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New York - Hikind: It's High Time That Mandatory Fingerprinting Should Be NY Law For Yeshivas

Published on: August 5, 2011 11:49 AM
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New York - A number of child-safety proposals have been floated in the wake of the murder of 8-year-old Leiby Kletzky in Brooklyn’s Boro Park neighborhood.
One proposal might stand out to New York State residents as a commonsense initiative: mandatory background checks and fingerprinting for private school employees.

The checks would not have prevented the murder of Kletzky. Accused killer Levi Aron, also a Jew from Boro Park, abducted the boy off the street in July as the child walked home from a neighborhood summer camp. But advocates contend that such regulation would codify one lesson of the murder: that Orthodox communities can no longer place blind trust in their own.

“The point that we bring to the table is that we Jews can’t do it ourselves,” said Elliot Pasik, president of the Jewish Board of Advocates for Children. “We can’t self-govern. We can’t police ourselves. We need laws for child safety.” Pasik’s most recent call (reported first on VIN News) for legislation, — which he sent to six New York State senators and Assembly members.

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NY Assemblyman Hikind, said it is high time that the mandatory fingerprint law, which he plans to sponsor again next year, is passed. The Kletzky murder, he suspects, might even propel the community of Boro Park and the broader Hasidic leadership to back him this time.

“I think now, with everything that has gone on, there is greater recognition that more has to be done,” Hikind said. “It’s about priming. It should have been done years ago. A lot of things should have been done years ago.”

Rabbi David Zwiebel, executive vice president of the Orthodox umbrella organization Agudath Israel of America, for his part, said that Agudath Israel is going to take a wait-and-see approach. “I am pretty sure we will not oppose it and we will discuss internally as to whether we will affirmatively encourage it,” he said.

Article edited but Read full story at The Forward 


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2

 Aug 05, 2011 at 12:54 PM shoebox Says:

Finaly a proposal that would actualy do some good
Another law should be stiff jail time for anybody who harms a child. Case in point. The guy in staten island that put his son into a hot oven received today 4 MONTHS in prison that's a joke another five minutes in the oven the kid would be dead @ we would have another child murder
Minimum for harming a child should be at least 5-8 years. And maybe maybe some of these crazy people would think twice before harming children

3

 Aug 05, 2011 at 12:47 PM Babishka Says:

Did anyone read the comments on this article at "The Forward"? The anti-Semitism there is as bad as anything you see on Yahoo or HuffPost.

4

 Aug 05, 2011 at 12:24 PM Anonymous Says:

While the "advocates" are willing to mortgage their homes for the passage of such a bill, as if it would be the safety miracle for our children, they are guilty of missing the forest for the trees. The crimes we are most concerned about are those that do not leave fingerprints. If a yeshiva were to hire someone with a criminal background, where fingerprints made a difference, it would shed virtually no light on the risk to the personal safety of the yeshiva child. I personally have no problem with making fingerprinting mandatory for private schools, and I would support the bill. But the true inroads into keeping our children safe will be achieved by teaching safety skills and prevention, the keeping of a fully utilized database, and criminal background checking. In hiring for a yeshiva, one must know a lot about the applicant's background. Just as for a shidduch, one must obtain reliable information, and one must inquire about many areas of background before accepting to employ for a yeshiva. To hire someone for their yichus is grossly irresponsible.

I would be more pleased to see progress in so many other aspects of improving child safety. Helmets on bikes, anyone?

6

 Aug 05, 2011 at 12:37 PM Stetson Says:

Levi Aron would not have been caught with this. Why is he using Leiby's blood to promote his agenda?

7

 Aug 05, 2011 at 01:30 PM Thinking cap Says:

Hilchos yichud came about after Tamar, the daughter of Dovid HaMelech, was raped by her half-brother. She was moser nefesh, and publicly called out to the rabbis for justice. We need to do the same. Preventive laws are the best medicine.

We have a mitzvah of makeh, to build a guardrail on the flat roof of our homes. The child protection laws being proposed, just like yichud, are the makeh. They will stop the crimes from happening.

8

 Aug 05, 2011 at 01:33 PM Anonymous Says:

I propose a training school school for rabbi's before they get a job in a yeshiva. You get training on how to deal with children in a classroom setting. You get a full background check and screening. And from here you can get outsourced or hired. Just cause some person got smicha, has a beard, and wears a hat means absolutely nothing.

There are some terrible rabbeim out there and its our job to get them out and protect our kids from letting them get in.

9

 Aug 05, 2011 at 01:44 PM Dan l'kaf z'chus Says:

Reply to #6  
Stetson Says:

Levi Aron would not have been caught with this. Why is he using Leiby's blood to promote his agenda?

The Forward article says that the advocates have been trying to pass these laws for a decade - before Leiby was born.

10

 Aug 05, 2011 at 01:44 PM Facts1 Says:

Lets just have a GPS planted into everybody so Government can track our movement, for our safety of course.

They should also have access to all our phone calls, bank transactions and all the rest, all in the name of a greater good and safety. While at that, they should monitor our shopping habits confirm to bloombarian theology.

Its scary that a politician I highly admire should think along these lines.

11

 Aug 05, 2011 at 01:55 PM mikeetg Says:

How would fingerprinting teachers help with child abuse?

And If you want the teachers to be even lower quality continue this way. Demonized, mistreated, underpaid. And then you will wonder why the teachers are rock bottom quality. Because anyone with a brain will get a different job.

12

 Aug 05, 2011 at 02:02 PM festayid Says:

Reply to #2  
shoebox Says:

Finaly a proposal that would actualy do some good
Another law should be stiff jail time for anybody who harms a child. Case in point. The guy in staten island that put his son into a hot oven received today 4 MONTHS in prison that's a joke another five minutes in the oven the kid would be dead @ we would have another child murder
Minimum for harming a child should be at least 5-8 years. And maybe maybe some of these crazy people would think twice before harming children

5-8 yrs r u kidding, a person who harms a child should be locked up for 25 to life. To abuse a child,somebody who cannot protect themselves, should be a capitol offense dealt with the utmost severity

13

 Aug 05, 2011 at 02:14 PM eigner Says:

This whole idea is just plain non sense. Finger printing will only identify a person with a criminal record. Our biggest concern are the guys without the records.
Let's not forget "Levi Aron had NO record"...

14

 Aug 05, 2011 at 02:38 PM unbelvbl Says:

Let me echo #6: This would not have prevented this terrible crime. It will also not prevent molesting because these molesters usually don't have a criminal background.

15

 Aug 05, 2011 at 02:39 PM esther Says:

please,this is not a conspiracy to erode civil liberties! only those who work with children need to be fingerprinted according to this proposed legislation and it's a shanda ,especially for the agudah,that it's been fought till now.

16

 Aug 05, 2011 at 02:40 PM shredreadyI Says:

as good Jews we should protect children yes it is a good idea even it comes from secular people sometimes they are smarter than you.
Yes if you want to work with children what it problem to cross check if you have been listed as an abuser

without this one can go from yeshiva to yeshiva and abuse as they do now.

One problem this will be useless unless people report

that is the real issue that people are not willing to do.

If no one reports there is no record.

17

 Aug 05, 2011 at 02:43 PM esther Says:

Reply to #4  
Anonymous Says:

While the "advocates" are willing to mortgage their homes for the passage of such a bill, as if it would be the safety miracle for our children, they are guilty of missing the forest for the trees. The crimes we are most concerned about are those that do not leave fingerprints. If a yeshiva were to hire someone with a criminal background, where fingerprints made a difference, it would shed virtually no light on the risk to the personal safety of the yeshiva child. I personally have no problem with making fingerprinting mandatory for private schools, and I would support the bill. But the true inroads into keeping our children safe will be achieved by teaching safety skills and prevention, the keeping of a fully utilized database, and criminal background checking. In hiring for a yeshiva, one must know a lot about the applicant's background. Just as for a shidduch, one must obtain reliable information, and one must inquire about many areas of background before accepting to employ for a yeshiva. To hire someone for their yichus is grossly irresponsible.

I would be more pleased to see progress in so many other aspects of improving child safety. Helmets on bikes, anyone?

a data base and criminal backround checks would be wonderful but will only work if all yeshivas will actually take legal action against molesters in their midst.

18

 Aug 05, 2011 at 02:49 PM G-Bro Says:

I'm all for this...but what good is it if we continue to protect abusers and not permit law enforcement or secular agencies to intervene. If the perps are never to the point of getting fingerprinted, then what good is this?...If shomrim has a list of perps that they beleive may be doing harm, as long as they simply stay on that list and nothing further, then what good is this law...they will never get to the point of being fingerprinted and as such can be hired by schools without any hesitation. That is the issue which needs to be dealt with.

19

 Aug 05, 2011 at 02:52 PM MazelKGH Says:

And yet, you live in Brooklyn anyway. Strange.

20

 Aug 05, 2011 at 03:08 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #4  
Anonymous Says:

While the "advocates" are willing to mortgage their homes for the passage of such a bill, as if it would be the safety miracle for our children, they are guilty of missing the forest for the trees. The crimes we are most concerned about are those that do not leave fingerprints. If a yeshiva were to hire someone with a criminal background, where fingerprints made a difference, it would shed virtually no light on the risk to the personal safety of the yeshiva child. I personally have no problem with making fingerprinting mandatory for private schools, and I would support the bill. But the true inroads into keeping our children safe will be achieved by teaching safety skills and prevention, the keeping of a fully utilized database, and criminal background checking. In hiring for a yeshiva, one must know a lot about the applicant's background. Just as for a shidduch, one must obtain reliable information, and one must inquire about many areas of background before accepting to employ for a yeshiva. To hire someone for their yichus is grossly irresponsible.

I would be more pleased to see progress in so many other aspects of improving child safety. Helmets on bikes, anyone?

It's amazing the passive aggressive views of people on this fingerprinting requirement. I WONDER why people are so afraid to have their fingerprints taken. What are you hiding?

21

 Aug 05, 2011 at 03:21 PM GB_Jew Says:

The Criminal Records Bureau (CRB) helps employers in England and Wales make safer recruitment decisions. A number of roles, especially those involving children or vulnerable adults, are entitled to a criminal record check.

CRB's aim is to help protect children and vulnerable adults by providing a first-class service to support organisations recruiting people into positions of trust.

A Criminal Records Bureau (CRB) check provides details of an individual's criminal record and, for certain jobs, information held by the Independent Safeguarding Authority to help you recruit suitable staff. When the CRB check is complete, the potential employer receives a CRB certificate.

Armed with information on an applicant's criminal past - or lack thereof) an employer may make an informed choice as to an applicant's suitability for working with children, young people, or other vulnerable sectors of the population.

CRB in England and Wales has been successfully performing this service for more than twenty years, so its not beyond the abilities of NYS authorities to do something similar.

Now I await the onslaught of the American "civil liberties" nay-sayers and the so-called defenders!

22

 Aug 05, 2011 at 03:26 PM KAHANAwasRIGHT Says:

If You're so affraid of having your prints on file, then YOU are exactly the one who should not be a reebi in a yeshiva

23

 Aug 05, 2011 at 03:36 PM Frum School Says:

these people obviously don't know much about frum schools, or for that matter much about private schools. Private schools are always trying to get every type of grant they can get their hands on, many of which require background-checks and/or fingerprints. So this is already being done in most frum schools and yeshivahs.

24

 Aug 05, 2011 at 03:47 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #14  
unbelvbl Says:

Let me echo #6: This would not have prevented this terrible crime. It will also not prevent molesting because these molesters usually don't have a criminal background.

But it will stop a molester from one city/area from moving to another and saying "I am a rabbi, give me a job teaching kids" - his fingerprints will be on file.

25

 Aug 05, 2011 at 03:50 PM Elliot Pasik Says:

There are 30,000 registered sex offenders in NYS alone, and 700,000 nationally. There are also thousands more convicted violent offenders, even murderers, who have completed their sentences, or are on parole or probation. Some of them are sick people, who want to work near children.

In NY, and 41 other states, all public schools are required to fingerprint their employees. Twelve states, but not NY, require their private schools to fingerprint - including some states with large frum populations, such as, Maryland, Illinois, Michigan, Calif. If you have relatives who teach in yeshivas there, ask them if they've been fingerprinted, and they should say, yes.

We also asked the NYS Educ. Dept. for the number of public school job applicants who have been rejected for employment over the past 10 years, based on their criminal histories. The number is 1,623 - and that doesn't include New York City. That number also doesn't include people who, when told of the fingerprint requirement, decided not to apply, well knowing they would be rejected.

So if these and other dangerous people want a job, especially near children, where will they apply? Yeshivas, unless we too have a law.

26

 Aug 05, 2011 at 04:04 PM Elliot Pasik Says:

Our letter of July 22, 2011, to leading state legislators called attention to NYS Education Law Section 803-a. This is the exact text: "All pupils in grades K-8 in all public schools in the state shall receive instruction designed to prevent abduction of children." This law needs to be speedily amended. State law should require that children in all schools, both public and nonpublic, receive instruction designed to prevent their abduction. Every summer, not only in Borough Park, but other neighborhoods also, there are dangerous predators who want to inflict harm on children. Sensible, age appropriate classroom instruction can help stop this.

27

 Aug 05, 2011 at 04:09 PM Yes you are Says:

Fingerprinting is in the future, all you people who are against it better prepare your fingers.

28

 Aug 05, 2011 at 04:34 PM Dentist fingerprinted Says:

Amazing all this talk about innocent till proven guilty. freedom etc.
In order to get my license in NYS to practice Dentistry I had to get fingerprinted. The choice was there; no fingerprints but no license. I do not think they are fingerprinting everybody just those that will do a specific job. Yhe choice remains, no fingerprints, no job.
These laws apply for many positions in health care and caring for elderly.
Yes, it is true this would not have helped in this case.
YES, there should be training courses for Rebbeim of young kids so we would have Rebbeim that are somewhat able to understand to separate their personal stresses for heir job and personality. There should be an ethical code that one Org can advise another of a proposed Rebbe that might not be fit.

29

 Aug 05, 2011 at 04:39 PM Auschwitz second generation Says:

An Idiot said;
I am glad we defeated the forces of evil in 1945 and again in 1989. Always another battle to fight I guess. ”
I feel it is sick and obnoxious to mix the Shoah into this. I am a child of Auschwitz survivors, I understand some of what they went through. Slipping your stupid comment that equates WW2 with this fingerprint issue is beyond the pale. In NY many responsible jobs and careers require fingerprinting.

30

 Aug 05, 2011 at 04:43 PM Butterfly Says:

I agree completely and it is about time. My kid used to complain about rabbis breaking his pencils and trying to hit in class. Even the best rabbi needs lessons!!

31

 Aug 05, 2011 at 04:50 PM Leon Zacharowicz Says:

Reply to #3  
Babishka Says:

Did anyone read the comments on this article at "The Forward"? The anti-Semitism there is as bad as anything you see on Yahoo or HuffPost.

Why not post your views there, to counter what is written?

32

 Aug 05, 2011 at 04:51 PM SandraM Says:

There is a serious concern on how teachers are treated. They are not prison guards.

Besides, Levi Aron had no record, and most molesters do not. Furthermore, it seems more and more likely that Levi Aron is a simply a class-A meshugeneh and not a molester.

It would be far more helpful if every school had an open policy on molestation, spoke openly to the kids about it IN FRONT OF THEIR TEACHERS. The biggest danger with molestation is the secrecy around it, which allows it to continue unchecked.

Hikind means well, but I think he is off-base here.

33

 Aug 05, 2011 at 05:01 PM Leon Zacharowicz MD Says:

Reply to #4  
Anonymous Says:

While the "advocates" are willing to mortgage their homes for the passage of such a bill, as if it would be the safety miracle for our children, they are guilty of missing the forest for the trees. The crimes we are most concerned about are those that do not leave fingerprints. If a yeshiva were to hire someone with a criminal background, where fingerprints made a difference, it would shed virtually no light on the risk to the personal safety of the yeshiva child. I personally have no problem with making fingerprinting mandatory for private schools, and I would support the bill. But the true inroads into keeping our children safe will be achieved by teaching safety skills and prevention, the keeping of a fully utilized database, and criminal background checking. In hiring for a yeshiva, one must know a lot about the applicant's background. Just as for a shidduch, one must obtain reliable information, and one must inquire about many areas of background before accepting to employ for a yeshiva. To hire someone for their yichus is grossly irresponsible.

I would be more pleased to see progress in so many other aspects of improving child safety. Helmets on bikes, anyone?

Almost singlehandedly, Elliot Pasik got the law changed, in New York State, to allow non-public schools to do criminal background checks on employees and prospective employees. (It was actually illegal for such schools to do so, prior to his efforts to change this archaic law.)

He then contacted numerous schools in our community, and organizations. Of nearly 20,000 private schools in New York State, guess how many actually do such checks? About 20.

I had to have my fingerprints taken and to undergo a criminal background check before renewing my medical license in New Jersey. (Any doctor, dentist, psychologist, etc must undergo such checks, even if they never have anything to do with children.) and to teach a course at HALB of the Five Towns (kudos to them).

It took a few minutes, and cost a few bucks.

If it saves one child from harm, it's worth it.

There are individuals who have criminal records, including those who pose a danger to our children, who slip through the hugh cracks in our community and become employees of our schools. If the schools won't by themselves require such testing, the government will. This is only happening because of the negligence of our leadership

34

 Aug 05, 2011 at 05:19 PM esther Says:

Reply to #11  
mikeetg Says:

How would fingerprinting teachers help with child abuse?

And If you want the teachers to be even lower quality continue this way. Demonized, mistreated, underpaid. And then you will wonder why the teachers are rock bottom quality. Because anyone with a brain will get a different job.

wow,teachers are rock bottom quality! that's an amazingly prejudiced statement so who's doing the demonizing and mistreating? most of the teachers i know teach out of love and dedication..here in california all teachers and child care workers get finger printed.i don't know of anyone who minds.it's just an aspect of a job that is very important and that requiers tremendous responsibility.

35

 Aug 05, 2011 at 05:27 PM eigner Says:

This whole idea is just plain non sense. Finger printing will only identify a person with a criminal record. Our biggest concern are the guys without the records.
Let's not forget "Levi Aron had NO record"...

36

 Aug 05, 2011 at 06:56 PM Chaya KP Says:

The Rosh Yeshiva should get fingerprinted first, and the others will follow. Somebody needs to be Nachshon ben Aminodov.

37

 Aug 05, 2011 at 07:18 PM Anonymous Says:

This is a disgrace. It would be the ultimate insult for any rav who has received semicha to undergo the humiliation of having to be fingerprinted. There is also a question of whether it is even mutar for women teachers to have to undergo this identificaiton process although there are fewer reported cases of abuse and molestation involving women teachers.

38

 Aug 05, 2011 at 07:34 PM Wake up!!!!! Says:

Reply to #6  
Stetson Says:

Levi Aron would not have been caught with this. Why is he using Leiby's blood to promote his agenda?

There are pedophiles hiding in our yeshivas!! Why do you think that Agudah has to think about it. Wouldn't you think that it would be a no-brainer to to automtically support fingerprinting of our yeshiva staff? It's not about whether Levy Aron was a school employee, but about waking our community from its naive slumber.

39

 Aug 05, 2011 at 09:31 PM esther Says:

Reply to #37  
Anonymous Says:

This is a disgrace. It would be the ultimate insult for any rav who has received semicha to undergo the humiliation of having to be fingerprinted. There is also a question of whether it is even mutar for women teachers to have to undergo this identificaiton process although there are fewer reported cases of abuse and molestation involving women teachers.

isn't it a far,far greater disgrace that individuals with smicha have been convicted of child molestation? and what question is there re women being IDed?

40

 Aug 05, 2011 at 09:34 PM esther Says:

Reply to #38  
Wake up!!!!! Says:

There are pedophiles hiding in our yeshivas!! Why do you think that Agudah has to think about it. Wouldn't you think that it would be a no-brainer to to automtically support fingerprinting of our yeshiva staff? It's not about whether Levy Aron was a school employee, but about waking our community from its naive slumber.

omg,i share your frustration! the safety of our children has got to come before some narishe sense of kavod.

41

 Aug 06, 2011 at 10:15 PM Be alert Says:

Levi Aron, in 2010, at 34 years-old, received a summons, in NYC, for public urination, to which he pled guilty. While not a crime, that is either an "offense" or "violation", depending upon the section of the law he was charged under. If someone with that type of record in his background applied for a job in a yeshiva, it would do us well to, first, know about it, and then, make a reasoned decision on whether to offer him the job.

In addition, there is one media report that in 1996, he was arrested for Driving Under the Influence of alcohol. It was dismissed.

42

 Aug 07, 2011 at 02:21 AM Leslie Says:

I really don't understand how this will help, though some child molesters in the community were teachers the majority had nothing to do with it, they were just regular people who would use a bathroom in Shul or the mikve to molest children, so how in the world would this help? And what does Leiby Kletzky have to do with this? Had Levi Aron even tried applying for a job at any school he would've been pushed out the door right away.
This wont make any changes. just make the community distrust the politicians even more.
I really don't understand Dov Hikind!!!

43

 Aug 07, 2011 at 10:55 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #42  
Leslie Says:

I really don't understand how this will help, though some child molesters in the community were teachers the majority had nothing to do with it, they were just regular people who would use a bathroom in Shul or the mikve to molest children, so how in the world would this help? And what does Leiby Kletzky have to do with this? Had Levi Aron even tried applying for a job at any school he would've been pushed out the door right away.
This wont make any changes. just make the community distrust the politicians even more.
I really don't understand Dov Hikind!!!

The hardest thing to understand is the attack by those who consider themselves advocates for victims of abuse. They have exploited a horrendous crime perpetrated on an innocent child for further their agenda of assaulting the establishment, as if there was someone to blame. Shame on them a million times. This tragic event brought out the worst in so many, from the creep who publicly claimed that this murderer was a pedophile that was being protected by rabbonim, to the frivolous blame of gedolei Yisroel. You are more than accurate that there is much that fingerprinting will not prevent. Many who molest stay under the radar for years. Many do not get reported or caught, mostly because of personal resistance, not the conspiracy attributed to Agudah or rabbonim. Hikind is right in expecting that private schools comply with the minimum standards of safety found in public schools. I was fingerprinted three times with either hiring or job application. Big deal. Bill is worth passing, but don't expect to catch a bunch of criminals.

44

 Aug 07, 2011 at 12:38 PM I feel the 9 days Says:

43 and others: Inevitably, whenever abuse is debated, a few accuse the advocates of bad manners. They attack the gedolim, they exploit the victims, and so on. This particular group of advocates, identified in the article, is trying real hard to do things the right way. They have their own rabbinic committee. They are all frum professionals. They have consulted with rabbis, often quietly, across the spectrum of klal Yisroel.

45

 Aug 07, 2011 at 01:57 PM esther Says:

Reply to #43  
Anonymous Says:

The hardest thing to understand is the attack by those who consider themselves advocates for victims of abuse. They have exploited a horrendous crime perpetrated on an innocent child for further their agenda of assaulting the establishment, as if there was someone to blame. Shame on them a million times. This tragic event brought out the worst in so many, from the creep who publicly claimed that this murderer was a pedophile that was being protected by rabbonim, to the frivolous blame of gedolei Yisroel. You are more than accurate that there is much that fingerprinting will not prevent. Many who molest stay under the radar for years. Many do not get reported or caught, mostly because of personal resistance, not the conspiracy attributed to Agudah or rabbonim. Hikind is right in expecting that private schools comply with the minimum standards of safety found in public schools. I was fingerprinted three times with either hiring or job application. Big deal. Bill is worth passing, but don't expect to catch a bunch of criminals.

i'm sorry but you don't what your talkng about.it's not only about catching molesters,it's about keeping them away from children,something fingerprinting would obviously do if the molester has a record.#2,there has absolutely been a conspiracy of sorts by rabonim to keep any knowlege of molestations from the public.this has included silencing victims by various means and sending molesters to different locations.

46

 Aug 07, 2011 at 02:25 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #45  
esther Says:

i'm sorry but you don't what your talkng about.it's not only about catching molesters,it's about keeping them away from children,something fingerprinting would obviously do if the molester has a record.#2,there has absolutely been a conspiracy of sorts by rabonim to keep any knowlege of molestations from the public.this has included silencing victims by various means and sending molesters to different locations.

There are many past ills, bad mistakes. That is not the situation today. But the "advocates" have been as rabid in the past few weeks when we have had reports going on. They are just as bad or worse in 2011 when the Brooklyn DA office is brimming over with reported cases. They lie about programs who are promoting reporting as doing the opposite. They accuse rabbonim of harboring and protecting Levi Aron when he has no Rov, and no one knew about him. They throw dirt at Shomrim that does a spectacular job, and DOES NOT block cases from the authorities.

Yes, protecting is a thing of the past. yes, there were witnesses that were intimidated to not testify against molesters. Yes, there was coercion to drop charges or not report. This was in the past, and is not the case today. There is unquestioned evidence to support that.

I favor fingerprinting for all. There is much left to accomplish in improving safety for our children. I won't delude myself that this bill will accomplish that. I would wish you could face facts and truth, instead of the hate and rage voiced by the advocates.

47

 Aug 07, 2011 at 07:35 PM rebbis wife says Says:

I am happy to see so many people raising their opinion. Being the wife of a long time rebbi I would like to say my opinion.

First of all I dought that any well meaning rebbi would oppose fingerprinting.

Second I can't believe what I see how poeple talk so low about today's Rebbis. Who is working to bring up our next generation if not for our devoted rebbis?

Before you talk like that on your own childs rebbi take a minute to think. How much time & Koach does he put into my kids? Do you ever think abit deaper? How about the rebbi finally comes home to his family & he can't sit calmly with his kids cause parents keep calling & he MUST be available all the time?

How about your son's rebbi probably didn't get paid already 5 MONTHS? Did anybody raise their opinion about that? Do you care about that? Or only screwing up what you can find negative? Pls start respecting your kids rebbis that are so devoted & work almost LESHEM SHAMAYIM cause they never know when their next pay check will come......................(& they have to come home every day telling their wife sorry no money for any shopping this season....) pls give credit where it is due..... THANX

48

 Aug 07, 2011 at 09:57 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #47  
rebbis wife says Says:

I am happy to see so many people raising their opinion. Being the wife of a long time rebbi I would like to say my opinion.

First of all I dought that any well meaning rebbi would oppose fingerprinting.

Second I can't believe what I see how poeple talk so low about today's Rebbis. Who is working to bring up our next generation if not for our devoted rebbis?

Before you talk like that on your own childs rebbi take a minute to think. How much time & Koach does he put into my kids? Do you ever think abit deaper? How about the rebbi finally comes home to his family & he can't sit calmly with his kids cause parents keep calling & he MUST be available all the time?

How about your son's rebbi probably didn't get paid already 5 MONTHS? Did anybody raise their opinion about that? Do you care about that? Or only screwing up what you can find negative? Pls start respecting your kids rebbis that are so devoted & work almost LESHEM SHAMAYIM cause they never know when their next pay check will come......................(& they have to come home every day telling their wife sorry no money for any shopping this season....) pls give credit where it is due..... THANX

Rebbi's wife: This discussion is not about the dedicated rebbe. It is about those whose dedication is not real. It is about those applying for a position as a rebbe who are not qualified. It is about other school personnel, not just teachers or rebbeim. There is no intent to demean the excellent work that many do, nor to disrespect the extra burden that today's rebbe carries in doing his job diligently. It is frightening that the rebbe is the last member of the community to receive wages for completed work, almost unheard of in any other career, and low wages at that.

Working with children requires special talent and training. Some yeshivos have fallen short on assurance their hires were qualified, in every way. There is heightened sensitivity here, since one bad apple can ruin the lives of so many. I recognize that you have no problem with fingerprinting, and that is noble and rational. I agree completely. It won't help much, but it is okay. I am upset about the fingerPOINTING. You are correct in noting that this is grossly unfair.

We are all indebted to rebbeim like your husband, and to wives like you who support them in their avodas hakodesh.

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 Aug 07, 2011 at 10:39 PM Rebbi's Wife Says Says:

Reply to #48  
Anonymous Says:

Rebbi's wife: This discussion is not about the dedicated rebbe. It is about those whose dedication is not real. It is about those applying for a position as a rebbe who are not qualified. It is about other school personnel, not just teachers or rebbeim. There is no intent to demean the excellent work that many do, nor to disrespect the extra burden that today's rebbe carries in doing his job diligently. It is frightening that the rebbe is the last member of the community to receive wages for completed work, almost unheard of in any other career, and low wages at that.

Working with children requires special talent and training. Some yeshivos have fallen short on assurance their hires were qualified, in every way. There is heightened sensitivity here, since one bad apple can ruin the lives of so many. I recognize that you have no problem with fingerprinting, and that is noble and rational. I agree completely. It won't help much, but it is okay. I am upset about the fingerPOINTING. You are correct in noting that this is grossly unfair.

We are all indebted to rebbeim like your husband, and to wives like you who support them in their avodas hakodesh.

Thank You for your CHIZUK. It meant alot

Unfortunately it is very important today to hear a good word too, when you gotta live with what you have without knowing from where rent will be paid (when your husband IS working).

How about people starting to put their foot down when paying tuition that that money go to their kids rebbi that works soooooo hard & not only the janiter gets paid.

My husband's Yeshiva Administrator said "First we gotta pay the janitor cause he will quit if not. & paying for supplies cause they can't do without." What about the Rebbis who work sooooo hard & gotta support a family?

I hope people will start raising their voices & be loyal to their kids Rebbis.

THANX.

P.S. Sorry if I was too strong but I am talking with a broken heart.....

50

 Aug 08, 2011 at 09:05 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #46  
Anonymous Says:

There are many past ills, bad mistakes. That is not the situation today. But the "advocates" have been as rabid in the past few weeks when we have had reports going on. They are just as bad or worse in 2011 when the Brooklyn DA office is brimming over with reported cases. They lie about programs who are promoting reporting as doing the opposite. They accuse rabbonim of harboring and protecting Levi Aron when he has no Rov, and no one knew about him. They throw dirt at Shomrim that does a spectacular job, and DOES NOT block cases from the authorities.

Yes, protecting is a thing of the past. yes, there were witnesses that were intimidated to not testify against molesters. Yes, there was coercion to drop charges or not report. This was in the past, and is not the case today. There is unquestioned evidence to support that.

I favor fingerprinting for all. There is much left to accomplish in improving safety for our children. I won't delude myself that this bill will accomplish that. I would wish you could face facts and truth, instead of the hate and rage voiced by the advocates.

You're lumping all of the "advocates" together. The group that is promoting legislation have done none of the things you claim.

51

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