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New York - Halachic Musings: Thanksgiving On Chanuka?

Published on: November 27, 2013 10:04 AM
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FILE - Second-grader Rozie Aronov, 7, holds up a menurkey, a paper-and-paint mashup of a menorah and turkey she created at Hillel Day School in Farmington Hills, Mich., Nov. 20, 2013. The recent class project reflects one way for Jews in the United States to deal with a rare quirk of the calendar that overlaps Thanksgiving with the start of Hanukkah. APFILE - Second-grader Rozie Aronov, 7, holds up a menurkey, a paper-and-paint mashup of a menorah and turkey she created at Hillel Day School in Farmington Hills, Mich., Nov. 20, 2013. The recent class project reflects one way for Jews in the United States to deal with a rare quirk of the calendar that overlaps Thanksgiving with the start of Hanukkah. AP

New York - This year, 5774/2013, in what is being billed as a ‘once in eternity overlap’, the American holiday of Thanksgiving falls out on Chanuka! Although it turns out that that label is not entirely accurate, nevertheless, with the next possible co-incidence being 2070, and subsequently followed by 2165 (however, then Thanksgiving will not fall out on the first day of Chanuka, rather the first night of Chanuka will occur on Thanksgiving), it still may be correctly dubbed a ‘once in a lifetime occurrence’. Therefore, it bears finding out what, if any, halachic impact this calendarical synthesis has. 

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Why Thanksgiving? 

Americans commonly trace the holiday of Thanksgiving to the 1621 Pilgrim celebration at Plymouth Plantation, Massachusetts. The Pilgrims were expressing gratitude to God for a successful harvest after surviving a particularly harsh winter; mainly due to the aid of Squanto, the English speaking Native American, and the Wampanoag tribe, who taught them how to hunt (turkeys) and plant (maize) in the New World, and shared food supplies with them. A second Thanksgiving was observed on July 30th, 1623 in appreciation of an abundant harvest after a refreshing 14-day rain following a nearly catastrophic drought. Similar sporadic celebrations occurred locally throughout theNew England area for the next century or so, but never on a national level until 1777, during the Revolutionary War, when ‘The First National Proclamation of Thanksgiving’ was given by the Continental Congress.

In 1782, John Hanson, the first United Statespresident under the Articles of Confederation (and mysteriously somehow forgotten from the history books), declared the fourth Thursday of every November was to be observed as Thanksgiving. Several years later, President George Washington issued ‘The First National Thanksgiving Proclamation’ (under the Constitution), designating November 26th 1789, as a day of Thanksgiving. He did so again in 1795. Yet, it was not until 1863, in the midst of the Civil War, when the holiday as we know it was formally established by President Abraham Lincoln, at the urging and behest of Sarah Josepha Hale, editor of Godey’s Lady Book, who was lobbying for a national day off from work. Thanksgiving has since been observed annually as a national holiday across the United States. But our subject is defining how Thanksgiving observance is viewed by Halacha. 

Chukos HaGoyim? 

To answer this question, a little halachic background is needed. In Parshas Acharei Mos (Vayikra Ch.18, verse 3), we are exhorted not to follow in the ways of the Goyim, “U’Vichukoseihem Lo Seleichu”. According to the Rambam and later codified by the Tur and Shulchan Aruch (Y”D 178, 1), this prohibition includes manners of dress, haircuts, and even building styles. Tosafos (Avodah Zarah 13a s.v. v’ee) mentions that this prohibition includes two distinct types of customs: idolatrous ones, and those that are nonsensical; implying even if they are not done l’sheim Avodah Zara, they would still be assur to practice.

However, the Ran (Avoda Zara 2b s.v. Yisrael) and Maharik (Shu”t Maharik, Shoresh 88, Anaf 1) define the prohibition differently. They maintain that a nonsensical custom of the Goyim is only prohibited when it is entirely irrational, with no comprehensible reason for it, or when it has connotations of idolatrous intent. Additionally, following a custom that would lead to a gross breach of modesty (pritzus) would fit the category. However, observing a simple custom of the Goyim that has no reference to Avodah Zara, would be permitted. Although the Vilna Gaon (Biur HaGr”a (Y”D 178, end 7) rejects their understanding of the prohibition, and the Gilyon Maharsha (ad loc. 1) seems to follow Tosafos, nevertheless the Rema (Y”D 178, 1) explicitly rules like the Maharik and Ran, as does the Beis Yosef. Accordingly, they hold that as long as a custom is secular, with no connection to Avodah Zara, we may observe such a custom as well.

[For more on the parameters of the prohibition of “U’Vichukoseihem Lo Seleichu” and its nuances at length, see Shu”t Melamed L’Hoyeel (O.C. 16), Shu”t Seridei Aish (old print vol. 3, 93; new print Y”D 39, Anaf 1, 5 - 14) and Minchas Asher (vol. 3, Vayikra, Parshas Emor, 33, ppg. 197 - 205).]

Thanksgiving: Religious or Secular? 

But to understand how this affects us and possible Thanksgiving observance, we must first ascertain whether Thanksgiving is truly a religious holiday or a secular one. Of the aforementioned Thanksgiving observances, all were declared as a unique day expressly designated to thank God for all of his ‘gracious gifts’. This implies that it is meant to be a religious holiday. Yet, only the Continental Congress’s proclamation made reference to the Christian deity. Additionally, there is no actual religious service connected with the day at all. Furthermore, nowadays, the vast majority of Americans simply associate Thanksgiving with food (mainly turkey), football, and family, and take the day off. This implies that its observance is strictly secular. Will the real Thanksgiving please stand up?

Contemporary Rulings 

As with many issues in halacha there are different approaches to Thanksgiving observance. In fact, Rav Moshe Feinstein alone has written four different responsa on topic (Shu”t Igros Moshe (E.H. vol. 2, 13; O.C. vol. 5, 20, 6; Y”D vol. 4, 11, 4; and Y”D vol. 4, 12). Although in the earlier teshuvos he seems to be against the idea of a Thanksgiving celebration, (possibly there were more religious connotations involved in the early 1960’s celebrations than in the 1980’s), nevertheless, in his later ones he allows a Thanksgiving observance (he notes that it is not a religious celebration) with turkey being served, as long as it is not seen as an obligatory annual celebration, but rather as a periodical ‘simchas reshus’. All the same, Rav Moshe concludes that it is still preferable not to have a celebration b’davka for Thanksgiving.

Other contemporary Gedolim who allowed eating turkey on Thanksgiving include Rav Eliezer Silver, Rav Yosef Dov (J.B.) Soloveitchik (the Boston Gaon; cited in Nefesh HaRav pg. 231), Rav Yehuda Hertzl Henkin, and the Rivevos Efraim. They maintain that Thanksgiving is “only a day of thanks and not, Heaven forbid, for idol celebration”, therefore eating turkey on Thanksgiving cannot be considered Chukos HaGoyim.

Yet, other contemporary authorities disagree. Rav Yitzchok Hutner is quoted (see Pachad Yitzchak - Igros U”Michtavim shel HaRav Hutner 109) as maintaining that the establishment of Thanksgiving as an annual holiday that is based on the Christian calendar is, at the very least, closely associated with Avodah Zarah and therefore prohibited. He explains that its annual observance classifies it as a ‘holiday’ and celebrating Gentile holidays is obviously not permitted.

Similarly, Rav Menashe Klein (Shu”t Mishna Halachos vol. 10, 116) ruled that it is a prohibited to celebrate Thanksgiving. Aside for citing the Gra’s opinion, which would prohibit any such celebration, he mentions that although the Thanksgiving holiday was originally established by (Pilgrims) rejoicing over their own survival, that they didn’t starve due to their finding the turkey, and might not be considered Chukos HaGoyim, nevertheless there is another prohibition involved. In Yoreh De’ah (148, 7), the Shulchan Aruch, based on a Mishna in Maseches Avodah Zara (8a), rules that if an idolater makes a personal holiday for various reasons (birthday, was let out of jail, etc.) and at that party he thanks his gods, it is prohibited to join in that celebration. Rav Klein posits that the same would apply to Thanksgiving, as it commemorates the original Pilgrim Thanksgiving, thanking God for the turkey and their survival, and would be certainly prohibited, and possibly even Biblically.

An analogous ruling was given by Rav Dovid Cohen (of Gevul Ya’avetz), and Rav Feivel Cohen (author of the Badei HaShulchan), albeit for different reasons. Rav Feivel Cohen takes a seemingly extreme approach, maintaining that not only is it forbidden for a Jew to celebrate Thanksgiving, it is even prohibited for a Gentile to do so as well. Rav Dovid Cohen, on the other hand, writes that for a Jew to eat turkey on Thanksgiving expressly for the sake of the holiday should be prohibited by the rule of Tosafos, as it would be deemed following an irrational rule of theirs that is improper to follow. Yet, he concedes that it is not prohibited for a family to get together on a day off from work and eat turkey together, as long as they do so not to celebrate Thanksgiving, but rather because they like turkey. Even so, he concludes that it is still preferable not to do so.

Trotting Out the Turkey?

With several differing major approaches to Thanksgiving advanced by contemporary authorities, which is the prevailing custom? Should turkey be on our plates this Thursday? The answer is that it depends. As shown, there are many authorities who felt that Thanksgiving dinner should be avoided. However, many people do eat turkey on Thanksgiving, albeit some with non-Thankgiving related intent. (Remember, even kosher turkey prices drop for the holiday!) Yet, one should not make an ‘exclusively for Thanksgiving’ party. Everyone should follow his community practice and the lead of their knowledgeable halachic authority.

Anecdotally, my own grandmother, Mrs. Ruth Spitz (May she have a Refuah Sheleimah), would buy a turkey, but instead of serving it for Thanksgiving dinner, would rather save it and serve it l’kavod Shabbos on the Shabbos immediately following Thanksgiving. This way one is not compromising on tradition nor halacha, and additionally receives the benefits of kavod and oneg Shabbos.

Although nowadays for many in Yeshivish and Chassidic circles the idea of observing some semblance of Thanksgiving may seem an anathema, it is interesting to note that many authorities of the previous generation did not seem too concerned with it. In fact, as is widely known, the annual Agudas Yisrael Convention, attended by many Gedolim, was traditionally held over Thanksgiving weekend for many decades, with turkey on the menu (As attested to in Rabbi Mordechai Kamenetsky’s ‘Streets of Life’ column in Ami Magazine #143, October 2, 2013, titled ‘Tagging Along’ pg. 94)! Additionally, Rav Yosef Eliyahu Henkin’s authoritative Ezras Torah calendar (with halachos for the whole year) noted Thanksgiving along with other secular holidays.

Come what may, this year, with Thanksgiving falling out on the first day of Chanuka, it most definitely will be a day of thanks giving, lehodos u’lehallel. In fact, in an interesting turn of phrase, whether or not one is talking turkey, it will be a day when we can all truly exclaim “Hodu Lashem Ki Tov!

Many of the shittos of Rabbanim mentioned in this article first appeared in the Journal of Halacha and Contemporary Society (vol. 30, pg. 59).  

Rabbi Yehuda Spitz serves as the Sho’el U’ Meishiv and Rosh Chabura of the Ohr Lagolah Halacha Kollel at Yeshivas Ohr Somayach in Yerushalayim. For any questions, comments or for the full Mareh Mekomos / sources, please email the author: yspitz@ohr.edu .



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Read Comments (24)  —  Post Yours »

1

 Nov 27, 2013 at 10:16 AM Nachum Says:

If Rav Soloveitchik and Rav Feinstein essentially stated that Thanksgiving is a secular holiday, and not a religious one, and they were truly two of the greatest rabbinical scholars in contemporary times, why is there still a small minority in our community, who seem to go ballistic at the very mention of Thanksgiving?

2

 Nov 27, 2013 at 10:42 AM Anonymous Says:

i remember hearing that there was a chassidishe rebbe who either made a tish for Thanksgiving or served turkey at his tish on the Shabbos after Thanksgiving? Anyone know who this was?

3

 Nov 27, 2013 at 11:08 AM Anonymous Says:

Good article. Really, we should not be so afraid of our own shadow, but are we indeed transgressing out own boundaries?

I am having my Thanksgiving Turkey tonight on Wednesday. Mom decided she wanted to do the work on Wednesday instead. Since that has been the case for a few years now, I regard the issue of having it on Shabbas equally blessed.

But I will have leftovers tomorrow when you are waiting for that turkey all day long!

4

 Nov 27, 2013 at 11:23 AM benalt Says:

I don't understand why it is considered irrational. Then so is drinking on Purim and drinking arba kosos.

5

 Nov 27, 2013 at 11:32 AM sighber Says:

The pilgrims also had Thanksgiving because they wanted to celebrate the English harvest festival
What is the mesorah for turkey?

6

 Nov 27, 2013 at 12:02 PM anonymous Says:

Reply to #5  
sighber Says:

The pilgrims also had Thanksgiving because they wanted to celebrate the English harvest festival
What is the mesorah for turkey?

The mesorah is that you never smelled the smoke from a crematoria, never saw SS and SA splitting the head of a Jew. Be grateful you are in this country can malign Bush and Obama, freedom to wear a strajmel and live off the dole from Uncle Sam.

7

 Nov 27, 2013 at 01:00 PM Anonymous Says:

With all due respect to the Rabbi, the explanation for the origin of Thanksgiving is a false story that became popular around 100 years ago and has now overtaken the real facts. The Puritans came to New England,captured natives, sold them into slavery and spread smallpox. Squanto was pretty much the only surviving member of the Patuxet tribe when he assisted the Puritans. They continued killing and enslaving the locals, with the Pequot Nation refusing to submit. The first Thanksgiving proclaimed by Governor John Winthrop was actually a celebration for the safe return of a group of Puritans. They were returning from a massacre of 700 Pequots men, women and children who were killed while celebrating the Pequot harvest festival. There were continuing slave raids and massacres against other local tribes, even those who had signed treaties. The myth of Puritans celebrating harvest with the natives was invented much later. This shouldn't be shocking news to any Jews of European ancestry. To conflate a celebration of the freedom of the indigenous Jews from the invading Syrian Greeks with a massacre of Native Americans by the invading European christians is terribly inappropriate.

8

 Nov 27, 2013 at 01:03 PM ayoyo Says:

The god of the Pilgrims is the same as ours there's no (shituf ) combination of deities mentioned regarding this.there are other people who believe in a Ribono shel olam. as we do.

9

 Nov 27, 2013 at 01:29 PM yolish Says:

rabbi thanks for bringing down all the shittos so we know that whichever way we go we have what to rely upon. but whyt in the world would r feivel cohen say it is usser for goyim to keep thanksgiving?

10

 Nov 27, 2013 at 01:37 PM Mark Levin Says:

Thank God the pilgrims supposedly ate turkey instead of chazir. Can you imagine the moreh heter crowd saying we should chv eat chazir to be thankful????

Personally I will keep proclaiming my thanks three times a day, sometimes four, to the Ribono Shel Olam.

11

 Nov 27, 2013 at 01:43 PM Yaakov Says:

Rabbi Spitz- Another amazing article, well written!!! I really enjoyed it! Most of the articles that I have come across usually have a bias and agenda (Rav Hutner vs. Reb Moishe etc) Yours just lays out the facts and allows readers to come to there own conclusions based on which posek they follow. Thank you.
A freilichen chanukah

12

 Nov 27, 2013 at 01:47 PM DikDuk Guy Says:

it will be a day when we can all truly exclaim “Hodu Lashem Ki Tov!”

Yes, certainly, but where will the accent be? If one pronounces it HOdu, as in meiHOdu ad kush, it means India, or, in modern idiom, a turkey. If one pronounces it hoDU, it is an imperative to praise (Hashem).

Yasher Koach for the article!

13

 Nov 27, 2013 at 02:51 PM Respect Says:

My rosh yeshiva used to quote his Rosh Yeshiva as saying that on Thanksgiving, after shiur, we should go eat turkey with our families.

14

 Nov 27, 2013 at 03:21 PM Chaim Says:

Didn't the pilgrims wear black hats (though with buckle) and ate turkey instead of meat shechita

15

 Nov 27, 2013 at 05:04 PM CantFightStupid Says:

Reply to #10  
Mark Levin Says:

Thank God the pilgrims supposedly ate turkey instead of chazir. Can you imagine the moreh heter crowd saying we should chv eat chazir to be thankful????

Personally I will keep proclaiming my thanks three times a day, sometimes four, to the Ribono Shel Olam.

We also remember leaving mitzrayim 3 times a day, yet we still have pesach?! What's wrong with showing a little more hokaras hatov once a year?

16

 Nov 27, 2013 at 05:19 PM Rafuel Says:

Reply to #7  
Anonymous Says:

With all due respect to the Rabbi, the explanation for the origin of Thanksgiving is a false story that became popular around 100 years ago and has now overtaken the real facts. The Puritans came to New England,captured natives, sold them into slavery and spread smallpox. Squanto was pretty much the only surviving member of the Patuxet tribe when he assisted the Puritans. They continued killing and enslaving the locals, with the Pequot Nation refusing to submit. The first Thanksgiving proclaimed by Governor John Winthrop was actually a celebration for the safe return of a group of Puritans. They were returning from a massacre of 700 Pequots men, women and children who were killed while celebrating the Pequot harvest festival. There were continuing slave raids and massacres against other local tribes, even those who had signed treaties. The myth of Puritans celebrating harvest with the natives was invented much later. This shouldn't be shocking news to any Jews of European ancestry. To conflate a celebration of the freedom of the indigenous Jews from the invading Syrian Greeks with a massacre of Native Americans by the invading European christians is terribly inappropriate.

Whereas the story of pilgrims celebrating together with savage indians is certainly concocted - indians were constantly attacking the pilgrims and would not make peace for many years, until it became obvious even to savages that Europeans are here to stay - the story you are telling is thousand times worse, mainly because it is all made up by the anti-american leftists you deem so dear. Whereas the conventional story was made up with some good intentions (let's all get along kind of thing), yours was made up with extremely vile ones.

That is not to say that we can celebrate Thanksgiving, an obviously goyisher ritual that will unfortunately remain for Jewish goyim to celebrate with real goyim for some time to come, not for loyal Torah Jews, but spreading clearly made up leftist cr-p is not good on any day of the year. Shame on you!

Oh, and freilichen Chanuka!

17

 Nov 27, 2013 at 06:28 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #16  
Rafuel Says:

Whereas the story of pilgrims celebrating together with savage indians is certainly concocted - indians were constantly attacking the pilgrims and would not make peace for many years, until it became obvious even to savages that Europeans are here to stay - the story you are telling is thousand times worse, mainly because it is all made up by the anti-american leftists you deem so dear. Whereas the conventional story was made up with some good intentions (let's all get along kind of thing), yours was made up with extremely vile ones.

That is not to say that we can celebrate Thanksgiving, an obviously goyisher ritual that will unfortunately remain for Jewish goyim to celebrate with real goyim for some time to come, not for loyal Torah Jews, but spreading clearly made up leftist cr-p is not good on any day of the year. Shame on you!

Oh, and freilichen Chanuka!

So please, enlighten us. How did a handful of Pilgrim survive the savage attacks of thousands of natives for so many years? By the way, what's the definition of "Savages?" They lived in farming communities, raised their children and lived their lives just like anyone else.

18

 Nov 27, 2013 at 07:56 PM anonymous Says:

Reply to #16  
Rafuel Says:

Whereas the story of pilgrims celebrating together with savage indians is certainly concocted - indians were constantly attacking the pilgrims and would not make peace for many years, until it became obvious even to savages that Europeans are here to stay - the story you are telling is thousand times worse, mainly because it is all made up by the anti-american leftists you deem so dear. Whereas the conventional story was made up with some good intentions (let's all get along kind of thing), yours was made up with extremely vile ones.

That is not to say that we can celebrate Thanksgiving, an obviously goyisher ritual that will unfortunately remain for Jewish goyim to celebrate with real goyim for some time to come, not for loyal Torah Jews, but spreading clearly made up leftist cr-p is not good on any day of the year. Shame on you!

Oh, and freilichen Chanuka!

You convoluted and rambling posting only makes it more imperative that every Jew who is fortunate enough to have never experienced the persecution and hate should have enough brain and sit down and eat a seudah todoah. Leftist has nothing to do with it only a twisted mind will operate that way

19

 Nov 27, 2013 at 08:48 PM Anonymous Says:

I have rarely found a collection of amoratzim as ignorant as the commenters of this article.

And I guess July 4th is also avodah zorah since it is celebrated according to the goyish calendar. Same with Labor day and memorial Day.

What a bunch of self-righteous fools you all are!

20

 Nov 27, 2013 at 10:23 PM schwartzi Says:

Reply to #4  
benalt Says:

I don't understand why it is considered irrational. Then so is drinking on Purim and drinking arba kosos.

aam ha'retz you l'havdil compare the arba koses to that farshtunke holiday and turkey? need i say more?

21

 Nov 28, 2013 at 07:06 AM Dave Says:

“in 2070 and 2165, Thanksgiving will not fall out on the first day of Chanuka, rather the first night of Chanuka will occur on Thanksgiving.”
So lfi this, when one is bentching after the Thanksgiving meal, do they add Al Hanissim, or would that be a tarti d’sasri? Or will they simply have to finish eating before shkiah?

22

 Nov 28, 2013 at 01:37 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #20  
schwartzi Says:

aam ha'retz you l'havdil compare the arba koses to that farshtunke holiday and turkey? need i say more?

need you say more? no, since anyone who uses the word "farshtunke" like you did is an obvious moron to begin with.

23

 Nov 28, 2013 at 01:38 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #21  
Dave Says:

“in 2070 and 2165, Thanksgiving will not fall out on the first day of Chanuka, rather the first night of Chanuka will occur on Thanksgiving.”
So lfi this, when one is bentching after the Thanksgiving meal, do they add Al Hanissim, or would that be a tarti d’sasri? Or will they simply have to finish eating before shkiah?

why do you ask? do you expect to be alive then to worry about it? Or are you just trying to be a smartass?

24

 Nov 28, 2013 at 01:41 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #7  
Anonymous Says:

With all due respect to the Rabbi, the explanation for the origin of Thanksgiving is a false story that became popular around 100 years ago and has now overtaken the real facts. The Puritans came to New England,captured natives, sold them into slavery and spread smallpox. Squanto was pretty much the only surviving member of the Patuxet tribe when he assisted the Puritans. They continued killing and enslaving the locals, with the Pequot Nation refusing to submit. The first Thanksgiving proclaimed by Governor John Winthrop was actually a celebration for the safe return of a group of Puritans. They were returning from a massacre of 700 Pequots men, women and children who were killed while celebrating the Pequot harvest festival. There were continuing slave raids and massacres against other local tribes, even those who had signed treaties. The myth of Puritans celebrating harvest with the natives was invented much later. This shouldn't be shocking news to any Jews of European ancestry. To conflate a celebration of the freedom of the indigenous Jews from the invading Syrian Greeks with a massacre of Native Americans by the invading European christians is terribly inappropriate.

and why should anyone believe your story the more believable one? Cite a source!

25

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