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Jerusalem - Archive Belonging to Reb Amram Blau Sheds New Light On The Rabbi's 1965 Marriage to a Convert

Published on: July 26, 2010 11:29 AM
By:  Haaretz
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Rabbi Amram Blau, Ruth Ben DavidJerusalem - For the past 17 years, journalist Shmuel Chaim Pappenheim has been racking his brain, trying to figure out how to finish his biography of Rabbi Amram Blau (1894-1974 ), the legendary leader of the extremist, ultra-Orthodox group Neturei Karta.

“I have writer’s block; I simply do not know how to navigate through this narrative,” he laments.

An ultra-Orthodox Jewish journalist, Pappenheim feels morally obligated to skirt around sensitive issues. However, in this particular instance, such maneuvering is virtually impossible: How can you write about Blau’s life without mentioning his scandalous marriage to a convert in the last decade of his life? Pappenheim, who is in his 40s, fears that even if he simply omits the episode from the biography, “someone might react and, in this way, I will inadvertently cause this matter to rise to the surface. Four different investors are pressing me to finish the book, but I just cannot solve this problem.”

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Read Comments (84)  —  Post Yours »

1

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:35 AM Anonymous Says:

Well no need to worry now...the cat is out of the bag

2

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:44 AM Cadd9 Says:

What I find the most important take away from this is that we can't elevate one facet of Jusdiasm over everything.
Even if one is to believe in Kanoyis, what about the mitzvah of ahavas hageir the aveirah of being metzayer a geir.
Every kat that obsseses about one mitzvah over the others the end result is they lose all balance and end up being poretz geder.
We need to be very vigilant about new chumros and shitahs created by charismatic individuals that emphasize one issue out of the all encompassing Torah. We need to be sure it is real and not misogyny , OCD , narcissism etc.

3

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:49 AM moshe Says:

whats wrong?!

4

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:52 AM Shalom Koenig Says:

What is so scandalous about marrying a convert? Is Judaism racist (Heaven forbid!) And what is so scandalous about marrying someone who is younger than you? Is this against Jewish Law?

5

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:52 AM Anonymous Says:

Fascinating!

6

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:55 AM Anonymous Says:

What was wrong with him marrying a "geyores"? HELLO!!!!

7

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:55 AM Anonymous Says:

Its a scandal that he married a ger? Doesn't everyone already know this womanwas a ger and saved Jewish kids in France during the war?

8

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:55 AM glatekup Says:

i know of many cases where chidren messed up whole families because they mixex in to thier fathers personal life. sometimes it is important but other times it is a matter of jealousy.

9

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:57 AM hear nur Says:

What's wrong?! She was a kosher geir, what's the problem?

10

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:58 AM Anonymous Says:

I don't understand the scandal. As much as I deplore neteurei karta, if halacha doesn't forbid the marriage how can anyone prevent it based on how they feel about it?

11

 Jul 26, 2010 at 12:06 PM Chaim Says:

Typical selective use of halacha - only listen to bais din when they agree with you.

12

 Jul 26, 2010 at 12:07 PM formally Says:

i wonder if her conversion would be acceptable by today's rebbies in Israel

interesting how he found a heter for his needs and wants

13

 Jul 26, 2010 at 12:24 PM dovy Says:

nk of those days was not an "extremist" group. they were the mainstream orthodoxy which almost every religous jew believed in.

14

 Jul 26, 2010 at 12:31 PM Ma Rabbi Says:

This event happened 45 years ago. At that time, I was a teenager. But as I remember:
1 Rav Amram wrote to the Satmar Rebbe who agreed to the match.
2 Ruth Ben David was Righteous convert who had saved Jewish children during the war. Her conversion came from the purest motives long before she met Rav Amram.
Rav Amram was a great man who loved all Jews. He was respected by all segments even those who disagreed with his Anti-Zionist views. He never met with Arafat or the Iranians or other enemies of the Jewish people. He would have been appalled at the ridiculous behavior of the crazy Niturei Karta of today. May his memory be blessed.

15

 Jul 26, 2010 at 12:34 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #10  
Anonymous Says:

I don't understand the scandal. As much as I deplore neteurei karta, if halacha doesn't forbid the marriage how can anyone prevent it based on how they feel about it?

The real scandal is that the sons of Reb Blau went to the Badatz to stop their father's marriage and they agreed. Who do you trust if our courts can't be objective?

16

 Jul 26, 2010 at 12:34 PM Tanna Kamma Says:

Brings to mind 2 other 'scandalous' marriages to converts:
Moses & Joshua.

17

 Jul 26, 2010 at 12:38 PM Babishka Says:

I think it's a lovely romantic story. They fell in love, and he defied his family in order to be with her. As far as the age difference, she wasn't a teenager, she was in her 40's! And she was a beautiful woman.

18

 Jul 26, 2010 at 12:38 PM SimchaB Says:

Reply to #11:Bais Din had no business intervening in such a case. This was not a Din Torah between two parties. Why was he bound by it's unsolicited (by him) opinion?

19

 Jul 26, 2010 at 12:56 PM Anonymous Says:

I don't understand why this is a scandal. Can someone explain?

20

 Jul 26, 2010 at 01:00 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #12  
formally Says:

i wonder if her conversion would be acceptable by today's rebbies in Israel

interesting how he found a heter for his needs and wants

of course the zionist rabbanut wouldn't accept a heimishe convert

21

 Jul 26, 2010 at 01:08 PM Anonymous Says:

the gemarah in mesechta b'rachos says that one should not marry a gaioris.
the mitzvah of loving a ger do not extend to marrying them. apparantly some comments here stem from modern liberalism.
oh well

22

 Jul 26, 2010 at 01:18 PM Anonymous Says:

This is fascinating stuff...it just shows the history leading up to the irrational & violent behavior we keep reading about. I don't agree with #14, Rabbi Amram created a monster and they just took the ball and ran with it. True, it sounds like he didn't encourage violence, but he did despise Zionism (although at least he wasn't a hypocrite & took nothing from the State.)

I don't understand what ruling by the Eida Rabbi Amram broke (it's unclear in the article.) His wife was a nice looking woman & by all accounts a good woman too. What's the problem? Of course, his sons were afraid of undue influence (Yerusha??) & "shame" because of her gioress status, but that just piles on the hypocrisy.

Nice to see that what happens in little people's families also is in the elite. I wonder if 35 years later it would be such a scandal? Not when you consider the kissing (literally) of Arafat & the devotion these sick people have to Jew-killers. You can't get more scandalous & appalling than that.

23

 Jul 26, 2010 at 01:34 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #13  
dovy Says:

nk of those days was not an "extremist" group. they were the mainstream orthodoxy which almost every religous jew believed in.

Wrong NK was never, ever mainstream orthododoxy.

26

 Jul 26, 2010 at 01:50 PM Simcha Says:

Thank you #14 for your comment. I was zoiche to meet R' Amram Blau when I was young - his protests against the medina, against chillul shabbos, etc. came from a heart full of ahavas yisroel. He was a warm "old-style" yerushalmi yid. ZY'O.

27

 Jul 26, 2010 at 01:56 PM Jersey Yid Says:

Wow, let's cont how many timesthe Torah and Neveim talk about how to treat a ger in comparions to other mitzvot. Looks like those who don;t see the big picture got a taste of their own.

28

 Jul 26, 2010 at 01:58 PM Anonymous Says:

I remember the case. There was no scandal per se. It's just that people in Neturei Karta as well as Rabbonim in that faction were vehemently opposed to his marriage to this convert, as was his family. They did not forgive him for this. To them it was a scandal but there was no scandal in the true sense of the word. as we think..

31

 Jul 26, 2010 at 02:07 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #21  
Anonymous Says:

the gemarah in mesechta b'rachos says that one should not marry a gaioris.
the mitzvah of loving a ger do not extend to marrying them. apparantly some comments here stem from modern liberalism.
oh well

Can you give us the daf? I don't recall that gemorrah , and even if so , we don't pasken directly from a gemorrah . By the way , Kings Dovid and Shlomo , just to name 2 , are according to you modern liberals.

33

 Jul 26, 2010 at 02:14 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #21  
Anonymous Says:

the gemarah in mesechta b'rachos says that one should not marry a gaioris.
the mitzvah of loving a ger do not extend to marrying them. apparantly some comments here stem from modern liberalism.
oh well

The goyim in the time of Chazal were mostly ovdei kochavim. Bazman hazeh, this , for the most part , does not apply. You can not pasken halacha l'maaseh from the gemorrah because so many things have changed.

34

 Jul 26, 2010 at 02:25 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #21  
Anonymous Says:

the gemarah in mesechta b'rachos says that one should not marry a gaioris.
the mitzvah of loving a ger do not extend to marrying them. apparantly some comments here stem from modern liberalism.
oh well

can you pont where in S'U there is such halacha..we dont pasken from gemmorah

35

 Jul 26, 2010 at 02:33 PM Anonymous Says:

It sounds like the scandal was the fighting within his family over the marriage. But the truth is, adult children always cause trouble to their elderly parent when the parent wishes to remarry, regardless of who the new spouse is. Sad but true.

36

 Jul 26, 2010 at 02:34 PM hear nur Says:

Reply to #21  
Anonymous Says:

the gemarah in mesechta b'rachos says that one should not marry a gaioris.
the mitzvah of loving a ger do not extend to marrying them. apparantly some comments here stem from modern liberalism.
oh well

I think you are being the liberal here. Ruth, the mother of the Davidic Dynasty, from whom Melech Ha'Moshiach will descent was a giyoress.

37

 Jul 26, 2010 at 02:34 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #12  
formally Says:

i wonder if her conversion would be acceptable by today's rebbies in Israel

interesting how he found a heter for his needs and wants

What do you mean he found a heter? Who says you can't marry a ger?

38

 Jul 26, 2010 at 03:00 PM Anti Zionist pro AUthentic Yiddishkeit Says:

I was always under the impression that Rav Amram Blau ZT"L was a tzaddik and his wife albeit a geyoress, was a tzadekess, so why was it a scandal? The original NK had the purist motives, If the heilige Satmar Rov, Rav Yoel Teitelbaum ZT"L was in accord with them, then I have no reason to think otherwise.

39

 Jul 26, 2010 at 03:12 PM Anonymous Says:

There's nothing wrong with a convert/geyores, this marriage had a different story tied to it, as there were some of his friends and relatives that didn't want this shiduch.

40

 Jul 26, 2010 at 03:16 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #21  
Anonymous Says:

the gemarah in mesechta b'rachos says that one should not marry a gaioris.
the mitzvah of loving a ger do not extend to marrying them. apparantly some comments here stem from modern liberalism.
oh well

Whether the Gemara says that or not (and I cannot say), it is Judaism 101 that there is a difference between the Gemara telling a yachid what he should or should not do, and what Batei Dinim has authority to force on someone. For example, the Gemara says not to eat bread on Erev Shabbos, but Beis Din is not going to wire your mouth shut if you insist on eating bread.

41

 Jul 26, 2010 at 03:30 PM Babishka Says:

Reply to #21  
Anonymous Says:

the gemarah in mesechta b'rachos says that one should not marry a gaioris.
the mitzvah of loving a ger do not extend to marrying them. apparantly some comments here stem from modern liberalism.
oh well

It's a good thing Boaz didn't agree with you, or we would never have Dovid Hamelech. So you go to shul on Shavuos or do you just fall asleep after fressing blintzes?

42

 Jul 26, 2010 at 04:12 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #12  
formally Says:

i wonder if her conversion would be acceptable by today's rebbies in Israel

interesting how he found a heter for his needs and wants

He didn't have to FIND A HETER for something that was so clearly mutar. I knew Rav Amram's granddaughter a little when I was in Yerushalayim, and she always spoke about what a special person his new wife was. Don't walk through divrei k'dusha with your muddy boots.

43

 Jul 26, 2010 at 04:43 PM berel Says:

Reply to #40  
Anonymous Says:

Whether the Gemara says that or not (and I cannot say), it is Judaism 101 that there is a difference between the Gemara telling a yachid what he should or should not do, and what Batei Dinim has authority to force on someone. For example, the Gemara says not to eat bread on Erev Shabbos, but Beis Din is not going to wire your mouth shut if you insist on eating bread.

there is no such a gemmorah about not eating bread erev shabbo.s see pertaining halachos simen 249 hichos shabbos

44

 Jul 26, 2010 at 04:43 PM Anonymous Says:

I don't understand why we just don't let Artscroll take this over and do a little history re-writing. It'll be a win-win situation.

45

 Jul 26, 2010 at 05:07 PM Anonymous Says:

Let's see how all of you who are so pro this marriage react when your Mendy's and Esti's come home with a Ger. That will be the proof of the pudding.

46

 Jul 26, 2010 at 05:14 PM Avremela Says:

Reply to #4  
Shalom Koenig Says:

What is so scandalous about marrying a convert? Is Judaism racist (Heaven forbid!) And what is so scandalous about marrying someone who is younger than you? Is this against Jewish Law?

Reb Amrom was a cohen.

47

 Jul 26, 2010 at 05:33 PM Yehuda Says:

Reply to #16  
Tanna Kamma Says:

Brings to mind 2 other 'scandalous' marriages to converts:
Moses & Joshua.

You forgot Boaz & Ruth from whom Moshiach will come.

48

 Jul 26, 2010 at 05:34 PM Anonymous Says:

Something smells fishy. I never heard an author publicly say before his book was published that he has writer's block. Mr. Pappenheim obviouly is a PR genius. Very soon his mental block will melt and he'll sell out his first edition. He'll be laughing all the way to Bank Leumi. Writer's block ,my foot ! " I simply don't know how to navigate.... blah....blah....blah..." Mr. Pappenheim , I'm calling you out on this. You think we're all suckers.

49

 Jul 26, 2010 at 06:05 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #45  
Anonymous Says:

Let's see how all of you who are so pro this marriage react when your Mendy's and Esti's come home with a Ger. That will be the proof of the pudding.

It's irrelevant how we react. If the kids want it , and it's a kosher marriage , then our objections based on this alone wouldn't be valid.

50

 Jul 26, 2010 at 06:05 PM simple Says:

Very simple! His kids were afraid that ppl today will say like 1 moron said here that he fell in love with her despite their age difference and its unusual for a famous Rabbi to marry a giyoret, therefore they went to badatz they should hold him back from doing it, side note Satmar rebbe zt"l was very angry at Batatz for fighting r' amrom but he didn't want to fight them publicly in order not to undermine their authority

51

 Jul 26, 2010 at 06:10 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #45  
Anonymous Says:

Let's see how all of you who are so pro this marriage react when your Mendy's and Esti's come home with a Ger. That will be the proof of the pudding.

lets see shmee...we are dealing here with halacha not feellings. and reb amrom blum married the convert so whats wrong with that lehalacha?

52

 Jul 26, 2010 at 06:23 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #45  
Anonymous Says:

Let's see how all of you who are so pro this marriage react when your Mendy's and Esti's come home with a Ger. That will be the proof of the pudding.

What is wrong with a ger? Or is this more of that Emanuel style tolerance I hear so much about?

53

 Jul 26, 2010 at 06:24 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #38  
Anti Zionist pro AUthentic Yiddishkeit Says:

I was always under the impression that Rav Amram Blau ZT"L was a tzaddik and his wife albeit a geyoress, was a tzadekess, so why was it a scandal? The original NK had the purist motives, If the heilige Satmar Rov, Rav Yoel Teitelbaum ZT"L was in accord with them, then I have no reason to think otherwise.

The tone conveyed by the phrase "albeit a geyoress, was a tzadekess" may offer you a clue as to why people would be so upset.

54

 Jul 26, 2010 at 06:25 PM Anonymous Says:

This woman saved Jewish children in France as a righteous gentile and then decided to join the Jewish people and became an upstanding frum woman. Sounds like good people to me.

55

 Jul 26, 2010 at 07:12 PM Anonymous Says:

I don't think I'll buy the book unless it only speaks favorably of Rav Blau, NK and Rebetzin Blau.

56

 Jul 26, 2010 at 07:14 PM Anonymous Says:

Well, his problem is not saying that R' Blau married a convert, his problem is saying why he married her. He had been injured by shrapel, so he could not marry into the Jewish people...also because, before she became a tzadekes, she was a prostitute in Paris.

57

 Jul 26, 2010 at 07:22 PM truth Says:

Reply to #46  
Avremela Says:

Reb Amrom was a cohen.

He was a petzua daca and therefore able to marry a giyores. There was absolutely nothing wrong with this tzaddik marrying this tzidkonis.

58

 Jul 26, 2010 at 07:27 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #43  
berel Says:

there is no such a gemmorah about not eating bread erev shabbo.s see pertaining halachos simen 249 hichos shabbos

Gitten 38b says a person will lose property for being koevah seuda erev Shabbos.

59

 Jul 26, 2010 at 08:11 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #56  
Anonymous Says:

Well, his problem is not saying that R' Blau married a convert, his problem is saying why he married her. He had been injured by shrapel, so he could not marry into the Jewish people...also because, before she became a tzadekes, she was a prostitute in Paris.

What has shrapnel got to do with marrying a Jew?

60

 Jul 26, 2010 at 08:40 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #21  
Anonymous Says:

the gemarah in mesechta b'rachos says that one should not marry a gaioris.
the mitzvah of loving a ger do not extend to marrying them. apparantly some comments here stem from modern liberalism.
oh well

There is a special name for one who is intentionally making up gemaros and twisting halachos.

To be melamed z'chus here, such a person can be just very confused and not so well versed.

61

 Jul 26, 2010 at 08:41 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #38  
Anti Zionist pro AUthentic Yiddishkeit Says:

I was always under the impression that Rav Amram Blau ZT"L was a tzaddik and his wife albeit a geyoress, was a tzadekess, so why was it a scandal? The original NK had the purist motives, If the heilige Satmar Rov, Rav Yoel Teitelbaum ZT"L was in accord with them, then I have no reason to think otherwise.

Once she was megayer, Rebitzen Blau has the identical status in yiddeshkeit and is the equal, if the the greater, than the Satmar rav or any other person who was born a yid.

62

 Jul 26, 2010 at 09:25 PM TRUTH Says:

FACT: Rav Amrom Blau Zt'l is one of the great tzaddikim that has lived out his life with mesiras nefesh.

FACT: Mr. Pappenheim is simply preparing the debut of his upcoming new book by using this lame excuse. It won't surprise me in the least, would it be filled with much misinformation and fiction to stir controversy and make him the money he is seeking.

FACT: There are people looking to include Geirim within their life, fore so many of them found TRUTH in Judaism, including the TRUTH that Zionism is anti-Judaism.

63

 Jul 26, 2010 at 09:30 PM Anonymous Says:

if i'm not mistaken; Reb. Ruth Blau was the one that transported Yossele Shuemacher out of Isreal...

64

 Jul 26, 2010 at 09:54 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #58  
Anonymous Says:

Gitten 38b says a person will lose property for being koevah seuda erev Shabbos.

Read it again...there is nothing on daf lamid chet amut beis that holds that they would lose property for so being.

65

 Jul 26, 2010 at 09:56 PM Secular Says:

Some say he suffered an injury which made him A Kerus Shafcha, and therefore forbidden to mary into the Kahal, To be able to marry he had to marry one that is technically not Kahal hashem i.e a Gyores...

66

 Jul 26, 2010 at 09:58 PM Secular Says:

Reply to #61  
Anonymous Says:

Once she was megayer, Rebitzen Blau has the identical status in yiddeshkeit and is the equal, if the the greater, than the Satmar rav or any other person who was born a yid.

There still are halachic differences between a Ger and Born Jew. A Ger (female) may not marry a Kohen. a Ger may marry someone from Amon and Moav. A Gyores can marry a Kerus Shafcha, whereas a Bas Israel cannot...

67

 Jul 26, 2010 at 10:08 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #17  
Babishka Says:

I think it's a lovely romantic story. They fell in love, and he defied his family in order to be with her. As far as the age difference, she wasn't a teenager, she was in her 40's! And she was a beautiful woman.

and what if she had been an ugly woman?

68

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:52 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #64  
Anonymous Says:

Read it again...there is nothing on daf lamid chet amut beis that holds that they would lose property for so being.

I like that. At least some people make others learn a few dafim gemara to be able to answer the comment.

69

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:53 PM Anonymous Says:

Marrying a Geyoris is practically forbidden in those circles and when its done by a leader and respected Rov, to them its a massive scandal.
I heard that Rabbi Blau had wound that he received during the War of Independence, that made it halachically assur for him to marry a Jewish woman after his wife died. So he had to marry a Geyoris.

70

 Jul 26, 2010 at 11:54 PM kul homoisif moisifin loy Says:

We're becoming talmidei chachomim from reading these posts. Maybe we can get a psak that reading VIN is considered learning.

71

 Jul 27, 2010 at 12:37 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #13  
dovy Says:

nk of those days was not an "extremist" group. they were the mainstream orthodoxy which almost every religous jew believed in.

glad u mentioned it.the group who call themselves "neturei karta" today are just a several losers with troubled backgrounds, looking for a cause to attach themselves to. They do not represent anyone but themselves and their warped ideas.

72

 Jul 27, 2010 at 01:46 AM shlomo zalman Says:

This is not a halachic issue. Blau violated the taboos in his society. One, he married outside the inner circle, absolutely forbidden. Two, the concept of "marrying for love" as in between man and woman, does not exist in NK or any other chareidi community.

73

 Jul 27, 2010 at 06:35 AM Tanna Kamma Says:

Reply to #56  
Anonymous Says:

Well, his problem is not saying that R' Blau married a convert, his problem is saying why he married her. He had been injured by shrapel, so he could not marry into the Jewish people...also because, before she became a tzadekes, she was a prostitute in Paris.

Do you know the background of Rachav who became the wife of Yehoshua Bin Nun?

74

 Jul 27, 2010 at 08:20 AM Secular Says:

Reply to #73  
Tanna Kamma Says:

Do you know the background of Rachav who became the wife of Yehoshua Bin Nun?

yea, rachav was an innkeeper... look at Rashi...

75

 Jul 27, 2010 at 08:38 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #16  
Tanna Kamma Says:

Brings to mind 2 other 'scandalous' marriages to converts:
Moses & Joshua.

And Boaz!
From that marriage resulted Dovid Hamelech and our Royal family. And, of course, Melech Hamoshiach.

76

 Jul 27, 2010 at 08:41 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #73  
Tanna Kamma Says:

Do you know the background of Rachav who became the wife of Yehoshua Bin Nun?

It is actually a machlokes hameforshim. Look in Rashi.
Having said that your point is 100% right.

77

 Jul 27, 2010 at 10:01 AM yosef Says:

Reply to #48  
Anonymous Says:

Something smells fishy. I never heard an author publicly say before his book was published that he has writer's block. Mr. Pappenheim obviouly is a PR genius. Very soon his mental block will melt and he'll sell out his first edition. He'll be laughing all the way to Bank Leumi. Writer's block ,my foot ! " I simply don't know how to navigate.... blah....blah....blah..." Mr. Pappenheim , I'm calling you out on this. You think we're all suckers.

B"H The first one that says it like it is . poppenheim is a lair and regretably should not be publishing thsi book since he will not be publishing teh truth and nohing but the truth. Before Ruth Bendavid was engagaed to Reb amarm she was "redt" teh shidduch with two other members of teh Beth din tzedek if the eida Charedis, and she refused both after meeting them. The document written about never was secret, i saw it forty fiv years ago before teh amrriage. reb amram wrote a "teshuavh" with backing in Chazal and shulkchan Oruch why he cannot marry a yisroleis any longer sincve he was wounded badly during teh 1948 bombardment by teh Jordanians. Reb amram was so punctilious in Halocah and derech eretz he told teh Satmar Rov he would never drop teh shidduch if he tells him to, he would just remain a chosoin till he departs teh eartly world. The Satmar Rov told him in Eretz Yisroel the summer of 1965 when he vsiited the last time , that Chas Vesholom he should not drop teh Shidduch, and they decided that if he would amrry somehere else such as Bnei Brak which he did, The Beis Din woudl lay off. Regretably, the opportunists who wanted REb amram out of the leadership of The Eida

78

 Jul 27, 2010 at 10:49 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #62  
TRUTH Says:

FACT: Rav Amrom Blau Zt'l is one of the great tzaddikim that has lived out his life with mesiras nefesh.

FACT: Mr. Pappenheim is simply preparing the debut of his upcoming new book by using this lame excuse. It won't surprise me in the least, would it be filled with much misinformation and fiction to stir controversy and make him the money he is seeking.

FACT: There are people looking to include Geirim within their life, fore so many of them found TRUTH in Judaism, including the TRUTH that Zionism is anti-Judaism.

Your so-called Fact that Zionizm is anti-Judaism is nothing more than your opinion.
It most definitely is NOT a fact nor is it the TRUTH.

79

 Jul 27, 2010 at 10:56 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #77  
yosef Says:

B"H The first one that says it like it is . poppenheim is a lair and regretably should not be publishing thsi book since he will not be publishing teh truth and nohing but the truth. Before Ruth Bendavid was engagaed to Reb amarm she was "redt" teh shidduch with two other members of teh Beth din tzedek if the eida Charedis, and she refused both after meeting them. The document written about never was secret, i saw it forty fiv years ago before teh amrriage. reb amram wrote a "teshuavh" with backing in Chazal and shulkchan Oruch why he cannot marry a yisroleis any longer sincve he was wounded badly during teh 1948 bombardment by teh Jordanians. Reb amram was so punctilious in Halocah and derech eretz he told teh Satmar Rov he would never drop teh shidduch if he tells him to, he would just remain a chosoin till he departs teh eartly world. The Satmar Rov told him in Eretz Yisroel the summer of 1965 when he vsiited the last time , that Chas Vesholom he should not drop teh Shidduch, and they decided that if he would amrry somehere else such as Bnei Brak which he did, The Beis Din woudl lay off. Regretably, the opportunists who wanted REb amram out of the leadership of The Eida

and because you say 'first one to say it like it is' then its' like it is,?

80

 Jul 27, 2010 at 11:06 AM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #77  
yosef Says:

B"H The first one that says it like it is . poppenheim is a lair and regretably should not be publishing thsi book since he will not be publishing teh truth and nohing but the truth. Before Ruth Bendavid was engagaed to Reb amarm she was "redt" teh shidduch with two other members of teh Beth din tzedek if the eida Charedis, and she refused both after meeting them. The document written about never was secret, i saw it forty fiv years ago before teh amrriage. reb amram wrote a "teshuavh" with backing in Chazal and shulkchan Oruch why he cannot marry a yisroleis any longer sincve he was wounded badly during teh 1948 bombardment by teh Jordanians. Reb amram was so punctilious in Halocah and derech eretz he told teh Satmar Rov he would never drop teh shidduch if he tells him to, he would just remain a chosoin till he departs teh eartly world. The Satmar Rov told him in Eretz Yisroel the summer of 1965 when he vsiited the last time , that Chas Vesholom he should not drop teh Shidduch, and they decided that if he would amrry somehere else such as Bnei Brak which he did, The Beis Din woudl lay off. Regretably, the opportunists who wanted REb amram out of the leadership of The Eida

Yes, it is true that al pee torah he couldn't marry anybody but a georous, but it was from an injury he sustained when an israeli policeman kicked he during a protest.

The Gerrer Rebbe at the time said that it is like as if someone koshering meat and by mistake rinses the meat with kerosine, the meat is still kosher but it stinks. The marrage was mutar according ALL shites, but many held that due to his status as a gudel hador, just plain ess past nisht.

81

 Jul 27, 2010 at 11:13 AM Joel Schnur Says:

Reply to #57  
truth Says:

He was a petzua daca and therefore able to marry a giyores. There was absolutely nothing wrong with this tzaddik marrying this tzidkonis.

exactly. those of us old enough to remember the so called scandel, also remember the reason he gave. nonetheless, i always enjoy all the speculation and pontification that readers express that have nothing to do with the facts.

82

 Jul 27, 2010 at 11:36 AM yid Says:

Reply to #80  
Anonymous Says:

Yes, it is true that al pee torah he couldn't marry anybody but a georous, but it was from an injury he sustained when an israeli policeman kicked he during a protest.

The Gerrer Rebbe at the time said that it is like as if someone koshering meat and by mistake rinses the meat with kerosine, the meat is still kosher but it stinks. The marrage was mutar according ALL shites, but many held that due to his status as a gudel hador, just plain ess past nisht.

since when was he a gadol hador???
was he outstanding for his learning , or was he just a political figure for the " i love gallut yidden" ?

83

 Jul 27, 2010 at 12:16 PM actual Jew Says:

My grandfather (Z''L) was cheder and yeshiva educated. He told me that if someone is a hateful person in one way (NK), he is a degenerate in another (this).
There is nothing wrong with marrying a ger. I am friends with several and my kids would be lucky to marry into their families (G-d willing).
But this guy kidnapped a kid and she was his accomplice. He dedicated his life to the destruction of Israel and the Jewish people. He had a heart full of malice and hatred.

84

 Jul 27, 2010 at 12:47 PM HaNavon Says:

Reply to #59  
Anonymous Says:

What has shrapnel got to do with marrying a Jew?

Because the shrapnel rendered him a petzuah daka, so he was not permitted to marry between jews.

85

 Jul 27, 2010 at 03:05 PM Israeli Says:

That R' Amram was a tzaddik who NK actions were l'shem shomayim is not disputed even by those who disagreed with his views.
That he was not a godol hador is also obvious.
Who he (or anyone) marries is his own private affair and nobody's business, not yours, not mine and certainly not the business of his childrem from a previous marriage.
Have we really fallen so far to the depths of the goyishe gutter press that we must publish details of peoples' most private lives in order to titillate the feelongs of the lowest of the low. And of course only to sell papers, or in this case a book.
Gevald!!

86

 Jul 27, 2010 at 03:09 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #67  
Anonymous Says:

and what if she had been an ugly woman?

Even more romantic.

87

 Jul 27, 2010 at 03:12 PM Rochel Says:

Reply to #83  
actual Jew Says:

My grandfather (Z''L) was cheder and yeshiva educated. He told me that if someone is a hateful person in one way (NK), he is a degenerate in another (this).
There is nothing wrong with marrying a ger. I am friends with several and my kids would be lucky to marry into their families (G-d willing).
But this guy kidnapped a kid and she was his accomplice. He dedicated his life to the destruction of Israel and the Jewish people. He had a heart full of malice and hatred.

I do not think kidnapping this kid from his loving parents is anything good, and I am not trying to find R'Amram Blau any excuse at all for doing this, but I believe he and Rebbetzin Ruth didn't think about it as kidnapping the child, but a way to save his soul !
I wished this episode never existed, but they had so much ahavas yisroel they didn't think it was for bad reasons. plus he wasn't dedicated on the destruction of Israel but believed this way would be better for jews not to have a secular israeli state for all the reasons of antizionist beliefs (that I belong to).

They were full of ahavas yisroel and not malice and hatred !

May they rest in peace

88

 Jul 27, 2010 at 03:13 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #46  
Avremela Says:

Reb Amrom was a cohen.

No he was not. My brother-in-law is a Blau from the same family and he is non a cohen.

89

 Jul 27, 2010 at 07:53 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #56  
Anonymous Says:

Well, his problem is not saying that R' Blau married a convert, his problem is saying why he married her. He had been injured by shrapel, so he could not marry into the Jewish people...also because, before she became a tzadekes, she was a prostitute in Paris.

she was a ballet dancer, not a prostitute

90

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