Jerusalem – Four students were expelled from the Tiferet Israel yeshiva in Jerusalem after it became known that they had obtained driver’s licenses in violation of the yeshiva’s rules.
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The decision triggered a heated debate among the ultra-Orthodox public surrounding the question of the legitimacy of owning a license.
After learning that some of their students might have taken driving lessons, the yeshiva heads conducted a thorough investigation and even contacted the Transportation Ministry on the matter.
“Anyone can call the Transportation Ministry, give an ID number and inquire whether that person owns a driver’s license,” one of the students explained.
Following the inquiry, the yeshiva heads convened to discuss the “problematic phenomenon” and eventually decided to immediately expel any student who is in possession of a license.
The rabbis told the students that they could be readmitted once they have their license revoked.
However, one of the expelled students was later readmitted after the rabbis found out that he got the license to help his crippled father.
Most ultra-Orthodox rabbis oppose the notion of a haredi person getting a license. “It’s inappropriate for a person who defines himself learned in the Torah to have a driver’s license,” a prominent rabbi told the yeshiva director when the latter came to consult him on the issue.
The rabbis were right in expelling the students. Getting a driver license is a first step in getting a job and supporting your family. God Forbid it can lead to an exodus in the yeshiva.
Ribono shel Olam, what are these yeshiva heads thinking?
“It’s inappropriate for a person who defines himself learned in the Torah to have a driver’s license,”
granted, but how about the fact that it is inappropiate to kick young boys on to the street for such a silly matter. I’m sure that will help them so much, they will immediately do Teshuva and rip their licenses. Yeah, right.
Throwing a boy out of School today is spiritual murder, why can’t these Rabbis get it?
can they take a taxi instead?
Sheer ultra-frum craziness. Do they hate the “Zionist” government that much? Or is this more aimed at reinforcing the notion that these students can never go get a real job, because you can’t work somewhere if you can’t get there. Would the rabbis prefer they get wherever they have to do go by riding on a donkey, just like in the time of the Torah? Or by having to pathetically schor rides off strangers?
Hopefully this will reduce teenage drivnig accidents, I wish all yeshivas would ban bucherim from driving!
I wonder what his punishment would have been for eating treif.
Excuse me; their punishment for eating treif. What happened if they looked at girls (from a distance)?
Who runs this yeshiva? The Taliban?
The Amish finally made their entrance into yidishkeit. What’s next no electricity?
i dont think this is correct. While its not ok for a buchir in a chasidisha yeshiva to obtain a drivers licence. it is 100 percent accepted for a marreid yingerman to have DL in the chasidisha world
Driver’s Education! This is outrageous behavior indeed, they should be put in jail.
One has to wonder what the punishment would have been if it had been “sex education” This would obviously have been a much graver offense…….we can’t have our youth learning such things as how to recognize and avoid predators and pedophiles now can we? That would throw a monkey wrench into the whole system. We must maintain ignorance at all cost. “Ignorance uber alles”
Ok so it now more beneficial for them to drive to the tel aviv beach front instead of learning in yeshiva with a licence !! Great decision by the yeshiva !!? Very very sad priority problems – when we say in shmona esrei “ hashiva shofteynu kevorishona” we should have more kavona – Please send moshiach soon
Pushing a child away from learning Torah is disgusting. I feel these Rabbis who clearly want money and not to teach kids properly. Btw nowhere in the torah does it talk about driving. chassidim hhave big issues. they love adding to the torah!
most ppl comenting here never learned in a chasidisha yeshiva so mind your own business every yeshiva has their rules which yeshivas with lower standard rules would laugh at
Honestly, if the yeshiva had a rule that states that you cannot have a driver’s license and you broke the rule, you should be punished, no matter how stupid that rule is.
you’re missing it
no one is against a married person getting a drivers license,
this has nothing to do w/ zionism
isreal loses more lives to car accidents than to terrorists
young bochur + aggressivnes + car = speeding disaster
the yeshiva offered the bochurim to give up the license & they are back in
& allowed a bochur with special circumstances to keep his license
& last point if youre in that “type ” of school follow the rules
I’ve never attended a chassidesheh yshiva so I cannot commnet on the wisdom (or lack thereof) behind this rule.
However, rules are rules and if one disagrees with the rules one is free to leave the yeshiva. Rules are meant to be followed even if one disagrees with their purpose of effect. That is why they are called rules and are not called suggestions.
What is this world coming to? Why would they ban drivers Licenses? Maybe if they would focus on being Mechanech the Bocherim instead of worrying about ,if they are getting Drivers Lisences ,Less kids would be going of the derech.
I ASK YOU PLEASE EXPLAIN HOW THIS IS DAAS TORAH???????
I was in the same position as these boys plus I had permission from my father nonetheless I got kicked out and embarrased publibly this is not what a yid, forget about a chasidisha yid is supposed to act like. They can’t get their act straight they focus on stupid issues and forget about the priorities like torah and “derech eretz”. They have no manners!!!!!!!!!!!
When I was in yeshiva,I cycled everywhere as did others,and I still do,the main advantages over driving being far cheaper,free,easy parking,and excellent excercise,which many yeshiva students get precious little of.cars are so last century!GET ON YOUR BIKES!
why in the world need a bucir DL? I think 90 percent yshivs douing the same think, let thw bucir go work
There was once a Rabbi that did not want his students to get a license. The students asked “How will we be able to do community service and outreach without it “The Rabbi answered “Don’t blame your Tayvos on community service”. Another answer “You can’t control yourself how will you control a car “
“Sheer ultra-frum craziness. Do they hate the “Zionist” government that much? Or is this more aimed at reinforcing the notion that these students can never go get a real job,..”
OY-VEY, SHALLOW THINKING REARS ITS HEAD AGAIN.–
First of all, why does everyone accept a story from the secular, Yeshiva-hating, drive-by media at face value? The “facts” in the story are just plain wrong (and I suspect that the Hareidi-hating journalist who wrote the story knows it.)
No one objects to Hareidim having a driver’s license to earn a living. The problem is when Yeshiva boys, who are supposed to be devoted to learning in an atmosphere of Kedusha start driving.
We’re talking about Yeshiva Tiferes Yisroel, the very Hasidic Rizhiner Yeshiva.The Yeshiva receives donor’s funding for boys to concentrate solely on learning Torah. Experience has shown that once they get a driving license, they start hiring cars, taking time off from learning for joy trips to the north, and generally are not doing what they are supposed to be doing.
It does not matter if one should have a license or not. The Yeshiva has a rule. They broke the rule. If the Yeshiva would allow them to remain, others would be tempted to break that – and other – rules.
Please note that they made an exception for a bochur who needed to drive to help his father.
I don’t necessarily have a problem with a school setting down rules and asking the students to adhere to them. What I do find a bit odd, however, is the punishment and its relation to the crime. Expulsion from the yeshiva for possessing a driver’s license sounds a lot like using bazookas to kill roaches — while it’ll get the job done, it’ll also do far more damage than good.
The Wolf
The rules are the rules! If you don’t like it, don’t enroll there!
I personally have already warned my teenage son, no driving until you are 18.(Because of my own beliefs) I don’t think young people need to be driving…it’s scray!
“Throwing a boy out of School today is spiritual murder, why can’t these Rabbis get it?”
WRONG. They weren’t thown out. They were simply suspended until they revoked their licences. The Yeshiva is simply maintaining discipline, which is their obligation to the parents who send their kids there to learn and to the boys themselves who want to succeed in their studies.
when a bucher makes himself drivers dl he makes a statement lerning is not my piorety. so the yeshiva tald him go out and get yourself a job
“Most ultra-Orthodox rabbis oppose the notion of a haredi person getting a license. “It’s inappropriate for a person who defines himself learned in the Torah to have a driver’s license,” a prominent rabbi told the yeshiva director when the latter came to consult him on the issue.”
Can someone out there explain this to me? This doesn’t sound right…I am assuming only bochurim are not alowed to get driver’s license???!
every time I visit this site I learn something else that jews are not allowed to do…. is there anything that the jews are allowed that will make their lives more bearable to live?? I thought the torah says that everyone has choices and the free will to make these choices…. it seems as if these rights are taken away if you are chassidic or litvish, yeshivish, whatever…… why don’t thesepeople have the right to decide whats best for them, whether it’s going to college, going to work, driving, movies, concerts, or staying in yeshiva and learning all day?? can someone please clarify this???
every bochur practically has a cell phone nowadays . which is way worse then a car, especially if if it is internet enabled .
1.The solution would be let them keep there licence,and use it after they received smyche.
2.Change yeshives there is plenty to choose from!
i bet this rosh yeshiva himself was thrown out of scholl or chayder at some time in his life .
People need to adhere to the rules and regulations set forth by the school they attend. If they cannot adhere to the rules of the school they dont have to go there. This is not a case of farfrumtness or anything of the like. The school has rules. Rules need to be kept. You dont like the rules because in your pithy little mind you think they dont apply to you, either speak to the hanhola and maybe they will work something out because you have special circumstances or GO SOMEPLACE ELSE!
Let’s take talking to members of the opposite sex as an example. There are rules set up by HKBH & Chazal which are enforced (sometimes not too good) by the schools. If a kid is caught fratinizing with members of the opposite sex, the kid could be asked to leave. This is NOT “sheer ultra-frum craziness.” These are the rules.
If the school is a “rehab” school and they are taking mandatory on the spot urine testing. The kids know the rules about what happens if you flunk a urine test. If they dont like it, they could LEAVE AND GO SOMEPLACE ELSE!
The same is with a job. Certain jobs have stricter rules than others. If you cannot adhere to these stricter rules, go work elsewhere. Its that simple!
I think it’s a very good thing to ban dl’s until the boy is married or twenty and older. Once married, you hope he has a little more responsibility, and the impulsiveness that leads to speeding which causes accidents would be greatly avoided. And this is from a safety perspective, not a halacha perspective.
was anyone ever kicked out of yeshiva for learning how to ride a horse in olden times?
Thanks to the Rabbis behind this: 4 new shababniks!
Do they also have a rule against smoking?
when i went to yeshiva, the yeshiva had driver’s ed . look how far we came.
I believe that riding scooters, bicycles and motorcycles are the same as filling out a death certificate with the date left blank. Speed is only one factor in accidents, the lack of protection and speed of the cars involved can cause death.
Of course. Wait till the bochur is older, married and gets caught driving without a license. That is the Torah way to these people.
Why cant the have a drivers license but have rukles about when/where they can drive/
Everyone has to remember that this is in eretz yisroel, where for the most part people take buses. there are few reasons that a bachur in yerushalayim would need a license.
PLEASE ALL UNDERSTAND…THERE ARE SCHOOLS YASHIVE COLLEGES UNIVERSITY THEY HAVE THER RULES..YOU KEEP IT- YOURE ARE IN ..YOU DONT -YOURE OUT.PLEASE UNDERSTAND IF YOU KEEP THE ROTTEN APPLES IN, THE GOOD ONEN– THEY ALL GET ROTTEN. WE HAVE ENOUGH CORRUPTION IN THE GOVERMENT IN SCHOOLS AND IN FAMILY. ENOUGH ENOUGH ENOUGH..GO WITH THE RULLES NO TOLARENCE..IF YOU HAVE KIDS IN SCHOOL YOULE UNDERSTAND…
Anonymous,
Please stop using ALL CAPS. It makes your comments harder to read and doesn’t make them any more valid.
The Wolf
Ok so it now more beneficial for them to drive to the tel aviv beach front instead of learning in yeshiva with a licence !! Great decision by the yeshiva !!? Very very sad priority problems – when we say in shmona esrei “ hashiva shofteynu kevorishona” we should have more kavona – Please send moshiach soon
All out-of-town rabbis drive. It is a way of life in most non-New York cities. If this is the attitude the Haredim are going to take, then it should be ASSUR FOR THEM TO ASK A FRUM PERSON WITH A DRIVER’S LICENSE TO DRIVE THEM AROUND! PERIOD. IF THEY NEED A CHAUFFER, LET THEM GET A GOY. I am so sick of the double standard of people that refuse to drive themselves around because they think there is something wrong with it, yet it’s ‘okay’ for them to use another frum jew who happens to have a drivers license.
No society can survive if it were to allow every person the freedom to choose which rules they follow and which they ignore.
The current crises in the Jewish philinthropic world is exactly where this attitude leads.
The rule MIGHT be unreasonable but the ehrlicher way of dealing with it is to leave the yeshiva, not to ignore the rules.
i agre they broke the rules, but c’mon these rabbanim are looking dumber and dumber every day. My brother was thrown out of school ad put on probation witch was horrible because he went out to lunch. imagine a bochur thrown into the crazy world out there and treated like a crminal because he went ut to eat lunch.
reb moishe said u cant throw a kid out of yeshiva unless he RUINING other children, and this doesnt count!!!
It’s all about control, Power corrupts and… Yes a yeshiva is entitled to have its rules as well BUT wake up and smell the roses…