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Brooklyn, NY - Explaining the Inexplicable: Rabbi Horowitz, Chai Life Line How To Speak To Your Child (Audio Replay)

Published on: July 13, 2011 09:58 AM
Last updated on: July 13, 2011 06:44 PM
By: VIN News By Rabbi Yakov Horowitz
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Rabbi Yakov HorowitzBrooklyn, NY - Since the terrible news about Leiby a’h broke, I have been inundated with calls from parents, educators and camp directors asking what they ought to be saying to their children about this tragedy—especially since many of them have been saying tehillim for Leiby.

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In order to assist parents in speaking to your children about this horrific tragedy, a conference call was conducted 11:00 a.m. Rabbi Simcha Scholar and the crisis team of Chai Lifeline with myself.

Should you have any future questions, kindly email them to yhprojectyes@GMAIL.com


Listen below.

Or below YouTube



More of today's headlines

Mumbai, India - Three near-simultaneous explosions rocked India's busy financial capital at rush-hour Wednesday, killing at least 17 people in what the government said... Brooklyn, NY - Photos of the crime scene earlier this morning where the Borough Park boy's body were discovered in Sunset Park. Assemblyman Dov Hikind, who helped...

 

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1

 Jul 13, 2011 at 10:22 AM Anonymous Says:

Frum adults are not being equipped properly in the way to teach children about strangers. It is not enough to talk about obvious matters such as not letting anyone touch in covered places. The problem is that children have a hard time identifying WHO IS A STRANGER. Again, not the obvious strangers. But for example, if a child's parent has business dealings with a certain person once or twice, the person might have even visited the home to speak with the parent, the child then becomes confused. Is this a stranger or not? If this person talks to me in the street should I treat him as a stranger or not? This gets into a more complex area which must be addressed, especially if the surveillance video we saw suggests that this little neshama knew and trusted the monster.

2

 Jul 13, 2011 at 10:50 AM Anonymous Says:

Thank you

3

 Jul 13, 2011 at 11:02 AM Avi Says:

i hope this will be on video and posted online or at least audio
and please dont traumatize your kids by being specific on what happened just that he was killed..

4

 Jul 13, 2011 at 11:17 AM OyGevald Says:

The sad reality of today's generation even amongst the Frum circles is that we can no longer teach our children that Frum people are not to be trusted anymore than "strangers".
Even school staff isn't guranteed safe. We must teach our kids that any kind of "too-friendly" contact is suspect and to report it to their parents to investigate.

5

 Jul 13, 2011 at 11:20 AM Anonymous Says:

Why was everyone so quick to tell children about this in the first place? You realized it might have ended like this, didn't you? Well then, if you don't know what to say now, why bring it up in the first place?

6

 Jul 13, 2011 at 11:29 AM ablydec Says:

Reply to #5  
Anonymous Says:

Why was everyone so quick to tell children about this in the first place? You realized it might have ended like this, didn't you? Well then, if you don't know what to say now, why bring it up in the first place?

...because just maybe, their innocent tefilos could have made a difference. And for that, it was worth it.

7

 Jul 13, 2011 at 11:31 AM Anonymous Says:

Just tell the truth!

8

 Jul 13, 2011 at 11:33 AM independent_mind Says:

Reply to #5  
Anonymous Says:

Why was everyone so quick to tell children about this in the first place? You realized it might have ended like this, didn't you? Well then, if you don't know what to say now, why bring it up in the first place?

the children knew from other people on the street. i live in a small community in europe and my kids came home with this news from cheder. so i imagine kids in america and all over heard it like that too. if i would want to keep my kids protected from this i would have to keep them locked up in the house all their youth...

9

 Jul 13, 2011 at 11:38 AM J-R-S Says:

Reply to #5  
Anonymous Says:

Why was everyone so quick to tell children about this in the first place? You realized it might have ended like this, didn't you? Well then, if you don't know what to say now, why bring it up in the first place?

good point. (tho of course, that, too is water under the bridge by now).

Everyone's very big on telling children horror stories---for one thing, they probably assume goyim will end up being the villains, and that's always useful to make us feel superior & better about ourselves---and enlisting the kids to say tehillim for everything. Harsh reality---that there's not always a happy ending with a wonderful moral---is still not something most people in our community are used to.

10

 Jul 13, 2011 at 11:45 AM A Gutter Yid Says:

This was a terrible Gezeirah, when a child is killed it is incumbent for everyone in the community to do teshuvah. Let us not be mekatrig yidden, 100% of the people I know would help a lost child find his parents. Awareness is important, speak with your children, please don't forget to tell them this was a Gezeirah.

11

 Jul 13, 2011 at 11:46 AM Lodzker Says:

Reply to #5  
Anonymous Says:

Why was everyone so quick to tell children about this in the first place? You realized it might have ended like this, didn't you? Well then, if you don't know what to say now, why bring it up in the first place?

because the children already know, they heard the loud speakers, saw the patrols, and saw that leiby didnt come to camp yesterday. you underestimate what kids know or dont know. they hear everything, and they understand more than people think.

12

 Jul 13, 2011 at 12:21 PM allmark Says:

Reply to #1  
Anonymous Says:

Frum adults are not being equipped properly in the way to teach children about strangers. It is not enough to talk about obvious matters such as not letting anyone touch in covered places. The problem is that children have a hard time identifying WHO IS A STRANGER. Again, not the obvious strangers. But for example, if a child's parent has business dealings with a certain person once or twice, the person might have even visited the home to speak with the parent, the child then becomes confused. Is this a stranger or not? If this person talks to me in the street should I treat him as a stranger or not? This gets into a more complex area which must be addressed, especially if the surveillance video we saw suggests that this little neshama knew and trusted the monster.

My kids school came up with what I thought was a perfect answer to the question of who is a stranger. If you don't know the person's name then they are a stranger.

Also, kids who become lost should be taught to approach anyone in a uniform and simply say: "I'm lost. Please help me.".

If no one with a uniform is available they should go into a store and say the same thing.

13

 Jul 13, 2011 at 12:26 PM MOMOFFOUR Says:

where can i listen to the recorded call?

14

 Jul 13, 2011 at 12:39 PM iboja48 Says:

Remember to teach your children never to go into a car with a stranger even if he is Jewish!!!

15

 Jul 13, 2011 at 01:23 PM esther Says:

Reply to #5  
Anonymous Says:

Why was everyone so quick to tell children about this in the first place? You realized it might have ended like this, didn't you? Well then, if you don't know what to say now, why bring it up in the first place?

what do you mean??? from this horrible story it is obvious that we have to warn,even scare our children. as sad and pathetic as it is,our kids need to know that their are "people" who want to harm and even kill them and that they must be vigelent.

16

 Jul 13, 2011 at 01:36 PM boroparkermom Says:

Reply to #5  
Anonymous Says:

Why was everyone so quick to tell children about this in the first place? You realized it might have ended like this, didn't you? Well then, if you don't know what to say now, why bring it up in the first place?

what are supposed to tell kids in his cheder class????? daycamp class???? the children who recited tehillim??? they saw him one day and the next.....

17

 Jul 13, 2011 at 01:41 PM chavi Says:

Reply to #5  
Anonymous Says:

Why was everyone so quick to tell children about this in the first place? You realized it might have ended like this, didn't you? Well then, if you don't know what to say now, why bring it up in the first place?

Because if you don't tell them they will certainly hear it from others. Wouldn't you want them to hear it from you, instead of from their friends? You, at least, are more qualified to answer their questions, and can present it in the least frightening way. The information is certain to be much more traumatic coming from someone else.

18

 Jul 13, 2011 at 02:01 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #4  
OyGevald Says:

The sad reality of today's generation even amongst the Frum circles is that we can no longer teach our children that Frum people are not to be trusted anymore than "strangers".
Even school staff isn't guranteed safe. We must teach our kids that any kind of "too-friendly" contact is suspect and to report it to their parents to investigate.

Since when are we supposed to tell our children that frum jews can be trusted? Thats ridiculous and a dangerous piece of advice

19

 Jul 13, 2011 at 02:07 PM Anonymous Says:

Reply to #12  
allmark Says:

My kids school came up with what I thought was a perfect answer to the question of who is a stranger. If you don't know the person's name then they are a stranger.

Also, kids who become lost should be taught to approach anyone in a uniform and simply say: "I'm lost. Please help me.".

If no one with a uniform is available they should go into a store and say the same thing.

Does that mean as long as the kid knows the adult's name, the adult can be considered safe?? Not sure this is a good parameter. And really drives home the point that trying to explain to kids who is a stranger is complicated; we are not getting help from the experts that really addresses the kids' confusion about whether they are facing a stranger or not.

20

 Jul 13, 2011 at 02:20 PM monseygirl Says:

I think people in chinuch and psychologists should team up and come out with a dvd for little children to teach them safety skills.

21

 Jul 13, 2011 at 02:21 PM Anonymous Says:

The truth is, wouldn't we do the same thing last week? Go to someone who looks Jewish and ask for help?

22

 Jul 13, 2011 at 03:21 PM iboja48 Says:

No, I taught my children you can't trust anyone, not even a Jew, unless he is a good friend of family or relative. They must also know NEVER! NEVER !NEVER! to step into a strange car to run for their life!!

23

 Jul 13, 2011 at 03:56 PM Anonymous Says:

To teach children that non Jewish people are all bad is just plain wrong. You need to instill sense not hate in your children.

24

 Jul 13, 2011 at 04:13 PM Anonymous Says:

The lesson to get out of this for parents, is to not shirk your responsibility. You have an obligation to watch over your children. Clearly this poor child was not old enough to find his way alone to a new address. Nebech, a real life monster crossed his path. Time for the rabbis to stop protecting molestors.

25

 Jul 13, 2011 at 04:47 PM NeveAliza Says:

From the comments and reactions I’ve read over the last couple of days it’s clear that the reason we’re having problems explaining this to our children is because we can’t even understand it ourselves. How Hashem runs the world, how much He leaves to our action or inaction, what our saying tehillim really accomplishes, and what the power of tefilah is are questions that our greatest Jewish minds have grabbled with for centuries. Comments such as “this is a wake up call”, “Hashem wants us to do teshuva” and “we need Moshiach already” are all 100% true, but they’re true every day, not just when such a terrible tragedy strikes. Having lost relatives to terror here in E”Y I know of the difficulty of making sense out of the loss of loved ones. Every explanation raises three more questions. I have not read anything yet from the leading US roshei yeshiva during or after the tragedy, but I’m sure that will be forthcoming. I’m sure.
The parents and family of Leiby A’H should have nechama and the inner strength to go on with their lives.

27

 Jul 13, 2011 at 05:30 PM Shmaye Says:

Thank you so much for posting this important audio!

28

 Jul 13, 2011 at 06:16 PM from #5 Says:

To all those saying "they were told anyway", that's precisely my point. My intention is not to attack YOU, but whoever it is that felt it necessary to tell these things to children. As far as friends, those living in the area etc., I guess it would be silly to try covering it up. But that doesn't mean evey child around the globe has to be informed of the story with every detail.

29

 Jul 13, 2011 at 07:09 PM Your Cousin Says:

It is disgusting to blame the victim, however a point must be said here. It is HIGH TIME that the orthodox jewish community stops allowing their kids to roam. It is highly irresponsible. In my travels through borough park, I have seen numerous kids walking the streets at hours they should be asleep, and they were not supervised. As far as the killer goes, I personally am sick of hearing that he panicked and killed the kid. Nobody panicks and kills let alone cuts up a child. It comes from being totally narcissistic, and totally psychotic, think of the cruelty and gruesome way he did it. We should also keep in mind, that just because he is a cold blooded killer and probably pedophile rapist, that doesn't mean he isn't a liar too.

30

 Jul 13, 2011 at 07:24 PM Anonymous Says:

i live in boro park and there was no way hiding this from children.....there were thousands of ppl everywhere....police....flyers.....loudspeakers and rightfully so...just explaining to the above commenter....we cant protect our children from reality....and now especialy every child should be told that everyone is a stranger.......and if anyone even a rebbe or counselor wants to see them privately they must they must tell their parents..
this is a heartbraking, tear jerking, unbelievably sad and horrendous story!! noo words!!! where did all the tefillos go? why did such an innocent neshama have to have such a missa meshune?im not chas veshalom questioning HaShem! its just so painful to think of what this boy went through and what his parents will live through forever while the world moves on.....i hope mashiach comes now! its enough! we proved our achdus ......also we must take a strong stand against every known child molester- they are rodfim and should not be protected because we cant be a moser.....it doesnt apply to a rodef....if someone can molest a child thus killing him emotionally then they are capable of murdering physically. we must act!!!! besuros tovos!!!!

31

 Jul 13, 2011 at 07:25 PM Your Conscience Says:

Reply to #25  
NeveAliza Says:

From the comments and reactions I’ve read over the last couple of days it’s clear that the reason we’re having problems explaining this to our children is because we can’t even understand it ourselves. How Hashem runs the world, how much He leaves to our action or inaction, what our saying tehillim really accomplishes, and what the power of tefilah is are questions that our greatest Jewish minds have grabbled with for centuries. Comments such as “this is a wake up call”, “Hashem wants us to do teshuva” and “we need Moshiach already” are all 100% true, but they’re true every day, not just when such a terrible tragedy strikes. Having lost relatives to terror here in E”Y I know of the difficulty of making sense out of the loss of loved ones. Every explanation raises three more questions. I have not read anything yet from the leading US roshei yeshiva during or after the tragedy, but I’m sure that will be forthcoming. I’m sure.
The parents and family of Leiby A’H should have nechama and the inner strength to go on with their lives.

Very well said and written. We are living in very difficult times. In every generation there are tzaros. We have and have had illnesses and tragedy all through the generations. We have been persecuted against since the beginning of time. But Hashem has been with us throughout. We just don't know until we ourselves get to the Olam Haemes what is fully expected of us. Where we went right and where we went wrong. We can only try to do what we know is expected of us to the best of our ability. Leiby A"H was a pure neshoma. There have been many tragedies of nebach people losing loved ones. I cannot for the life of me understand this tragedy. I would have possibly understood the killer's panic, that in the heat of the moment he snapped and killed Leiby, A"H. But dismemberment?? How can a person who has had Torah in his life do such a thing? I am so so sick over this!

32

 Jul 13, 2011 at 07:26 PM The silence is deafening Says:

I'm shocked that 2 prominent Frum speakers, both the Rabbi and the Dr., both fail to mention one worked about Bitochon when trying to calm the fears of children, ease their distress and to feel safe, as long as they do whatever needs to be done in the realm to naturally protect.

Reality is that this tragedy can not be guaranteed to never happen even with all the " Chachomim's" eitzos.

Of course we need to teach our children safety rules but how can someone frum "forget" to tell parents that the ultimate comfort to child en is only our Bitochon in Hashem.

Didn't anyone ever learn Chovas Halvovos, or is the sefer only for inside the Yeshiva but in the real world we don't mention a word about it to our children WHEN TRAGEDY STRIKES!

Why hasn't it occurred to anyone one of our prominent speakers on this subject TODAY to mention that everything is in Hashems hands and is BASHERT and in spite of everyones best efforts, only Hashem can prevent such tragedy.

This in no way minimizes all the advice which all our secular "chachomim" have given, but the in addition, if not one iota of even one word is mentioned about Bitochon, the silence is deafening

33

 Jul 13, 2011 at 07:53 PM bubii Says:

i dont hear one mention about his parents with all this information going around he lived at his parents house and no one speaks about his parents anyone here who heard about his mother and father ?

34

 Jul 13, 2011 at 08:02 PM Rabbi_CS Says:

Reply to #32  
The silence is deafening Says:

I'm shocked that 2 prominent Frum speakers, both the Rabbi and the Dr., both fail to mention one worked about Bitochon when trying to calm the fears of children, ease their distress and to feel safe, as long as they do whatever needs to be done in the realm to naturally protect.

Reality is that this tragedy can not be guaranteed to never happen even with all the " Chachomim's" eitzos.

Of course we need to teach our children safety rules but how can someone frum "forget" to tell parents that the ultimate comfort to child en is only our Bitochon in Hashem.

Didn't anyone ever learn Chovas Halvovos, or is the sefer only for inside the Yeshiva but in the real world we don't mention a word about it to our children WHEN TRAGEDY STRIKES!

Why hasn't it occurred to anyone one of our prominent speakers on this subject TODAY to mention that everything is in Hashems hands and is BASHERT and in spite of everyones best efforts, only Hashem can prevent such tragedy.

This in no way minimizes all the advice which all our secular "chachomim" have given, but the in addition, if not one iota of even one word is mentioned about Bitochon, the silence is deafening

You obviously did not listen for the full almost 50 minutes.

35

 Jul 13, 2011 at 08:04 PM ablydec Says:

Reply to #22  
iboja48 Says:

No, I taught my children you can't trust anyone, not even a Jew, unless he is a good friend of family or relative. They must also know NEVER! NEVER !NEVER! to step into a strange car to run for their life!!

Guess what? Of children who are abused, often the most dangerous one out there is that "good friend or relative". We must teach all of the above, and then we are STILL in the Eibeshter's hands.

36

 Jul 13, 2011 at 08:19 PM Brooklyn Mom Says:

ומחה ה' דמעה מעל כל פנים
We all have to talk to our children and grandchildren. Dr. Blumenthal tells us how to speak to our kids and show them that it's ok to cry. My problem is --how do we talk to our kids and try to explain it when we ourselves cannot fathom or understand it. I am 60 years old BA"H and the only time I cried this hard was when I lost my brother tragically. Please, mothers and fathers--hold on to your children when you are with them outside. And BE outside with them!!! Talk to your kids!!!! Teach them how to deal with the outside world. We have so ghettoized our families. We no longer can cloister ourselves.When such a Ruach HaTumah came over a person like this man, we no longer can cloister ourselves. Ghetto life is over.
May the Ribbono shel Olam brings menuchas hanefesh to this broken family and to Klal Yisroel because we are collectively heartbroken.

המקום ינחם אתכם בתוך שאר אבלי ציון וירושלים

37

 Jul 13, 2011 at 08:55 PM shredready Says:

Reply to #32  
The silence is deafening Says:

I'm shocked that 2 prominent Frum speakers, both the Rabbi and the Dr., both fail to mention one worked about Bitochon when trying to calm the fears of children, ease their distress and to feel safe, as long as they do whatever needs to be done in the realm to naturally protect.

Reality is that this tragedy can not be guaranteed to never happen even with all the " Chachomim's" eitzos.

Of course we need to teach our children safety rules but how can someone frum "forget" to tell parents that the ultimate comfort to child en is only our Bitochon in Hashem.

Didn't anyone ever learn Chovas Halvovos, or is the sefer only for inside the Yeshiva but in the real world we don't mention a word about it to our children WHEN TRAGEDY STRIKES!

Why hasn't it occurred to anyone one of our prominent speakers on this subject TODAY to mention that everything is in Hashems hands and is BASHERT and in spite of everyones best efforts, only Hashem can prevent such tragedy.

This in no way minimizes all the advice which all our secular "chachomim" have given, but the in addition, if not one iota of even one word is mentioned about Bitochon, the silence is deafening

Why hasn't it occurred to anyone one of our prominent speakers on this subject TODAY to mention that everything is in Hashems hands and is BASHERT and in spite of everyones best efforts, only Hashem can prevent such tragedy.

no you can do something don't just say "is BASHERT" if you only believe that then there is no reason to reflect to see if such a tragedy can be humanly prevented in the future

38

 Jul 13, 2011 at 09:07 PM newtransplant Says:

My children said tehillim, one of them is highly emotional and one is highly imaginitive - I told them that Leiby was lost, when the final news came through I told them that he was niftar. They asked how? I told a white lie, I said he had gotten lost and probably got dehydrated and was niftar. My kids accepted this, were upset, but then went on to their normal after school activities. I feel I did the right thing.

39

 Jul 13, 2011 at 09:41 PM BP MOM Says:

Reply to #38  
newtransplant Says:

My children said tehillim, one of them is highly emotional and one is highly imaginitive - I told them that Leiby was lost, when the final news came through I told them that he was niftar. They asked how? I told a white lie, I said he had gotten lost and probably got dehydrated and was niftar. My kids accepted this, were upset, but then went on to their normal after school activities. I feel I did the right thing.

You did the wrong thing! kids have to know the truth about stranger danger even if they look frum and this would have been the perfect opportunity to discuss it with them! It is every parents duty to tell their children what happend to avoid another such story! kids who are not educated are perfect victims! Please tell your children the truth! and never ever ever get into the car with anyone!

40

 Jul 13, 2011 at 10:06 PM anonymous Says:

I'm sorry but I don't believe the "little white lie" to your kids, that Leiby a"h "got dehydrated & was niftar," was a good idea at all. they will surely hear the truth from others & will then realize their parent lied to them & can't be trusted. 2nd point is, just warning kids about strangers is not enough! most child molesters turn out to be a family friend, relative or rebbe of the victim. kids must be taught never to allow anything inappropriate EVEN from a close relative/fam. friend or rebbe!

41

 Jul 15, 2011 at 05:14 AM curious Says:

Reply to #12  
allmark Says:

My kids school came up with what I thought was a perfect answer to the question of who is a stranger. If you don't know the person's name then they are a stranger.

Also, kids who become lost should be taught to approach anyone in a uniform and simply say: "I'm lost. Please help me.".

If no one with a uniform is available they should go into a store and say the same thing.

anyone in uniform? this guy was a security guard. he also once wore a uniform.

42

 May 13, 2016 at 03:16 PM Anonymous Says:

Is there a book for parents to read with there kids from the Yiddishe standpoint about safe touching?

43

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