New York – The fight for control of the Satmar Hasidic community’s Kiryas Joel cemetery must be resolved in a religious court, not a civil one, an Orange County judge has ruled.
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Acting Supreme Court Justice Victor J. Alfieri held that the matter fell squarely within the congregation’s bylaws, which require disputes between members to be decided by a rabbinical court.
“Since the Congregation’s bylaws are a secular corporate document adopted by its members pursuant to New York law, this Court finds that the Congregation and its members adopted the Rabbinical Court, i.e., the Din Torah…as the alternative dispute resolution mechanism of choice for disputes between and among members of its congregation,” Justice Alfieri held in Friedman v. CYL Cemetery, 8208-2009.
The Orange County Supreme Court decision will be published in the print edition of Monday’s Law Journal.
The judge further ordered that the panel hearing the matter consist of three specific Rabbinical Court judges who are already hearing at least two other succession-related disputes—Yitzchok Chaim Zeltrenreich, Yekusiel Zalman Graus and Mordechai Babad.
The leadership of the Satmar community has been in dispute since before the death of its longtime head, Moshe Teitelbaum, in 2006. His sons, Rabbis Aaron and Zalman Teitelbaum have fought over which son the father intended to lead the 100,000-plus member community. As noted by Justice Alfieri, the congregation is involved in 23 separate legal actions.
The two sides—often referred to as the Aaronites and the Zalmanites—have fought, both personally and through their supporters, over such issues as property, synagogues, elections and yeshivas. News reports have estimated that the disputed real estate alone is worth more than $500 million.
The suit before Justice Alfieri ostensibly involves only the Satmar cemetery, which is the final resting place of Moshe Teitelbaum. but it also constitutes an important front in the battle, both practically and psychologically, according to Andrew Fisher, an attorney for the Aaronite defendants.
“The rebbe is buried there so there’s enormous significance, both religious and economic,” said Mr. Fisher. “There’s a real honor to be buried as close to the rebbe as possible. There’s symbolism, there’s Jewish law, there’s politics, but more importantly this presents an opportunity for all of these religious disputes to have a real, proper, identifiable religious court.”
The cemetery dispute escalated following the death of a 41-year-old member of the Zalmanite faction in August 2009. Faced with Aaronite control of the cemetery and Jewish laws requiring speedy burial, the Zalmanite faction dug a grave in a nearby clearing, which they hoped to have dedicated as a new cemetery.
The Orange County Department of Planning did not return a call for comment.
Mr. Fisher, of Fisher & Fisher, called Justice Alfieri’s decision a victory for the Aaronites, who have argued that the matter, as well as all the other succession-related fights between the two factions, should be settled by the Beth Din.
David Smith of Smith Campbell represented the Zalmanite plaintiffs. He did not return a call for comment.
Now we will have the battle of which bais din to use. I hear that the conservatives want to go into the Kosher business – they might have a bais din set up at JTS that can solve the Satmar problem without going into any halacha
it takes a village……………….
what a shame that they did not know this themselves.
after all the legal expenses that we poor people have to pay………….
This judge is such a genius – “tell them to go to a bais din” – amazing. Perhaps all the others should have known this – probably they were too busy counting assets. Chillul Hashem big time.
This is a good sign. Now maybe all the Litvishe Yeshivos in Eretz Yisroel like Grodna – Ponovitch will also follow suit and stop thier Machlokes and settle up by a din torah and will go out of the Israeli Court process.
This is not only a Chassidish problem of going thru the court system thinking that justice is with them. The Litvish / Yesshivish system do the exact same. Hopefully a lesson will now be leaned that going to din torah is the right thing.
Maybe the court should also appoint a beth din, otherwise that alone is a friction between these two brothers!
Now to go to court to decide which bet din-this should take another 9 years.
Since Bet Din are impartial and dont play into politics-Money- or Power it
should be Good. (Being Sarcastic)
Oh vay the torah saying you need to go to a beth din is not enough you gotta have goish judge to say it “what a shame”
First off, I never see the two agreeing on a Beis Din ever. 2nd, were they to agree, no way will they obey. Waste of time.
The Judge GRANTED for Reb Aron’s side what they asked in a motion to not look in the case but to send it to Beth Din.
Why do we need to wait for a goy to tell us?
Shame on us, that we only listen when the Goy tells it to us.
Now they will be sitting in Bes Din forever just like in Bobov because the Rabonim don’t have the backbone or will to finish these din torahs “Satmar made Chilul Hashem by going to court- Bobov made an even bigger Chilul Hashem by going to Bes Din”
DUH!!! Isn’t that what Jews are supposed to do? So how many hundreds of thousands of dollars, not to mention incalculable agmos nefesh for Satmar (and the Rebbetzin A”H whose shiva just ended) was expended before this genius figured it out?
Why couldn’t they have done this to begin with. Power & money. Glad I don’t have either, my kids will get along just fine after I’m gone.
Baruch Hashem, the judge follows Halacha. IYH one day we all should too…
Beis din, huh, what’s that? The real reason that the two Satmar brothers won’t go to beis din is that they actually know all the rabbonim and dayonim who would be candiadtes to sit on that historical beis din. And they know that nione of these alleged unbiased judges are actually unbiased or trustworthy. So they go off to the secular courts where they felt they could get an unbiased trial. Sad commentary isn’t it?
The Rabbis can’t get the Rabbis to go before Rabbis.
Why don’t VIN/record say that this was on the request of the side from Reb Aaron??? This is a major flop for the zalonem!!!
Amazing how a secular judge needs to tell yidden to follow halacha. We should be embarrassed.
So if they go to bais din are they not complying with a secular court order
How sad a non Jew must teach them Halacha
What a shame!!! The judge has to tell us to go to Din Torah!!!
I wish that beth din the best of luck, if they ever reach a decision, which i strongly doubt, they will have to go into hiding for the rest of their lives or risk death. Ridiculous, is this about money, is it l’shem shomayim or is it about getting closer to the riboinoi shel oilom, dikduk mitzvos and chasidus. Unfortunately in my opinion chasidus has totally lost focus and the admoirim need to make a stand and revert back to what the Besht intended.
The funny part is, that secular court has to tell to go to a Bet Din. Only in Satmer people, only in Satmer
unfortunatly no bais din can handle this impartialy.they r all corrupt or afraid to take a stand.we are still waiting (indefinatly) for the Bobover psak. these cases are a “bchiya lidoiros”
chillul hashem of the day, that a ny court has to tell “heimeshe” to go to bes din.
Mi kiamcha yisroel!
thi sis a slap in the face a secular court telling the yiddin go to bias dein
B”H now we at least have a chance to get back Rodney
Who knows, perhaps this Bes Din will head towards the same “dead end” as the Bes Din whos on the Bobov case.
meby now will the aronim go to din torah
how can they solve their quarel if they have no common sense wont listen to anyone i doudt that they will ever solve their differences, even if they come up with a solution history their past behaviour shows they wont abide by it they are like perpetual children who never ever grew up theese satmerers, they love to fight its in their nature a bunch of uncivilized primitives all their torah learning is for naught all wasted
B”H, if you go to court you loose
The judge ordered that they use a beis din with Yitzchok Chaim Zeltenreich, Yekusiel Zalmaen Graus, and Mordechai Babad, or a different beis din if they can agree. What is this beis din? Is it satmar? I don’t know these rabbonim, but it could cut down on years of fighting over which beis din to use
Finely the court gave a heter to go to beth din to prevent a kidush hashem
B”H the chilun hashem is gevaldik
There is a system in place as to how to pick a beis din, each side picks one and then those two is borer a third. Problem is these chasidim will not accept no for an answer from and beis din, after all their rebe is the holyest of holy he knows better than dayonim…
look at the bobov din torah what a shame that they are in din torah for almost 6 years didn’t reach any psak I think mordcha dovid and bentzion will leave a tzvoah and the the same the dayonim wil leave a tzavoah for the children that they should keep on the din toirah I think its a big shame I believe that there is many people who don’t wanna go to din torah because of that
Woudn’t it be nice to form a Bais Din made up of Chasidish Litvish Few from every Chasidishe Chatzer (Lubavitch Satmar Bobov Belz Skver Vishnitz Lakewood Chaim Berlin Mir Tora Vadaath etc…) That we know are Yiras Shamaim and Sonai Batza and Chachamim Know Halacha. So no big dispute should have to go to Erkoos which is a tremendous chilul Hashem.
Each party appoints a dayan & the 2 dayanim appoint the 3rd dayan. It is a chilul Hashem to go to a secular court without reshus beth din.
Just on a positive not: I am not one to condone Machlokes, but look at the ositive side here. each sect opened new shulsm schools camps yeshivos colonies etc. at least there was a lot of growth. they will make up one day and you’ll have all this growth that may not happened . justa thought
All of you look up Choshen Mishpat Siman 26.
In addition to the quite explicit halocho there you will also see mareh mekoimois to many other poskim. Not one disagrees.
I commend to your special study the Rabbeinu Bachyi at the begining of Parshas Mishpotim. And that is only one of many.
there is a din in shilchon urich choshen mishpot that since you went to cort you shouldn’t go with him to din torah and I believe that since the ahronim went to cort the zalys wouldn’t go to din torah because the aronim will bring up the whole case of yatev lav and u.t.a. even the zalys can do the same in monroe but that will never finished and since the ahronim went to court they will appeal that case because I do believe that the zalys have a good case since they have won once the bais hachaim only the ahronim fool the zalis by making a false dead and signed by the monroe town. don’t forget that this rulling is from a monroe court what the zalis never win there anything because of political reasons but they have on what to hope by appealing it like the case of rosanvaser
the beis din will tell them to go back to court.
the judge is saying that thngs may remain the way they are now
they are not going to listen to a BD, or this is going to be the Salomonic BD decision
And zionism is bad??? This is the biggest form of chillul Hashem. They needed a Non Jew to tell them this? Zionism is nothing compared to this.
Here these people portray themselves as the “real Jews” and they stoop to the lowest levels of chillul Hashem, loshen horah, rechilus, machlokes, mesirah (when I reprimanded someone I know massered a another fellow Jew and got him locked uo, he said “mein rebbe geit oich in court”.
Shame on you!
When big things like this happen, it speaks quite loudly as a direct message from Hashem [through the mouth of the judge in this case]. How much more so 2 days after Tisha B’av. Until we realize that we will need to be united to have Mashiach come, we will likely be stuck here in this Galut. Option 2 always remains, where Chas Veshalom our time runs out and a major tragedy is sent by Hashem to make us come together. As someone recently said, when the bombs are falling, nobody needs yichus to get into the bomb shelter.
To anyone who knows our history, we have been repeating this saga of hatred between groups since before the Bet Hamikdash was destroyed. We brought it upon ourselves – as well as the bitter death that we lamented about just 2 days ago. We had 7 years of food storage in Yerushalayim, but it was burned down to force the dissenting group to enter battle with the Romans. Therefore we read about the people who died of utter starvation due to our own bitter in-fighting.
I hope that we realize this and somehow take even baby steps toward changing – rather than continuing our trend. On the other hand, bitter tragedy ironically brings us back together. I wish we dont need it
As the Lubavitcher Rebbe once commented, ‘Halevai it would be this easy to be poiel on the Ba’alei Bechirah.’
But seriously, this makes a good precedence for future people that try to take their cases to erkaos.
my Rav repeats, that all the tsoros, Rubashkin, Aberman, Japanese drug
Shmendrikes, hungry child etc. etc. are all the עונשfruits of the Manhigim
going to Arkoos. i.e. Didan Natsach, Bobov, Satmar and Ponevez. Imagine
that an African female judge must decide who will receive Shishi or the
עשרת הדיברות
will it end up like Bobov ? i remmber last year Nov 23rd, 2009 VIN had a article the headlines was this:
“Borough Park, NY – Bobov Dispute Heads Into Final Stage At Din Torah, Not Secular Court”
still waiting for these Final Stages…. will it take same long in satmar?
Just read the ruling, there is NOT going to be a fight who should be the bes din, the judge specificaly directed them to a specific ZABLA bes din, he named 3 rabbis, its the same bes din who is currently adjudicating a similar satmar case in boro park
Why would any beis din want to take on this broigas which is really a personal and political vendetta between two rabbonim with zealous followers who would make life miserable for the members of any beis din who ruled against their faction. They have shown themselves repeatedly as capable of violent and crude behavior against the other side.