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Brooklyn, NY - Hikind Decries Leaving Children Unattended Outside Stores While Shopping

Published on: February 14, 2012 09:33 AM
By: VIN News Staff
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in this undated photo Two infants left unattended outside a restaurant on 13th Ave in Brooklyn, NYin this undated photo Two infants left unattended outside a restaurant on 13th Ave in Brooklyn, NY

Brooklyn, NY - Assemblyman Dov Hikind (D-Brooklyn) was shocked when he recently encountered not one, but two unattended children – one infant and one toddler – crying in their strollers while parked outside different stores on 13th Avenue in Boro Park. Both children were observed crying and by themselves for more than ten minutes. It is a phenomenon Hikind says he sees all too often in Boro Park.

“This issue has been going on for years in Boro Park,” Hikind said. “Time and again, I have pleaded with parents, telling them that leaving their children alone in their strollers while they shop or dine in local stores and restaurants is incredibly dangerous. Would you leave your purse unattended? Of course not! So, why do so many people leave their most precious asset of all – their children – unattended? It makes absolutely no sense to me. We must protect our children.”

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Hikind said that his concerns are reflected by many in the community who have complained to him that something needs to be done. “Constituents and I discuss all the time that the possibility for a real tragedy exists any time children are left alone. Our community already suffered a tremendous tragedy last July. I cannot bear the thought that something similar could God forbid occur again because people are being reckless with their children’s lives and safety.”

Hikind is urging parents to exercise better judgment and to use common sense before deciding to leave their children unattended.



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1

 Feb 14, 2012 at 09:54 AM Trolly_McTrollerston Says:

its already a felony: child endangerment punishable up to a year in prison in NY State- we just need SOMEONE to enforce the law!
Make an example, (and please, no pidyon shvuyim asifas for the example) and I'm sure these irresponsible actions will come to a screeching halt!

2

 Feb 14, 2012 at 09:53 AM Anonymous Says:

Actually, all the laws on this already exist. This is clear parental neglect. If this were to end up before a judge, there would be basis to restrict that parent's rights to the child. Now, let's picture a scene. Someone foolishly does this, and a passerby watches the child cry for 15 minutes, and points this out to a cop patrolling the block (a clearly responsible thing to do). This becomes a case for ACS, and the parents get dragged through that system (a curse on anyone, let alone for a frum Yid). The poor passerby will be ostracized everywhere, shul, schools, etc. as a moseir. Dov is quite accurate when expressing a public plea to be more careful in this area. The alternative would be to enforce the obvious, and that would label and punish the wrong people (as goes on in many other areas of our community).

3

 Feb 14, 2012 at 09:52 AM Anonymous Says:

I agree even though there is no place in the store take your kid inside and leave the stroller outside. This has been going on in Williamsburg and Boro Park for years. Would you leave your pocket book outside? Your child is worth more!!!!!

4

 Feb 14, 2012 at 09:51 AM Concerned Parent Says:

why arent' these parents reported to the Rebbeim & ACS? this is true child endangerment! Haven't we learned anything from what happened last year??? Another thing I see all the time in BP is a 6 yr old taking their 4 yr old by the hand shopping for their mother BY THEMSELVES!!!! If this were to happen anywhere else in NY -in goyishe neighborhoods - the police would be called for child abandonment. Several years ago, a couple from Sweden were visiting NY & left their baby outside of a restaurant in a carrige while they ate by the window watching the baby. The couple were arrested & the child was taken away by ACS & it took a few weeks for everything to get cleared up (it was a cultural issue-this is what is done in Sweden).

5

 Feb 14, 2012 at 09:44 AM Arrest the parents Says:

Dov, we ought to have a law (and you have the ability to make this happen) that would result in these parents being arrested for leaving their kids unattended. Such behavior is unexcusable, and maybe the threat of spending time behind bars will knock some sense into these parents and help protect these helpless children.

I'm usually pretty libertarian (not Ron Paul-esque, but generally pro-small government), but if these parents won't protect their children then who will?

6

 Feb 14, 2012 at 09:41 AM Anonymous Says:

How about addressing the issue when strollers are pussed into traffic infront of adults. .......

7

 Feb 14, 2012 at 09:39 AM cynic Says:

Someone (hello, Mr. Hikind) should take a good and hard look at how NOT dangerous this practice is. Fear mongering is good for headlines, but let's not lose perspective.
Just as one example, more children, FAR more children, are injured and killed getting hit by motor vehicles. So where's Dov's call for banning all traffic in Brooklyn?

8

 Feb 14, 2012 at 09:55 AM VeyIzMir Says:

As much as I understand parents for doing this, it still is inexcusable.

Protect out young!

Parents, as much as you NEED to shop, children NEED to be watched!

Thank you Dov Hikind for your fine work!

9

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:01 AM blahblah Says:

I was recently shopping in BP with my baby, and when I went into the store with my stroller, I was told to leave it outside. I wasn't about to do that, so I left. The lady, understandably upset about losing a sale came running after me- "What's the big deal, everyone does it, we're all yidden, it's fine" etc. Have we learned nothing from Leiby, z'l? I am not taking chances with my child- better to go through the trouble of coming back later when I can go without the baby than do anything to risk his safety!

10

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:03 AM Liepa Says:

Reply to #7  
cynic Says:

Someone (hello, Mr. Hikind) should take a good and hard look at how NOT dangerous this practice is. Fear mongering is good for headlines, but let's not lose perspective.
Just as one example, more children, FAR more children, are injured and killed getting hit by motor vehicles. So where's Dov's call for banning all traffic in Brooklyn?

They're both bad. Two wrongs don't make it right.

11

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:18 AM qazxc Says:

Reply to #7  
cynic Says:

Someone (hello, Mr. Hikind) should take a good and hard look at how NOT dangerous this practice is. Fear mongering is good for headlines, but let's not lose perspective.
Just as one example, more children, FAR more children, are injured and killed getting hit by motor vehicles. So where's Dov's call for banning all traffic in Brooklyn?

Typical. An osaik betzorchai tzibur be'emunah tries to help the kehilla and protect our children and some jerk throws cold water on the idea.

12

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:21 AM awacs Says:

Reply to #4  
Concerned Parent Says:

why arent' these parents reported to the Rebbeim & ACS? this is true child endangerment! Haven't we learned anything from what happened last year??? Another thing I see all the time in BP is a 6 yr old taking their 4 yr old by the hand shopping for their mother BY THEMSELVES!!!! If this were to happen anywhere else in NY -in goyishe neighborhoods - the police would be called for child abandonment. Several years ago, a couple from Sweden were visiting NY & left their baby outside of a restaurant in a carrige while they ate by the window watching the baby. The couple were arrested & the child was taken away by ACS & it took a few weeks for everything to get cleared up (it was a cultural issue-this is what is done in Sweden).

SO, when Swedes do it, it's a 'cultural issue?'
But when BP Jews do it, it's child abandonment?

Am I the only one who's bothered by the double standard?

14

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:25 AM jewish-person Says:

Reply to #3  
Anonymous Says:

I agree even though there is no place in the store take your kid inside and leave the stroller outside. This has been going on in Williamsburg and Boro Park for years. Would you leave your pocket book outside? Your child is worth more!!!!!

EXACTLY. i have always used this argument. they wouldn't leave their purses outside but their babies they would? STUPID. my solution? ladies, get some baby-slings, holders, etc., and shop while comfortably and SAFELY holding your babies. you don't need to be unsafe just because you need groceries.

15

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:26 AM Ina Says:

The Leiby Kletsky tragedy should have been enough for each parent to rethink what he/she is doing when leaving their children unattended. Perhaps what is needed is some sort of media or poster campaign to build further awareness about the dangers lurking in each and every community. Mr. Hikind, perhaps you might wish to get behind such an endeavor.

16

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:33 AM Mayer Says:

Dear Cynic

The fact is that leaving a baby alone and unattended in the street is dangerous. Because, bechassdei shomayim, there have not been more cases of kidnapping, doesn't mean the parents or carers who leave their kids alone are not endangering them.

I heard that everyone who breathes dies, so lets ban breathing as well, after we clear Boro Park of traffic. Making fun of a serious issue doesn't make you into a cynic; it makes you into a fool.

17

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:36 AM ShatzMatz Says:

That photo was taken at the bagel shop on 13th Avenue. If you look closely you will see the mother standing in the doorway watching the stroller. Obviously in a society that is bustling with strollers you are going to see interesting sights, but the fact is that the mothers in this community have developed certain coping techniques. While they might look strange to the outsider, they seem to have served the community well for half a century.

BTW, many popular stores employ guards to watch carriages in front of their stores. So you might see 10 strollers with only one adult in front of a store. To the outsider it might look like there are 9 unattended strollers, but in reality they are all being supervised.

18

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:53 AM genmill Says:

Reply to #7  
cynic Says:

Someone (hello, Mr. Hikind) should take a good and hard look at how NOT dangerous this practice is. Fear mongering is good for headlines, but let's not lose perspective.
Just as one example, more children, FAR more children, are injured and killed getting hit by motor vehicles. So where's Dov's call for banning all traffic in Brooklyn?

Your argument is so flawed. More kids get killed by cars then guns so why do we have gun control, let's just have traffic control!
Genious. Are you really trying to say you think it is ok to leave a infant unattended in a stroller outside while you shop???
Hope someone protects your kids from you.

19

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:53 AM IMHOpinion Says:

This is a very common occurrence and is party the fault of storeowners who do not allow strollers into their stores.

It's terrible.

I once walked not a store and announced loudly- who's baby is outside ALONE? The mother nodded her head and look at me like I'm this crazy woman. Shes all pity on me! Yeah, terrible, I was bothering her shopping.

20

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:54 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #2  
Anonymous Says:

Actually, all the laws on this already exist. This is clear parental neglect. If this were to end up before a judge, there would be basis to restrict that parent's rights to the child. Now, let's picture a scene. Someone foolishly does this, and a passerby watches the child cry for 15 minutes, and points this out to a cop patrolling the block (a clearly responsible thing to do). This becomes a case for ACS, and the parents get dragged through that system (a curse on anyone, let alone for a frum Yid). The poor passerby will be ostracized everywhere, shul, schools, etc. as a moseir. Dov is quite accurate when expressing a public plea to be more careful in this area. The alternative would be to enforce the obvious, and that would label and punish the wrong people (as goes on in many other areas of our community).

It would be a big mitzvah to be a moser in these circumstances and call the police if you see a case of ongoing child neglect/abuse in front of your eyes. Any rav who would have the chutzpah to condemn someone making such a police report himself should be ostracized by the tzibur. How much more insanity in the name of daas torah are we willing to subscribe to.

21

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:28 AM Brains over Brawn Says:

Reply to #7  
cynic Says:

Someone (hello, Mr. Hikind) should take a good and hard look at how NOT dangerous this practice is. Fear mongering is good for headlines, but let's not lose perspective.
Just as one example, more children, FAR more children, are injured and killed getting hit by motor vehicles. So where's Dov's call for banning all traffic in Brooklyn?

Banning all traffic makes no logical sense. All commerce will screech to a halt. You saw the uproar about bike lanes. Imagine if there were whole areas without cars. What about those who are physically impaired? the elderly? They can't walk long distances- you want to back to the horse-drawn buggy and watch people getting kicked by horses, stepping in their excrement... no thank you!
This is NOT fear-mongering. After last summer, I would have thought parents would leave their empty strollers outside and carry their children inside! Would you leave your baby where anyone could snatch it? What about leaving them outside in Manhattan? As we learned, just because it is in a frum area, does not make it safe. Frum people can be sick in the head too...

22

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:15 AM Yossi Says:

Mr. Dov...Most stores on 13th avenue do NOT allow carriages in their store...Mothers need to do their shopping and there is no other way to get this done..
13th avenue has become the Banking center of America where most retail space is taken by those banks forcing the bigger stores to close down and all we are left is the small stores that can not accomidate carriages..Its time BP woke up and boycott some of thos ebanks and drive them away to other areas and lets bring retail back to 13th avenue...The landlords became very greedy and are looking for the big bucks the financial insutry brings them...And the interesting part who is paying the Banks rent.? We taxpayers had to bail them out so they can open more branches in retail territory....

23

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:31 AM ilovehashem Says:

nothing new Mr Hikings I have seen this kind of thing leaving baby carrages with babies in carrage outside of stores in boropark for years and always was angry at the mothers for abandening thier child like this , I also blame many of the stores who do not alow carrages in the store but I as a mother always made sure if the store will not alow me to bring in the carraige i will not step into the store . Many tmes when I saw babies left alone outside of a store I felt like taking the carriege and hiding just to see the reaction of the mother when she steps out and cannot find her baby and then to tell her, look what can happen but I didnt have the caurage to do so. I think if a child is left in a carrage outside a store alone the mother should be ticketed for abandoning and puting her child in danger. I dont think she would leave her purse outside alone!!

24

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:32 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #22  
Yossi Says:

Mr. Dov...Most stores on 13th avenue do NOT allow carriages in their store...Mothers need to do their shopping and there is no other way to get this done..
13th avenue has become the Banking center of America where most retail space is taken by those banks forcing the bigger stores to close down and all we are left is the small stores that can not accomidate carriages..Its time BP woke up and boycott some of thos ebanks and drive them away to other areas and lets bring retail back to 13th avenue...The landlords became very greedy and are looking for the big bucks the financial insutry brings them...And the interesting part who is paying the Banks rent.? We taxpayers had to bail them out so they can open more branches in retail territory....

Are you crazy yossi?? I would'nt leave a dog tied up alone outside a store and you are saying these sick mothers "have no choice" because the the small heimeshe stores don't allow carriages inside??? And then you blame it on the banks who are legally allowed to rent space where they feel the customers are. It is simply child abuse to leave a baby or young child alone for even a minute for ANY reason. If you can't take the child inside the store than DON'T go shopping with the child. Send your husband, have the food delivered or get a baby sitter. If you really want another tragedy like the one we experienced last year with pedophiles who can grab our yinglach if they are out of sight for even a minute, please leave your children alone, but don't you dare suggest others emulate your stupidity.

25

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:32 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #22  
Yossi Says:

Mr. Dov...Most stores on 13th avenue do NOT allow carriages in their store...Mothers need to do their shopping and there is no other way to get this done..
13th avenue has become the Banking center of America where most retail space is taken by those banks forcing the bigger stores to close down and all we are left is the small stores that can not accomidate carriages..Its time BP woke up and boycott some of thos ebanks and drive them away to other areas and lets bring retail back to 13th avenue...The landlords became very greedy and are looking for the big bucks the financial insutry brings them...And the interesting part who is paying the Banks rent.? We taxpayers had to bail them out so they can open more branches in retail territory....

These neglectful mothers deserve to have their children taken away from them. and then they should be forced to attend an A Time meeting where they'll hear all the childless couples' desperation and how THEY would treat their baby if only they were lucky enough to have one. Shame on these disgraceful, ungrateful "mothers."

26

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:35 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #19  
IMHOpinion Says:

This is a very common occurrence and is party the fault of storeowners who do not allow strollers into their stores.

It's terrible.

I once walked not a store and announced loudly- who's baby is outside ALONE? The mother nodded her head and look at me like I'm this crazy woman. Shes all pity on me! Yeah, terrible, I was bothering her shopping.

Why didin't you call the police on this crazy woman rather than debating with her the issue of leaving a child alone? Its a no-brainer. Call the police immediately. If a few of these parents are charged with child-neglect and lose rights to their children, maybe these people will learn. Why should a storeowner allow carriages inside anyway when there is no room in the aisles. Don't shop with young children unless your going to Pomegrante or some other store with wide aisles.

27

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:35 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #8  
VeyIzMir Says:

As much as I understand parents for doing this, it still is inexcusable.

Protect out young!

Parents, as much as you NEED to shop, children NEED to be watched!

Thank you Dov Hikind for your fine work!

how can you understand these mothers there is no good exuse to leave your baby alone outside a store anyone can kidnap the baby very easily, will it take a tragedy to teach these stupid mothers a lesson.

28

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:38 AM genmill Says:

I don't get it. If my local grocer didn't allow strollers inside my solution would not be to abandon my child outside. I would either carry the child or find another store.
Why is ditching your kid a solution? If you can't find a babysitter for you and your wife to get out do you just solve that prob by leaving your kids outside the theatre or restauront or wtvr??

29

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:39 AM IMHOpinion Says:

Yossi- MOST stores on 13?

I shop on 13 every day and always take my stroller inside. Only very few stores have that dumb policy, so I don't shop there, or I leave stroller outside and hold my baby in my arms.


And those "guards" they hire to watch 10 babies outside, are even more unsafe and I'd never do it. If somebody snatches a baby, what will that helpless guard do? Abandon the other 9 babies and run after the guy?

Mothers need to learn priorities and realize that kids are more important than clothing shopping, and fancy Mishloach Manos theme shopping.

30

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:40 AM qazxc Says:

Reply to #12  
awacs Says:

SO, when Swedes do it, it's a 'cultural issue?'
But when BP Jews do it, it's child abandonment?

Am I the only one who's bothered by the double standard?

No, it was a crime when the Sweedish couple did it and they were arrested, as well they should have been, and they had to fight to get back their child, as was also as it should have been.

These mothers prove Rabbi Tendler wrong. They are obviously alive and well without any brain function.

31

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:40 AM UseYourHead Says:

There are only two possible explanations for a parent doing such a thing: 1) The parent - consciously or subconsciously - does not want the child, or 2) The parent is mentally ill.

Either way, the existing laws need to be enforced.

32

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:41 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #12  
awacs Says:

SO, when Swedes do it, it's a 'cultural issue?'
But when BP Jews do it, it's child abandonment?

Am I the only one who's bothered by the double standard?

if swedes do it or not it is still wrong what is the problem with these boropark mothers do they think that thier kids are untouchable why do they think it is ok to leave thier babies outside a store unsupervised while they are shopping for a robe where is thier motherly sense never mind kidnappers pedophiles crazy lunies out there what if your baby is crying do you exept a strainger to put a pacifior in the babies mouth!!!

33

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:43 AM 5towns Says:

Reply to #22  
Yossi Says:

Mr. Dov...Most stores on 13th avenue do NOT allow carriages in their store...Mothers need to do their shopping and there is no other way to get this done..
13th avenue has become the Banking center of America where most retail space is taken by those banks forcing the bigger stores to close down and all we are left is the small stores that can not accomidate carriages..Its time BP woke up and boycott some of thos ebanks and drive them away to other areas and lets bring retail back to 13th avenue...The landlords became very greedy and are looking for the big bucks the financial insutry brings them...And the interesting part who is paying the Banks rent.? We taxpayers had to bail them out so they can open more branches in retail territory....

"there is no other way to get this done"
What? When my kids were little and I shopped in BP I refused to leave them outside. The solution is called an infant carrier or sling. I have been sorely tempted many times to scare a mother by waltzing off with her child just to show her how easy it would be. This is not a cultural thing, it is craziness and has to stop. I just hope it stops before some tragedy wakes everyone up.

34

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:46 AM ModernLakewoodGuy Says:

Oh my lord, there is only ONE way to solve this. CALL THE POLICE ON THESE PARENTS. Have them arrested and charged. It is the ONLY way this problem will go away. Begging the parents, making announcements, hanging up flyers will not get through the thick head of these parents. After all, shopping on 13th avenue is WAY more important than the safety of these innocent infants and toddlers. Truth is, its not like a frum person in BP would kidnap and chop up a jewish child right? Oh wait..

35

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:47 AM I Understand Says:

Unfortunately this is the world we live in today. Back in the fifties when I was a child it was absolutely safe and commonplace to leave your baby in a carriage outside a store. Today it is dangerous, but, these mothers have grown up in insulated neighborhoods where it was safe to leave babies outside stores in strollers, so they don't think it is wrong. It really shouldn't be wrong, it is just that we live in such terrible times.

36

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:51 AM whywhy Says:

I actually was walking down a quit block, when i passed a baby carriage outside a basement store.(door closed). I went in and asked whos baby is outside a woman ans. i said i will be watching your baby while you finish up so please hurry babysitting was not on my list of things to do today. She ans. me with chazal (which i wasn't formula with) i asked what does that mean,"it means hashem watches over fools and children, so i shouldn't worry!!!!! i said oh boy now am even more worried fool!! and yes i was standing by door open while talking to her, and stayed till she came out. i have her kids in my tefilos everyday.

and about stores not letting a carriage in? whats the issue is ur STUFF your getting so much more important then your child.!!! (who you are most probably shopping for). if the store didn't allow diamonds in for a fear of pulling or tearing the clothing would you leave them outside?!!!!

37

 Feb 14, 2012 at 12:07 PM Black-hatter Says:

CALL THE COPS on these people if they abandon their child. Go inside the store and say "Who's child is this? I saw some odd people lurking around. Protect your children". Watch the mothers run outside for their baby. If one mother doesn't-- call the cops. No excuses for child abandonment.

If the store is too small to shop with a carriage:
a) use a carrier/sling
b) don't bring the child
c) find a different store where there is enough room for the carriage.

38

 Feb 14, 2012 at 12:08 PM shredready Says:

I find this shocking i know many dog owners who would not leave their dogs outside while they shop.

They leave it at home. I know that is not an option with a child. But some just do their shopping with a friend one goes in the store the other stays outside. Why cannot this be done with children, just go with a friend.

Also in Manhattan many parents have baby carries (good if you have only one little one who cannot walk) that one wears and the baby is either in front or back why don't we see that in the frum world. Just take it along in the stroller and wear it when you go in a store.

A few weeks ago I saw this little boy just sitting on a stoop, I was going to knock on the door but a saw a frum woman a few feet away and assumed it was the mother (my mistake i should have asked). But when i came back another frum lady was holding the boy, she was frantic she found him wondering down the block and asked me if i know who this kid was. Since I saw where the boy was sitting we knocked on the door. The father did not even now that the kid left, and amazingly did not thank the woman or me.

39

 Feb 14, 2012 at 12:14 PM shredready Says:

Reply to #26  
Anonymous Says:

Why didin't you call the police on this crazy woman rather than debating with her the issue of leaving a child alone? Its a no-brainer. Call the police immediately. If a few of these parents are charged with child-neglect and lose rights to their children, maybe these people will learn. Why should a storeowner allow carriages inside anyway when there is no room in the aisles. Don't shop with young children unless your going to Pomegrante or some other store with wide aisles.

because that person knows very well the consequences of such an action.

that person would be condemned and people will rally around the mother

that is realty sadly

40

 Feb 14, 2012 at 12:15 PM shredready Says:

Reply to #29  
IMHOpinion Says:

Yossi- MOST stores on 13?

I shop on 13 every day and always take my stroller inside. Only very few stores have that dumb policy, so I don't shop there, or I leave stroller outside and hold my baby in my arms.


And those "guards" they hire to watch 10 babies outside, are even more unsafe and I'd never do it. If somebody snatches a baby, what will that helpless guard do? Abandon the other 9 babies and run after the guy?

Mothers need to learn priorities and realize that kids are more important than clothing shopping, and fancy Mishloach Manos theme shopping.

I shop on 13 every day and always take my stroller inside. Only very few stores have that dumb policy, so I don't shop there, or I leave stroller outside and hold my baby in my arms.

simple solution to a simple problem

money talkes if many mothers would simply refuse to shop at the stores that have that policy, the policy will change

41

 Feb 14, 2012 at 12:17 PM Anonymous Says:

No one has yet explained why these mothers in BP feel compelled to shop when they know that doing so will entail leaving their babies unattended? Are they that addicted to shopping they can't help themselves? If so, Hikind should sponsor a program to help these sick mothers rid themselves of such a compulsion. If they are are temporarily abandoning their children intentionally, the way someone might tie up a stray dog, than as many others here have noted, they should have their children removed from their control pending investigation by child welfare services.

42

 Feb 14, 2012 at 12:33 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #17  
ShatzMatz Says:

That photo was taken at the bagel shop on 13th Avenue. If you look closely you will see the mother standing in the doorway watching the stroller. Obviously in a society that is bustling with strollers you are going to see interesting sights, but the fact is that the mothers in this community have developed certain coping techniques. While they might look strange to the outsider, they seem to have served the community well for half a century.

BTW, many popular stores employ guards to watch carriages in front of their stores. So you might see 10 strollers with only one adult in front of a store. To the outsider it might look like there are 9 unattended strollers, but in reality they are all being supervised.

Its not always true.

43

 Feb 14, 2012 at 12:40 PM post4 Says:

Whoever Leaves a child outside of a store alone is CRAZY. That's it end of story. If something willחס ושלום happen, nothing would be a good reason.

44

 Feb 14, 2012 at 12:47 PM boroparkbabbi Says:

When I had younger children and had to do shopping, I always went out with a friend and she would watch my child when I went into a store to shop and I would do the same for her. We had each other for company and we were able to shop without any anxiety. and keep our children safe. It is a great buddy system for friends to do.

Many years ago, I experienced a mother leaving her newborn child outside of Lane's Pharmacy. She took her purse with her but left her baby unattended. When she returned her baby's face had been scratched up by a deranged women passerby and her baby was schreeching. She yelled for the police and yelled " Who did this to my baby?" She was attacked by all the people standing outside calling her an unfit mother. She fled the scene with her baby before the police arrived. I don't think that she ever left her baby unattended again.

THERE IS NEVER AN EXCUSE TO LEAVE A CHILD UNATTENDED, WHETHER IT IS OUTSIDE OF A STORE, AT HOME ON SHABBOS WHEN PARENTS TAKE A NAP, OR ARE CHATTING ON THE PHONE. THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT WOULD GIVE THEIR EYE TEETH TO HAVE CHILDREN.

TAKE CARE OF YOUR MOST PRECIOUS POSSESSIONS, YOUR CHILDREN!!!

45

 Feb 14, 2012 at 01:53 PM Anonymous Says:

It is painful reality that many stores cannot allow strollers in their stores. Aisles are not wide enough. Merchandise is displayed in ways that many children can reach out, grab things, with risk to the merchandise and often possible risk to the child. Owners might be great people, but disallowing baby carriages might be all they can do. If mothers must take their children shopping, they CANNOT take their children to such stores. Even older children without carriages are often times a royal pain to other customers. How many large stores can have an aisle blocked with a wagon plus a baby carriage, leaving no way for another customer to shop? Parents need to calculate all these things, not just their own personal convenience. It is a feature of our generation that we do what we want without caring for others (sometimes even our own children). No excuse for this.

64

 Feb 14, 2012 at 02:14 PM Anonymous Says:

I was once in Williamsburg saw a carriage with a baby outside in the cold. I went up the stairs & said 'who's baby is outside alone? There's a policeman on the block' u should've seen how fast that woman ran out! Totally irresponsible! & this wasn't on the main st. It was a side st. Mothers should realize kids are a gift from heaven! Please protect them they are worth more than diamonds!

65

 Feb 14, 2012 at 02:17 PM Anonymous Says:

Think how dangerous this can be. Shredready has said that he lives in the Boropark Area. Knowing that how can you leave your kids unwatched on the street. Who knows what he might do with his dog, or what his dog might do when he is not busy with shredready.

66

 Feb 14, 2012 at 02:23 PM Butterfly Says:

I used to get yelled at for bringing my child shopping by the store owner!! They would make me take out the child and leave the stroller art the entrance!! Other stores would not allow me to even park my stroller so no shopping!! We went top where we were welcome!! In large stores, I took a shopping cart and wheeling both the stroller and the shopping cart, but always kept the stroller with me!! I never left the stroller outside!! If somebody wants your business they will find a way to cooperate with you otherwise, go elsewhere!!

67

 Feb 14, 2012 at 02:44 PM sandymoos Says:

Reply to #12  
awacs Says:

SO, when Swedes do it, it's a 'cultural issue?'
But when BP Jews do it, it's child abandonment?

Am I the only one who's bothered by the double standard?

The Swedes were arrested and their child was taken away. Where is the double standard?

68

 Feb 14, 2012 at 03:28 PM shredready Says:

Reply to #65  
Anonymous Says:

Think how dangerous this can be. Shredready has said that he lives in the Boropark Area. Knowing that how can you leave your kids unwatched on the street. Who knows what he might do with his dog, or what his dog might do when he is not busy with shredready.

funny you should mention that, they play with my dog yes the chassidsha kids play with them even the very young ones.

and yes the parent know that some bring their child since they say their kids like dogs

69

 Feb 14, 2012 at 04:18 PM DemsBeBabies Says:

Reply to #22  
Yossi Says:

Mr. Dov...Most stores on 13th avenue do NOT allow carriages in their store...Mothers need to do their shopping and there is no other way to get this done..
13th avenue has become the Banking center of America where most retail space is taken by those banks forcing the bigger stores to close down and all we are left is the small stores that can not accomidate carriages..Its time BP woke up and boycott some of thos ebanks and drive them away to other areas and lets bring retail back to 13th avenue...The landlords became very greedy and are looking for the big bucks the financial insutry brings them...And the interesting part who is paying the Banks rent.? We taxpayers had to bail them out so they can open more branches in retail territory....

Yossi, I take it that you associate yourself with Occupy Wall Street , or do not understand free markets due to a lack in education.
Having banks in a community is one of the best things that can happen. It means that banks see the area as viable for their business. I'm not sure what you think banks do, but they aren't boogie men, they are in the business of taking capital and increasing it for their shareholders. This happens mostly by lending money to local businesses. Now in ghettos it's hard to find banks bec there is no reason to open them, as there is no business for them to invest in. They clearly see our communities as areas ripe for small/medium size businesses (bank managers usually get bonuses on the amount of money lent vs paid back on time and opening checking accounts for businesses).
Now the logic that you use as to only small stores being left open, it makes no sense. If the store was viable, then it would still be there. If it was just a rent issue, it would MOVE. The fact that small stores do not let in carriages are somehow a banks fault makes no sense at all!
As for bailouts, SOme of these banks came after, & others like chase, never took any.

70

 Feb 14, 2012 at 05:08 PM Anonymous, Too Says:

It takes only a second for someone to run away with a baby carriage or stroller.

Absolutely NEVER leave a baby carriage or stroller unattended, whether outside a store; or even inside a supermarket, where I've seen carriages and strollers left unattended in one aisle, while the parent was getting something in a completely different aisle.

71

 Feb 14, 2012 at 05:15 PM newtransplant Says:

Many years ago a baby was left outside a store on Manchester's shopping block, A passing goyte actually walked off with the pram, Boruch Hashem the mother came out in time and gave chase. This is a REAL danger. Most shops here have now redesigned their shops so that buggies and prams canbe brought inside the shop. In the ones that can't babies are taken out oftheir buggies and broughtinside. The times buggies are left outside are usually when children take them shopping......

72

 Feb 14, 2012 at 05:41 PM Lawyer Says:

NYS Penal Law § 260.10

"Endangering the welfare of a child.
A person is guilty of endangering the welfare of a child when:
1. He or she knowingly acts in a manner likely to be injurious to the
physical, mental or moral welfare of a child less than seventeen years
old or directs or authorizes such child to engage in an occupation
involving a substantial risk of danger to his or her life or health; ...

Endangering the welfare of a child is a class A misdemeanor."

A misdemeanor is punishable by up to one year in prison. Leaving an unattended baby outside a store would likely result in a plea deal of no jail time, but with probation and supervision by child welfare authorities for a period of time.

73

 Feb 14, 2012 at 05:56 PM Shoshe Says:

Would you leave your barsilino Black Hat outside? Would you leave your $5,000 Streimel outside? Would you leave your $3,000 sheitel outside? However, you do leave your priceless child outside, nebach on our values.

74

 Feb 14, 2012 at 06:08 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #9  
blahblah Says:

I was recently shopping in BP with my baby, and when I went into the store with my stroller, I was told to leave it outside. I wasn't about to do that, so I left. The lady, understandably upset about losing a sale came running after me- "What's the big deal, everyone does it, we're all yidden, it's fine" etc. Have we learned nothing from Leiby, z'l? I am not taking chances with my child- better to go through the trouble of coming back later when I can go without the baby than do anything to risk his safety!

THUMBS UP!!!

75

 Feb 14, 2012 at 06:16 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #9  
blahblah Says:

I was recently shopping in BP with my baby, and when I went into the store with my stroller, I was told to leave it outside. I wasn't about to do that, so I left. The lady, understandably upset about losing a sale came running after me- "What's the big deal, everyone does it, we're all yidden, it's fine" etc. Have we learned nothing from Leiby, z'l? I am not taking chances with my child- better to go through the trouble of coming back later when I can go without the baby than do anything to risk his safety!

This Bubby says:

Mothers, go shopping with friends or sisters & while one shops, the other stands guard outside. Then you change over. Yes it takes double the time but isn't it better to be safe than sorry? Don't blame tiny stores, I hate having to navigate round strollers. I'm a shopper too! Don't I have the right to shop in peace? I am grateful to stores that ban strollers.

When I had 4 kids under 5 I never went shopping without my husband so he could watch the kids. Sometimes he would babysit on a Sunday & give me a few precious and peaceful hours to dash round BP on my own because all my family is in Europe so I couldn't ask my mother to help out. I did what I had to do and many times if my husband couldn't babysit my shopping plans fell through. Too bad. There was always another week.

76

 Feb 14, 2012 at 06:36 PM Anonymous Says:

Leaving a baby outside in a stroller also leaves them subject to RAT bites. Yes, RATS are all over our streets, and will easily munch on a small defenseless child.

77

 Feb 14, 2012 at 06:58 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #20  
Anonymous Says:

It would be a big mitzvah to be a moser in these circumstances and call the police if you see a case of ongoing child neglect/abuse in front of your eyes. Any rav who would have the chutzpah to condemn someone making such a police report himself should be ostracized by the tzibur. How much more insanity in the name of daas torah are we willing to subscribe to.

I'm sure you do not have children or you wouldn't say this. Do you honestly believe any child would be better off being placed in foster care by ACS? Most stores do have chaperones whom you may not notice and/or there are other mothers outside keeping an eye on several carriages.
Fear mongering due to the Leiby Kletzky story is just that. Adults get kidnapped and killed as well so start having bodyguards for every adult as well!

78

 Feb 14, 2012 at 07:10 PM Yoilish Says:

JUST FOR THE RECORD:

The picture above is outside the "Hot Bagels" store. This store is tiny and the whole front of the store is made of a large window where parents can keep a close eye on the happenings outside.

79

 Feb 14, 2012 at 07:22 PM ShmuelG Says:

Reply to #69  
DemsBeBabies Says:

Yossi, I take it that you associate yourself with Occupy Wall Street , or do not understand free markets due to a lack in education.
Having banks in a community is one of the best things that can happen. It means that banks see the area as viable for their business. I'm not sure what you think banks do, but they aren't boogie men, they are in the business of taking capital and increasing it for their shareholders. This happens mostly by lending money to local businesses. Now in ghettos it's hard to find banks bec there is no reason to open them, as there is no business for them to invest in. They clearly see our communities as areas ripe for small/medium size businesses (bank managers usually get bonuses on the amount of money lent vs paid back on time and opening checking accounts for businesses).
Now the logic that you use as to only small stores being left open, it makes no sense. If the store was viable, then it would still be there. If it was just a rent issue, it would MOVE. The fact that small stores do not let in carriages are somehow a banks fault makes no sense at all!
As for bailouts, SOme of these banks came after, & others like chase, never took any.

“ Yossi, I take it that you associate yourself with Occupy Wall Street , or do not understand free markets due to a lack in education."

Agreed, but how is it either or? The former is always predicated on the latter and could not possibly exist otherwise.

80

 Feb 14, 2012 at 08:25 PM ygrazi Says:

Simple solution, give the kid a non Chalav Yisroel Candy.
I bet it never happens again.

81

 Feb 14, 2012 at 09:33 PM MiriamH Says:

sometimes I wonder if little kids are better off with stay-at-home moms or working moms...when moms work, their kids are safely (hopefully) monitored in day care...

82

 Feb 14, 2012 at 09:34 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #78  
Yoilish Says:

JUST FOR THE RECORD:

The picture above is outside the "Hot Bagels" store. This store is tiny and the whole front of the store is made of a large window where parents can keep a close eye on the happenings outside.

I noticed that too! The problem definitely exists, but this picture isn't proof...the mothers 99% had their eyes glued to their kids!

83

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:01 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #12  
awacs Says:

SO, when Swedes do it, it's a 'cultural issue?'
But when BP Jews do it, it's child abandonment?

Am I the only one who's bothered by the double standard?

blah blah blah blah!

Why are you people all wasting time? Next time you see a child out alone, call 911.

End of story. Either the police will put an end to this by arresting a neglectful mother, or they will get so annoyed at getting these calls they will do what they have to to stop it.

Have you tried double parking on avenue J or Coney island Avenue lately? Send the meter maids over to BP for a day. Let them hold any unattended carriage until the police come and file a report. BP and WB will get the message fast enough!

84

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:11 PM They'reUnfitToBeMothers Says:

Reply to #44  
boroparkbabbi Says:

When I had younger children and had to do shopping, I always went out with a friend and she would watch my child when I went into a store to shop and I would do the same for her. We had each other for company and we were able to shop without any anxiety. and keep our children safe. It is a great buddy system for friends to do.

Many years ago, I experienced a mother leaving her newborn child outside of Lane's Pharmacy. She took her purse with her but left her baby unattended. When she returned her baby's face had been scratched up by a deranged women passerby and her baby was schreeching. She yelled for the police and yelled " Who did this to my baby?" She was attacked by all the people standing outside calling her an unfit mother. She fled the scene with her baby before the police arrived. I don't think that she ever left her baby unattended again.

THERE IS NEVER AN EXCUSE TO LEAVE A CHILD UNATTENDED, WHETHER IT IS OUTSIDE OF A STORE, AT HOME ON SHABBOS WHEN PARENTS TAKE A NAP, OR ARE CHATTING ON THE PHONE. THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT WOULD GIVE THEIR EYE TEETH TO HAVE CHILDREN.

TAKE CARE OF YOUR MOST PRECIOUS POSSESSIONS, YOUR CHILDREN!!!

There was a case last year on East 36th street in Marine Park on a Friday night AT MIDNIGHT where a frum man came upon a 2 year old child wandering alone outside! He grabbed the child and began knocking on every door trying to locate his parents and he finally found them...socializing in their neighbors' house! They had left that child as well as their 2nd infant alone at home sleeping, never expecting the 2 year old to wake up, unlock the door and go outside by themselved! To this day I am sorry the police weren't called and the children taken away permanently! Parents like these selfish, irresponsible ones should not have children!

85

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:14 PM DemsBeBabies Says:

Reply to #79  
ShmuelG Says:

“ Yossi, I take it that you associate yourself with Occupy Wall Street , or do not understand free markets due to a lack in education."

Agreed, but how is it either or? The former is always predicated on the latter and could not possibly exist otherwise.

well, you are half right. all ows people do not undersatnd free markets, but not all people who dont understand free markets are OWSers.

86

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:17 PM anon Says:

While I agree in theory that it is wrong to leave a baby alone and let him cry, the danger is being overstated. This practice has been done for literally decades, and b"H I've yet to hear of a story where a baby dissapeared off the streets of boro park.
I'm much more bothered by the fact that mothers don't care a wit that their babies are crying, lonely and scared. Are these our compassionate Jewish mothers?

87

 Feb 14, 2012 at 10:42 PM Leon Zacharowicz MD Says:

Reply to #30  
qazxc Says:

No, it was a crime when the Sweedish couple did it and they were arrested, as well they should have been, and they had to fight to get back their child, as was also as it should have been.

These mothers prove Rabbi Tendler wrong. They are obviously alive and well without any brain function.

I absolutely love that last line.
Unfortunately, this is no laughing matter. This is child neglect, plain and simple. It is inexcusable.

88

 Feb 14, 2012 at 11:04 PM Benjey Says:

Forget the babies those carriges are worth $2,000 and all the young couples are walking around with them and then they run to toty and momy when there is no money? oh i forgot they got it for a present .

89

 Feb 15, 2012 at 12:24 AM ALLAN Says:

I have grandchildren and the thought of them or anyone elses child being left unattended is beyond acceptable...not even for one second...no excuses.

90

 Feb 15, 2012 at 12:31 AM md2205 Says:

Forget about leaving the child outside in the stroller...I told my kids you cannot turn your head away from the child when you take the child outside, and you cannot turn around to be facing the other way when you are with your child, even when the child is in the stoller. The child cannot be behind you when you are outside with him.

91

 Feb 15, 2012 at 02:51 AM Trolly_McTrollerston Says:

Reply to #3  
Anonymous Says:

I agree even though there is no place in the store take your kid inside and leave the stroller outside. This has been going on in Williamsburg and Boro Park for years. Would you leave your pocket book outside? Your child is worth more!!!!!

they won't leave their stroller outside- they are afraid it will get stolen!

92

 Feb 15, 2012 at 05:54 AM freebies Says:

I guess to those of us who don't have children, plenty available on 13th avenue come and take your pick.

93

 Feb 15, 2012 at 07:40 AM trust me Says:

to all of you who say that it is moiser to call the police on this & that this is better than the children being placed in foster care:
1. Gedolei HaDor have Paskined recently (don't ask me which Gadol-I can't recall which one) that it is NOT moiser in this day & age to involve the police when it comes to child abuse & child endangerment. It is more important to be concerned about the safety & well being of a child than if someone is being Moiser.
2. If a parent is endangerng a child in any way, it is more important that the child remain safe & sound & well taken care of. When ACS is called regarding a frum child, they immediately contact Ohel & Ohel places the child first with famly members. If there arent any family members willing to take in the child(ren) then they place them with a very warm & loving FRUM family, usually in the same neighborhood.There will be an investigation during which time the parents will more than likely will have to go to therapy & such. in the end the child will be returned to the parent if it is found that the parent can provide a SAFE home & will exhibit proper actions toward the child.

94

 Feb 15, 2012 at 08:42 AM chardal Says:

Reply to #2  
Anonymous Says:

Actually, all the laws on this already exist. This is clear parental neglect. If this were to end up before a judge, there would be basis to restrict that parent's rights to the child. Now, let's picture a scene. Someone foolishly does this, and a passerby watches the child cry for 15 minutes, and points this out to a cop patrolling the block (a clearly responsible thing to do). This becomes a case for ACS, and the parents get dragged through that system (a curse on anyone, let alone for a frum Yid). The poor passerby will be ostracized everywhere, shul, schools, etc. as a moseir. Dov is quite accurate when expressing a public plea to be more careful in this area. The alternative would be to enforce the obvious, and that would label and punish the wrong people (as goes on in many other areas of our community).

You seem to be more worried about the legal repercussions than the clear and present danger of leaving a child unattended. I always want to take a stroller and move it down the block and see what happens when the mother returns. I know that many stores do not allow strollers inside - so either take your baby out or dont frequent that store!! I have heard of mixups too - that a harried mother grabs her stroller and starts walking only to discover she took the wrong stroller!

95

 Feb 15, 2012 at 10:05 AM missyid Says:

Reply to #36  
whywhy Says:

I actually was walking down a quit block, when i passed a baby carriage outside a basement store.(door closed). I went in and asked whos baby is outside a woman ans. i said i will be watching your baby while you finish up so please hurry babysitting was not on my list of things to do today. She ans. me with chazal (which i wasn't formula with) i asked what does that mean,"it means hashem watches over fools and children, so i shouldn't worry!!!!! i said oh boy now am even more worried fool!! and yes i was standing by door open while talking to her, and stayed till she came out. i have her kids in my tefilos everyday.

and about stores not letting a carriage in? whats the issue is ur STUFF your getting so much more important then your child.!!! (who you are most probably shopping for). if the store didn't allow diamonds in for a fear of pulling or tearing the clothing would you leave them outside?!!!!

I would have responded "Yes, G-d sent me to watch over a child who has a foolish mother. Thank G-d for sending me."

To all those who say the 50's were safer. My mom was born in the 50's in Brooklyn and my mother tells a story of an aunt who was eating in a restaurant and had a baby in a stroller outside. My grandmother (my mother's mother and the aunts sister) passed by and recognized the baby in the stroller and walked away with the stroller to make a "point" to her sister. So even in the 50's some smart women (like my Grandmother) had the presence of mind to realize there was definitely an inherent danger to leaving a child unattended. But things do not change when the concept of "being self-absorbed" is passed down from parent to child in Brooklyn. I can assure you this would never happen in the Midwest where I live, and if it did, you would see the mug shots of any woman who behaved this way.

96

 Feb 15, 2012 at 10:14 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #94  
chardal Says:

You seem to be more worried about the legal repercussions than the clear and present danger of leaving a child unattended. I always want to take a stroller and move it down the block and see what happens when the mother returns. I know that many stores do not allow strollers inside - so either take your baby out or dont frequent that store!! I have heard of mixups too - that a harried mother grabs her stroller and starts walking only to discover she took the wrong stroller!

You're not correct in describing my concerns. I know I'm hiding behind my anonymity, but my greatest concern is the health and welfare of our children. The matter at hand is a statement by a politician. Let's think a minute about the importance of that. Dov Hikind is not the individual to whom one turns to hear divrei mussar. Either he is addressing the need for legislation, establishing or promoting some government program, or issuing a warning to the public. That's all I considered in comment #2. There is a reality that many stores are not large enough or designed with child safety (or child friendliness) in mind. You are correct - if a store cannot handle your shopping with your children with you, go elsewhere. Compromising on safety for children is not an option ever.

97

 Feb 15, 2012 at 01:09 PM DavidCohen Says:

Reply to #22  
Yossi Says:

Mr. Dov...Most stores on 13th avenue do NOT allow carriages in their store...Mothers need to do their shopping and there is no other way to get this done..
13th avenue has become the Banking center of America where most retail space is taken by those banks forcing the bigger stores to close down and all we are left is the small stores that can not accomidate carriages..Its time BP woke up and boycott some of thos ebanks and drive them away to other areas and lets bring retail back to 13th avenue...The landlords became very greedy and are looking for the big bucks the financial insutry brings them...And the interesting part who is paying the Banks rent.? We taxpayers had to bail them out so they can open more branches in retail territory....

A: That is an exaggeration. And B: if a store insist that babies be left outside, DON'T SHOP THERE! When they have no customers they will have to change their policy.

Bottom line, if you see a baby unattended, call the police or social services!

98

 Feb 15, 2012 at 02:15 PM ShmuelG Says:

Reply to #85  
DemsBeBabies Says:

well, you are half right. all ows people do not undersatnd free markets, but not all people who dont understand free markets are OWSers.

That's what I meant when I said "The former is always predicated on the latter" and not the other way around. I trained myself to speak as precisely as possible.

Regardless, we seem to be in complete agreement.

99

 Feb 16, 2012 at 02:28 PM Rivkah Says:

Easy solution for Hikind to implement: have cops patrol the areas, and give verbal notices to the mothers, warning them that next time they WILL be arrested. The word will get around fast. Fear of cops is effective in avoiding traffic violations, and it will work here. (as sad as it is that we need such measures to get mothers to protect their own kids, the fact is that some are too naive as to the dangers of our world...watching from the window, will not stop a kidnapper from throwing the stroller & kid into a van and zipping away).

100

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