by may people.
There is noone that even claims that he didnt release them. The question was were they authentic. Which they were proven not to be.
He gave food to LT's enemies to try and destroy him and his family.
That is a terrible sin.

"They went over the tapes and decided that they were NOT authentic"
What part of the tape is not "authentic?" The Voice is definitely LT.
If you want to say they cut and pasted parts of his speech.... so when and to whom and why did LT say the following words:
"Darling" .... "I want to squeeze you" S--, "the Satmar Guy"
In other words... in order for a studio to cut and paste, LT had to have said these words.... words cannot be cut and pasted only sentences can .
So can you explain in what forum and to whom did LT say these words?

33

 Jan 14, 2010 at 06:25 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #27  
Anonymous Says:

1. He was NEVER videod/ recorded doing anything not befitting a frum jew.
2.He NEVER admited anything.
3.The tapes were proven to be false.
4. They were NEVER proven to be authentic. Not by a professional nor by his lowlife enemies.
5.The technology very much exits. Did you ever watch a hollywood movie? They are 100% cut and paste, plus voice impersonation. Nothing a billionaire cant get done to his worst enemy (that he has vowd revenge to) for a couple of bucks.
6. Do YOUR research.
7. Rabbi Tropper was never "entraped". The whole story is bogus.
8. His enemies don't argue with logic and after reading his enemies comments I know that they grasp at straws to destroy him so nothing they argue should surprise me.
9. His acusers are the same guys theat never liked him to begin with. Any objective person that has looked into the facts of the case and done some backround research has concluded that not only is R' Tropper innocent, he is a tzadik!
10 Many Gedolim are standing by Tropper and fighting by him tooth and nail. Enough said. Of couse there are those that hate gedolim and know better than them. To them the answer is: Did your rebbe patch you too hard when you were a kid?

What's even more amazing than the desperate twisted machinations trying to convince intelligent people that night is day is that you actually believe that there will be even one person that will buy your outright lies & shtusim. .

34

 Jan 14, 2010 at 07:48 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #26  
Anonymous Says:

If your going by what that women said. Then LT is totaly innocent.
If not... her geirus is not valid. The Beis Din that did the Geirus knows that better than anyone. They went over the tapes and decided that they were NOT authentic, thus they went forth with the geirus. Had they been authentic they wold never have done such a geirus.
Guma reliesed the tapes. The email's were traced back to him by may people.
There is noone that even claims that he didnt release them. The question was were they authentic. Which they were proven not to be.
He gave food to LT's enemies to try and destroy him and his family.
That is a terrible sin.

Get your facts straight, the women discussed the tapes in an interview. She also discussed her relationship with Trauper and how she took money from him to help her with a court case against her ex-husband.

35

 Jan 14, 2010 at 09:40 PM Black Hatter Says:

What more can be said ?
Guma is well intentioned and, as suggested, must be suffering from exhaustion and deep diappointment in a character like tropper, a charlatan and immoral faker.
Does poor souls that keep on insisting that tropper is a tzaddik, etc., must themselves be brought to mental health experts. The tapes and videos, my poor souls, leave nothing to the imagination. If you continue to believe in him you are no better than those that believed, and continue to believe, in Shabsi Tzvi, yemach shemoy vezichroy. You are a danger to Yiddishkeit. If a low life faker like tropper can be called a tzaddik of rabbi by you, then he is on the same level as Shabsi Tzvi and you are followers of Shabsi Tzvi.

36

 Jan 15, 2010 at 12:16 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #31  
Anonymous Says:

1. Yes he was. You just haven't seen them. The videos are very explicit.
2. He has never denied it either - he is not someone who is backwards at coming forward!
3. No they were not, you liar.
4. Yes they have been proven authentic by several independent audio experts. Furthermore anyone who knows him knows that it is him speaking on the recordings.
5. Clearly you live in a fantasy world. Real life is not James Bond, and not even the best technology can convincingly reproduce the type of conversations that the recordings contain.
6. The research has been done. You are in denial.
7. Your brain has been entrapped. You are a moron. As are all Tropper supporters.
8. There is no one more irrational and illogical than a Tropper supporter. Nothing you say makes sense, even to a child. What do you take us all for? Morons like you?
9. Ahh! Kill the messenger! Stupid tactic. In any case, it doesn't sound like Ms Orand was Tropper's enemy when she attended his family simchos and worked for him. So what do you reckon made her change her mind? Could it be his shameless sexual exploitation of her?
10. Where are explicit letters of support from godolim in which it says that Tropper is innocent?

1.No he wasnt. People that saw the one video and how poorly it was pasted together concluded that it was obvious proof of LT's innocence. It doent even show him in it.
2. He denied it MANY times. Just cus he didnt come to your personal blog and post a denial doesnt mean that he didnt deny it. Anyone that has spoken to him since the story broke heard him deny it.
3. Lier.
4. They were NOT authenticated by anyone but your twisted head. Furthermore, there are parts that MIGHT be his voice. Question is: from how many different conversations, over how many months? Who was he talking to. How much is really him? Is voice altering involved?
5. False statemant. For a few $ these audios could have been produced.
6. This has been researched by many people who agree that he is innocent. You hated him before, and cant see straight.
7. 8. Profound intellingence. No one expects any different.
9. No kill the sender AND messenger. The point is look at all the guys that became audio experts and happen to be "simply messengers": ALL ENEMIES FROM BEFORE. What a coincidence.
Ms.Orand never decided which one of her 4 stories shes going with. Do research on her.
10. Fact. Many gedolim are with.

37

 Jan 15, 2010 at 03:05 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #4  
The truth Says:

The real one responssible for Leib Tropper's demise was Guma Aguiar. He's the one who paid for these tapes to be fabricated in order to bring shame to his uncle Tom Kaplan through Tropper. I met Aguiar once he seemed like a nice guy, but deffinettely not all there. He also said here in Israel at one time that he was Moshiach.

Tropper is the one who brought himself down. It was his actions and azus that he could get away with it. And would he have stopped such behavior if it wasn't so public?Didi he ever admit and apologize?

I don't understand how anyone can rationalize the metzius - the rabbi was pimping out a younger woman who looked to him as a religious authority to his friends. This is not just an adulterous affair as we are used to reading about non-jewish, assimilated, and nonobservant political leaders. This was a man who walked around in the guise of the holiest of holies who claimed he had the right to determine who is a Jew and brought the shmutz on himself and his family and everyone surrounding him.

Maybe Aguiar is having a breakdown because some blame him for Tropper's downfall. Aguiar clearly only wants to do good for klall yisroel. Before you criticize, let us know how many millions have you given to tzedaka? And let us know where is the money that Tropper allegedly took but never delivered.

38

 Jan 15, 2010 at 03:42 AM you are correct Says:

Reply to #19  
Anonymous Says:

It's called Bi-Polar. I think Guma is suffering a case of manic highs, soon to be a major depression.

sounds just like bi-polar disorder. when my best friend began showing signs of it, he began saying he was the mashiach and wanted to save everybody. he also claimed to be talking to g-d. days later he plummeted into depression.

39

 Jan 15, 2010 at 08:27 AM anonymous Says:

Reply to #36  
Anonymous Says:

1.No he wasnt. People that saw the one video and how poorly it was pasted together concluded that it was obvious proof of LT's innocence. It doent even show him in it.
2. He denied it MANY times. Just cus he didnt come to your personal blog and post a denial doesnt mean that he didnt deny it. Anyone that has spoken to him since the story broke heard him deny it.
3. Lier.
4. They were NOT authenticated by anyone but your twisted head. Furthermore, there are parts that MIGHT be his voice. Question is: from how many different conversations, over how many months? Who was he talking to. How much is really him? Is voice altering involved?
5. False statemant. For a few $ these audios could have been produced.
6. This has been researched by many people who agree that he is innocent. You hated him before, and cant see straight.
7. 8. Profound intellingence. No one expects any different.
9. No kill the sender AND messenger. The point is look at all the guys that became audio experts and happen to be "simply messengers": ALL ENEMIES FROM BEFORE. What a coincidence.
Ms.Orand never decided which one of her 4 stories shes going with. Do research on her.
10. Fact. Many gedolim are with.

1. Who saw it and drew these conclusions? You? Are you an expert? What is your name? Where do you live? What are your credentials?
2. Not in his statement. Let him come out in writing denying that he had the conversation recorded with Shannon Orand. Let him back up his written statement with a letter from an independent objective audio expert(s).
3. Prove it. If they have been debunked, prove it.
4. That's right, plant seeds of doubt and you have won the argument. Well, no one is falling for it besides for a few 'friends' of LT (who were recipients of Kaplan's generosity). Oh, and a few morons who think that chareidim are always innocent even when proven guilty.
5. How do you know? Have you got price quotes from anyone? Or you just guessing after having watched a few hi-tech films and read a few conspiracy blogs.
6. Who researched it? Names, please? I have never spoken to or met LT.
7 & 8 You've proved it again. Even a flea with your brain would be retarded.
9. Of course the whole thing is a conspiracy. And there were no gas chambers in Auschwitz either. The Holocaust is a Jewish invention.
10. Yeah? Who? Where are their letters of support and praise for LT? Hmmmm.

40

 Jan 15, 2010 at 11:49 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #35  
Black Hatter Says:

What more can be said ?
Guma is well intentioned and, as suggested, must be suffering from exhaustion and deep diappointment in a character like tropper, a charlatan and immoral faker.
Does poor souls that keep on insisting that tropper is a tzaddik, etc., must themselves be brought to mental health experts. The tapes and videos, my poor souls, leave nothing to the imagination. If you continue to believe in him you are no better than those that believed, and continue to believe, in Shabsi Tzvi, yemach shemoy vezichroy. You are a danger to Yiddishkeit. If a low life faker like tropper can be called a tzaddik of rabbi by you, then he is on the same level as Shabsi Tzvi and you are followers of Shabsi Tzvi.

Beautifully put!!!!
It's a nebech that there are still lemmings that are so shallow that even confronted with
tapes & no denial etc. will still keep drinking the kool-aid.

41

 Jan 15, 2010 at 04:00 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #39  
anonymous Says:

1. Who saw it and drew these conclusions? You? Are you an expert? What is your name? Where do you live? What are your credentials?
2. Not in his statement. Let him come out in writing denying that he had the conversation recorded with Shannon Orand. Let him back up his written statement with a letter from an independent objective audio expert(s).
3. Prove it. If they have been debunked, prove it.
4. That's right, plant seeds of doubt and you have won the argument. Well, no one is falling for it besides for a few 'friends' of LT (who were recipients of Kaplan's generosity). Oh, and a few morons who think that chareidim are always innocent even when proven guilty.
5. How do you know? Have you got price quotes from anyone? Or you just guessing after having watched a few hi-tech films and read a few conspiracy blogs.
6. Who researched it? Names, please? I have never spoken to or met LT.
7 & 8 You've proved it again. Even a flea with your brain would be retarded.
9. Of course the whole thing is a conspiracy. And there were no gas chambers in Auschwitz either. The Holocaust is a Jewish invention.
10. Yeah? Who? Where are their letters of support and praise for LT? Hmmmm.

1 I saw it. hes not in it
Exactly! Im not an expert & even I and anyone else that I know that saw it says its fake. How do you know that Superman is fake? You an expert?
2. Let him do this and let him do that? Why? Cus couple of his sick enemies made up a story? So now he's your puppet?
You think you got him, he doesnt care what YOU think. Go knock yourself out. He doesnt have to answer to scum
3. a. The obvious proof is her geirus by a Bais Din. Had they thought that the tapes were real there would be no geirus. b.I heard the rest of the tape "rebetzins admission",The part they DIDNT want you to hear. c. Professionals have written that the tapes are bogus. Not everything YOU dont see doesnt exist
4. THEY WERE NOT AUTHENTICATED. Thats oceans of doubt!
ahh, I knew we had an anti semite chareidi hater. Your 3rd grade rebbe pinched your cheek too hard?
5. How do I know that superman is fake? & how do I know that someone paid to make the movie?
6. Im not giving you names. Im not crazy. I researched it. Happy?
7.&8. Eloquent
9. As I said, anti semite denying the Holocaust
Every person I know that claims its true hated him or all chareidim before
10. Read # 2. Whos against him?

42

 Jan 15, 2010 at 04:16 PM why Says:

Reply to #6  
Anonymous Says:

Tropper stepped on this guys toe a little to hard and look what he did to Tropper. GUMA is very dangerous.
I think peple owe Tropper an apology after they see who the guy who releasd all the "evidence" is.
Guma had also claime to be Mashiach.
Enough said.

Tropper is officially a frum guy. guma is not. Therefore, there is no apology needed for tropper. tropper owes us an apology for what he did.

43

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